Don't Blame the Driver?

Discussion in 'Australia and New Zealand' started by PiledHigher, Oct 22, 2006.

  1. BT Humble

    BT Humble Guest

    Tamyka Bell wrote:
    > PiledHigher wrote:
    > <snip>
    > > I'm not seeking revenge, I'm suggesting that just because mummy & daddy
    > > say so you are resolved of being responsible, particularly when you
    > > take on an adult task like driving.
    > >
    > > I'm saying, from initial reports the kid looks responsible but we can't
    > > say so because it might hurt his self estimee.

    >
    > Actually it's probably got more to do with to a
    > constitutional right to be deemed innocent until proven
    > guilty.


    Unless ASIO wants to "interview" you.


    BTH
     


  2. Theo Bekkers

    Theo Bekkers Guest

    Tamyka Bell wrote:

    > Agreed. But whose fault is it?
    >
    > How
    > about if a kid drops a rock off an overpass onto your car -
    > is that your fault?


    Happened to my son (in my car) when he was 18. Some shit dropped a rock off
    a ped bridge which broke the windscreen. fortunately he didn't lose control.

    Theo
     
  3. Theo Bekkers

    Theo Bekkers Guest

    scotty72 wrote:

    > It is simply not good enough for a ditsy teen to jump in a car and
    > think, petrol goes here, key goes here - end of story.


    That modus operandi works for most adults, even me. I don't check the tyre
    pressures and depth of tread before I leave my driveway. Do you know anyone
    who does?

    Theo
     
  4. Tamyka Bell

    Tamyka Bell Guest

    Theo Bekkers wrote:
    >
    > scotty72 wrote:
    >
    > > It is simply not good enough for a ditsy teen to jump in a car and
    > > think, petrol goes here, key goes here - end of story.

    >
    > That modus operandi works for most adults, even me. I don't check the tyre
    > pressures and depth of tread before I leave my driveway. Do you know anyone
    > who does?


    *confession* Tyres no more than once a fortnight, similarly
    for oil check. But then I only scoot one day per week and
    only fill up the tank every third week or so...

    Tam
     
  5. Shabby

    Shabby New Member

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    Don't blame the driver, it was the trees that made the car stop so suddenly....

    Speed doesn't kill, its the rapid deceleration that does the damage.
     
  6. Tamyka Bell

    Tamyka Bell Guest

    Shabby wrote:
    >
    > Don't blame the driver, it was the trees that made the car stop so
    > suddenly....
    >
    > Speed doesn't kill, its the rapid deceleration that does the damage.


    Excellent point. We should cull those pesky trees.

    Tam
     
  7. Sir Lex

    Sir Lex Guest

    PiledHigher wrote:
    > What the? Surely this not the road safety message we should be getting
    > out...
    > I'm glad that victoria continues with 18 as driving age.
    >
    > In the text the car lost control.... Once again what the?, the driver
    > lost control. His parents want him to recover with a clear concience,
    > sorry not for you...
    >
    >
    >
    > Don't blame driver, say parents
    > http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,20626721-662,00.html
    > <snip>
    >



    I reckon what they're trying to say is for the media and the public not
    to rip into him for what he's done. He's got to live with the fact that
    he killed 3 of his good mates. He will never forget it, and will need
    all the support he can get because of his mistake. Other papers have
    been reporting that the only thing the kid says when he's awake is "oh
    my god I killed them, oh my god I killed them."

    The media and the public getting stuck into him is only going to make
    things worse, and without the right support, the kid may well commit
    suicide.

    Other news sources cite that witnesses say the boy wasn't speeding, and
    police do not think that drugs or alcohol were a factor either. The
    road was wet and lined with trees (if the high speed road was lined with
    trees, why was it not also lined with armco to prevent people hitting
    the trees?). The kid was driving a rear wheel drive car, and as
    learning skid control is frowned upon by authorities in this country for
    some ungodly reason, the kid will have had no idea what to do if he lost
    the back end of his car on a wet road.

    The kid had only had his licence four days when he had the accident,
    again raising calls for newly licensed drivers to have a curfew and/or a
    passenger limit. I agree with the passenger limit, peer pressure is the
    most dangerous thing to find in a car full of teenagers.

    As for the legal driving age, many countries around the world let kids
    as young as 14 obtain a restricted motorcycle/moped licence. They are
    then allowed to start driving cars at 16. Compulsory driver training
    can cost as much as AU$2000, which includes on track training, skid
    control, classroom training, etc, by professionals. Why are we so
    backward in this country? No Australian politician has the balls to say
    that a system like that is really needed in Australia. Instead the
    responsibility is passed onto children's parents who also don't know how
    to drive. How many encounters have the readers of this newsgroup had
    with older, adult drivers? Chances are, each of those drivers will
    teach a child to drive in their lifetime. Chances are, each of those
    children will have heard their parents say "bloody cyclists, bloody taxi
    drivers, bloody hell I'm 5 minutes late" whilst tailgating, performing
    erratic lane changes, failing to keep left unless overtaking, driving at
    70 odd in 50 zones, and generally driving like a moron. Then everyone
    has a go at new drivers who start doing the same thing?

    Until each state and territory gets a politician who has the guts to
    take on a far too conservative driver education system, then things like
    this will keep happening. The useless kiddy bashing will continue every
    time there is a multiple fatality involving young drivers, and we will
    get nowhere.


    --

    SL.


    Take back the web. www.Getfirefox.com

    http://www.firefoxflicks.com/flick/?id=20272

    Take back your Inbox. www.Getthunderbird.com
     
  8. Tamyka Bell

    Tamyka Bell Guest

    Sir Lex wrote:
    <snips the other very valid points>

    > The kid had only had his licence four days when he had the accident,
    > again raising calls for newly licensed drivers to have a curfew and/or a
    > passenger limit. I agree with the passenger limit, peer pressure is the
    > most dangerous thing to find in a car full of teenagers.


    There are passenger (pillion) restrictions on a motorcycle,
    so I can't see why cars should be any different, except that
    I hate the thought of people being forced to drive as sole
    occupants of a vehicle!

    Never understood the peer pressure thing, though. Perhaps
    it's because I didn't start driving until I was older. If
    passengers egged me on to drive in a dangerous manner, I
    simply pulled over and asked them to get out, or kindly shut
    the fsck up.
    <snip>
    > Instead the
    > responsibility is passed onto children's parents who also don't know how
    > to drive. How many encounters have the readers of this newsgroup had
    > with older, adult drivers? Chances are, each of those drivers will
    > teach a child to drive in their lifetime. Chances are, each of those
    > children will have heard their parents say "bloody cyclists, bloody taxi
    > drivers, bloody hell I'm 5 minutes late" whilst tailgating, performing
    > erratic lane changes, failing to keep left unless overtaking, driving at
    > 70 odd in 50 zones, and generally driving like a moron. Then everyone
    > has a go at new drivers who start doing the same thing?

    <snip>

    My Dad had the good sence to acknowledge that he breaks a
    fair few road rules. He drove me to the local "technology
    park" on a weekend for some familiarisation... this is how
    the car works, have a go at what it feels like to drive...
    then he sent me off to a driving school to be taught
    properly. Then they wouldn't let me go on any long drives
    until I'd done a defensive driving course, which they gave
    me as a birthday present. (At that course, I decided I'd
    been lucky to have such a good driving instructor, because
    so many on the course were clueless, even to my untrained
    eye.)

    Tam
     
  9. Theo Bekkers

    Theo Bekkers Guest

    Tamyka Bell wrote:

    > Excellent point. We should cull those pesky trees.


    They cut down the tree that Peter Brock attempted to kill.

    Theo
     
  10. cfsmtb

    cfsmtb New Member

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    Don't laugh, but this has previously been suggested, as has the removal or repositioning of bus shelters & street furniture. Personally I think the authorities should stop farting around and simply line the streets with armco or guardrail.
     
  11. Theo Bekkers

    Theo Bekkers Guest

    Sir Lex wrote:

    > As for the legal driving age, many countries around the world let kids
    > as young as 14 obtain a restricted motorcycle/moped licence. They are
    > then allowed to start driving cars at 16.


    Some countries allows six year old children ride bicycles with no formal
    training. Allow teenagers to ride their unlicenced bicycles on the roads.
    Where are the safety checks, the training, compulsory vehicle checks?

    Think of the children!

    Theo
    Sarcasm, if you hadn't noticed.
     
  12. scotty72

    scotty72 New Member

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    Then, this is a clear case of fault.

    Someone (unless there is one in a million freak occasion) - like a metor drops on your bonnet) is always responsible.

     
  13. Tamyka Bell

    Tamyka Bell Guest

    cfsmtb wrote:
    >
    > Tamyka Bell Wrote:
    > >
    > >
    > > Excellent point. We should cull those pesky trees.

    >
    > Don't laugh, but this has previously been suggested, as has the removal
    > or repositioning of bus shelters & street furniture. Personally I think
    > the authorities should stop farting around and simply line the streets
    > with armco or guardrail.
    >
    > --
    > cfsmtb


    Streets are obviously dangerous full stop, so are footpaths.
    Cull them all.

    Tam
     
  14. scotty72

    scotty72 New Member

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    Then stop driving.

    If your not at least visually inpecting your tyres at least once every few days - you're a menace - get off the road.

    How hard is it to walk a lap of your car? Are you that much of a lazy slob?

     
  15. Tamyka Bell

    Tamyka Bell Guest

    scotty72 wrote:
    >
    > Then stop driving.
    >
    > If your not at least visually inpecting your tyres at least once every
    > few days - you're a menace - get off the road.
    >
    > How hard is it to walk a lap of your car? Are you that much of a lazy
    > slob?


    Shall I go walk a lap of my scooter every few days? I'd
    spend more time walking around it than driving it.

    T
     
  16. scotty72

    scotty72 New Member

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    Why not? He killed 3 young people! Shouldn't he be made to feel bloody awful? Better than what happened to his mates.

    This is most likely media management. I have worked in and with the media on and off; any media 101 student can tell you that there will be a well co-ordinated strategy going on here.

    And if he is made to feel blameless then he may well kill others again.


    The 'witnesses' were a car load of his mates following them home. What might you tell the cops if they asked you if your mate was driving like an idiot, killing people? Do you reckon you'd tell them your mate drove so stupidly that he killed 4 people?

    Now imagine that pressure to protect your mate as a teenager.


    That's right - don't ask people to be responsible for what they do - the road did it; the trees are a fault. Are you this guys parent. HE DID IT - not the tree!


    Yes, getting a licence is far too easy. It should be long, difficult and expensive - then they might respect it.

    You're right again.

    This highlights the point about the so-called witnesses.
    Yes, you're on a roll!

    And, you were doing so well.

    It's not the kid's fault - it was the pollies' fault.

    All those things must happen but, MOST IMPORTANT is that kids are made wholly and soley responsible for any wrong that they do. Only then will people start to change their attitudes.

    Until then, the whole 'It wasn't my fault' culture (and the carnage) will continue.

    SCotty
     
  17. Theo Bekkers

    Theo Bekkers Guest

    scotty72 wrote:
    > Theo Bekkers Wrote:


    >> That modus operandi works for most adults, even me. I don't check the
    >> tyre
    >> pressures and depth of tread before I leave my driveway. Do you know
    >> anyone
    >> who does?


    > Then stop driving.
    >
    > If your not at least visually inpecting your tyres at least once every
    > few days - you're a menace - get off the road.
    >
    > How hard is it to walk a lap of your car? Are you that much of a lazy
    > slob?


    Good Lord. Do you ping all your spokes before you ride down to the shops?

    Theo
     
  18. Tamyka Bell

    Tamyka Bell Guest

    scotty72 wrote:
    >
    > Sir Lex Wrote:
    > >
    > > I reckon what they're trying to say is for the media and the public
    > > not
    > > to rip into him for what he's done.
    > > Why not? He killed 3 young people! Shouldn't he be made to feel bloody

    > awful? Better than what happened to his mates.
    >
    > > Other papers have
    > > been reporting that the only thing the kid says when he's awake is
    > > "oh
    > > my god I killed them, oh my god I killed them."


    > This is most likely media management. I have worked in and with the
    > media on and off; any media 101 student can tell you that there will be
    > a well co-ordinated strategy going on here.

    <snip?

    Awesome. I hope the media feels great when they drive a
    young remorseful teenager to suicide. They have been
    reported to have driven others to death as well.

    Sir Lex made a very good point about that - if he feels bad,
    all the media coverage in the world ain't going to achieve
    anything because he already feels bad.

    If he doesn't feel bad, it's just going to piss him off, and
    increase his sense of how it's not his fault and the world
    is out to get him, so yay, he'll be an angry young driver.

    Tam
     
  19. scotty72

    scotty72 New Member

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    No, but a busted spoke wont kill 4 people.

     
  20. scotty72

    scotty72 New Member

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    At least the next young (or old) driver might think twice if he sees a young life ruined by his own actions.

     
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