Experience with Campy's 05 Frt Derailleur for Compact Cranks



I

IanD

Guest
Hello all,

I was wondering if anyone has had a chance to sample Campy's frt
derailleur designed for compact cranks? I'm looking for techinical
feedback with concerns over the ease of shifting between this
derailleur and the standard double derailleur. I'm currently riding a
record db derailleur with a FSA compact crank. I haven't had any
problems but then again I curious as what the side benefits this
derailleur would have over the normal double. I see that it appears
that the inside shifting plate looks more like a triple in terms of
size and appears to be notched. Anyhow, any info would be greatly
appreciated.

Thanks!

Ian in San Diego (Currently in Seoul)
 
I wonder if anyone outside of trade shows has actually SEEN one of these
critters... Rumor has it the inner plate makes it LESS likely to drop
the chain off the inner ring onto the spindle. I've done this a couple
of times, and it's one situation I can't bail from without having to
stop and pull the chain back on by hand...

IanD wrote:
> Hello all,
>
> I was wondering if anyone has had a chance to sample Campy's frt
> derailleur designed for compact cranks? I'm looking for techinical
> feedback with concerns over the ease of shifting between this
> derailleur and the standard double derailleur. I'm currently riding a
> record db derailleur with a FSA compact crank. I haven't had any
> problems but then again I curious as what the side benefits this
> derailleur would have over the normal double. I see that it appears
> that the inside shifting plate looks more like a triple in terms of
> size and appears to be notched. Anyhow, any info would be greatly
> appreciated.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Ian in San Diego (Currently in Seoul)
 
IanD-<< I was wondering if anyone has had a chance to sample Campy's frt
derailleur designed for compact cranks? >><BR><BR>

It isn't in the US yet but as you have seen, the normal FD, either a double in
your case or a triple works just fine and dandy. The new one for compact will
too, but I don't see the need for it.

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"
 
There's an obvious need! LOTS of folks have $90 or so they absolutely
MUST get rid of. This gives them the opportunity to put a fine $90 FD
into the parts bin (or eBay) and put it into one that might not function
a bit differently...

Qui si parla Campagnolo wrote:
> IanD-<< I was wondering if anyone has had a chance to sample Campy's frt
> derailleur designed for compact cranks? >><BR><BR>
>
> It isn't in the US yet but as you have seen, the normal FD, either a double in
> your case or a triple works just fine and dandy. The new one for compact will
> too, but I don't see the need for it.
>
> Peter Chisholm
> Vecchio's Bicicletteria
> 1833 Pearl St.
> Boulder, CO, 80302
> (303)440-3535
> http://www.vecchios.com
> "Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"
 
> I'm currently riding a
> record db derailleur with a FSA compact crank.


Hi Ian, i'm curious which FSA compact crankset you're using and how you like it.
I'm thinking of getting a FSA CFJ compact crankset because it has almost the same
q-factor as my current Record double and the FSA carbon cranksets are a bit too
expensive.


"IanD" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> Hello all,
>
> I was wondering if anyone has had a chance to sample Campy's frt
> derailleur designed for compact cranks? I'm looking for techinical
> feedback with concerns over the ease of shifting between this
> derailleur and the standard double derailleur. I'm currently riding a
> record db derailleur with a FSA compact crank. I haven't had any
> problems but then again I curious as what the side benefits this
> derailleur would have over the normal double. I see that it appears
> that the inside shifting plate looks more like a triple in terms of
> size and appears to be notched. Anyhow, any info would be greatly
> appreciated.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Ian in San Diego (Currently in Seoul)
 
On Sun, 07 Nov 2004 08:55:34 -0500, richard wrote:

> I wonder if anyone outside of trade shows has actually SEEN one of these
> critters... Rumor has it the inner plate makes it LESS likely to drop
> the chain off the inner ring onto the spindle. I've done this a couple
> of times, and it's one situation I can't bail from without having to
> stop and pull the chain back on by hand...
>
>


N-Gear Jump Stop, ten bucks and suicide shifting is gone forever.
 
Greets!

Despite the fact that I am not Ian, let me respond to your query re:
FSA compact aluminum cranks. I have the Energy compact that I am
using with an isis bb (FSA platinum?) and a Daytona 10 double der.

Nice crankset, bb seems smooth, shifting is great (i.e., as good or
better than with my Chorus crankset). No need for a "compact"
derailleur.

I'm just a little concerned about the durability of the finish on the
crankset (not due to actual knowledge, just concerned about a painted
crankset) but that is probably a minor concern.

App
 
[email protected] (Qui si parla Campagnolo ) wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> IanD-<< I was wondering if anyone has had a chance to sample Campy's frt
> derailleur designed for compact cranks? >><BR><BR>
>
> It isn't in the US yet but as you have seen, the normal FD, either a double in
> your case or a triple works just fine and dandy. The new one for compact will
> too, but I don't see the need for it.
>


I beg to differ. I shipped one out today with a Record Compact Carbon
crank.
I suspect you're right about the need. A normal double will shift ok.
I haven't had the luxury of setting up one with a CT derailleur
though.

Robin Hubert
 
"richard" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:qPpjd.475801$mD.95053@attbi_s02...
> I wonder if anyone outside of trade shows has actually SEEN one of these
> critters... Rumor has it the inner plate makes it LESS likely to drop
> the chain off the inner ring onto the spindle. I've done this a couple
> of times, and it's one situation I can't bail from without having to
> stop and pull the chain back on by hand...
>
> IanD wrote:
> > Hello all,
> >
> > I was wondering if anyone has had a chance to sample Campy's frt
> > derailleur designed for compact cranks? I'm looking for techinical
> > feedback with concerns over the ease of shifting between this
> > derailleur and the standard double derailleur.


<snippage>

I will let you all know when mine arrives in Dec. I currently have the FSA
carbons with their bb and standard record derailleur. With short
chainstays, the chainline sucks and the chain frequently drops despite close
attention to adjustment. With the regular derailler, you cannot pick up the
chain while riding like you can with normal cranks...you have to stop and
get off. The campy CT's use the Record BB, so my chainline will be back to
normal, and I suspect the curve of the new derailleur will allow you to pick
up the chain while riding if you do accidentally throw it off. I will
definitely keep you posted.

Cat
PS-anyone want to buy a used FSA compact carbon and ti BB?
 
>>IanD-<< I was wondering if anyone has had a chance to
sample Campy's frt
>>derailleur designed for compact cranks? >><BR><BR>


> [email protected] (Qui si parla Campagnolo ) wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
>>It isn't in the US yet but as you have seen, the normal FD, either a double in
>>your case or a triple works just fine and dandy. The new one for compact will
>>too, but I don't see the need for it.


Robin Hubert wrote:
> I beg to differ. I shipped one out today with a Record Compact Carbon
> crank.
> I suspect you're right about the need. A normal double will shift ok.
> I haven't had the luxury of setting up one with a CT derailleur
> though.


Yes, Campagnolo's Carbon Compact is pretty cool.
http://www.yellowjersey.org/cranx3.html
And light, and available! Agree with Peter, hven;'t seen a
need fro a diffferent changer, theseshift well with the
standard Campagnolo fronts.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
 
"A Muzi" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> >>IanD-<< I was wondering if anyone has had a chance to sample Campy's

> frt
>>>derailleur designed for compact cranks? >><BR><BR>

>
>> [email protected] (Qui si parla Campagnolo ) wrote in message
>> news:<[email protected]>...
>>>It isn't in the US yet but as you have seen, the normal FD, either a
>>>double in
>>>your case or a triple works just fine and dandy. The new one for compact
>>>will
>>>too, but I don't see the need for it.

>
> Robin Hubert wrote:
>> I beg to differ. I shipped one out today with a Record Compact Carbon
>> crank.
>> I suspect you're right about the need. A normal double will shift ok.
>> I haven't had the luxury of setting up one with a CT derailleur
>> though.

>
> Yes, Campagnolo's Carbon Compact is pretty cool.
> http://www.yellowjersey.org/cranx3.html
> And light, and available! Agree with Peter, hven;'t seen a need fro a
> diffferent changer, theseshift well with the standard Campagnolo fronts.
>
> --

Thanks, nice photo. Your picture states:

"all crank lengths and 34-50 and with the excellent 110mm format.
We stock damn near every ring size 34 to 56 teeth "

The question then is does the Campy CT compact have a 110mm bolt circle
diameter? If so, that's great news and contrary to alot of others who stated
that it would be some weird proprietary bolt pattern like 112mm or
112.5mm.....
 
"Ronald" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> > I'm currently riding a
> > record db derailleur with a FSA compact crank.

>
> Hi Ian, i'm curious which FSA compact crankset you're using and how you like it.
> I'm thinking of getting a FSA CFJ compact crankset because it has almost the same
> q-factor as my current Record double and the FSA carbon cranksets are a bit too
> expensive.

Ronald,

I have two FSA compact cranks -> Carbon Pro Elite and the Energy. I
really have had any major problems with the cranks at all. Currently
riding on the carbon with record double and the engery with centaur
double with the latest generation shimano pedals. I find the q-factor
of both cranks a non-issue for myself at least. For measurements sakes
I'm about 5'6" equal length upper and lower torsos. I have not had the
pleasure of having my chain drop when shifting to the inner ring,
although like anything else in life, it will probably happen some time
in my cycling future. I just like having the gear range afforded with
these carbon cranks. I'm not a terribly good climber so I need all the
help I can get.
 
-snip Campagnolo compact crank-

The perspicacious bfd wrote:
> Thanks, nice photo. Your picture states:
> "all crank lengths and 34-50 and with the excellent 110mm format.
> We stock damn near every ring size 34 to 56 teeth "
>
> The question then is does the Campy CT compact have a 110mm bolt circle
> diameter? If so, that's great news and contrary to alot of others who stated
> that it would be some weird proprietary bolt pattern like 112mm or
> 112.5mm.....


I had heard that rumor, too.

I measured the crank last Friday, wrote the web page but
didn't try to change a ring until today. Should have
measured more carefully.

The crank is indeed _mostly_ 110mm. The one bolt inside the
arm is at 112mm. (I can't recall any other asymmetric drill)

Here's the crank with a Sugino ring:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/photosfromthepast/CAFCCOMP.JPG

Here's how it doesn't work:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/photosfromthepast/CAFCCOMX.JPG

Here's the tool:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/photosfromthepast/SHAPER.JPG

With such a shaper positioned inside the existing chainring
bolt hole at the proper depth, push the ring across the
table of the drill press 2mm (use stops so the ring can't
spin!), There's no inner chainring seat or land below that
bolt so, even though the Campagnolo ring is relieved (on the
inside edge) you needn't trim that part of your replacement
ring.

And you thought Shimano was weird. . . Is this related to
the recent reintroduction of absinthe to Europe?
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
 
> Despite the fact that I am not Ian, let me respond to your query re:
> FSA compact aluminum cranks. I have the Energy compact that I am
> using with an isis bb (FSA platinum?) and a Daytona 10 double der.
>
> Nice crankset, bb seems smooth, shifting is great (i.e., as good or
> better than with my Chorus crankset). No need for a "compact"
> derailleur.
>
> I'm just a little concerned about the durability of the finish on

the
> crankset (not due to actual knowledge, just concerned about a

painted
> crankset) but that is probably a minor concern.


Hi, thanx. I've ran across the Energy also but i wan't to start cheap
(the CFJ is about half price of the Energy). Also i need an Italian
bottom bracket and when i look at the availability of ISIS and
Octalink BB's in the specified sizes it doesn't look too bright. There
are some FSA ISIS bb's but i don't trust them much after reading the
article on Sheldon's site (http://www.sheldonbrown.com/fsabb.html).
The CFJ uses a standard square JIS spindle and i guess these will be
available for some time to come. Only thing i'm not too sure about is
the cheaper RPM chainrings on the FSJ.


"Appkiller" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Greets!
>
> Despite the fact that I am not Ian, let me respond to your query re:
> FSA compact aluminum cranks. I have the Energy compact that I am
> using with an isis bb (FSA platinum?) and a Daytona 10 double der.
>
> Nice crankset, bb seems smooth, shifting is great (i.e., as good or
> better than with my Chorus crankset). No need for a "compact"
> derailleur.
>
> I'm just a little concerned about the durability of the finish on

the
> crankset (not due to actual knowledge, just concerned about a

painted
> crankset) but that is probably a minor concern.
>
> App
 
Robin-<< I beg to differ. I shipped one out today with a Record Compact Carbon
crank. >><BR><BR>

What supplier did you get it from please?

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"
 
On Mon, 8 Nov 2004 16:54:04 -0500, "Cat Dailey"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>I will let you all know when mine arrives in Dec. I currently have the FSA
>carbons with their bb and standard record derailleur. With short
>chainstays, the chainline sucks and the chain frequently drops despite close
>attention to adjustment. With the regular derailler, you cannot pick up the
>chain while riding like you can with normal cranks...you have to stop and
>get off. The campy CT's use the Record BB, so my chainline will be back to
>normal, and I suspect the curve of the new derailleur will allow you to pick
>up the chain while riding if you do accidentally throw it off. I will
>definitely keep you posted.


I find your post most interesting. I have the FSA Compact crankset
with an FSA 108 ISIS bottom bracket. I also drop the chain on that
bicycle, a CAAD7. I never thought that the chainline was the problem.
I eventually gave up after multiple attempts at adjusting the front
derailleur and changing to different front derailleurs. I installed a
Jump Stop on that bicycle. My other CAAD7 uses a Stronglight
Granfundo compact with the recommended 113 JIS bb and doesn't drop the
chain. The 50t ring on that set is an old SR w/o shift assists and
the Campy 10 sp double derailleur shifts it fine.
 
"Paul Kopit" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Mon, 8 Nov 2004 16:54:04 -0500, "Cat Dailey"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >I will let you all know when mine arrives in Dec. I currently have the

FSA
> >carbons with their bb and standard record derailleur. With short
> >chainstays, the chainline sucks and the chain frequently drops despite

close
> >attention to adjustment. With the regular derailler, you cannot pick up

the
> >chain while riding like you can with normal cranks...you have to stop and
> >get off. The campy CT's use the Record BB, so my chainline will be back

to
> >normal, and I suspect the curve of the new derailleur will allow you to

pick
> >up the chain while riding if you do accidentally throw it off. I will
> >definitely keep you posted.

>
> I find your post most interesting. I have the FSA Compact crankset
> with an FSA 108 ISIS bottom bracket. I also drop the chain on that
> bicycle, a CAAD7. I never thought that the chainline was the problem.
> I eventually gave up after multiple attempts at adjusting the front
> derailleur and changing to different front derailleurs. I installed a
> Jump Stop on that bicycle. My other CAAD7 uses a Stronglight
> Granfundo compact with the recommended 113 JIS bb and doesn't drop the
> chain. The 50t ring on that set is an old SR w/o shift assists and
> the Campy 10 sp double derailleur shifts it fine.


I even called FSA from my LBS to see what was up with the cranks. We wanted
to try reversing the bb, but FSA said no go to that. My LBS thought that
the drive side crank sat very far away from the bb (does that make sense?)
when installed correctly. He pointed out the crappy chain line right away.
I do have very short chainstays, which was the first thing the FSA tech rep
asked me on the phone. He basically said there was no solution. That's why
I want to go back to my Record BB and Record cranks. I LOVE compacts and am
very happy to be getting the Campy version.

Cat
 
On Tue, 9 Nov 2004 16:28:21 -0500, "Cat Dailey"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>I even called FSA from my LBS to see what was up with the cranks. We wanted
>to try reversing the bb, but FSA said no go to that. My LBS thought that
>the drive side crank sat very far away from the bb (does that make sense?)
>when installed correctly. He pointed out the crappy chain line right away.
>I do have very short chainstays, which was the first thing the FSA tech rep
>asked me on the phone. He basically said there was no solution. That's why
>I want to go back to my Record BB and Record cranks. I LOVE compacts and am
>very happy to be getting the Campy version.


For a while FSA had carbon, road cranksets that were samped "ISO" on
the innerside near the square taper hole. They used the regular Campy
102 bb and worked fine. I'm certain they can do the same trick with
their compact offerings. I put TA chainrings on the arms and they
were fine.
 
In article <[email protected]>,
Cat Dailey <[email protected]> wrote:
>I even called FSA from my LBS to see what was up with the cranks. We wanted
>to try reversing the bb, but FSA said no go to that.


ISIS bottom brackets are symetrical.

>My LBS thought that
>the drive side crank sat very far away from the bb (does that make sense?)
>when installed correctly.


Perhaps, although the rings are what's important - farther from the
bottom bracket would make for less rub.

The specified chain line for FSA compacts (43.5mm) is identical to Campagnolo
doubles (43.5mm).

>He pointed out the crappy chain line right away.
>I do have very short chainstays, which was the first thing the FSA tech rep
>asked me on the phone. He basically said there was no solution.


Last night I installed a FSA 50-34 carbon pro elite compact and found that I
have slight chain rub on the two smallest cogs. This morning I grabbed my
calipers, and the spacing seems (I was a bit rushed) to be .025" - .035"
narrower.

Campy's 10-speed big ring is spaced in .4mm = .025" compared to 9 speed.

.025" = .6mm, .035" = .9mm.

Seem real significant compared to the amount of rub, and should have a much
bigger effect on eliminating it than spacing both rings out farther with
a longer bottom bracket.

I'm going to order some LeTour spacers (available in .4 and .6mm)
or try shim stock if I'm feeling less lazy.
--
<a href="http://www.poohsticks.org/drew/">Home Page</a>
Life is a terminal sexually transmitted disease.
 
Drew-<< Last night I installed a FSA 50-34 carbon pro elite compact and found
that I
have slight chain rub on the two smallest cogs. >><BR><BR>

Common and normal with most modern systems.

With a 16t difference with the spacing, it is not really an issue and not worth
shimming or spacing, IMO. Just shift to the big ring and up a few cogs, same
ratio.

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"