Fahrenheit 9/11 : Did you see it and if you did what do you think about it ?

[limerickman]

I would like to ask the Soapboxers about their view of Fahrenheit 9/11.

Have you seen this movie ?
Does it re-enforce your political beliefs (ie pro/anti Bush) ?
Did it persuade you to change your mind about the Bush administration ?

For what it's worth, I didn't learn anything about Bush which wasn't already known such as Carlyle, 2000 Florida fiasco and WMD.

The issue of Mr.Bath was new for me - I wasn't aware of that.

I did notice that some of the footage shown in the Moore film had been taken
from other media from outside the USA though.

 

[keydates]

It was obviously nothing more than a base-motivator. Most Republicans either didn't see it or don't believe/care about what Moore says.

Like Ann Coulter, Rush Limbaugh, and others, the claims/things that Michael Moore make have to be taken with a (large) grain of salt. He quotes things out of context, twists things, makes claims that aren't really backed up, etc. etc. There is a relatively recent article on www.spinsanity.org about this film (and others).

That being said, my political beliefs were not changed by this film.

 

[Salsa Rider]

I did saw it just this last weekend. Having read all the left wing propaganda already there was very little new for me, tho actually seeing it in motion was nice. It didnt change any views for me, mostly because I stand just to the left of Al Franken, but am not as well spoken. I've always thought that the 2000 election was a travesty, but I was amazed and shocked at how much damage one small group of people could do to an entire country in just 3 1/2 years.

Flame Away

 

[Weisse Luft]

I did saw it just this last weekend. Having read all the left wing propaganda already there was very little new for me, tho actually seeing it in motion was nice. It didnt change any views for me, mostly because I stand just to the left of Al Franken, but am not as well spoken. I've always thought that the 2000 election was a travesty, but I was amazed and shocked at how much damage one small group of people could do to an entire country in just 3 1/2 years.

Flame Away

I downloaded a copy before the flood of traffic caused a DOS for most and the film's distributors went ape and against Moorons intentions for free distribution to private viewers.

This movie is a piece of art in how it utilizes the editing room talents of Mooron to completely distort the truth. In this respect, it follows in his tradition of making a silk purse into a sow's ear. Turning gold into lead. Snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.

 

[birdman23]

Haven't seen it, won't waste my time or money to see it. I don't necessarily agree with everything the Bush administration has done but Moore has nothing to say but lies and distorted facts.

 

[keydates]

This film was more accurate than his previous ones...but it's still very deceptive.

 

[jhuskey]

This film was more accurate than his previous ones...but it's still very deceptive.

Hate to rag on someones apperance but anyone that has no more respect for his health and body that this Moore does,gets no notice or respect from me.
I assume that most people here are in good condition or want to be.
Just can't relate to a fat slob. Sorry!

 

[TrekDedicated]

Hate to rag on someones apperance but anyone that has no more respect for his health and body that this Moore does,gets no notice or respect from me.
I assume that most people here are in good condition or want to be.
Just can't relate to a fat slob. Sorry!

I'm sure we'll learn why he is sooooo fat with his next movie about health care...I think it is titled 'Sicko'

On F9/11, I have not seen it, I may contemplate it if I was given a free copy. I am not willingly paying for skewed film editing and a man who denounces the US when outside these borders to make a few more million dollars...

 

[zapper]

I did saw it just this last weekend. Having read all the left wing propaganda already there was very little new for me, tho actually seeing it in motion was nice. It didnt change any views for me, mostly because I stand just to the left of Al Franken, but am not as well spoken. I've always thought that the 2000 election was a travesty, but I was amazed and shocked at how much damage one small group of people could do to an entire country in just 3 1/2 years.

Flame Away

No flames required..You said it all with your Al Franken remark...Al Franken came about my old ship, the HARRY S. TRUMAN while we were deployed. He was vulgar and made quite the ass out of himself. So, if you think the 2000 election was a travisty, just wait until november. Kerry will have to report back to the job he's been awol from for the last year....

 

[zapper]

Hate to rag on someones apperance but anyone that has no more respect for his health and body that this Moore does,gets no notice or respect from me.
I assume that most people here are in good condition or want to be.
Just can't relate to a fat slob. Sorry!

The gross fat pig...Moore is getting fat off of all those lefty dollars being thrown his way. Funny, these left wing environmentalist cringe when paying a dollar for a yellow wristband to support cancer research via LAF, but think nothing of throwing down 50 bucks for popcorn and a movie, if that's what you want to call moores manipulation of half truths on film...Poor libs, cry poverty but they seem to come up with the money somehow....

 

[Salsa Rider]

I'm sure we'll learn why he is sooooo fat with his next movie about health care...I think it is titled 'Sicko'

On F9/11, I have not seen it, I may contemplate it if I was given a free copy. I am not willingly paying for skewed film editing and a man who denounces the US when outside these borders to make a few more million dollars...

Ok folks its time to separate the person that is the President and the Country. Moore is a Patriot. He sees someone doing wrong to his country or his countrymen and he is trying to stop it. He loves his country same as I do, same as you do. Our president though has done a terrible job. He has done us an insane amount of disservice to our standing as the leading democracy in the world through his inept foreign policy. He has sold public lands to private companies for pennies on the dollar. Millions of jobs lost over the last 3 years and the tens of thousands of jobs that he has managed to create in the last 3 months are on average paying $9k dollars less than the ones lost. He has accumulated a record deficit, what happened to fiscal responsibility? We will be paying this bill for decades. A thousand soldiers killed, tens of thousands of innocent Iraqi's killed, and the perpetrator of the largest act of terrorism is still free. Saddam was an evil man, yes, but he was *not* a threat to America or Americans. The men making millions while doing disservice to this country are in the board rooms of our energy corporation, our defense contractors, our pharmaceutical companies and in our White House. I love my country, but I cant stand what has been done to it by GW and his puppet masters.



And the people that should be the maddest of all; our proud members of the military. He has chosen to risk your lives on information that most of the world would not risk their sons and daughters on.



/me takes a deep breath and gets ready for the backlash

 

[TrekDedicated]

Moore is a Patriot.

http://www.americandaily.com/article/3748

Moore saves his best shots against his fellow Americans for when he is in Europe, where he is adored for his vocal loathing of his countrymen. In Germany, he mused that since America is full of such ignorant people, how could it be that such fools were able to rise to power? Moore laughed that Americans always have a “big a-- grin on our face all the time, because our brains aren't loaded down." He said that the American system is so flawed that Germany should never consider trying to copy it but stay on their correct socialist path

Moore told a Cambridge reporter that all America is known for around the world is “bringing sadness and misery to places around the globe." In England, he told a reporter that Americans were possibly “the dumbest people on the face of the planet.” He shows his respect for our men and women in uniform by describing those killing our military people as “Iraqi Minutemen and freedom fighters.” He has also had his movie enthusiastically endorsed by Hezbollah and “Fahrenheit 9/11” will be shown in Syria and Lebanon. Both of these terrorist-ridden countries are sending jihadists into Iraq to kill American soldiers.

Patriot? A Patriot supports his country, he doesn't tear it down when speaking to other countries.

And the people that should be the maddest of all; our proud members of the military. He has chosen to risk your lives on information that most of the world would not risk their sons and daughters on.



hmmm.... yes... the military is against it...

A sergeant with 10 years of service under his belt said, "I speak for all of us. We think that we are doing the right thing in Iraq," before saying he is to be deployed there in a few weeks and is "eager" to go and serve.

http://www.nypost.com/news/nationalnews/25935.htm

 

[limerickman]

Patriot? A Patriot supports his country, he doesn't tear it down when speaking to other countries.

http://www.nypost.com/news/nationalnews/25935.htm

That is your definition of patriotism.

Patriotism is a word that is used as a flag of convenience.
You think that Michael Moore is being unpatriotic because he asks a questions
of your President Bush, through his film.
In your opinion by doing so, Moore is being unpatriotic.

I think being unpatriotic is sending American soldiers in to an illegal war in Iraq.

This question of patriotism is going to drive your country apart.
Can you not see this ?
As an outsider, it is evident that your goverment is playing games - expensive games with peoples lives.
Look at today - look at the clowns, for that is what they are clowns - calling a security alert on information that is out of date ??
Information which is three years out of date !
This sounds like the WMD fairy tale all over again !
Is it patriotic to feed the US people with lies ?
Is it patriotic to tell lies about Saddam or to lie about Al Queda ?
Is it patriotic ?

You and your nation need to seriously and rigourously to look at the goverment that you have.
This is not about Republican/Democrat anymore.
it is about whether or not, you can trust Bush.
If you cannot trust Bush - you've got to get rid of him.

 

[Weisse Luft]

First of all, the US is NOT a democracy. Its a constitutional republic with a democratically elected represented government.

Second of all, the entire US Military is a volunteer service. Say what you want about the economic makeup of the services because there are more than one Pat Tillman's serving today. And the majority of the service members are in agreement with President Bush and NOT in favor of Senator Kerry. I thought majority mattered out of the tendency for people to think the US is a democracy...

Mooron finds the minority and makes the image the minority is the majority.

 

[limerickman]

First of all, the US is NOT a democracy. Its a constitutional republic with a democratically elected represented government.

Second of all, the entire US Military is a volunteer service. Say what you want about the economic makeup of the services because there are more than one Pat Tillman's serving today. And the majority of the service members are in agreement with President Bush and NOT in favor of Senator Kerry. I thought majority mattered out of the tendency for people to think the US is a democracy...

Mooron finds the minority and makes the image the minority is the majority.

My understanding is that if the President of the USA issues an order for the military to act - they have no choice but to obey the order or face treason ?
Correct ?

 

[keydates]

Maybe not treason, but possibly a failure to obey orders, or desertion. Not really sure of the (military) legal code.

sometimes , the minority is right...

 

[limerickman]

Maybe not treason, but possibly a failure to obey orders, or desertion. Not really sure of the (military) legal code.

sometimes , the minority is right...

Ok but to disobey an order would incur some sort of sanction, right ?
Disobedience could include saying "well although I disagree with this order -
I have to obey it and go to Iraq".

So to conclude that Moore only spoke to those people in the minority
is hardly logical.
Because those in the army cannot think - by the very nature of the job -they're required to unquestioningly obey an order, right ?
And 100% must agree with the war - they've no choice !

Therefore the conclusion that there is a small minority of nay sayers is baloney.

 

[Bikerman2004]

That is your definition of patriotism.

Patriotism is a word that is used as a flag of convenience.
You think that Michael Moore is being unpatriotic because he asks a questions
of your President Bush, through his film.
In your opinion by doing so, Moore is being unpatriotic.

I think being unpatriotic is sending American soldiers in to an illegal war in Iraq.

This question of patriotism is going to drive your country apart.
Can you not see this ?
As an outsider, it is evident that your goverment is playing games - expensive games with peoples lives.
Look at today - look at the clowns, for that is what they are clowns - calling a security alert on information that is out of date ??
Information which is three years out of date !
This sounds like the WMD fairy tale all over again !
Is it patriotic to feed the US people with lies ?
Is it patriotic to tell lies about Saddam or to lie about Al Queda ?
Is it patriotic ?

You and your nation need to seriously and rigourously to look at the goverment that you have.
This is not about Republican/Democrat anymore.
it is about whether or not, you can trust Bush.
If you cannot trust Bush - you've got to get rid of him.

Exactly what lies did Bush tell about Al Queda?
What lies about WMD did he tell? (remember the French and Russians said he had them as well)
Also what type of government do you recommend we have over here?

 

[Weisse Luft]

My understanding is that if the President of the USA issues an order for the military to act - they have no choice but to obey the order or face treason ?
Correct ?

Derelection of duty, failure to follow command and others. But not treason.

And to clear up the muddied waters a bit...the 12 years following the defeat of the Iraqi occupation in Kuwait were administered by UN mandates ad infinitium that were consistently IGNORED. It was high time the situation changed but the UN was too busy lining its pockets off profits from its sanctions (read up on how Kofi Annan's son at the ripe age of 24 headed a shell corporation involved...).

Now the UN has Sudanese on its human rights commission? That is like hiring Jeffery Dahlmer (when he was still alive) as a camp counselor. Or having Michael Jackson babysit your pre-teen boys.

The UN needs overhaul. It has become the authority of the America haters. The party club of the class warfare machine.

 

[Weisse Luft]

Ok but to disobey an order would incur some sort of sanction, right ?
Disobedience could include saying "well although I disagree with this order -
I have to obey it and go to Iraq".

So to conclude that Moore only spoke to those people in the minority
is hardly logical.
Because those in the army cannot think - by the very nature of the job -they're required to unquestioningly obey an order, right ?
And 100% must agree with the war - they've no choice !

Therefore the conclusion that there is a small minority of nay sayers is baloney.

No, the small minority of service members who became the fodder of Mooron. The disgruntled malingerers. The Joes with "F.T.A." written everywhere. They still obey orders, for the most part but some take trips to Canada or throw up an air of conscienous objection. But make these "nancy-boys" ruck up and get ready for deployment and they sound like a bunch of 6th graders being called in from recess.