Drug Enforcement Agency: Methylphenidate (Ritalin)



>Subject: Re: Drug Enforcement Agency: Methylphenidate (Ritalin)
>From: Peter Bowditch [email protected]
>Date: 9/20/2003 4:04 PM Pacific Standard Time
>Message-id: <[email protected]>
>
>[email protected] (Jan) wrote:
>
>>A recent study reveals that the drug being prescribed to tens of millions of
>>school-age children for a scientifically unproved mental disorder is more
>>potent than cocaine.
>
>First it was 4 to 5 million kids (an amount of Ritalin which far
>exceeds world production) and now it's "tens of millions".
>
>I am running a book on how soon it becomes billions.


Oh? Does that book include *stark contrast* and *demonizing*??


>By the way - the "4 to 5 million" is actually the number of
>prescriptions written. As a new one is required each month this means
>about 400,000 users. But what do facts have to do with anything?

A few facts you snipped, and didn't mention it. Not that anyone thinks that is
a big deal except you, when *I* do it.

Ritalin 'Cocaine Properties' May Lead To Later Drug Abuse

Ritalin is More Potent Than Cocaine

Schedule ll

These medicines have therapeutic uses and have the highest abuse and dependence
potential for drugs with medicinal purposes. Examples include Morphine,Demerol,
Speed, Opium, Cocaine and Ritalin. A written prescription is required
and refills are not allowed.

US: Pay Attention - Ritalin Acts Much Like Cocaine.

Are you interested in *those* facts Peter??

What you have done in another stupid skeptic trick.

Sorry it didn't change the facts.

Remember that most people do not have sufficient time or expertise for careful
discrimination, and tend to accept or reject the whole of an unfamiliar
situation. So discredit the whole story by attempting to discredit *part* of
the story. Here's how: a) take one element of a case completely out of context;
b) find something prosaic that hypothetically could explain it; c) declare
that therefore that one element has been explained; d) call a press conference
and announce to the world that the entire case has been explained!

Jan
 
[email protected] (Jan) wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> >Subject: Re: Drug Enforcement Agency: Methylphenidate (Ritalin)
> >From: Joe Parsons [email protected]
> >Date: 9/19/2003 3:49 PM Pacific Standard Time
> >Message-id: <[email protected]>
> >
> >On Fri, 19 Sep 2003 19:31:28 GMT, [email protected] (David Wright)
> >wrote:
> >
> >>In article <[email protected]>,
> >>F Troop <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>"Jeff" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >>>news:[email protected]...
> >>>> Read the last paragraph of the article you cite:
> >>>> http://www.usdoj.gov/dea/pubs/cngrtest/ct051600.htm
> >>>>
> >>>> When taken as prescribed, methylphenidate is safe and effective.
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>The compliance rate amongst people who are prescribed psychotropic drugs is
> >>>so low, that is a moot point.
> >>
> >>"Studies report noncompliance rates of 20-65% with stimulant
> >>treatment, although there are only limited published studies
> >>and these show considerable individual variation."
> >> (Swanson, J., "Compliance with stimulants for attention-
> >> deficit/hyperactivity disorder: issues and approaches
> >> for improviement", CNS Drugs 2003; 17(2): 117-31.)
> >>
> >>So, FTroop, you're blowing smoke.
> >
> >Imagine our surprise.
> >
> >Joe Parsons
>
> Imagine the debunkers sticking together, even when they are wrong.
>
> Jan Drew
>
> http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2003-01-16-kids-drug_x.htm

Interesting. The article may, or may not, pertain to ADHD medications.
However, since you are using it to bash the use of safe and effective
ADHD medications, this is an interesting quote from the article:

"Among teens, girls were more likely than boys to have misused drugs;
it was opposite among young adults."

Since AD/HD is far more common in males, and girls abuse more often,
then the abuse of AD/HD meds must not be a very big problem.

(Jan,I know this requires you to follow logic, but, hey,there are some
things in life that are hard.)
 
jake <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> On 20 Sep 2003 07:17:00 -0700, [email protected] (Mark
> Probert) wrote:
>
> >jake <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> >> On Fri, 19 Sep 2003 20:18:31 GMT, "Mark Probert"
> >> <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>
> >> >
> >> >"jake" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >> >news:[email protected]...
> >> >> On Fri, 19 Sep 2003 17:11:35 GMT, "Mark Probert"
> >> >> <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> >
> >> >> >"jake" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >> >> >news:[email protected]...
> >> >> >
> >> >> >Where is this?
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >> Olympic mountains WA
> >> >
> >> >It looked familiar.
> >> >
> >> >I lived in Steilacoom, WA while I was assigned to Ft. Lewis, WA, 1969-70. We
> >> >rented a house on Puget Sound and it was known as party city.
> >>
> >> wow!
> >> small world and all that
> >>
> >> :>)
> >>
> >>
> >> >
> >> >We went to Olympic National Park several times to go fishing.
> >> >
> >> >See: http://www.nps.gov/olym/wic/duplela.htm
> >>
> >>
> >> I was not fit enough to go to upper lena but had to stay at lower lena
> >
> >You missed a gorgeous lake.
>
> oh..I know :>((
> >
> >Lower Lena was my day-trip fishing hole. I learned fly casting on the
> >Hamma Hamma, which means, in Nisqually, much fish.
> >
> >It was, until I got there. :)
>
> so YOU are responsible..LOL
>
> the natural beauty will be locked in my heart for ever

Better..I right clicked on it and made it my wallpaper.
 
"F Troop" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> "Joe Parsons" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:p[email protected]...
> >
> > I am incredulous...asking for substantiation for an assertion is a
> "trick."
>
> Why are you incredulous you are viewed as trolling whenever you make
> gratuitous requests others provide you a cite to substantiate assertions
> without your providing any empirical data or grounds for questioning their
> assertion, Joe?
>
> You and the other ASAD trolls have been repeatedly told that unless you
> provide contradictory empirical data or some reasonable grounds for
> questioning an assertion, your gratutious requests for cites will be
> dismissed as trolling.

No, now, Linda, you have been told that proving one's assertions is
the norm for usenet. Please prove yours.
 
>"Jeff" <[email protected]> wrote
>> > > no ..is this relevant to whether ritalin is nearly identical with
>> > > cocaine as the DEA says?
>> > It is true, whether the DEA says it or not.
>> Ritalin works on the many or all of the same receptors as amphetamine and
>> cocaine. However, the onset of action and the time it takes for the
>effects
>> to wear off are vastly different. These diffences in pharmacokinetics
>makes
>> the drugs very different.
>
>Think of ritalin as slow-acting cocaine.

Think of Roger as a slow-thinking Dale Gribble.
 
On Sat, 20 Sep 2003 18:56:36 +0100, jake <[email protected]> wrote:

>On Sat, 20 Sep 2003 17:39:51 GMT, [email protected] (PF Riley)
>wrote:
>>
>>So you think heroin and morphine are bad drugs?
>
>morphine addiction is rare and tends to be confined to doctors and
>nurses..

OK, so apparently you think morphine is OK since addiction is rare
within the general public.

>heroin on the other hand..devastates whole communities..
>I have lost track of the number of peole I hve known whose lives and
>families were trashed by it..

Forget heroin -- by far the most devastating drug in the history of
mankind is ethanol. Do you ever drink wine?

>been to too many funerals..sorry
>
>
>
> What's about codeine
>>and dextromethorphan? Do you ever cough or have pain?
>
>sure..and I use codeine as infrequently as possible

OK, but apparently you think codeine is OK.

>>Cocaine is a very useful topical anesthetic.
>
>as is morphine and heroin in terminal cancer cases ..for example..
>
>that something is a necessary evil does not make it less evil..

So you think it's evil to relieve pain in a "terminal cancer case?"

Let me see if I can reconstruct your logic.

Hmm. Cocaine and methylphenidate are not structurally identical, but
they have similar biochemical effects. Cocaine is bad, therefore
methylphenidate is bad.

Codeine is helpful if you have a cough. Codeine is an opioid, and so
is heroin. They are more similar to each other than methylphenidate
and cocaine are. Heroin is bad ("devastating," in fact), therefore,
codeine is bad. But codeine is OK for a cough. I don't get it.

Alcohol is more devastating than heroin, yet you drink wine (I'm
assuming here), but avoid heroin. Why is that?

Get back to me when you've figured out either (a) a logical
explanation for your simple-minded paradigm that drugs are either
"bad" or "good," or (b) that life, and subsequently the ethics of
psychopharmacotherapy, is more complex than you think it is (in other
words, "Ritalin acts like cocaine, cocaine is bad, therefore Ritalin
is bad" is a false syllogism.)

PF
 
Illness Nien doesn't think at all.

Had to change your nick again to get anybody to see you?

Bye for the 6th time

<PLONK>

"Ilsa9" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> >"Jeff" <[email protected]> wrote
> >> > > no ..is this relevant to whether ritalin is nearly identical with
> >> > > cocaine as the DEA says?
> >> > It is true, whether the DEA says it or not.
> >> Ritalin works on the many or all of the same receptors as amphetamine
and
> >> cocaine. However, the onset of action and the time it takes for the
> >effects
> >> to wear off are vastly different. These diffences in pharmacokinetics
> >makes
> >> the drugs very different.
> >
> >Think of ritalin as slow-acting cocaine.
>
> Think of Roger as a slow-thinking Dale Gribble.
 
On Sun, 21 Sep 2003 02:30:10 GMT, [email protected] (PF Riley)
wrote:

>On Sat, 20 Sep 2003 18:56:36 +0100, jake <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>On Sat, 20 Sep 2003 17:39:51 GMT, [email protected] (PF Riley)
>>wrote:
>>>
>>>So you think heroin and morphine are bad drugs?
>>
>>morphine addiction is rare and tends to be confined to doctors and
>>nurses..
>
>OK, so apparently you think morphine is OK since addiction is rare
>within the general public.
>
>>heroin on the other hand..devastates whole communities..
>>I have lost track of the number of peole I hve known whose lives and
>>families were trashed by it..
>
>Forget heroin -- by far the most devastating drug in the history of
>mankind is ethanol.

I would dispute that..it is a little ethnocentric..

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/1600712.stm


to be continued...0400 here...
 
[email protected] (Mark Probert) wrote:

>Better..I right clicked on it and made it my wallpaper.

Oh, thank goodness. We were all really worried there for a while.

Okay, so I've got to ask....

Here you two are carrying on your own intimate little conversation (complete
with huge binary attachments), cross-posting it to no less than 5 newsgroups
(none of which are even remotely relevant to whatever it is you're talking
about), and yet you both seem downright blissful.

So, are you trying to make some sort of point? Are you in love and you want
the world to know? Is this some sort of freshman psych experiment? Your
email doesn't work so you're using newsgroups instead?

Just curious....
 
On Sun, 21 Sep 2003 05:20:59 GMT, Carey Gregory
<[email protected]> wrote:

>[email protected] (Mark Probert) wrote:
>
>>Better..I right clicked on it and made it my wallpaper.
>
>Oh, thank goodness


uhuh..here comes Carey Gregory

> We were all really worried there for a while.

who is "we"..?

you and your cat?



>
>Okay, so I've got to ask....

nah you dont..but your sort cant resist can they?


>
>Here you two are carrying on your own intimate little conversation (complete
>with huge binary attachments), cross-posting it to no less than 5 newsgroups
>(none of which are even remotely relevant to whatever it is you're talking
>about), and yet you both seem downright blissful.

jealous are you..well you always have your cat!




>
>So, are you trying to make some sort of point? Are you in love and you want
>the world to know?

wash your mouth out with soap..



Is this some sort of freshman psych experiment? Your
email doesn't work so you're using newsgroups instead?

If you had followed the thread in your usual stalking fashion
you would know..

>Just curious....

curiosity killed the cat


--
http://shorterlink.com/?46RBSB


Nah, it's just a notorious troll and net loon known as "Carey Gregory"
or "[email protected]." A FAT 70 YEAR OLD LITTLE MAN He engages in a form
of
cyberstalking by following people
around usenet (he searches out their posts on google), and posting
weird, nonsensical followups to everything they post. He morphs his
identity daily, sometimes hourly, but the incoherence and nonsensical
nature of his posts usually makes it obvious it's him.

is just carrie.

[email protected] ,[email protected], [email protected])
[email protected]

see carrie @ http://www.evolutionbodypiercing.com/images/wodawide.jpg
it's just carrie


Carey Gregory

[email protected]

[email protected]

Carey Gregory

[email protected]

www. [email protected]

Carey Gregory

[email protected]

http://www.webnews.kornet.net/group.cgi?group=sci.med&page=1

http:// webnews.kornet.net/group

Carey Gregory

www.gw-tech.com

www. [email protected]
 
On 20 Sep 2003 06:11:24 GMT, [email protected] (Jan) wrote:

>>From: jake [email protected]
>>Date: 9/19/2003 9:24 PM Pacific Standard Time
>>Message-id: <[email protected]>
>>
>>On 20 Sep 2003 05:11:44 GMT, [email protected] (Jan) wrote:
>>
>>>>From: [email protected] (PF
>>>
>>>Now that you are done calling people idiots. Take a look at this.
>>>
>>>http://www.drug-rehabs.org/faqs/FAQ-ritalin.php
>>>
>>>Ritalin Addiction
>>>Ritalin addiction is a very serious and sometimes life threatening dilemma.
>>Not
>>>only is it difficult for the addict, it is extremely hard on those around
>>them
>>>who care about them. For the addict, admitting they have an addiction
>>problem
>>>can be difficult. However painful this may be, it must be acknowledged as
>>the
>>>first gradient to overcoming the problem. The next hurdle is being willing
>>to
>>>seek & accept help from an addiction professional. It can be hard for an
>>addict
>>>to confront the fact that they can not do it alone. Once this fact is
>>accepted,
>>>it is time to seek the appropriate professional treatment. Drug rehab
>>programs
>>>based on the social education modality are highly successful. This means
>>that
>>>individuals who are recovering from Ritalin addiction are not made wrong for
>>>their past indiscretions, but are taught how to avoid future ones. They are
>>>provided with knowledge on how to change their lives and how to live
>>>comfortably without Ritalin. Receiving treatment for addiction should be
>>done
>>>in a safe & stable environment that is conducive to addiction recovery.
>>>Research studies show that residential treatment programs of at least 3
>>months
>>>in duration have the best success rates. 3 months may seem like a long time,
>>>but one day in the life of an individual addicted to Ritalin can feel like
>>an
>>>eternity. Addiction is a self imposed hellish slavery. The chains can be
>>broken
>>>people do it everyday. You can be free!
>>>
>>>Drug rehabilitation is a multi-phase, multi-faceted, long term process.
>>>Detoxification is only the first step on the road of addiction treatment.
>>>Physical detoxification alone is not sufficient to change the patterns of a
>>>drug addict. Recovery from addiction involves an extended process which
>>usually
>>>requires the help of drug addiction professionals. To make a successful
>>>recovery, the addict needs new tools in order to deal with situations and
>>>problems which arise. Factors such as encountering someone from their days
>>of
>>>using, returning to the same environment and places, or even small things
>>such
>>>as smells and objects trigger memories which can create psychological
>>stress.
>>>This can hinder the addict's goal of complete recovery, thus not allowing
>>the
>>>addict to permanently regain control of his or her life.
>>>
>>>Almost all addicts tell themselves in the beginning that they can conquer
>>their
>>>addiction on their own without the help of outside resources. Unfortunately,
>>>this is not usually the case. When an addict makes an attempt at
>>detoxification
>>>and to discontinue drug use without the aid of professional help,
>>statistically
>>>the results do not last long. Research into the effects of long-term
>>addiction
>>>has shown that substantial changes in the way the brain functions are
>>present
>>>long after the addict has stopped using drugs. Realizing that a drug addict
>>who
>>>wishes to recover from their addiction needs more than just strong will
>>power
>>>is the key to a successful recovery. Battling not only cravings for their
>>drug
>>>of choice, re-stimulation of their past and changes in the way their brain
>>>functions, it is no wonder that quitting drugs without professional help is
>>an
>>>uphill battle.
>>>
>>>As an organization we are dedicated to finding the correct solution for your
>>>specific addiction problem. Our referral list contains over 3,000 resources
>>>which encompass the following treatment categories :
>>>
>>>Ritalin Detox Center
>>>Ritalin Rehab
>>>Ritalin Treatment
>>>Ritalin Addiction Treatment
>>>Ritalin Addiction Counseling
>>>Meetings
>>>Ritalin In-Patient Treatment
>>>Ritalin Out-Patient Treatment
>>>
>>>In 1990, 900,000 American kids were on Ritalin. Today some estimate the
>>total
>>>number of children on Ritalin has increased to 4 - 5 million or more per
>>year
>>>America now uses 90% of the world's Ritalin - more than five times the rest
>>of
>>>the world combined.
>>>Emergency room visits by children ages 10-14 involving Ritalin intoxication
>>>have now reached the same level as those for cocaine which indicates
>>escalating
>>>abuse of this highly addictive drug.
>>>80% of children on Ritalin are boys.
>>>
>>>--------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>------
>>>
>>>Q) What is Ritalin?
>>>
>>>A) Ritalin (methylphenidate) is a central nervous system stimulant, similar
>>to
>>>amphetamines in the nature and duration of its effects. It is believed that
>>it
>>>works by activating the brain stem arousal system and cortex.
>>>Pharmacologically, it works on the neurotransmitter dopamine, and in that
>>>respect resembles the stimulant characteristics of cocaine. When taken in
>>>accordance with usual prescription instructions, it would be classified as
>>>having mild to moderate stimulant properties, but when snorted or injected
>>it
>>>has a strong stimulant effect. Ritalin is manufactured by CIBA-Geigy
>>>Corporation, and is supplied in 5 mg., 10 mg., and 20 mg. tablets, and in a
>>>sustained release form, Ritalin SR as 20 mg. tablets. It is readily water
>>>soluble and is intended for oral use. It is a Schedule II Controlled
>>Substance
>>>under both the federal and Indiana Controlled Substances Acts. Since Ritalin
>>is
>>>a Schedule II Controlled Substance, the federal government strictly
>>regulates
>>>the amount that may be manufactured, through a system of rigid manufacturing
>>>quotas.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>--------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>------
>>>
>>>Q) How is Ritalin used?
>>>
>>>A) When abused, Ritalin tablets are taken orally, crushed and then snorted,
>>or
>>>dissolved in water and "cooked" for intravenous injection.
>>>There are numerous reports in medical journals about permanent and
>>irreversible
>>>lung tissue damage related to injection of crushed Ritalin tablets.
>>>
>>>In order to make the 5- to 20 mg. dose tablets large enough to handle
>>easily,
>>>at least 100 mg. of "inert ingredients" are added to the tablets to increase
>>>their size. Depending upon size and formulation, the following inert
>>>ingredients are found in Ritalin tablets, according to the manufacturer:
>>>lactose, starch, polyethelene glycol, magnesium stearate, sucrose, talc,
>>>cellulose, mineral oil, and various dyes and conditioning agents. While
>>these
>>>ingredients are "inert" when taken by mouth, they can cause serious problems
>>>when injected or snorted.
>>>
>>>Health Consequences of Intravenous and/or Injection Drug Use
>>>The hypodermic syringe was designed to deliver a concentrated dose of a drug
>>>quickly and efficiently. In doing so, it bypasses many of the body's natural
>>>defense mechanisms such as the skin, respiratory cilia, digestive acids,
>>etc.
>>>The syringe allows anything in it (drugs, dust, bacteria, pollen, allergens,
>>>yeasts, viruses, fillers, etc.) to pass directly into the blood and body
>>>tissues. The rapid delivery of drugs via injection makes it difficult for
>>the
>>>user to control the intensity of the drug effect, thus making toxic
>>overdoses
>>>more likely.
>>>When drugs are prepared for injection by a street user, dust, dirt, and
>>other
>>>contaminants fall into the liquid. Bacteria, talc, lint, and other particles
>>>are injected along with the drug. The "inert ingredients" that manufacturers
>>>include to increase the bulk may be harmless when taken by mouth, but talc,
>>>cellulose, mineral oil, and sugars (among other fillers) can create serious
>>>problems when injected directly into veins or body tissues. Complications
>>from
>>>injection drug use include:
>>>drug overdoses and toxic overdose reactions
>>>blood clots from scar tissue, particles in the liquid, cotton and lint
>>fibers,
>>>etc.
>>>infections ("blood poisoning," abscesses, hepatitis, AIDS, etc.)
>>>scars ("tracks" and adhesions)
>>>pulmonary problems ("addict's lung," embolisms, etc.)
>>>skin and circulatory problems
>>>
>>>Health consequences of Snorting Drugs (Intranasal Insufflation)
>>>The delicate epithelial tissues that line the nasal cavities and air
>>passages
>>>may be damaged by direct contact with drugs. Ritalin tablets contain the
>>>hydrochloride salt of methylphenidate and yield dilute hydrochloric acid
>>when
>>>they come into contact with moisture. While this is not a problem in the
>>>stomach (hydrochloric acid is one of the digestive acids used in the
>>stomach),
>>>in the nasal passages the acid can "burn" the delicate nasal tissues,
>>resulting
>>>in open sores, nose bleeds, and possibly in deterioration of the nasal
>>>cartilage.
>>>
>>>--------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>------
>>>
>>>Q) What are the side effects of Ritalin?
>>>
>>>A) The side effects of Ritalin addiction include but are not limited to:
>>>
>>>drug addiction
>>>nervousness and insomnia
>>>loss of appetite
>>>nausea and vomiting
>>>dizziness
>>>headaches
>>>changes in heart rate and blood pressure (usually elevation of both, but
>>>occasionally depression)
>>>skin rashes and itching
>>>abdominal pain
>>>weight loss
>>>digestive problems
>>>toxic psychosis
>>>psychotic episodes
>>>severe depression upon withdrawal
>>>High doses of stimulants produce a predictable set of symptoms that include:
>>
>>>
>>>loss of appetite (may cause serious malnutrition)
>>>tremors and muscle twitching
>>>fevers, convulsions, and headaches (may be severe)
>>>irregular heartbeat and respiration (may be profound and life threatening)
>>>anxiety, restlessness
>>>paranoia, hallucinations, and delusions
>>>excessive repetition of movements and meaningless tasks
>>>formicaton (sensation of bugs or worms crawling under the skin)
>>>While death due to non-medical use of Ritalin is not common, it has been
>>known
>>>to occur.
>>>
>>>
>>>--------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>------
>>>
>>>Q) What are the symptoms of Ritalin overdose?
>>>
>>>A) Symptoms of Ritalin overdose may include: Agitation, confusion,
>>convulsions
>>>(may be followed by coma), delirium, dryness of mucous membranes, enlarging
>>of
>>>the pupil of the eye, exaggerated feeling of elation, extremely elevated
>>body
>>>temperature, flushing, hallucinations, headache, high blood pressure,
>>irregular
>>>or rapid heartbeat, muscle twitching, sweating, tremors, vomiting.
>>>
>>>A growing number of youngsters taking the drug Ritalin® (methylphenidate)
>>>experience overdose, researchers report. The study looked at the frequency
>>of
>>>Ritalin overdose cases reported to a regional poison control center in
>>Detroit.
>>>Children ages 6 to 9 years were at the greatest risk of overdose, compared
>>with
>>>other age groups. Over a two-year period, 289 cases were reported. Of these,
>>>31% developed symptoms. Most common adverse effects included tachycardia,
>>>agitation and lethargy. Most cases were due to parents or caregivers
>>>unintentionally giving patients excessive amounts of the drug
>>
>>
>>prhaps this should be incorporated in Joe Parson's "FAQ" ???
>
>Like I said, I'll wager these people know more about it than Joe.

Thats a kind thought

I dont think its a question of lack of knowledge

http://www.winternet.com/~mikelr/flame48.html


>
>Jan
>
 
> Decoding Psychiatric Propaganda
> http://groups.msn.com/psychbusters

> 11. Side-effects or Ritalin: increased blood pressure, heart rate,
> respirations and temperature; appetite suppression, weight loss,
> growth retardation; facial tics, muscle twitching, central nervous
> system stimulation, euphoria, nervousness, irritability and agitation,
> psychotic episodes, violent behavior, paranoid delusions,
> hallucinations, bizarre behaviors, heart arrhythmias, palpitations and
> high blood pressure; tolerance and psychological dependence and death.

You know, before starting methylphenidate, my blood pressure was so
low, I had trouble getting up/staying standing.

As for the death thing, I don't randomly fall now, so I think i've
increased my chances of staying alive..

-i
 
On Sun, 21 Sep 2003 07:50:50 +0100, jake <[email protected]> wrote:

>On Sun, 21 Sep 2003 05:20:59 GMT, Carey Gregory
><[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>[email protected] (Mark Probert) wrote:
>>
>>>Better..I right clicked on it and made it my wallpaper.
>>
>>Oh, thank goodness
>
>
>uhuh..here comes Carey Gregory
>
> > We were all really worried there for a while.
>
>who is "we"..?
>
>you and your cat?
>
>
>
>>
>>Okay, so I've got to ask....
>
>nah you dont..but your sort cant resist can they?
>
>
>>
>>Here you two are carrying on your own intimate little conversation (complete
>>with huge binary attachments), cross-posting it to no less than 5 newsgroups
>>(none of which are even remotely relevant to whatever it is you're talking
>>about), and yet you both seem downright blissful.
>
>jealous are you..well you always have your cat!

I hiked the high divide above the Hoh valley. Incredible. When the
full moon rose it was so stunning it looked like the Ruskies had
dropped the big one on the horizon.

The surreal was going from the incredible backcountry to the area
where repeated commercial timber harvests had turned the land into a
stick farm, then passing a beaten trailer with stickers about another
timber industry job.

Sure, we need sticks to build wood frame houses, but the incredible
backcountry in the PNW or coastal Alaska cannot be turned into a stick
farm for trailer park jobs. All the money from the timber went
somewhere else.

......Bush is a calk sucker.

-G
 
I was not aware that the reply also carri
"Carey Gregory" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> [email protected] (Mark Probert) wrote:
>
> >Better..I right clicked on it and made it my wallpaper.
>
> Oh, thank goodness. We were all really worried there for a while.
>
> Okay, so I've got to ask....
>
> Here you two are carrying on your own intimate little conversation
(complete
> with huge binary attachments), cross-posting it to no less than 5
newsgroups
> (none of which are even remotely relevant to whatever it is you're talking
> about), and yet you both seem downright blissful.
>
> So, are you trying to make some sort of point? Are you in love and you
want
> the world to know? Is this some sort of freshman psych experiment? Your
> email doesn't work so you're using newsgroups instead?
>
> Just curious....
>
 
"Jan" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> >Subject: Re: Drug Enforcement Agency: Methylphenidate (Ritalin)
> >From: [email protected] (David Wright)
> >Date: 9/19/2003 11:54 AM Pacific Standard Time
> >Message-id: <[email protected]>
> >
> >In article <[email protected]>,
> >F Troop <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>
> >>"David Wright" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >>news:[email protected]...
> >>> In article <[email protected]>,
> >>> F Troop <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>> >
> >>> >"Jeff" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >>> >news:[email protected]...
> >>> >> Read the last paragraph of the article you cite:
> >>> >> http://www.usdoj.gov/dea/pubs/cngrtest/ct051600.htm
> >>> >>
> >>> >> When taken as prescribed, methylphenidate is safe and effective.
> >>> >>
> >>> >
> >>> >The compliance rate amongst people who are prescribed psychotropic
drugs
> >>is
> >>> >so low, that is a moot point.
> >>>
> >>> "Studies report noncompliance rates of 20-65% with stimulant
> >>> treatment, although there are only limited published studies
> >>> and these show considerable individual variation."
> >>> (Swanson, J., "Compliance with stimulants for attention-
> >>> deficit/hyperactivity disorder: issues and approaches
> >>> for improviement", CNS Drugs 2003; 17(2): 117-31.)
> >>>
> >>> So, FTroop, you're blowing smoke.
> >>
> >>Hardly.
> >>
> >>The compliance rate of psychiatric treatments is said to be low relative
to
> >>the 75-90% compliance rate to treatment for physiological conditions.
> >
> >"Is said to be?" By whom? You? Give me a cite or put a sock in it.
> >
> >>The low compliance rate of those receiving psychiatric treatment means
one
> >>can't dismiss the danger posed by the addictive properties of stimulants
by
> >>assertions they are safe when taken as directed, where up to 65% of
people
> >>don't take stimulants as directed.
> >
> >Hardly. "Up to 65%". Or maybe it's 20%. You don't know and neither
> >do I. Nobody knows. So your claim of "most" is baseless.
> >
> >Furthermore, ritalin is not particularly addictive when taken orally
> >(as opposed to when snorted).
>
> Wrong again.

Again, Jan did not read what she posted. If she did:



> http://www.drug-rehabs.org/faqs/FAQ-ritalin.php

snip

> Q) How is Ritalin used?
>
> A) When abused, Ritalin tablets are taken orally, crushed and then
snorted, or
> dissolved in water and "cooked" for intravenous injection.
> There are numerous reports in medical journals about permanent and
irreversible
> lung tissue damage related to injection of crushed Ritalin tablets.

See..the article is talking about ABUSE, not use as prescribed, which is by
taking the medication orally..

What a nitwit.
 
"Jan" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> >From: [email protected] (David Wright)
> >Date: 9/19/2003 6:46 PM Pacific Standard Time
> >Message-id: <[email protected]>
> >
>
> <snip>
>
> >Since there's now evidence that children treated with ritalin are much
> >less likely to become drug abusers later in life than those untreated,
> >exactly who are we protecting from what?
>
> No there isn't any new evidence, that's the debunkers twist. They added
the
> untreated. There is MUCH evidence that those on Ritalin will move on to
> stronger drugs, and become addicted.

The evidence actually shows the opposite.
 
"Jan" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> >Subject: Re: Drug Enforcement Agency: Methylphenidate (Ritalin)
> >From: nknisley [email protected]
> >Date: 9/20/2003 1:06 PM Pacific Standard Time
> >Message-id: <[email protected]>
> >
> >Jeff wrote:
> >> "jake" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >> news:[email protected]...
> >>
> >>>On Sat, 20 Sep 2003 09:07:21 GMT, [email protected] (PF Riley)
> >>>wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>On Sat, 20 Sep 2003 03:56:33 GMT, "Roger Schlafly"
> >>>><[email protected]> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>"Jeff" <[email protected]> wrote
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>>>no ..is this relevant to whether ritalin is nearly identical with
> >>>>>>>>cocaine as the DEA says?
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>It is true, whether the DEA says it or not.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Ritalin works on the many or all of the same receptors as
amphetamine
> >>
> >> and
> >>
> >>>>>>cocaine. However, the onset of action and the time it takes for the
> >>>>>
> >>>>>effects
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>to wear off are vastly different. These diffences in
pharmacokinetics
> >>>>>
> >>>>>makes
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>the drugs very different.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Think of ritalin as slow-acting cocaine.
> >>>>
> >>>>Or think of it as a slow-acting methamphetamine derivative, since
> >>>>that's what it is, idiot.
> >>>
> >>>ever taken cocaine or meths ?
> >>>
> >>>Most drugs categorized as having addictive properties effect the
> >>>release or re-uptake of the neurotransmitters Dopamine (DA) and/or
> >>>Norephinephrine (NE). Drugs in this category include cocaine, and the
> >>>amphetamine class of stimulants (i.e.; benzedrine and the ever
> >>>addictive methylphenidate [ritalin]).
> >>
> >>
> >> Yet methylphenidate, when taken as prescribed, is not addicting.
> >>
> >> There is more to a drugs actions than just receptors and
neuromodulators.
> >>
> >
> >As the following information indicates:
> >
> >"New Research Helps Explain Ritalin's Low Abuse Potential When Taken as
> >Prescribed" http://www.nida.nih.gov/MedAdv/98/MA-929.html .
>
> American Journal of Psychiatry
>
> NIDA, the National Institute of Mental Health,
>
> NIH Office of Medical Applications of Research
>
> Nuff said.

Yes, that is sure enough. They know what they are doing.

You don't.
 
"Jan" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> >Subject: Re: Drug Enforcement Agency: Methylphenidate (Ritalin)
> >From: "Jeff" [email protected]
> >Date: 9/19/2003 7:49 PM Pacific Standard Time
> >Message-id: <[email protected]>
> >
> >
> >"Roger Schlafly" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >news:[email protected]...
> >> "jake" <[email protected]> wrote
> >> > no ..is this relevant to whether ritalin is nearly identical with
> >> > cocaine as the DEA says?
> >>
> >> It is true, whether the DEA says it or not.
> >>
> >
> >Ritalin works on the many or all of the same receptors as amphetamine and
> >cocaine. However, the onset of action and the time it takes for the
effects
> >to wear off are vastly different. These diffences in pharmacokinetics
makes
> >the drugs very different.
> >
> >Jeff
>
> http://www.mercola.com/2001/sep/26/ritalin.htm
>
>
> Ritalin is More Potent Than Cocaine
>
>
> By Jean West
>
> The children's drug Ritalin has a more potent effect on the brain than
cocaine.
>
>
> Using brain imaging, scientists have found that, in pill form, Ritalin -
taken
> by thousands of British children and four million in the United States -
> occupies more of the neural transporters responsible for the 'high'
experienced
> by addicts than smoked or injected cocaine. The research may alarm parents
> whose children have been prescribed Ritalin as a solution to Attention
Deficit
> Hyperactive Disorder.
>
> The study was commissioned to understand more about why Ritalin - which
has the
> same pharmacological profile as cocaine - is effective in calming children
and
> helping them concentrate, while cocaine produces an intense 'high' and is
> powerfully addictive.
>
> In oral form, Ritalin did not induce this intense psychological 'hit'. But
Dr
> Nora Volkow, psychiatrist and imaging expert at Brookhaven National
Laboratory,
> in Upton, New York, who led the study, said that injected into the veins
as a
> liquid rather than taken as a pill, it produced a rush that 'addicts like
very
> much'.
>
> Interviewed in last week's Journal of the American Medical Association
> newsletter, she said: 'They say it's like cocaine.'

Dr. Volkow, when I heard her speak, supported the use of MPH in treating
ADHD.

She is now the head of the NIDA.

Bush's best appointment so far.
 
In article <[email protected]>,
"F Troop" <[email protected]> wrote:

> "Joe Parsons" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:p[email protected]...
> >
> > I am incredulous...asking for substantiation for an assertion is a
> "trick."
>
> Why are you incredulous you are viewed as trolling whenever you make
> gratuitous requests others provide you a cite to substantiate assertions
> without your providing any empirical data or grounds for questioning their
> assertion, Joe?

Perhaps because it is up to the person doing the asserting, not the one
questioning the assertion, to back up his or her claims. It is a very
simple concept.


> You and the other ASAD trolls have been repeatedly told that unless you
> provide contradictory empirical data or some reasonable grounds for
> questioning an assertion, your gratutious requests for cites will be
> dismissed as trolling.

Logical fallacy used above:

Shifting the burden of proof, which is a special case of argumentum ad
ignorantiam. See also:

http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/burden-of-proof.html
http://www.infidels.org/news/atheism/logic.html#shifting
http://www.infidels.org/news/atheism/logic.html#ignorantiam
http://gncurtis.home.texas.net/ignorant.html
http://datanation.com/fallacies/distract/ig.htm
http://www.skepticreport.com/tools/logicfallacies.htm

--
Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
|
|"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
| inconvenience me with questions?"
 
reposted for Buny to see in asad
"Jan" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> >Subject: Re: Drug Enforcement Agency: Methylphenidate (Ritalin)
> >From: "SumBuny" [email protected]
> >Date: 9/20/2003 1:02 PM Pacific Standard Time
> >Message-id: <Yc3bb.2307$AH4.1554@lakeread06>
> >
> >
> >"F Troop" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >news:[email protected]...
> >> http://www.addictionwithdrawal.com/ritalin.htm
> >>
> >> Ritalin Withdrawal
> >>
> >> Ritalin (methylphenidate) is a central nervous system stimulant,
similar
> >to
> >> amphetamines in the nature and duration of its effects. It is believed
> >that
> >> it works by activating the brain stem arousal system and cortex.
> >> Pharmacologically, it works on the neurotransmitter dopamine, and in
that
> >> respect resembles the stimulant characteristics of cocaine. When taken
in
> >> accordance with usual prescription instructions, it would be classified
as
> >> having mild to moderate stimulant properties, but when snorted or
injected
> >> it has a strong stimulant effect.
> >
> >IOW, those who *abuse* the medication run into trouble...those of us who
> >*take as directed* do not...
>
> Trouble is IT IS BEING ABUSED!!!
>
> Secondly it is given to children who brains aren't developed yet, don't
mess
> with mothers nature.
>
> Thirdly your statement is false. Those who do take it as directed do have
> problems.
>
> >Funny thing is--that is true of *any* medication, whether prescription or
> >over-the-counter....
>
> Sorry, this is a stupid skeptic trick. Sounds childish.
>
> Example:
>
> A child is caught smoking. Oh but he can say, well I wasn't drinking and
it's
> just as bad. Does that excuse his smoking??
>
> I thik not.
>
> > Ritalin is an addictive drug and mimics the action of chemicals your
brain
> >> produces to send messages of pleasure to your brain's reward center.
> >Ritalin
> >> produces an artificial feeling of pleasure. Ritalin produces its
> >pleasurable effects by chemically acting like certain normal brain
messenger
> >chemicals,
> >> which produce positive feelings in response to signals from the brain.
>
> > The result is an addiction to Ritalin because the individual can depend
on
> >> the immediate, fast, predictable high Ritalin provides.
>
> >IOW, those who *abuse* the medication run into trouble...those of us who
> >*take as directed* do not...
>
> No that's an excuse.
>
> >My question....how is it that we who take it as directed for our ADHD
> >*forget* to take the medication we are supposedly "addicted" to? It
happens
> >more often than not.
> >
> >Buny
>
> And what happens, when you don't take it??
>
> Jan
 
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