Eating Before Sleep

NYC XYZ said:

Hi, All:

I've heard different things about eating before bed...it
makes you
fat, food simply passes through without real benefit,
interferes with
a good night's sleep...does anyone know (and/or have
links/refs)
regarding this matter?

I mean, is it a bad thing? (Unhealthy?) Why?

There are two reasons why you should eat at least a high
protein snack before bed.

1) Not eating before bed means you go too long without food.
To gain muscle most experts recommend eating a small meal or
snack every 3-4 hours. It is bad enough that you will be
going 8 hours or so overnight without eating while you sleep
but if dinner is your last meal it will be more like 12
hours. In that 12 hours you will end up in a catabolic
state.

2) Sleep is a metabolically active time. It is
recouperative. You need fuel.

I agree that the snack before bed should be considered when
figuring out how much to eat in a day so the total calories
meet your goals regarding gaining or losing weight.Unless
you are looking to bulk up and need more calories you will
need to cut back somewhere else.

Also, if reflux is an issue keeping the meal small and low
fat can help. Also raising yuor head when you sleep can
help.

The people that say you won't digest and use the food at
night are morons. Don't ever listen to a thing they say ever
again.

--
00doc

Too many books I've read that say that. Last person who told me this, a
couple of weeks ago, was my personal trainer: George Turner.

Quoted message said:

1) Not eating before bed means you go too long without food. To gain
muscle most experts recommend eating a small meal or snack every 3-4
hours. It is bad enough that you will be going 8 hours or so overnight
without eating while you sleep

If that were true then you are saying we need to get up in the middle of the
night to eat. Breakfast is called breakfast because you "break your fast".

Quoted message said:

2) Sleep is a metabolically active time. It is recouperative. You need
fuel.

You don't eat so you can get through the night. You eat throughout the day
and recuperate at night.

Quoted message said:

I agree that the snack before bed should be considered when figuring out
how much to eat in a day so the total calories meet your goals regarding
gaining or losing weight.Unless you are looking to bulk up and need more
calories you will need to cut back somewhere else.

So if we snack at night we have to cut out some day time food? Then why
snack at night at all?

Quoted message said:

Also, if reflux is an issue keeping the meal small and low fat can help.
Also raising yuor head when you sleep can help.

Also not eating before you go to bed helps. Your body is not designed to
digest food lying down.

Quoted message said:

The people that say you won't digest and use the food at night are morons.
Don't ever listen to a thing they say ever again.

You contradict everything I've read.

drhowarddrfinedrhoward said:

Quoted message said:

1) Not eating before bed means you go too long without
food. To gain
muscle most experts recommend eating a small meal or
snack every 3-4
hours. It is bad enough that you will be going 8 hours or
so
overnight without eating while you sleep

If that were true then you are saying we need to get up in
the middle
of the night to eat. Breakfast is called breakfast
because you
"break your fast".

Ummm...yeah? That's why it is called breakfast. What does
that have to do with whether your should eat before bed?

Nutritionally speaking I'm not sure we shouldn't get up at 3
am to eat. it would make sense. Personally, I like my sleep
too much to do that and I do have some doubts about whether
the decrease in sleep would be worth it.

The the point is that none of the the quoted text above
gives any argument against what I am saying. It is just kind
of random babbling.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

2) Sleep is a metabolically active time. It is
recouperative. You
need fuel.

You don't eat so you can get through the night. You eat
throughout
the day and recuperate at night.

What is recouperation? If it involves muscle repair (or
building) then it must require protein. Doesn't it make
sense to put protein in the system at the time when you are
using it?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I agree that the snack before bed should be considered
when figuring
out how much to eat in a day so the total calories meet
your goals
regarding gaining or losing weight.Unless you are looking
to bulk up
and need more calories you will need to cut back
somewhere else.

So if we snack at night we have to cut out some day time
food? Then
why snack at night at all?

Because small frequent meals are used more efficiently than
large infrequent ones. Are there really people who doubt
this? Why not just eat one big meal a day?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Also, if reflux is an issue keeping the meal small and
low fat can
help. Also raising yuor head when you sleep can help.

Also not eating before you go to bed helps. Your body is
not
designed to digest food lying down.

Quoted message said:

The people that say you won't digest and use the food at
night are
morons. Don't ever listen to a thing they say ever again.

You contradict everything I've read.

Several people asked you what it is you are reading that
says that. You still have not replied. If you have read so
much that contradicts me then it should not be hard to post
a reference or two. Alternately, you could give us some
logical coherent reasoning to suggest what you say. Either
would be fine by me.

--
00doc

drhowarddrfinedrhoward said:

Too many books I've read that say that.

OK - name one.

Quoted message said:

Last person who told me
this, a couple of weeks ago, was my personal trainer:
George Turner.

I've seen many personal trainers who did not have a clue. In
fact - I would say it is most of them.

--
00doc

Roger Zoul said:

Larry Hodges said:

Quoted message said:

NYC XYZ wrote:
> Hi, All:
>
> I've heard different things about eating before bed...it makes you
> fat, food simply passes through without real benefit, interferes
> with a good night's sleep...does anyone know (and/or have
> links/refs) regarding this matter?
>
> I mean, is it a bad thing? (Unhealthy?) Why?
>
>
> TIA!

I usually eat dinner at 10pm, then go right to bed. But I don't get
home from the gym until 9pm, and to deprive my body of protein and
nutrients post workout would be stupid. I also eat before I go to
the gym. Usually a protein shake with some fruit.

It's not so much "when" you eat, but how much in a day. Excess
calories is what make you fat. When I get home from the gym, I'm
usually around 1,800 - 2,000 calories at that point. Since I'm
cutting (dropping some weight), I'm shooting for around 2,600
calories. So, dinner is around 600 calories.

You need to estimate what your calories are to maintain your weight.
Then you can decide to eat at that to maintain, or under that to
lose weight. I like this site:

http://www.exrx.net/Calculators/CalRequire.html

You could also start a free account on fitday.com and track
calories. This will also give you grams of protein / carbs / fats
eaten, which is helpful.

If you eat more than your maintenance in a 24 hr period, you'll get
fat. If you eat under your maintenance, you'll lose weight.
Simple.

Not quite. You can average calories over days to avoid weight gain.
Hence, if you eat over maintenance one day and then eat under
maintenance the next by the same amount, it will balance out. there
seems to be a lag time before the body can respond to an
increase/decrease relative to maintenance. IME, BTW.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

--
-Larry

Good point. I stand corrected, and I should've pointed that out. It's
just, how much detail do you provide? Most noobs need the "day by day"
thing to understand it's calories in / calories out that determines weight
loss.

For me, I look at the entire week, as I tend to eat...and drink...over my
maintenance on the weekends.
--
-Larry

00doc said:

1) Not eating before bed means you go too long without food.
To gain muscle most experts recommend eating a small meal or
snack every 3-4 hours. It is bad enough that you will be
going 8 hours or so overnight without eating while you sleep
but if dinner is your last meal it will be more like 12
hours. In that 12 hours you will end up in a catabolic
state.

It's rumored that people wake up in the middle of the
night to pound protein shakes.

Striving for 24/7 anabolism is slightly nuts. Does it
matter if you reach your goal weight in 8 weeks or 8
weeks and two days? Only if you started training two days
too late and think that 60 grams will make a difference.

Quoted message said:

2) Sleep is a metabolically active time. It is
recouperative. You need fuel.

If you have half a pound of fat on you, you have plenty
of fuel for a night's sleep. If you are eating excess
calories to anabolize, you have way more than plenty of
fuel for a night's sleep.

The only thing you might need at night is protein, but
that's because you need protein every few hours because
it doesn't store anywhere but as muscle.

Quoted message said:

The people that say you won't digest and use the food at
night are morons. Don't ever listen to a thing they say ever
again.

Wasn't that Brink?

--Blair
"Wasn't it yams?"

drhowarddrfinedrhoward said:

Too many books I've read that say that. Last person who told me
this, a couple of weeks ago, was my personal trainer: George Turner.

Ahh...good 'ol George. Well, it must be true then!

Seriously, I'd love to see a cite for your claim that food doesn't digest
when you're sleeping. Or even a book reference.
--
-Larry

"Per Elmsäter" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Robert said:

"Bob Falooley" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

drhowarddrfinedrhoward wrote:
> Do not eat right before bed time. It does not make you fatter but
> the food will not digest until you wake in the morning. Then your
> body tries to digest it along with breakfast. You may not eat as
> much thus depriving yourself of nutrition for that day.
>

Why wouldn't the food digest when I am sleeping, why am I hungrier
when I wake up after eating right before I go to bed?

> Depending on what you eat it can interfere with your sleep;
> indigestion or sugars trying to give you an energy boost.

Just don't eat [censored].

>
> The best is do not eat less than two hours before bed time though
> I've heard as much as three and as little as 1.5 hours.
>
>

I do not agree with this advice, I think you should eat whenever you
like, but ideally spread your calories throughout the day. While
bulking wake up in the middle of the night and chug a glass of milk.

--Falooley

It's not a matter of calories as much as acid burning your esophageal
valve and eventually going up into your throat. The Ashley Simpson
excuse as to why she sounded like [censored].
If you do it all the time eventually you will have esophageal reflux
disease and will have to sleep in a more upright position. Anybody
with this condition knows and you don't have to ask them twice about
how long one can eat before going to bed. You will find out as the
years pass. That question is really one for the young foolish kids.

I don't think it's a matter of age as much as of obesity.

--
Perre
I gave up on SPAM and redirected it to hotmail instead.

I am not obese although I am going up there in age and as I mentioned even
the young and non-obese can have trouble speaking waking in the morning
after their throat has been burned up.

"Slambram" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Wed, 2 Mar 2005 13:35:36 -0800, "Robert" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

You should rephrase that from "if you have GERD" to "if you want to avoid
GERD" and also if you want to avoid esophageal cancer. People don't get

it

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

that their is concentrated acid in their stomach and if you lie down then

it

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

travels back up. The esophagus and upper structures are not well suited

for

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

handling a constant acid load.

If i lie down after i eat i'll get cancer?

Aliment Pharmacol Ther. 2004 Oct;20 Suppl 5:105-10. Related Articles, Links

Review article: what I do now to manage adenocarcinoma risk, and what I may
be doing in 10 years' time.

Spechler SJ.

Division of Gastroenterology, Dallas VA Medical Center, Dallas, TX 75216,
USA. [email hidden]

This article summarizes the present recommendations for the screening,
surveillance and treatment of Barrett's oesophagus, and identifies those
areas in which change seems likely within the next decade. As a result of
economic constraints and emerging data on ethnic variations in the frequency
of Barrett's oesophagus, future screening programmes will probably focus on
those individuals most likely to develop Barrett's adenocarcinomas: older
white men whose gastro-oesophageal reflux symptoms are of long duration. The
present surveillance strategy for patients with Barrett's oesophagus relies
heavily on random biopsy sampling of the oesophagus to find dysplasia. In
the future, biomarkers other than dysplasia may be used to identify patients
at high risk for carcinogenesis, and physicians may use endoscopic
techniques, such as fluorescence spectroscopy, to identify areas of
dysplasia for biopsy sampling. Indirect evidence suggests that
super-aggressive antisecretory therapy and treatment with non-steroidal
anti-inflammatory drugs may reduce the risk of cancer in Barrett's
oesophagus. Well-designed prospective studies will be needed to determine
whether these treatments have sufficient efficacy in cancer prophylaxis to
justify the large numbers needed to treat. Finally, recent data are
reviewed, which suggest that the gastro-oesophageal junction is exposed
repeatedly to concentrated acid and to potentially genotoxic concentrations
of nitric oxide generated from dietary nitrate. Future studies on
carcinogenesis in Barrett's oesophagus may well focus on the combined roles
of nitric oxide and gastric acid.

Publication Types:
Review
Review, Tutorial

PMID: 15456473 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Rene said:

"NYC XYZ" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Hi, All:

I've heard different things about eating before bed...it makes you
fat, food simply passes through without real benefit, interferes
with a good night's sleep...does anyone know (and/or have
links/refs) regarding this matter?

I mean, is it a bad thing? (Unhealthy?) Why?

TIA!

This came to my mind:

From "Protein Power" by Drs Eades in regard to the release of human
growth hormone

"A couple of important points need to be made, however. First, since
increased glucose levels inhibit the release of growth hormone, it
behooves us to avoid anything sweet, starchy or otherwise
carbohydrate laden before we go to bed. Any of these substances will
give us an elevation of blood glucose that will inhibit the normal
shot of growth hormone released an hour or so after our falling
asleep. See what all those snacks of milk and cookies at bedtime
have been doing to you!
Second, the pulse of growth hormone released by exercise generally
hits the circulation toward the end of the workout and immediately
after. If you want to inhibit this growth hormone surge, all you
have to do is to eat a power bar or a candy or drink fruit juice, as
trainers often advise you to do before, during, and right after
workouts in the mistaken notion that you need "explosive, high-carbo
energy" as on of these products advertises. What you're really
getting is not growth hormone. Always work out on an empty stomach,
don't consume anything except water during the workout, and don't eat
until an hour or so after. Then make sure it's a protein-rich
meal-you need plenty of amino acids for the growth hormone to use to
repair and rebuild your muscles."

Comments?

René

I bet this doctor has never done a good workout in his life. That'd be all
he'd need to realize how ridiculous the above statement is 😉

--
Perre
I gave up on SPAM and redirected it to hotmail instead.

"Rene" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"NYC XYZ" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Hi, All:

I've heard different things about eating before bed...it makes you fat,
food simply passes through without real benefit, interferes with a good
night's sleep...does anyone know (and/or have links/refs) regarding
this matter?

I mean, is it a bad thing? (Unhealthy?) Why?

TIA!

This came to my mind:

From "Protein Power" by Drs Eades in regard to the release of human growth
hormone

.... Always work out on an

Quoted message said:

empty stomach, don't consume anything except water during the workout, and
don't eat until an hour or so after.

Maybe if you're doing a short, not too intense session. If you're going to
do a significant amount of work the above advice is at best stupid and at
worst (long ride on a hot day) could kill you.

Peter

This is not the exact info you are asking for but it talks about what I
mean:

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=george&dbid=109

"our digestive tracts are set up to work best when we are standing; lying
down results in gravity pulling the "wrong way" to help food digest. Even
though the practice of napping after a meal is common, it isn't ideal from
the standpoint of digestion. "

"Sleep is the least physically demanding part of the day, and the least
logical target for release of food energy and nutrients."

"A small snack in the hour before bed is usually not problematic if you are
truly hungry, but the ideal solution is to time your last meal so that you
don' feel hungry during the 1-2 hours before bed. "

Just Google and you can find some stuff:

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=george&dbid=109

"our digestive tracts are set up to work best when we are standing; lying
down results in gravity pulling the "wrong way" to help food digest. Even
though the practice of napping after a meal is common, it isn't ideal from
the standpoint of digestion. "

"Sleep is the least physically demanding part of the day, and the least
logical target for release of food energy and nutrients."

"A small snack in the hour before bed is usually not problematic if you are
truly hungry, but the ideal solution is to time your last meal so that you
don' feel hungry during the 1-2 hours before bed. "

George Turner told us not to eat anything 2 1/2 hours before we worked out
and would jump down your throat if you did.

drhowarddrfinedrhoward said:

This is not the exact info you are asking for but it talks about what I
mean:

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=george&dbid=109

"our digestive tracts are set up to work best when we are standing; lying
down results in gravity pulling the "wrong way" to help food digest.

I just found an explanation for your posts: you
must be standing on your head.

--
Scott Johnson / scottjohnson at kc dot rr dot com

"drhowarddrfinedrhoward" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

George Turner told us not to eat anything 2 1/2 hours before we worked out
and would jump down your throat if you did.

If you're going to do a short piece of work, then that's reasonable; you
don't want anything sitting in your stomach where you might vomit it.

If you're going to do an hour of weights work, then you might find that you
run into problems with blood sugar levels getting low and screwing up your
performance. I would, in that situation. So I'll eat a bit before or drink a
sports drink during the workout.

If you're doing a long bike ride, run, whatever, then you will certainly
need to eat something, or you will deplete your glycogen stores within two
or three hours and the rest of your ride will be unpleasant and slow. You
also need to replace what you lose sweating; water is not good here, as it
does not replace the salt you sweated out. If you are doing a long ride on a
hot day, you can easily sweat more than 5 litres out; if you replace that
with 5 litres of water you will end up with hyponatremia. This is
particularly nasty because its symptoms are fairly similar to dehydration
and heat exhaustion - so you are tempted to drink even more, and that makes
it worse. If it gets serious, you will need proper medical treatment
quickly; if you don't get it then it can be fatal.

Peter

drhowarddrfinedrhoward said:

This is not the exact info you are asking for but it talks about what I
mean:

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=george&dbid=109

isn't ideal from the standpoint of digestion. "

How did you arrive at "...the food will not digest until you wake in
the morning" from "...isn't ideal from the standpoint of digestion."

On Wed, 2 Mar 2005 23:26:33 -0800, "Robert" <[email hidden]>
wrote:

Thanks for definition of the pre-cancerous condition known as
Barrett's oesophagus, a risk factor for people who already have GERD.

What i'd like to know is how you arrived at the conclusion that GERD
and esophageal cancer is caused by lying down after you eat?

The AMA says GERD is caused mostly by obesity and genetic factors,
http://www.gerd.com/articles/recent/abstracts/2227.htm, and lying down
after you eat is but one of many factors which exacerbates GERD in
patients who already have it,
http://www.gerd.com/intro/noframe/posscaus.htm

Please cite something which backs up your correction of Proton Soup's
original post from ""if you have GERD" to "if you want to avoid
GERD" and also if you want to avoid esophageal cancer.""

I do a full hour of weight work with 12 minutes cardio.