Eating "Naturally"

Discussion in 'Food and nutrition' started by George Cherry, Mar 15, 2006.

  1. Here's my take on what's "natural" for humankind to eat.
    I'm talking here about our GENOME, which was formed
    a long time before domesticated animals, agriculture,
    and supermarkets. My ancient, ancient ancestors (whose
    genome was very, very similar to mine) were hunter-
    gatherers who successfully gathered a greater deal more
    than they successfully hunted. It's really hard to down
    an ungulate with a stick or a rock, especially when the
    deer or antelope can run 3-4 times faster than you. So
    these Paleolithic guys and gals ate lots of stuff that they
    could pull out of the ground or off trees or pick off bushes.
    I channel a Paleolithic guy named Geeorgius who assures
    me he ate mostly veggies, fruits, nuts, and seeds. The
    most sophisticated food preparation thing he did was
    soak grains overnight in water in a hollow gourd so that
    he could chew and digest them. He got to eat meat about
    once or twice a year when he got really lucky throwing
    a rock at a rabbit or chasing a coyote away from an antelope
    it downed. I have science to back me up. The only essential
    vitamin or mineral found only in meat (not in plant foods)
    is vitamin B-12. The human body can store B-12 for
    many years. So if you eat meat about once every year,
    you're all set with respect to what you need from meat.
    As for milk, I agree that it's unnatural for human adults
    to drink it. However, my ancestors did gather eggs.
    BTW, there's plenty of protein in nuts, seeds, legumes,
    and grains. So, I'm a "near vegan", which accords well
    with my desire not to cause any more suffering than
    really necessary.

    George
     
    Tags:


  2. TC

    TC Guest

    Your palolithic ancestors would not have survived. What about fish,
    shellfish, small mammals, small amphibians, bugs, snakes, etc. They
    used of traps, sticks, and all kinds of tools to catch all kinds of
    small animals ans bugs, lots of bugs. Just do a bit of research on
    Australian Aboriginies and you will quickly find out all the small
    animals they eat or ate.

    Your palolithic ancestors appear to be idiots.

    TC


    George Cherry wrote:
    > Here's my take on what's "natural" for humankind to eat.
    > I'm talking here about our GENOME, which was formed
    > a long time before domesticated animals, agriculture,
    > and supermarkets. My ancient, ancient ancestors (whose
    > genome was very, very similar to mine) were hunter-
    > gatherers who successfully gathered a greater deal more
    > than they successfully hunted. It's really hard to down
    > an ungulate with a stick or a rock, especially when the
    > deer or antelope can run 3-4 times faster than you. So
    > these Paleolithic guys and gals ate lots of stuff that they
    > could pull out of the ground or off trees or pick off bushes.
    > I channel a Paleolithic guy named Geeorgius who assures
    > me he ate mostly veggies, fruits, nuts, and seeds. The
    > most sophisticated food preparation thing he did was
    > soak grains overnight in water in a hollow gourd so that
    > he could chew and digest them. He got to eat meat about
    > once or twice a year when he got really lucky throwing
    > a rock at a rabbit or chasing a coyote away from an antelope
    > it downed. I have science to back me up. The only essential
    > vitamin or mineral found only in meat (not in plant foods)
    > is vitamin B-12. The human body can store B-12 for
    > many years. So if you eat meat about once every year,
    > you're all set with respect to what you need from meat.
    > As for milk, I agree that it's unnatural for human adults
    > to drink it. However, my ancestors did gather eggs.
    > BTW, there's plenty of protein in nuts, seeds, legumes,
    > and grains. So, I'm a "near vegan", which accords well
    > with my desire not to cause any more suffering than
    > really necessary.
    >
    > George
     
  3. TC

    TC Guest

    George Cherry wrote:
    > Here's my take on what's "natural" for humankind to eat.
    > I'm talking here about our GENOME, which was formed
    > a long time before domesticated animals, agriculture,
    > and supermarkets. My ancient, ancient ancestors (whose
    > genome was very, very similar to mine) were hunter-
    > gatherers who successfully gathered a greater deal more
    > than they successfully hunted. It's really hard to down
    > an ungulate with a stick or a rock, especially when the
    > deer or antelope can run 3-4 times faster than you. So
    > these Paleolithic guys and gals ate lots of stuff that they
    > could pull out of the ground or off trees or pick off bushes.
    > I channel a Paleolithic guy named Geeorgius who assures
    > me he ate mostly veggies, fruits, nuts, and seeds. The
    > most sophisticated food preparation thing he did was
    > soak grains overnight in water in a hollow gourd so that
    > he could chew and digest them. He got to eat meat about
    > once or twice a year when he got really lucky throwing
    > a rock at a rabbit or chasing a coyote away from an antelope
    > it downed. I have science to back me up. The only essential
    > vitamin or mineral found only in meat (not in plant foods)
    > is vitamin B-12. The human body can store B-12 for
    > many years. So if you eat meat about once every year,
    > you're all set with respect to what you need from meat.
    > As for milk, I agree that it's unnatural for human adults
    > to drink it. However, my ancestors did gather eggs.
    > BTW, there's plenty of protein in nuts, seeds, legumes,
    > and grains. So, I'm a "near vegan", which accords well
    > with my desire not to cause any more suffering than
    > really necessary.
    >
    > George


    http://www.cultureandrecreation.gov.au/articles/foodanddrink/

    Australian Food and Drink
    Native Australians and Early Settlers
    Aboriginals' Food Sources
    Before white settlement, Aboriginal people survived off the native
    plants and animals of the Australian environment for thousands of
    years. Across the many different environments of Australia, they knew
    how to find food and water.

    Native mammals and birds such as kangaroo, wallaby and emu were
    regularly hunted and killed. Although animals were sometimes thrown
    straight onto the fire for cooking, there were a variety of preparation
    and cooking techniques.


    Goose egg hunting by George Malibirr 1934-1998, Gurrumba Gurrumba clan,
    Ramingining, Ngalyindi country in Central Arnhem Land
    Image courtesy of the National Gallery of Australia
    Other foods that seem less palatable to modern urban Australians - such
    as witchetty grubs, lizards, snakes and moths - were greatly valued.

    Bush foods such as berries, roots and nectars were a vital part of the
    aboriginal diet in many areas. Often these required advanced
    preparation techniques to neutralise toxins and to make them palatable
    and nutritious.

    In certain coastal areas, shellfish were plentiful and easily
    harvested. Aboriginals also caught fish in the oceans and rivers using
    hooks, spears and fish traps.

    Aboriginal groups would often travel from season to season; moving to
    where they knew various food sources would be available. One such
    source was the annual Bogong moth migrations to New South Wales.

    The more bountiful the area a tribe lived in, the less nomadic they
    were forced to be. Desert dwellers may have been on the move constantly
    searching for food, while coastal tribes may have remained reasonably
    static.

    Certain Aboriginal groups did more than just survive - they thrived.
    Some white explorers reported meeting groups of aboriginals from time
    to time that appeared especially healthy and well fed.

    But living off the land also meant that from area-to-area and
    season-to-season there were also times of hardship.

    Food for Australia's Early Settlers
    Upon arrival in Australia, the early settlers were confronted by a
    landscape and range of plants and animals that were largely foreign to
    them. In many places, even fresh water was scarce, especially in
    comparison to the rain-soaked fields of Britain and Ireland.

    There were some familiar animals; wild swans, ducks, geese and pigeons
    that were similar to their European cousins. The oceans and rivers were
    full of fish and eels that were not too dissimilar from the European
    varieties. But other game was foreign and challenging to their British
    tastes.

    Some settlers were driven by curiosity or necessity to hunt and eat the
    native mammals. Stuffed wombat and fried echidna were on the menu in
    early settlements in Van Diemen's Land, as Tasmania was known in those
    times.

    But largely, the early settlers set their hands to producing European
    crops and raising European herd animals for food. Over the years, they
    introduced European game animals such as deer and rabbits for hunting.
    Many of these animals thrived in their new home and have since become
    pests to Australian farmers and environmentalists.

    Flour was a staple item of the early settler's diet. It was usually
    made into bread or damper (a dense, thick bread).

    The available meat was usually beef, pork or mutton (the meat of adult
    sheep). As there was no refrigeration, it was usually salted or dried
    to preserve it.

    Tea was the staple drink and considered a necessity, even when other
    items were scarce.

    Salt was highly prized for flavour and for preserving meat.

    The settlers brought rum with them, and the fledgling colonies soon
    developed the capacity to produce it themselves. Rum was such a valued
    commodity that it became the key currency in the early years of
    settlement.

    Food for Australia's Early Explorers
    Australia's explorers of the early 1800s usually set off with hundreds
    of pounds of flour, dozens of pounds of tea and a generous amount of
    salt and sugar. They brought sheep or cattle for food. The oxen, and
    sometimes horses, had the dual role of beast of burden and food source
    when they were needed.

    Some explorers, such as Ludwig Leichhardt, were keen to observe and
    learn from Aboriginal food gathering and eating habits. They interacted
    with Aboriginals they met and exchanged food.

    According to Leichhardt's journals, members of his successful 1844-1845
    expedition of 4,800 kilometres from Darling Downs in Queensland to
    Point Essington in Northern Western Australia owed their lives to the
    hunting and survival skills of its two Aboriginal guides, Charley
    Fisher and Harry Brown. They hunted game to supplement the group's
    provisions, catching animals such as flying foxes and magpie geese to
    add to the pot on many occasions. They gathered salt were it occurred
    naturally along riverbanks, washed in from the ocean.

    By contrast other explorers, such as Edmund Kennedy and Burke and Wills
    preferred to kill and eat their own pack animals rather than hunt game
    or fish to supplement their supplies. Only when their provisions had
    dwindled to the point that the party was facing starvation, scurvy and
    dysentery did they hunt and gather food or accept the generous gifts of
    food presented by the friendly Aboriginals they met.

    Rabbit and other Meat during the Great Depression

    Motor lorry loaded with 1,760 pairs of rabbits, c1918
    Image courtesy of National Library of Australia: nla.pic-an24664485
    During the tough economic times of the Great Depression of the 1930s,
    the rabbit became a welcome commodity rather than the pest it had been
    to farmers. The skins could be sold for money and the meat was often
    the only option available to poor families. Rabbits could be caught
    fairly readily even in the outskirts of big cities such as Melbourne,
    in suburbs that are now densely populated.

    In the 1990s, after years of being shunned as 'underground mutton',
    rabbit overcame much of its depression-time reputation as the poor
    person's last resort. It has been reintroduced as a respected and even
    fashionable gourmet food in Australian restaurants and public bars.

    Whether valued exclusively for their taste or in combination with a
    sense of nostalgia for earlier times, other cuts of meat and offal that
    were once only eaten by poor people who could not afford anything else
    - such as ox tail, lamb shanks and kidney - have found their way onto
    menus in even the most expensive restaurants in Australia.

    Multicultural Influences on Australian Cuisine
    Early and 20th Century European immigrants such as Germans, Italians
    and French helped to pioneer and grow the Australian wine industry that
    had become so healthy by the 21st century.

    Immigration to Australia since 1945 has had a major multicultural
    impact upon Australian culture, and in particular upon what Australians
    eat and drink. For example, European migrants brought with them a
    preference for espresso coffee. This has overtaken tea as the most
    popular hot beverage ordered in restaurants and cafes. Pasta dishes,
    another staple of many European countries, are one of the most popular
    choices on the menu for many Australians.

    Where once the Australian diet was based strongly upon its British and
    Irish heritage, by the end of the 20th century, Australians were
    regularly enjoying Italian, Greek, Chinese, Indian and Vietnamese
    cuisines cooked in restaurants and homes.

    Due mainly to later immigrants to the country, Australians have a
    growing interest in multicultural foods and drinks from across Asia,
    The Middle East, Europe and Africa

    Since the late 20th century there has also been a growing awareness of
    cultural and religious food requirements, such as Halal and Kosher
    practices.

    Vegetarianism (the practice of eating only vegetable food) and veganism
    (a strict vegetarian diet that excludes any animal product) have also
    gained broader acceptance in Australian society, thanks in part to the
    important role that vegetables and vegetable products such as tofu play
    in Asian, Indian and other international cuisines.

    Australian Native Food and Drink in The 21st Century

    A cluster of macadamia nuts growing in Northern New South Wales
    Image courtesy of Australian Macadamia Society
    In the late 20th and early 21st century Australian native bush tucker
    foods remained mainly a novelty. Game meats such as kangaroo, wallaby,
    emu and crocodile are available as specialty items.

    Australian seafood is highly prized domestically and is a lucrative
    export industry.

    The macadamia nut is the only highly-commercialised Australian native
    food crop.

    ********

    TC
     
  4. TC

    TC Guest

    George Cherry wrote:
    > Here's my take on what's "natural" for humankind to eat.
    > I'm talking here about our GENOME, which was formed
    > a long time before domesticated animals, agriculture,
    > and supermarkets. My ancient, ancient ancestors (whose
    > genome was very, very similar to mine) were hunter-
    > gatherers who successfully gathered a greater deal more
    > than they successfully hunted. It's really hard to down
    > an ungulate with a stick or a rock, especially when the
    > deer or antelope can run 3-4 times faster than you. So
    > these Paleolithic guys and gals ate lots of stuff that they
    > could pull out of the ground or off trees or pick off bushes.
    > I channel a Paleolithic guy named Geeorgius who assures
    > me he ate mostly veggies, fruits, nuts, and seeds. The
    > most sophisticated food preparation thing he did was
    > soak grains overnight in water in a hollow gourd so that
    > he could chew and digest them. He got to eat meat about
    > once or twice a year when he got really lucky throwing
    > a rock at a rabbit or chasing a coyote away from an antelope
    > it downed. I have science to back me up. The only essential
    > vitamin or mineral found only in meat (not in plant foods)
    > is vitamin B-12. The human body can store B-12 for
    > many years. So if you eat meat about once every year,
    > you're all set with respect to what you need from meat.
    > As for milk, I agree that it's unnatural for human adults
    > to drink it. However, my ancestors did gather eggs.
    > BTW, there's plenty of protein in nuts, seeds, legumes,
    > and grains. So, I'm a "near vegan", which accords well
    > with my desire not to cause any more suffering than
    > really necessary.
    >
    > George



    http://www.mcguinnessonline.com/australia/aussie_people_aboriginals1.htm

    Their Food & Diet

    Hunting is a word that is used to identify the practice of catching and
    killing 'game' either as a sport or as a source of food. Gathering is
    the collecting of food such as plants, berries, eggs or insects.
    Fishing is another method of obtaining food.

    The Aborigines who lived in areas which included waterways such as
    rivers or were on the seacoast, made canoes from bark or tree trunks.


    The Eora / Dharawal made canoes which carried up to three or four
    people. In other areas, the canoes were much larger and included
    dugouts and outrigger types. They were made from tree trunks (not just
    the bark).

    Aboriginal men and women who lived in coastal regions or in areas where
    there were rivers, caught and collected food by fishing. Males usually
    used spears, while females used hand lines with hooks made from shells
    and rocks as sinkers. Fish species were also caught by the use of fish
    traps. Some traps were made from rocks in the form of a pen. At high
    tide fish could swim in and out of them, but some were trapped within
    the rock walls at low tide. Traps were also constructed from sticks and
    tree branches across rivers to make a dam. When sufficient numbers were
    trapped the people would enter the water, scoop up the fish in their
    hands and throw them onto the river bank to be collected for cooking.


    Males hunted animals such as kangaroos, wallabies, echidnas and
    possums. But also reptiles (snakes and lizards) and birds such as
    ducks, swans and parrots. They used spears and boomerangs to hit, catch
    and kill - but also climbed trees to get their food. Sometimes they
    hunted in parties or groups and each person shared the catch. On these
    occasions some of the men acted as 'beaters' driving animals towards
    another group of men who were armed and waiting to spear the animals
    that were driven towards them. Sometimes they used fire to drive the
    animals forward.

    Aboriginal woman (often carrying babies on their backs) and assisted by
    young children left the camp on a daily basis searching and collecting
    berries, yams and other sources of food.


    Some writers have suggested that 'gathering' provided the bulk or main
    source of food for the Australian Aborigines. It has also been said
    that some tribes people were mainly 'vegetarians' because 'meat' was
    not readily available in some areas. It is also a fact that some
    Aboriginal people ate more marine life (fish, oysters and mussels etc)
    because these food items were predominant in the area in which they
    lived.

    Survival was highly dependent upon knowledge of the life-cycle of flora
    and fauna and it is certain that the Aborigines had excellent
    understanding as they learned to track, hunt and gather food from when
    they were young children.

    In 1972 Australian Anthropologist, Kenneth Maddock, said: "Australia is
    the only continent to have been populated until modern times
    exclusively by hunters and gatherers..." (The Australian Aborigines. A
    Portrait of their society). He also quoted statistics showing that in
    10,000 BC all human beings (100%) were hunters and gatherers; by 1,500
    AD this had reduced to about 1% because mankind had generally developed
    skills in the cultivation of crops and domestication of animals. By
    1960 only 0.001% of the world's population were hunters and gatherers.

    The fact that the Australian Aborigines did not cultivate land to grow
    crops or domesticate animals, they have often been portrayed as being a
    backward race.

    However this can be disputed. After all, the Aborigines did harvest
    crops in the sense that they made a form of flour from various types of
    flora. Domestication of animals was not possible due to the type (or
    perhaps kind) of animals that roamed the continent of Australia. For
    example kangaroos, wombats, possums and snakes.

    Sheep and cow were introduced by Europeans. But there is evidence to
    suggest that the Aborigines of the Cowpastures district (Campbelltown
    area) herded and killed cattle that had escaped from the Port Jackson
    area circa 1788 and found there way to that area.

    These cattle had been transported from Africa and before vandals
    destroyed it, there was a cave in the Campbelltown area that was called
    Bull Cave, because of the drawings of cattle on the walls.

    Those Aborigines who lived in coastal regions or near waterways caught
    fish and eels in a number of ways. Males often used a spear but are
    known to have also built fish-traps by making rectangular areas with
    rocks, that stood above the water at low tide. This meant that fish
    could swim into the traps at high tide and were trapped as the tide
    receded.

    In the Illawarra district the Aborigines were often observed
    barricading (blocking) rivers with tree branches and logs. As fish swam
    down the river towards the sea they were trapped behind the dam where
    they were scooped up and thrown onto the shore. The Aborigines also
    fished from rocks and beaches using hand lines made from plants and
    hooks made from shells. Stones were used as sinkers.

    Aboriginal people had to catch and collect their food, each and every
    day of their life. They were successful at doing this because they had
    an intimate knowledge of food-chain cycles, the migration patterns of
    birds and of the habitat where they lived. No doubt there were times
    when there were food shortages. But the essential point is that the
    Aboriginal people had a complete understanding of the flora and fauna
    within their tribal territory. They also engaged in land management
    practices - mainly burning grass and weeds.

    Their totemic practices protected species because a person could not
    eat his own totem and others needed permission to catch another
    person's totem on his land. For example, a man whose totem was a
    waterfowl would not eat that bird (otherwise it would be a form of
    cannibalism). Other members of the tribe could not hunt the bird in the
    territory that belonged to another man. This provided a safe
    environment for different species.

    ********

    TC
     
  5. Rob

    Rob Guest

    George Cherry wrote:

    <snip vegan drivel>

    Sorry George, this may fly on vegsource.com but not here.

    Rob
     
  6. George Cherry wrote:

    The purpose of this thread is what? It beats the hell out of me!!!

    > Here's my take on what's "natural" for humankind to eat.


    The concept of doing what seems 'natural' is just plain stupid and was
    first advocated by the nature cure movement in Europe.

    > I'm talking here about our GENOME, which was formed
    > a long time before domesticated animals, agriculture,
    > and supermarkets.


    What the hell, are you talking about? What is wrong with the word:
    genes?

    > My ancient, ancient ancestors (whose
    > genome was very, very similar to mine) were hunter-
    > gatherers who successfully gathered a greater deal more
    > than they successfully hunted.


    Who the hell are you talking about: Adam and Eve? And, why should I
    care about your ancestors?

    > It's really hard to down
    > an ungulate with a stick or a rock, especially when the
    > deer or antelope can run 3-4 times faster than you. So
    > these Paleolithic guys and gals ate lots of stuff that they
    > could pull out of the ground or off trees or pick off bushes.


    Are you trying to knock the Paleolithic Diet by crossing to the other
    side of the street by way of outer space? It beats the hell out of me,
    what point you are feebly trying to make here. :(

    > I channel a Paleolithic guy named Geeorgius who assures
    > me he ate mostly veggies, fruits, nuts, and seeds. The
    > most sophisticated food preparation thing he did was
    > soak grains overnight in water in a hollow gourd so that
    > he could chew and digest them. He got to eat meat about
    > once or twice a year when he got really lucky throwing
    > a rock at a rabbit or chasing a coyote away from an antelope
    > it downed. I have science to back me up.


    Please don't tell me that you had a séance with a psychic? How much
    did they charge per hour. Were you able to use a credit card, or was
    it a 900 number? And, why should I care?

    > The only essential
    > vitamin or mineral found only in meat (not in plant foods)
    > is vitamin B-12.


    Ooooh! Another Arse who thinks he knows better than mother nature what
    is essential in meat. :(

    > The human body can store B-12 for
    > many years. So if you eat meat about once every year,
    > you're all set with respect to what you need from meat.


    Ha, ... Hah, Ha!

    Are you related to that brain damaged Montygram? You have my
    condolences.

    > As for milk, I agree that it's unnatural for human adults
    > to drink it. However, my ancestors did gather eggs.


    Prove it!!! And who cares what they ate? Certainly not me. I prefer
    to use the brain that god gave me.

    > BTW, there's plenty of protein in nuts, seeds, legumes,
    > and grains. So, I'm a "near vegan", which accords well
    > with my desire not to cause any more suffering than
    > really necessary.


    Well there it is. That explains your obvious mental incapacity.

    You have my condolences.
    http://naturalhealthperspective.com/food/whole-grains.html
    --
    John Gohde,
    Achieving good Nutrition is an Art, NOT a Science!

    The nutrition of eating a healthy diet is a biological factor of the
    mind-body connection. Now, weighing in at 18 web pages, the
    Nutrition of a Healthy Diet is with more documentation and
    sharper terminology than ever before.
    http://naturalhealthperspective.com/food/

    http://naturalhealthperspective.com/tutorials/weston-price.html
     
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