Early 80's Campagnolo Viner Parts Questions

[lizzardlizzah]

Hello there!
So recently my dad gave me his older Campagnolo Viner. All I really know about it is that it is an early 80's model and my dad put a lot of parts on it (mostly Campy stuff, but I think the bars are different). He gave it to me after I expressed interest in restoring it for my personal use. It is in pretty good condition. So far I have cleaned the bike, cassette, and chain, replaced the tubes and tires, took off the old brake cables and housing, derailleur cables, and the brake handle housing.
Aside from the tires and tubes, I'd like to keep everything Campy. I've been looking for brake cables and housings along with derailleur cables. I found a few on Amazon but most are made for new bikes. I'm curious as to if I could use any of them for my bike. I have attached pictures of the cable heads and the bike in general. I don't have access to any digital calipers (it's back in Austin, I'm in Dallas), so I don't know the thickness of the cables yet, but I may break down and go buy one. My dad also suggested that I get new brake pads.
I guess my questions for you guys are:
1. Can I use newer cables for the derailleur and brakes if they match the thickness of the original one?
2. What websites do you use to get parts from?
3. Where can I find brake pads that match the original, or at least ones that fit?
4. Same goes with the brake handle housing.
If I can find and replace most of these, I can get it running. After it's finished I would like to get everything checked out and the wheels aligned to make sure it's in the best shape for riding. Is there anything else I need to do after installing parts? Did I leave anything out? This is my first post and my first time fixing up a bike.

Thanks for all of the help!
Cheers,
Lizzy

 

[alfeng]

Nice bike ...

1. You can use newer, stainless steel cables as replacements for the galvenized steel cables
   • you will want to lube the cables with ANY light grease (white lithium, etc.)
   • if there is a HARBOR FREIGHT near you, then you will either want to buy a set of their ORANGE handled pliers because you will want a pair of their wire cutters which I have found work well as cable cutters for the derailleur & brake cables
     you want brake cables whose ends are designed for ROAD brake levers
     in the past 16+ years, Campagnolo's more recent levers use a slightly smaller diameter diecast end
   • the derailleur cable ends are the same for most older levers as the derailleur cables which you will typically be able to buy ... again, Campagnolo has gone rogue with their more recent sizing
   
   
2. if you don't have alloy end caps (you need to buy these separately) which can be crimped then you can simply wrap the ends with masking tape ...
   • I used to silver solder the ends
   • some people put a drop of Super Glue on the ends
   • most recently, I have used grey Epoxy (i.e., JB WELD)
3. BTW. When the only cables that were available were galvenized steel, to limit what I perceived to be cable stretch, I used to use BRAKE cables for my downtube derailleur cables AFTER I reduced (by hand filing!) the diecast ends to the much smaller size typically found on the ends of derailleur cables.
   
4. eBay, Nashbar, Colorado Cyclist, Excel Sports, etc. OR your local bike shop (expect to pay a premium for the "convenience")
5. a few years ago I bought some generic (non-Campagnolo) brake pads which where close to the right size ... I needed to "shave down" the sides using a grinder (!) to achieve the correct sizing ... it is NOT a task for the faint of heart or if you have limited prior skill with hand-and-power tools.
   • if the pads are not worn down, then you may find that simply de-glazing the contact surface of the brake pads with some sandpaper or emery cloth will make the pads viable
6. possibly eBay ... regardless of the eventual source, expect to pay a HUGE premium for "gum rubber"/(tan) hoods ... a few years ago, someone made "copies" of unknown-to-me quality which were about $25 (?) per pair. Otherwise, you may be able to find some hoods for less BUT you need to ensure that they are designed for Campagnolo brake levers.
   • you can consider the hoods to be cosmetic because those older levers are difficult to use for braking when your hands are on the top of the lever bodies ...
   • an alternative is to replace the brake levers with "aerodynamic" levers which are equally functional when your hands are on the top of the lever bodies ("on the hoods") ... the "aerodynamic" levers are so-called because the brake cables are under the handlebar tape.
     TEKTRO makes/(made?) brake levers which looked very similar to Campagnolo's 1998-2006 shift-brake levers
   
   

Check (not necessarily in this order ...) www.sheldonbrown.com, www.parktool.com, YouTube, etc,

 

[CAMPYBOB]

Niiiiice! The old Viner's were great frames.

Is that a Selle San Marco Concor saddle? Is the stem a Cinelli or Modolo or? Brand of handlebars?

The shift levers look like Modolo brand.

What model Campagnolo components are used on this bike? Record? Gran Sport?

I love that old 42-52 chainring and 14-19 (21?) straight block setup! Climbing was always a tough grind, but flat out flying in a criterium or on an open, flat road with a tailwind was dialed-in awesome on those old road racers!

I'm glad you're keeping it all Campy! The old girl deserves it!

Older (New Old Stock or NOS) 'Record' shift and brake cables are still available. Colorado Cycles, The Yellow Jersey, Excel Sports, etc. will all be able to sell you genuine Campagnolo pieces parts. Buying a set of period correct Campagnolo shift levers is also easy to do. eBay is a great place to find a good deal.

Period correct Campy brake cable housing is usually grey colored. Sometime in the 1980's black and white colored housing became available, but I'm not certain as to the exact year. The rear derailleur should have the spiral-wound stainless steel type housing with no vinyl cover.

 

[BobCochran]

Wow! That is a very nice bike. I am a beginner to bicycling, so I'll watch this thread with great interest. Please let us all know how your restoration project is going.

Thanks a ton

Bob Cochran

 

[lizzardlizzah]

Niiiiice! The old Viner's were great frames.

Is that a Selle San Marco Concor saddle? Is the stem a Cinelli or Modolo or? Brand of handlebars?

The shift levers look like Modolo brand.

What model Campagnolo components are used on this bike? Record? Gran Sport?

I love that old 42-52 chainring and 14-19 (21?) straight block setup! Climbing was always a tough grind, but flat out flying in a criterium or on an open, flat road with a tailwind was dialed-in awesome on those old road racers!

I'm glad you're keeping it all Campy! The old girl deserves it!

Older (New Old Stock or NOS) 'Record' shift and brake cables are still available. Colorado Cycles, The Yellow Jersey, Excel Sports, etc. will all be able to sell you genuine Campagnolo pieces parts. Buying a set of period correct Campagnolo shift levers is also easy to do. eBay is a great place to find a good deal.

Period correct Campy brake cable housing is usually grey colored. Sometime in the 1980's black and white colored housing became available, but I'm not certain as to the exact year. The rear derailleur should have the spiral-wound stainless steel type housing with no vinyl cover.

Thanks for the reply! The saddle is a Concor Supercorsa Confort, the stem is a Cinelli, the handle bars are also Cinelli. The shift levers have an "M" on them so I assume Modolo. I took some pictures of the parts you were asking about.

 

[lizzardlizzah]

What model Campagnolo components are used on this bike? Record? Gran Sport?

I just asked my dad. His reply was "The bike is a Viner made in Italy. The components brakes, shifter ,crank and wheel hubs are campagnolo. I believe the crank is Grand Sport. Look at the pedal arm and should have a GS on it (I checked, it does). The rest is Record. I believe that Record is just a bit better than the GS".

 

[lizzardlizzah]

Wow! That is a very nice bike. I am a beginner to bicycling, so I'll watch this thread with great interest. Please let us all know how your restoration project is going.

Thanks a ton

Bob Cochran

Thanks! I'm a beginner also. I'm still in college so this project may take a while to complete as I am always busy but I'll definitly keep it updated whenever I get new parts or add stuff to it.

 

[CAMPYBOB]

Yes, those are Modolo shift levers. They are far more rare than Campagnolo shift levers. They will appreciate in value. I would still match up the bike with Campy levers and carefully store the Modolo levers for posterity and a big bucks eBay sale some time in the distant future.

Buy yourself several tubes of Happich Simichrome polish and a 6" bench grinder upon which you will mount one of several cotton buffing wheels you will purchase. Also buy some very fine grit buffing compound dressing sticks for those cotton wheels...also known as sewn cotton buffing discs. Harbor Freight has the cotton wheels and the el cheap 6" bench mounted double wheel grinders (something like $30 on sale...maybe less).

All that aluminum can be carefully hand and machine polished to look like new. disassemble the bike and first carefully clean all the grease and oil from the components. Go easy on any turned finishes and lettering/stamped logo areas of the components when polishing with any motorized buffing rig. The idea is not to over do it. Just bring back the original sparkle and shine. That old stuff was rarely anodized so re-polishing is no sin.

Same goes for the chrome on the frame. Here, a detail sander or Dremel tool with felt bob drums and wheels would be as aggressive as I would go and even then only with a steady hand. Otherwise, wreck you finger tips and polish away with a good set of terry cloth rags and some good chrome polish. Simichrome also works on chrome. Whatever you use on the chrome, stay off the paint work!

The rims/spokes/hubs are a royal pain to get looking good, but I've found that using rags and old socks with Simichrome paste gets the job done in about 2 hours per wheel and requires 2 or 3 buffings of all surfaces...they look like mirrors! Use the rag like dental floss...sawing it back and forth at all imaginable angles. It's a *****, even when doing it while watching the television or such as a distraction. I need to put up a pic of the Santana Sovereign tandem's wheels. I just bought the tandem as a used machine and the wheels were very dull and oxidized. After the detail polishing they look way better than the dull old carbon or black alloy stuff sold today. The Edco Swiss Hubs, stainless DT spokes and bare alloy WheelSmith rims are as sanitary and polished as the chrome wheels on a brand new Porsche. Your Viner's wheels will look just as good or better, I'm sure.

I would leave the paint original and clean up the rust with a very careful detail sanding. Take the frame to an automotive paint shop with one of those high zoot light spectrum color matching scanners and get a spray can or two of touch-up paint. Masking carefully in areas with a break line or blending the touch-up paint into the OEM paint...she'll never be perfect, but it will still be mostly original, look much better and be protected from future oxidation. Maybe...just maybe...a clear coat to help the blend job and protect what's left of the decals. Talk to your local automotive paint guys and ask lots of questions. They'll point you in the right direction.

Only after all the paint is dry-dry-dry would I fog the inside of the frame tubing with oil or rust preventative of choice. Grease up the headset and the bottom bracket and re-install and adjust both bearing sets. Then start putting all the component pieces back on the frame.

It's a lot of work and your hands WILL feel the effort for days after the bike is all back in one piece, but that machine is really worth the effort.

 

[lizzardlizzah]

Nice bike ...

1. You can use newer, stainless steel cables as replacements for the galvenized steel cables
   • you will want to lube the cables with ANY light grease (white lithium, etc.)
   • if there is a HARBOR FREIGHT near you, then you will either want to buy a set of their ORANGE handled pliers because you will want a pair of their wire cutters which I have found work well as cable cutters for the derailleur & brake cables
     you want brake cables whose ends are designed for ROAD brake levers
     in the past 16+ years, Campagnolo's more recent levers use a slightly smaller diameter diecast end
   • the derailleur cable ends are the same for most older levers as the derailleur cables which you will typically be able to buy ... again, Campagnolo has gone rogue with their more recent sizing
   
   
2. if you don't have alloy end caps (you need to buy these separately) which can be crimped then you can simply wrap the ends with masking tape ...
   • I used to silver solder the ends
   • some people put a drop of Super Glue on the ends
   • most recently, I have used grey Epoxy (i.e., JB WELD)
3. BTW. When the only cables that were available were galvenized steel, to limit what I perceived to be cable stretch, I used to use BRAKE cables for my downtube derailleur cables AFTER I reduced (by hand filing!) the diecast ends to the much smaller size typically found on the ends of derailleur cables.
   

https://www.coloradocyclist.com/campagnolo-ergopower-10-11-speed-cable-setWould something like this work? It would be easier to buy a set but I don't think I need cable housing for the derailleur cables (or at least the bike didn't have any). I'm still looking around but you shared a lot of helpful sites and had a lot of good information. I really appreciate your help.

 

[lizzardlizzah]

@CAMPYBOB* You provided me with a lot of information, I really appreciate it! Right now I don't have the tools or location to do a lot of the buffing and shining but this winter break I will be able to visit my dad's shop (where he possesses most of these things) and do some work. I can't wait to work on it more and make it shine. I do have a question; the bike has original stickers on it but some have been scratched off or are completely missing. What would you recommend? Are there places or websites to get original sticker sets? It's not the biggest concern right now as it will be something I do at the very end, but just curious.

Thanks so much

Liz

*Also, I'm not very sure on how to tag you in this

 

[CAMPYBOB]

BicycleDecals and CyclArt can make new decals for you. They'll probably cost you a few dollars, but they are definitely worth the investment IMO.

http://bicycledecals.net/

http://cyclart.com/

Even if you are stuck in a dorm room or small apartment, rags and Simichrome + time will get you off to a good start. I've hand polished many bike back to life over the years. A buffer and Dremel just make easier, faster work of it.

You WILL need to aquire some bottom bracket and headset tools somewhere down the line to safely get those areas of the bike apart for cleaning and re-packing of the bearings. Eventually.

Search the web for the correct parts you may need. ALL of them are out there and almost all are still at least 'reasonably' priced. Try not to use incorrect vintage parts as the tend to stick out like a sore thumb.

http://www.yellowjersey.org/cabrx.html

The Yellow Jersey is a good place to start shopping for any needed spares. Campagnolo USA / Ochner is also a source for some of the older Campagnolo Record and Gran Sport components and small pieces parts.

 

[alfeng]

https://www.coloradocyclist.com/campagnolo-ergopower-10-11-speed-cable-setWould something like this work? It would be easier to buy a set but I don't think I need cable housing for the derailleur cables (or at least the bike didn't have any). I'm still looking around but you shared a lot of helpful sites and had a lot of good information. I really appreciate your help.

You may want to buy a "set" of cables & housing, but at the moment & for your Viner, YOU do not want that particular set for a couple of reasons ...

1. the ends of the derailleur cables in that set which you linked to are for the fore mentioned ErgoPower shifters whose diecast ends were previously & clumsily described by me as being shaped-and-sized differently
2. and (if you could use that set), you would be paying a premium for a set of derailleur housing (which you correcty realize you do not need ... you only need a short, ~12" (?) piece of housing to use between the frame & rear derailleur)
   • you will need to cut the cables regardless of how-or-where you source them
   • I use/(and suggest) brake cable housing which has a coiled core for my derailleur cable housing & only use the so-called derailleur housing which has parallel stranded wires (which I thought had been universally abandoned in the late 70s) which comes in the Campagnolo & Shimano cable sets at times when I want to throw caution to the wind!

You can buy stainless steel cables through eBay or from your local bike shop or via any mail order source whom you prefer (figure about $6 per cable ... LESS if you are a wise shopper)

BTW. Shimano's current cables continue to have the diecast ends which your brake levers & shifters use (i.e., the old "standard" size).

 

[lizzardlizzah]

Here are a few recent pictures. So far I have found cables that fit perfectly (local bike shop helped me out and for a good price, shout out to Sprockets in Denton), and have hand polished all of the polishable parts using the Simichrome (I just need to borrow my dad's dremel tool to get it super shiny. My main goal for next week (or when I get the chance) is to get the wheels trued and get the cables adjusted properly (to make sure I did it right), then it is basically rideable. I will continue to update.
Credit to my cat Oliver for helping me install cables. Sorry if any of the pictures are blurry or hard to see.
Liz

 

[BobCochran]

This is a great update, thank you for posting it! The pictures of the chainrings are interesting for me -- the chainrings of the 1980s seem to have different designs from today's chainrings. That is just an observation. You are doing an excellent job of restoring the bike. Well done!

Bob