Effective diet to reduce cardiovascular disease



Juhana Harju wrote:
>
> Fresh article about reducing the heart disease risk by a combination diet.
>
> Franco OH et al., The Polymeal: a more natural, safer, and probably tastier
> (than the Polypill) strategy to reduce cardiovascular disease by more than 75%.
> BMJ 2004;329:1447-1450 (18 December).
>
> http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/329/7480/1447?
>
> http://tinyurl.com/56p4m
>
> --
> Juhana


If it is tastier, it will be that much harder to eat less.

Enter the 2PD Approach :)

Hope the above information helps you.

Such is the work being done here for Christ's glory
(http://makeashorterlink.com/?U1E13130A).


Servant to the humblest person in the universe,

Andrew

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/

**
Who is the humblest person in the universe?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?L26062048

What is all this about?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?K6F72510A

Is this spam?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?D13B21FF9
 
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
> Juhana Harju wrote:
>>
>> Fresh article about reducing the heart disease risk by a combination
>> diet.
>>
>> Franco OH et al., The Polymeal: a more natural, safer, and probably
>> tastier (than the Polypill) strategy to reduce cardiovascular
>> disease by more than 75%. BMJ 2004;329:1447-1450 (18 December).
>>
>> http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/329/7480/1447?
>>
>> http://tinyurl.com/56p4m
>>
>> --
>> Juhana

>
> If it is tastier, it will be that much harder to eat less.


Do you have any evidence to suspect that a diet based on generous consumption of
vegetables, fruit and fish would result in weight gain?

> Enter the 2PD Approach :)


Your 2PD approach does not offer the same cardiovascular disease preventing
properties as the Polymeal diet. Second, your 2PD approach also entices people
to eat very energy dense foods, which is contrary to what is healthy. A healthy
approach is to favour nutrient dense foods, like vegetables and fruits, instead
of energy dense foods. The latter contain very little nutrients per calories.

> Hope the above information helps you.


I don't think so. :)

> Such is the work being done here for Christ's glory


Are you able to notice and appreciate when other people are doing good job -
like the researches in the study above?

> Servant to the humblest person in the universe,
>
> Andrew


--
Juhana
 
Andrew, many of the comments others have made on this thread point, as you
and I have discussed previously, to several of the nutritional flaws in
the 2 lb diet. When next we talk we should incorperate them into the next
revision of the diet now underway. Are you taking notes?
 
Juhana Harju wrote:
>
> Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
> > Juhana Harju wrote:
> >>
> >> Fresh article about reducing the heart disease risk by a combination
> >> diet.
> >>
> >> Franco OH et al., The Polymeal: a more natural, safer, and probably
> >> tastier (than the Polypill) strategy to reduce cardiovascular
> >> disease by more than 75%. BMJ 2004;329:1447-1450 (18 December).
> >>
> >> http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/329/7480/1447?
> >>
> >> http://tinyurl.com/56p4m
> >>
> >> --
> >> Juhana

> >
> > If it is tastier, it will be that much harder to eat less.

>
> Do you have any evidence to suspect that a diet based on generous consumption of
> vegetables, fruit and fish would result in weight gain?


My experience has been that generous consumption of any kind of food
results in weight gain.

Has your experience been different?

> > Enter the 2PD Approach :)

>
> Your 2PD approach does not offer the same cardiovascular disease preventing
> properties as the Polymeal diet.


In truth, you do not know what a person following the 2PD Approach is
eating.

There is much evidence to believe that reducing visceral adiposity has
significant cardioprotective effect.

> Second, your 2PD approach also entices people
> to eat very energy dense foods, which is contrary to what is healthy.


In truth, it does not. People are unable to sense caloric density.
What people are drawn to is tastier foods and such foods are not
necessarily denser in calores. Do you have evidence to support this
claim that folks using the 2PD Approach are enticed to eat very energy
dense foods?

> A healthy
> approach is to favour nutrient dense foods, like vegetables and fruits, instead
> of energy dense foods. The latter contain very little nutrients per calories.


Your latter claim is not true (you can enrich anything with vitamins and
minerals without significantly changing its density). It seems you
confuse nutrients with fiber (adding fiber will alter density).

> > Hope the above information helps you.

>
> I don't think so. :)


Your choice.

> > Such is the work being done here for Christ's glory

>
> Are you able to notice and appreciate when other people are doing good job -
> like the researches in the study above?


Do you believe advocating a diet with claims that it is tastier is a
"good job" ?


Hope the above question and discussion enlightens you.

Such is the work being done here for Christ's glory
(http://makeashorterlink.com/?U1E13130A).


Servant to the humblest person in the universe,

Andrew

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/

**
Who is the humblest person in the universe?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?L26062048

What is all this about?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?K6F72510A

Is this spam?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?D13B21FF9
 
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
> Juhana Harju wrote:
>>
>> Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
>>> Juhana Harju wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Fresh article about reducing the heart disease risk by a
>>>> combination diet.
>>>>
>>>> Franco OH et al., The Polymeal: a more natural, safer, and probably
>>>> tastier (than the Polypill) strategy to reduce cardiovascular
>>>> disease by more than 75%. BMJ 2004;329:1447-1450 (18 December).
>>>>
>>>> http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/329/7480/1447?
>>>>
>>>> http://tinyurl.com/56p4m
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Juhana
>>>
>>> If it is tastier, it will be that much harder to eat less.

>>
>> Do you have any evidence to suspect that a diet based on generous
>> consumption of vegetables, fruit and fish would result in weight
>> gain?

>
> My experience has been that generous consumption of any kind of food
> results in weight gain.
>
> Has your experience been different?


According to the following study eating less energy dense food helps in weight
control. Quite the contrary to what you are suggesting with you 2PD approach.

Kral TVE, Roe LS, Rolls BJ. Combined effects of energy density and portion size
on energy intake in women. Am J Clin Nutr 2004;79:962-8

http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/abs...pec=relevance&resourcetype=1&journalcode=ajcn

http://tinyurl.com/6c633

In this study there was found an *inverse* relationship with fruit consumption
and weight gain.

Vicky Drapeau et al, Modifications in food-group consumption are related to
long-term body-weight changes, American Journal of Clinical Nutrition, Vol. 80,
No. 1, 29-37, July 2004

http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/abs...orexactfulltext=and&searchid=1103380560117_19
88&stored_search=&FIRSTINDEX=0&sortspec=relevance&resourcetype=1&journalcode=ajc
n

http://tinyurl.com/4r4yq

>
>>> Enter the 2PD Approach :)

>>
>> Your 2PD approach does not offer the same cardiovascular disease
>> preventing properties as the Polymeal diet.

>
> In truth, you do not know what a person following the 2PD Approach is
> eating.


Please inform me.

>
> There is much evidence to believe that reducing visceral adiposity has
> significant cardioprotective effect.


Of course weight reduction is important. But if you are suggesting your diet as
a long term diet, I think there are healthier options.

>
> Andrew


--
Juhana
 
"Juhana Harju" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Fresh article about reducing the heart disease risk by a combination diet.
>
> Franco OH et al., The Polymeal: a more natural, safer, and probably

tastier
> (than the Polypill) strategy to reduce cardiovascular disease by more than

75%.
> BMJ 2004;329:1447-1450 (18 December).
>
> http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/329/7480/1447?
>
> http://tinyurl.com/56p4m
>
> --
> Juhana


Excellent...thanks for the post!

I especially like this line from near the bottom of the study:

"Redundant cardiologists could be retrained as Polymeal chefs and wine
advisers."

I'm assuming that was tongue-in-cheek, but imagining Doc C. as a chef and
wine adviser gave me a laugh.

GG
 
Juhana Harju wrote:
> Fresh article about reducing the heart disease risk by a combination

diet.
>
> Franco OH et al., The Polymeal: a more natural, safer, and probably

tastier
> (than the Polypill) strategy to reduce cardiovascular disease by more

than 75%.
> BMJ 2004;329:1447-1450 (18 December).
>
> http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/329/7480/1447?
>
> http://tinyurl.com/56p4m
>
> --
> Juhana


I have just had a conversation with the study author. In response to my
query about alcohol consumption in one who cannot tolerate or take
alcohol, he suggests grapefruit and/or grapefruit juice.
Dr. Franco will be reading here today.

Zee
 
"The Polymeal includes wine, fish, dark chocolate, fruits and vegetables,
almonds and garlic, eaten on a daily basis (but four times a week for fish).
Scientists reviewed the medical literature on how much each ingredient cuts
heart disease, blood pressure or cholesterol levels by varying amounts,
(150ml wine daily for instance reduces heart disease by 32%) and worked out
the combined effect of the ingredients. They then calculated the potential
effect across an ongoing study of American adults."

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/medicalnews.php?newsid=17949

Of note, a recent article in Urology reveals that a man drinking 3 glasses
of red wine a week can reduce the risk of prostate cancer by aboout 40%.

Ed

"zwalanga" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> Juhana Harju wrote:
> > Fresh article about reducing the heart disease risk by a combination

> diet.
> >
> > Franco OH et al., The Polymeal: a more natural, safer, and probably

> tastier
> > (than the Polypill) strategy to reduce cardiovascular disease by more

> than 75%.
> > BMJ 2004;329:1447-1450 (18 December).
> >
> > http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/329/7480/1447?
> >
> > http://tinyurl.com/56p4m
> >
> > --
> > Juhana

>
> I have just had a conversation with the study author. In response to my
> query about alcohol consumption in one who cannot tolerate or take
> alcohol, he suggests grapefruit and/or grapefruit juice.
> Dr. Franco will be reading here today.
>
> Zee
>
 
Juhana Harju wrote:
>
> Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
> > Juhana Harju wrote:
> >>
> >> Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
> >>> Juhana Harju wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> Fresh article about reducing the heart disease risk by a
> >>>> combination diet.
> >>>>
> >>>> Franco OH et al., The Polymeal: a more natural, safer, and probably
> >>>> tastier (than the Polypill) strategy to reduce cardiovascular
> >>>> disease by more than 75%. BMJ 2004;329:1447-1450 (18 December).
> >>>>
> >>>> http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/329/7480/1447?
> >>>>
> >>>> http://tinyurl.com/56p4m
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> Juhana
> >>>
> >>> If it is tastier, it will be that much harder to eat less.
> >>
> >> Do you have any evidence to suspect that a diet based on generous
> >> consumption of vegetables, fruit and fish would result in weight
> >> gain?

> >
> > My experience has been that generous consumption of any kind of food
> > results in weight gain.
> >
> > Has your experience been different?

>
> According to the following study eating less energy dense food helps in weight
> control. Quite the contrary to what you are suggesting with you 2PD approach.
>
> Kral TVE, Roe LS, Rolls BJ. Combined effects of energy density and portion size
> on energy intake in women. Am J Clin Nutr 2004;79:962-8
>
> http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/abs...pec=relevance&resourcetype=1&journalcode=ajcn
>
> http://tinyurl.com/6c633
>
> In this study there was found an *inverse* relationship with fruit consumption
> and weight gain.
>
> Vicky Drapeau et al, Modifications in food-group consumption are related to
> long-term body-weight changes, American Journal of Clinical Nutrition, Vol. 80,
> No. 1, 29-37, July 2004
>
> http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/abs...orexactfulltext=and&searchid=1103380560117_19
> 88&stored_search=&FIRSTINDEX=0&sortspec=relevance&resourcetype=1&journalcode=ajc
> n
>
> http://tinyurl.com/4r4yq


Now answer my question:

> > My experience has been that generous consumption of any kind of food
> > results in weight gain.
> >
> > Has your experience been different? <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<


Well?

> >
> >>> Enter the 2PD Approach :)
> >>
> >> Your 2PD approach does not offer the same cardiovascular disease
> >> preventing properties as the Polymeal diet.

> >
> > In truth, you do not know what a person following the 2PD Approach is
> > eating.

>
> Please inform me.


It seems you admit that you have made a conclusion out of ignorance.

> > There is much evidence to believe that reducing visceral adiposity has
> > significant cardioprotective effect.

>
> Of course weight reduction is important. But if you are suggesting your diet as
> a long term diet, I think there are healthier options.
>


You are entitled to your beliefs even if you hold them out of ignorance.

Hope this information enlightens you.

Such is the work being done here for Christ's glory
(http://makeashorterlink.com/?U1E13130A).


Servant to the humblest person in the universe,

Andrew

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/

**
Who is the humblest person in the universe?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?L26062048

What is all this about?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?K6F72510A

Is this spam?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?D13B21FF9
 
Ed Mathes wrote:
> "The Polymeal includes wine, fish, dark chocolate, fruits and

vegetables,
> almonds and garlic, eaten on a daily basis (but four times a week for

fish).
> Scientists reviewed the medical literature on how much each

ingredient cuts
> heart disease, blood pressure or cholesterol levels by varying

amounts,
> (150ml wine daily for instance reduces heart disease by 32%) and

worked out
> the combined effect of the ingredients. They then calculated the

potential
> effect across an ongoing study of American adults."
>
> http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/medicalnews.php?newsid=17949
>
> Of note, a recent article in Urology reveals that a man drinking 3

glasses
> of red wine a week can reduce the risk of prostate cancer by aboout

40%.
>
> Ed
>
> "zwalanga" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> >
> > Juhana Harju wrote:
> > > Fresh article about reducing the heart disease risk by a

combination
> > diet.
> > >
> > > Franco OH et al., The Polymeal: a more natural, safer, and

probably
> > tastier
> > > (than the Polypill) strategy to reduce cardiovascular disease by

more
> > than 75%.
> > > BMJ 2004;329:1447-1450 (18 December).
> > >
> > > http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/329/7480/1447?
> > >
> > > http://tinyurl.com/56p4m
> > >
> > > --
> > > Juhana

> >
> > I have just had a conversation with the study author. In response

to my
> > query about alcohol consumption in one who cannot tolerate or take
> > alcohol, he suggests grapefruit and/or grapefruit juice.
> > Dr. Franco will be reading here today.
> >
> > Zee
> >



A very similar diet I adopted about a year ago may account for my
present cholesterol level, the lowest I've been able to achieve
including while on Lipitor and Baycol. TC 9.7

Zee
 
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
> Juhana Harju wrote:
>>
>> Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
>>> Juhana Harju wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
>>>>> Juhana Harju wrote:


>>> My experience has been that generous consumption of any kind of food
>>> results in weight gain.
>>>
>>> Has your experience been different?
>>>

>
> Well?


I replied to you by providing studies which show that it is easier to control
weight if you eat less energy dense foods. If you consume generously foods that
have just little colories that does not result in weight gain.


>>>>> Enter the 2PD Approach :)
>>>>
>>>> Your 2PD approach does not offer the same cardiovascular disease
>>>> preventing properties as the Polymeal diet.
>>>
>>> In truth, you do not know what a person following the 2PD Approach
>>> is eating.

>>
>> Please inform me.

>
> It seems you admit that you have made a conclusion out of ignorance.


No, I was ready to listen you. But you just replied by being arrogant. Not very
civil from you.

>>> There is much evidence to believe that reducing visceral adiposity
>>> has significant cardioprotective effect.

>>
>> Of course weight reduction is important. But if you are suggesting
>> your diet as a long term diet, I think there are healthier options.
>>

>
> You are entitled to your beliefs even if you hold them out of
> ignorance.


So this was your way to despise a remarkable study about an effective diet to
prevent heart disease. I think that the study would have deserved more serious
attention especially from a cardiologist.

> Hope this information enlightens you.
>
> Such is the work being done here for Christ's glory
> (http://makeashorterlink.com/?U1E13130A).
>
>
> Servant to the humblest person in the universe,
>
> Andrew


--
Juhana
 
In article <[email protected]>,
"zwalanga" <[email protected]> wrote:


> I have just had a conversation with the study author. In response to my
> query about alcohol consumption in one who cannot tolerate or take
> alcohol, he suggests grapefruit and/or grapefruit juice.
> Dr. Franco will be reading here today.
>
> Zee


...............

Something to investigate.


Grapefruit Juice and Medications: A Potential for Adverse Events

Many patients may take their medications with a glass of juice. However,
since the accidental discovery of an interaction between the calcium
channel blocker, felodipine, with grapefruit juice,1 it has now become
evident that grapefruit juice has the potential to

alter the plasma concentrations of many medications when they are taken
by mouth. In some cases, this may result in undesirable clinical effects
of medications.

Administration of grapefruit juice in humans results in a decrease in
the level of CYP3A in the intestine,2 an important site for metabolism
for many medications. This mechanism would account for the increase in
levels of medications that are metabolized by CYP3A when concomitantly
administered with grapefruit juice.

A list of medications that have been shown, in clinical studies, to have
an interaction with grapefruit juice can be found in the table below.
All of the medications, except for theophylline and itraconazole, are
known to be substrates of CYP3A. When given with grapefruit juice in
pharmacokinetic studies their availability increases. In most cases, the
clinical consequence of the pharmacokinetic interaction has not been
evaluated. However, for midazolam and triazolam, as well as for
buspirone, impairment of CNS function was observed, and for the calcium
channel blocker felodipine greater blood pressure lowering has been
observed. In contrast to the increased levels of the other medications,
the grapefruit juice interaction observed with theophylline and
itraconazole was reduced plasma concentrations. The mechanism for this
effect has not been determined.

Although the clinical consequence of the grapefruit juice interaction
with most of the listed drugs has not been evaluated, increased plasma
concentrations of many of these drugs could result in adverse outcomes.
Examples include excessive lowering of blood pressure with the calcium
channel blockers, rhabdomyolysis and the potential for renal impairment
with the HMG CoA reductase inhibitors, and adverse pulmonary effects of
amiodarone. Inconsistent use of grapefruit juice or variability in its
effect on drug metabolism could result in variable and difficult to
control plasma concentrations of other medications, where maintaining a
certain plasma concentration may be especially important, such as for
cyclosporine or for HIV protease inhibitors like saquinavir.

In light of the potential for serious adverse outcomes, patients taking
medications with a potential for interaction with grapefruit juice
should be advised to avoid drinking grapefruit juice. Possible
interactions with whole grapefruit have not been evaluated but it would
be assumed to have similar effects.

Drug Class (Therapeutic Uses)

Medication

Brand Names

Antidepressant (depression)
Sertraline
Zoloft

Antihypertensive (high blood pressure)
Felodipine
Plendil

Nisoldipine
Sular

Pranidipine
Not available in the United States

Antilipemic (lowers cholesterol)
Atorvastatin

Lipitor

Lovastatin
Mevacor

Simvastatin

Zocor

Antimalarial (malaria infection)

Artemether

Paluther

Antiretroviral (HIV infection)
Saquinavir

Fortovase, Invirase

Anxiolytic (anxiety); Sedative (sleep)
Diazepam

Valium

Midazolam

Versed

Triazolam

Halcion

Buspirone

BuSpar

Bronchodilator (asthma, bronchospam)
Theophylline
Theo-Dur, Slo-bid, others

GI stimulant (stimulates GI motility)
Cisapride

Propulsid

Estrogen (birth control, hormone replacement therapy)
Ethinyl estradiol

Ortho-Novum, Loestrin, femhrt, others

Immune suppressant (prevents organ rejection)
Cyclosporine
Neoral, Sandimmune, SangCya

Antifungal (fungal infection)
Itraconazole

Sporanox

Antiarryhthmic (heart rhythm)
Amiodarone
Cordarone, Pacerone

Note: Medication names are hyperlinked to references in PubMed

1. Bailey DG, Spence JD, Munoz C, Arnold JMO.
Interaction of citrus juices with felodipine and nifedipine. Lancet
1991; 337:268-9.

2. Lown KS, Bailey DG, Fontana RJ, et al.
Grapefruit juice increases felodipine oral availability in humans by
decreasing intestinal CYP3A protein expression.

Return to Drug Interaction Advisory Index



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zwalanga wrote:
> Juhana Harju wrote:
> > Fresh article about reducing the heart disease risk by a

combination
> diet.
> >
> > Franco OH et al., The Polymeal: a more natural, safer, and probably

> tastier
> > (than the Polypill) strategy to reduce cardiovascular disease by

more
> than 75%.
> > BMJ 2004;329:1447-1450 (18 December).
> >
> > http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/329/7480/1447?
> >
> > http://tinyurl.com/56p4m
> >
> > --
> > Juhana

>
> I have just had a conversation with the study author. In response to

my
> query about alcohol consumption in one who cannot tolerate or take
> alcohol, he suggests grapefruit and/or grapefruit juice.
> Dr. Franco will be reading here today.
>
> Zee




It is GRAPES and GRAPE JUICE, not grapefruit or grapefruit juice, to
substitute for wine. What a nice man!


Dear Zee

I apologize for the confusion that in a mistake from my not so good
english I have generated. When I said grapefruit I was refering to
"UVAS"
which are grapes. I had not idea that grapes and grapefruits were
different. I am not a native english speaker, my mother tongue is
spanish!
I was refering to grape juice (similar to wine which comes also from
grapes but without alcohol). About grapefruit, I can not tell much
about
its interactions with medicaments, I am still not sure what it exactly
is,
my wife is here explaining me that it is a sort of orange and tastes
like
lemon. I am sorry for the confusion, please take my apologies and offer
them in my name to the members of your discussion group. I will love to
join your discussion group but here in the Netherlands is saturday
23+17,
its time to sleep! Greetings and thank you once more for your interest!
Dr Oscar H. Franco
 
Juhana Harju wrote:
>
> Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
> > Juhana Harju wrote:
> >>
> >> Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
> >>> Juhana Harju wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
> >>>>> Juhana Harju wrote:

>
> >>> My experience has been that generous consumption of any kind of food
> >>> results in weight gain.
> >>>
> >>> Has your experience been different?
> >>>

> >
> > Well?

>
> I replied to you by providing studies which show that it is easier to control
> weight if you eat less energy dense foods. If you consume generously foods that
> have just little colories that does not result in weight gain.


You still are not answering the simple question:

Has it been your experience that when you eat more generous amounts of
food that you do not gain weight?


Hope your thinking about this question enlightens you.

Such is the work being done here for Christ's glory
(http://makeashorterlink.com/?U1E13130A).


Servant to the humblest person in the universe,

Andrew

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/

**
Who is the humblest person in the universe?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?L26062048

What is all this about?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?K6F72510A

Is this spam?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?D13B21FF9
 
"Juhana Harju" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
>> Juhana Harju wrote:
>>>
>>> Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
>>>> Juhana Harju wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
>>>>>> Juhana Harju wrote:

>
>>>> My experience has been that generous consumption of any kind of food
>>>> results in weight gain.
>>>>
>>>> Has your experience been different?
>>>>

>>
>> Well?

>
> I replied to you by providing studies which show that it is easier to
> control
> weight if you eat less energy dense foods. If you consume generously foods
> that
> have just little colories that does not result in weight gain.
>
>
>>>>>> Enter the 2PD Approach :)
>>>>>
>>>>> Your 2PD approach does not offer the same cardiovascular disease
>>>>> preventing properties as the Polymeal diet.
>>>>
>>>> In truth, you do not know what a person following the 2PD Approach
>>>> is eating.
>>>
>>> Please inform me.

>>
>> It seems you admit that you have made a conclusion out of ignorance.

>
> No, I was ready to listen you. But you just replied by being arrogant. Not
> very
> civil from you.


Judging from his posts, the chinese doctor is very troubled <sigh>.

Would best be to leave him in his fantasy world - take him for entertainment
value ! Nothing more. His science = a big zero.
 
Kim wrote:
> This diet sounds very similar to the "Mediterranean Diet".




Kim you asked about my "diet":


No diet. I should not have used that word. When I look at what I eat
and look at the various nutrition recommendations I seem to be between
the Polymeal and the Mediterranean: lots of fresh fruits and
vegetables, especially brightly coloured vegetables and green leafy
vegetables; whole grains; fish about four times a week, chicken or
turkey a couple times a week, red meat rarely--bison, moose, deer or
goat; something from the beans, pulses, and dal family every day, olive
oil, olives, walnut oil, various nuts and seeds including almond,
Brazil and walnuts; ground flax seed every day, a small amount of dairy
and cheese.

Up to one ounce Swiss, German, Belgian or Dutch dark chocolate or one
ounce cocoa powder (not hot chocolate mix) usually every day.

None to minimum trans fats. I know there was some trans fat in the two
Scottish oatcakes I ate today but I haven't had them for about a year.
Rarely purchased baked goods, and no baked goods unless made with whole
grains, canola or olive oil; or rarely, butter. (Hard to make
shortbread without butter.)

Several times a week a cup of either green tea, black tea with milk or
lemon or mint tea.

A good nutrition site to consult.

http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/


The Polymeal diet is the subject of the thread we were in. Ed Mathes
gives a link.

Probably some things I left out. Here is what I ate today to give you
an idea:

Breakfast

4 ounces cooked Scottish oatmeal
1/2 ounce walnuts
1/2 ounce ground flax seed
1 1/2 ounces plain full fat yogurt
2 ounces sliced banana

4 ounces whole milk in 2 cups coffee (think I have to cut that down to
2 ounces and one cup).


Lunch

2 ounces medium gouda cheese
3 ounces (12 large) dark red grapes
2 Scottish oat cakes



Supper

2 ounces rice stick noodles
1/4 cup chicken broth
2 cups assorted julienned vegs: Anaheim green pepper, jalepeno pepper,
green beans, broccoli stem
1 small tomato
4 cloves garlic slivered
1 piece ginger thinly sliced
4 ounces snapper (fish)
2 green onions
teaspoon dark sesame oil
juice of one small lime
water to cook

one ounce dark chocolate (Droste pastilles)

2 litres water apart from water in cooking and coffee.
I usually eat an apple every day. Missed today.



Zee