Dutch Bikes, Literally

[Elisa Francesca]

I'm still scouring the market for a bicycle that has all the comfort and safety features I want.

Two Saturdays ago I visited a dealer in the 16th Arrondissment who specializes in Dutch bikes. He
had several Giant bikes of the kind I'm interested in: Nexus 7 or 8 speed shifters or SRAM
DualDrives or Rohloff shifters, Roller brakes or roller-V-brake combinations, hub dynamo lights,
full chain-guards, skirt guards, luggage racks, front baskets, very low step-through, as light as
possible under the circumstances. Interestingly, these models of Giant were not on either of the two
catalogues 2003 or 2004 that I had taken home from previous research.

The dealer told me this was because this kind of model is not sold in France. People who live in
Paris intramuros want city-bikes, but don't want to spend more than a couple hundred because the
bikes are too easily stolen if they have to be parked in the street. Consequently the upmarket
city-bike has a poor sales performance here. It requires a garage with a private box, a suburban
configuration, but suburbanites seem to prefer VTTs, especially in hilly Essonne.

However, he told me he could procure me a "real" Dutch bike and showed me some catalogues, which I
have since followed up on the Internet. There are 4 main producers: www.union.nl www.sparta.nl
www.gazelle.nl www.batavus.nl

I fell in love with a bike by Union called the Oase. (Fortunately, it turns out bike specs in Dutch
are quite easy to understand.) According to this dealer, these true Dutch bikes are much better
quality than their mass-market equivalents by Giant or similar. He said the finishing was far better
and that they were more aesthetic and durable. He had no financial interest in maintaining this
since the cost of the bikes was very equivalent to the Giants he stocked and there would have to be
a special order.

Just wondering if anyone had experiences or comments to pass on these makes. I remember a thread
about marketing Batavus in the USA and how many posters opined that there wouldn't be much of a
market there either. Are there no Dutch in the forum?

Elisa Francesca Roselli Ile de France

 

[Mark]

"Elisa Francesca Roselli" wrote .. <snip>
> Just wondering if anyone had experiences or comments to pass on these makes. I remember a thread
> about marketing Batavus in the USA and how many posters opined that there wouldn't be much of a
> market there either. Are there no Dutch in the forum?
>
> Elisa Francesca Roselli Ile de France
>

There is a Dutch cycling NG called nl.fiets. Maybe someone there could help?

At any rate, it seems that you have finally found a good LBS.
--
mark

 

[Robert Chung]

Elisa Francesca Roselli wrote:
> However, he told me he could procure me a "real" Dutch bike and showed me some catalogues, which I
> have since followed up on the Internet. There are 4 main producers: www.union.nl www.sparta.nl
> www.gazelle.nl www.batavus.nl
>
> I fell in love with a bike by Union called the Oase. (Fortunately, it turns out bike specs in
> Dutch are quite easy to understand.) According to this dealer, these true Dutch bikes are much
> better quality than their mass-market equivalents by Giant or similar. He said the finishing was
> far better and that they were more aesthetic and durable. He had no financial interest in
> maintaining this since the cost of the bikes was very equivalent to the Giants he stocked and
> there would have to be a special order.

I believe there's a bike shop that specializes in real Hollandais on rue Diderot in the 12eme (Metro
Reuilly-Diderot, near the intersection with Crozatier). You might be able to see and ride such a
bike there.

 

[Elisa Francesca]

mark wrote:

> There is a Dutch cycling NG called nl.fiets. Maybe someone there could help?

Good suggestion. It may be rude to go in there speaking English but I expect most posters would
understand me.

> At any rate, it seems that you have finally found a good LBS.

Unfortunately, the 16th Arrondissment is so far off local that the delivery from there to my home
will probably come to another 50 Euros or so. I am also investigating the possibility of ordering
from a dealer in Belgium (nearest direct outlet) to have the bike shipped to my office as it could
come out cheaper.

EFR

 

[Peter]

"Elisa Francesca Roselli" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I'm still scouring the market for a bicycle that has all the comfort and safety features I want.
cut...

My wife has a Giant bike that comes with everything you describe except the basket, which I easily
fitted. Its the Giant SuXes 7. (That is how its spelt)It has a seven speed Nexus hub, front and rear
hub brakes, built in rear lock, bright dynamo lights, chain and skirt guard, carrier you could load
an elephant onto, bell and so on..

She fell in love with Dutch style bikes when we were on holiday in Amsterdam last year and after
scouring everywhere we decided the Giant is the best equipped and most durable. Its built like a
tank and you won't win any races on it as its heavy, but after a year of constant use and being
jammed into a shed overnights with the other bikes it still looks like new. The strange thing is it
was about half the price of the other Dutch bikes we looked at.

Theres a link to it in English at: http://www.giant-bicycles.com/uk/030.000.000/030.000.000.asp?dea-
lerid=&dealercountry=&lYear=2003&bikesection=8786&range=78&model=9861

Its also on the Giant french site at: http://www.giant-bicycles.com/fr/030.000.000/030.000.000.asp?-
dealerid=&dealercountry=&lYear=2003&bikesection=8785&range=88&model=9907 hope this helps peter

 

[Robert Chung]

Robert Chung wrote:
> Elisa Francesca Roselli wrote:
>> However, he told me he could procure me a "real" Dutch bike and showed me some catalogues, which
>> I have since followed up on the Internet. There are 4 main producers: www.union.nl www.sparta.nl
>> www.gazelle.nl www.batavus.nl
>>
>> I fell in love with a bike by Union called the Oase. (Fortunately, it turns out bike specs in
>> Dutch are quite easy to understand.) According to this dealer, these true Dutch bikes are much
>> better quality than their mass-market equivalents by Giant or similar. He said the finishing was
>> far better and that they were more aesthetic and durable. He had no financial interest in
>> maintaining this since the cost of the bikes was very equivalent to the Giants he stocked and
>> there would have to be a special order.
>
> I believe there's a bike shop that specializes in real Hollandais on rue Diderot in the 12eme
> (Metro Reuilly-Diderot, near the intersection with Crozatier). You might be able to see and ride
> such a bike there.

Here's the web address: http://www.hollandbikes.com/

 

[Peter Storey]

Elisa Francesca Roselli <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> I'm still scouring the market for a bicycle that has all the comfort and safety features I want.
>
> Two Saturdays ago I visited a dealer in the 16th Arrondissment who specializes in Dutch
> bikes. <SNIP>
>
> The dealer told me this was because this kind of model is not sold in France. People who live in
> Paris intramuros want city-bikes, but don't want to spend more than a couple hundred because the
> bikes are too easily stolen if they have to be parked in the street. Consequently the upmarket
> city-bike has a poor sales performance here. It requires a garage with a private box, a suburban
> configuration, but suburbanites seem to prefer VTTs, especially in hilly Essonne.
>
> <SNIP>
>
> Elisa Francesca Roselli Ile de France

The "real" Dutch bikes are truly magnificent, and I can sympathize with your desire for one. Great
finish, lots of accessories, total comfort. Very classy and very classic.

But did you say "hilly Essonne"? The Oase is said to weigh almost 22kg (48 lbs). In fact, that is
not terribly out of line for a fully-equipped Dutch city bike, but it may explain why so few are
sold in France. How it is that an aluminum-framed bike can weigh that much is still something of a
mystery to me, but the same is true of the Gazelle and Batavus offerings.

The 8-speed gearing on the Oase will probably get you up the hills, but it will be VERY slow going.
Unless you are planning to keep it in Paris, are you sure this is the right style of bike for you? A
hybrid ("loisir" or "VTC" as opposed to "Ville") might make a better choice, even if you have to add
some of the accessories yourself.

Also to consider: the Decathlon City 5 is said to weigh 4kg less than the Oase, sells for one-third
as much and is probably easier to get hold of. Less a work of art, but also less of an investment.
The 21-speed derailleur gearing may also offer some greater flexibility, although it requires more
careful maintenance.

Hope this helps,

Peter Storey

 

[Risto Varanka]

Elisa Francesca Roselli <[email protected]> wrote:

: Unfortunately, the 16th Arrondissment is so far off local that the delivery from there to my home
: will probably come to another 50 Euros or so.

You can't ride it home?

--
Risto Varanka | http://www.helsinki.fi/~rvaranka/hpv/hpv.html varis at no spam please iki fi

 

[Don Wiss]

On 4 Nov 2003, [email protected] (Peter Storey) wrote:

>But did you say "hilly Essonne"? The Oase is said to weigh almost 22kg (48 lbs). In fact, that is
>not terribly out of line for a fully-equipped Dutch city bike, but it may explain why so few are
>sold in France. How it is that an aluminum-framed bike can weigh that much is still something of a
>mystery to me, but the same is true of the Gazelle and Batavus offerings.

My Batavus Legato weighs only 20.3 kg (44 2/3 lbs). See it at:
http://www.batavus.nl/2002/collectie/bike.asp?bikeid=408

>The 8-speed gearing on the Oase will probably get you up the hills, but it will be VERY slow going.

You can change your rear cog wheel. Dutch bikes have the center gear to be equivalent to a one-speed
bike. I changed by rear cog wheel from 17 to 20 teeth. This moved the straight through position
exactly one notch from gear 4 to gear 5. I could have gone more if needed. I do have a 21 cog wheel
here. Maybe when I get older I'll use it.

Don <donwiss at panix.com>.

 

[Bernie]

Elisa Francesca Roselli wrote:

>
>mark wrote:
>
>>There is a Dutch cycling NG called nl.fiets. Maybe someone there could help?
>>
>
>Good suggestion. It may be rude to go in there speaking English but I expect most posters would
>understand me.
>
>>At any rate, it seems that you have finally found a good LBS.
>>
>
>Unfortunately, the 16th Arrondissment is so far off local that the delivery from there to my home
>will probably come to another 50 Euros or so. I am also investigating the possibility of ordering
>from a dealer in Belgium (nearest direct outlet) to have the bike shipped to my office as it could
>come out cheaper.
>
>EFR
>
Give most value to the shop that you can visit when necessary. Your Frenchman sounds promising. You
can see him/her for parts and tune ups, and get looked after properly. I remember your earlier posts
about the shops charging for the simplest adjustments and not offering any advice. Shame on them!

Anyway, my experience is, if you buy a bicycle, and are a faithful customer, the bike shop will give
you blue ribbon service. My shop gives me discounts, calls as soon as the work is done, and the
mechanic makes simple adjustments (like tuning my brakes) without batting an eye. Overall they are
good to me, and mainly all I do is buy tires and tubes and the occasional blinky, plus a tune up now
and then. Life is good. Ride on! Bernie

 

[Elisa Francesca]

Peter Storey wrote:

> But did you say "hilly Essonne"? The Oase is said to weigh almost 22kg (48 lbs).

That's odd. This page has changed over the past few days. The Oase I was looking at only last week
had 7 speeds, not 8, and weighed under 20 kg
- in fact it was one of the lighter ones in its category. It also cost 755 Euros as opposed to
nearly 900. I guess they upped the specs and price for 2004 when I had my back turned. In fact, it
looks like the whole catalogue has changed. The old Oase was much closer to what they are now
calling the Sphinx, with 7 speeds. There was also a bike called the Flamingo which was a good
runner-up, which is no longer listed.

> In fact, that is not terribly out of line for a fully-equipped Dutch city bike, but it may explain
> why so few are sold in France. How it is that an aluminum-framed bike can weigh that much is still
> something of a mystery to me, but the same is true of the Gazelle and Batavus offerings.

True, the Giant Melbourne that I had wanted to buy was listed at under 18 kg. Unfortunately it is no
longer sold, and I don't much like what they are offering as its replacements. Moreover, they cost
as much as the true Dutch and I am told they are much less classy in the flesh..

> The 8-speed gearing on the Oase will probably get you up the hills, but it will be VERY slow
> going. Unless you are planning to keep it in Paris, are you sure this is the right style of bike
> for you? A hybrid ("loisir" or "VTC" as opposed to "Ville") might make a better choice, even if
> you have to add some of the accessories yourself.

I don't ever want to look at a derailleur again. I consider an integrated hub shifter to be of the
first necessity. Trips in the hills may become a regular occurence but for the moment I have the
daily trip to work, over a trifling 1.6 km to think about. And on that trip, I am thoroughly fed up
with being unable to restart at every traffic light, and having to organize elaborate shifting
sequences and go meters out of my way just to be able to move. When I do travel the 11 kms to Les
Ulis, I have to do the whole trip in 1st gear because of this traffic light problem. Have you
noticed how lights are always at the lowest point between two hills?

> Also to consider: the Decathlon City 5 is said to weigh 4kg less than the Oase, sells for
> one-third as much and is probably easier to get hold of. Less a work of art, but also less of an
> investment.

I already have a supermarket bike. I want a nice bike now, My Definitive Bike. Cost isn't really an
issue, if I could only have what I want. I just wish someone could invent something like the Oase
but 4 kg lighter and with a Rohloff shifter. Also, please not in black. I want a bike, not a hearse.

EFR

 

[Elisa Francesca]

[email protected] wrote:

> You can't ride it home?

Perhaps, if I allow four days.

EFR

 

[Elisa Francesca]

Peter Storey wrote:

> The Oase is said to weigh almost 22kg (48 lbs).

Found one at Sparta, the Helios, with a weight of 17.8 kg, 7 speeds etc, unsuspended (prefereble for
my weight) at 750€. Plus, it's metallic blue. Must look nto this.

EFR