Fahrenheit 9/11 : Did you see it and if you did what do you think about it ?
- Thread starter limerickman
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I live in australia DUH if all you can do is knock me about my spelling that say a lot, no answer to what i said as for history what part did i get wrong ???pomod said:Actually
Pardon my cynicism, I have a smart ass gene.
But in all seriousness and at the risk of sounding condescending, I want to suggest to you to turn of Fox news. In fact throw your TV away and pick up some newspapers, read a variety of sources Left and Right wing - the editorials are a good place to start. You know, you have the internet, find out what people outside the US are saying about these events, in Europe or in the Middle East as well. While you’re at it, go down to the Library and check out some history books, again, written from a variety of perspectives. (because there is no single solitary version of history, it's true) Question the authority of your government, your allowed to - really, it keeps them on their toes, and despite what they tell you it compromises none your patriotism.
And then, after making some informed opinions, go and vote with your conscious in November. If nothing else, your spelling will at least improve
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very good post w/ good points; like reelistment numbers declining & the fact that the majority of soldiers over there are from low-middle income families. I wonder what the republicans would do if the wealthy had to send thier children to make up for the shortfall. I'll tell you, they would reinstitute the draft so that they could get some more poor bastards to fight thier ideological war. Shrub let the cat out of the bag, in re: of why he was hell bent on going into iraq, when he said "They tried to kill my daddy." If it wer'nt for his & his puppet master- Cheney's act of invasion, his presidency would be mediocre at best. Other than re-rewarding the wealthy w/ his mindless tax-cut he's done next to nothing other than taking some of our most important freedoms away (Ashcroft & him).wadoflove said:I saw the movie recently and was really blown away by the comparison between the Orwell novel 1984 and what is going on in the US. If you remember, in 1984 the government engages in a war against "terrorists" which may or may not exist. The war is a tool to keep people afraid and compliant, worried more about the enemy than what their own government is up to. It seems that Karl and **** and the boys have learned their lessons from this book well (and their puppet Georgie is willing playing along). Hence the security alerts (some based on 3-4 year old info) just after the democrats make major announcements. Hence the unwinnable "War on Terror". I guess the unwinnable "War on Drugs" simply did not have any caché anymore. Perhaps this is why they didn't finish the war in Afghanistan or capture Osama...
I also thought it was funny that at the Republican convention the Repubs were saying that Kerry was a ***** because he said "knowing what they know now he would not have voted for the war in Iraq". Bush on the other hand would not have changed a thing. Isn't not learning from your mistakes a sure sign of stupidity? OK, perhaps Repubs don't think 1000 dead soldiers from lower income families is a mistake, or that the highest oil prices in several decades is a mistake, or that the largest deficit in the history of the US is a mistake, or several thousand dead innocent Iraqis are a mistake, or that they didn't capture Osama, or that Al Qaeda is still operational, or that the re-enlistment rate in the Army is dropping like a rock... as long as America is still #1 in their own minds everything is OK.
Your average American says "We sure kicked some arab ass in Iraq, we're number 1! USA USA USA. Who cares that the rest of the world hates us and what we stand for more and more every day. Who cares that it is becoming increasingly dangerous to be an American tourist abroad. We'll kick yer ass in any non-guerilla war (assuming of course that anyone will still want to serve in the Armed forces after Iraq)."
Japan was (is) so cool when i was there from 88-90. Virtually no crime, 1st world amenities, very good & healthy food, hot chicks, world class public transportation, availibility of cutting edge electronics before they are released to the rest of the world. I could go on. The only downside was the, almost daily, rain; which you could get used to & an umbrella is essential!!!jhuskey said:
I agree, I hope this admin is consigned to the "dustbin of history"(see my signature below) It is odd how thier followers ignore the shortcomings or, rather, outright failures in all area's. I cannot think of one accomplishment, in the last 4 yrs., that benefit the country as a whole & not re-reward the wealthy.limerickman said:
wanderer390000 said:
So wait, let me get this straight, what you're saying is we in the west have been so very peaceful in comparison to the Arabs in the middle east for the past 2000 years???
wanderer390000 said:
Erm, I remind you that they had no weapons of mass destruction. So what were France and Germany going to ask them to give up for this disarmament? I mean, they had already used up most of the armaments they bought from the USA killing Iranians in the 80s and attempting to fight back in the 90s.
WMD was intelligence cooked by **** and Rummy and their ilk to justify the war which they had decided to wage long before 9/11. Watch Fahrenheit 9/11 and you'll see why, the Bush regimes buddies in business say the war is "Good for business, bad for the people". Now ask yourself which companies have made the most money from the war and which will make the most after its finally over (if ever). Haliburton, Carlysle (sp?), Exxon...
The war on terror was an excuse to attack Iraq. It has nothing to do with WMD, terrorism, or democracy.
If it was about democracy why try to put in place a government of US friendly Iraqi expats unpopular with the Iraqi people?
If it was about WMD where are they? If it was a mistake because of bad intel why is it that only the US (and UK) seems to have had this bad intel? Weapons inspectors from the UN were saying there WERE no weapons before the war! In fact there were reports that the only decent person in the Bush regime, Powell, was really ****** off and embarrassed about the obviously bogus intel he was forced to present to the UN.
If it was bad intel why doesn't Bush apologize to the Iraqi people for killing them uneccessarily and even worse for not having a clue about how they were going to proceed after the war was over to introduce stability, democracy and peace in a country that has a history of instability?
If it was about terror where is the provable link to Al Qaeda, 9/11 or any terrorist act since the war ended?
"My country right or wrong", or "my president (leader, fuhrer, emperor) right or wrong" is not a healthy, democratic or informed view. I mean, isn't that what many Germans and Japanese said to justify their actions in WW2?
jhuskey said:
I eat it every day and love it. "Tabemono" or roughly "things for eating"
All still the same a bit more crime maybe but nothing like west. Same hot girls, same high tech gizmos. The Prime Minister is pretty much in Bush's pocket and wants to change the constitution to throw out article 9. We were ok this year for rain but it was a freaking hot summer. Kind of a weird bike scene. Most people ride the obachan bikes, (probably same when you were here) and those who are into riding seriously are seriously into their gear, even if its just too cruise down by the river on a Sunday.
Dear Mr. Jackass, You can count and you can read...Congratulations...Now if only you could master the comprehension thing....pomod said:
However, I must admit, you are the first poster on here to admit you are a Liberal. I do respect you for that...It's refreshing that we don't have to cut through that "I used to be a Republican or I am of no particular party ****." So, I thank you for your honesty...
pomod said:
Have you read the book by William Ferguson "Hokkaido Highway Blues"? I laughed until I stopped. I have lived all over Europe and adapted to different cultures and ideas but I don't think I could hack the culture shock of Japan. Maybe its the idea of being a VERY visible minority in a country that appears to have problems with both nationalism and insecurity at the same time...
never heard that one(tabemono) cool !!! Incidentally, I perused a few post's before arriving at this one & came across one of Zapper insulting you. You will probably have to get used to it. It usually revolves @ not agreeing w/ his point of view.pomod said:
wanderer390000 said:
I apollogize for not realizing that you live in Australia and that I came off sounding like a bit of a *****. If I'm not mistaken, you still have an election coming and a government that supported this mess in Iraq, so most everything else I wrote stands.
I see, you compare GWB to ****** then you post this anti-semitic ****? Your "American Friends" came over did they? Did they help you drum up these gems? I am shocked... I have found you to be stubborn and arrogant at times concerning Bush and the War in Iraq but never dreamed you would stoop this low.limerickman said:
zapper said:
You should check the list of Bush's flipflops before you use a tag line like the one from Leno. I mean caricature can be funny and mudslinging is always present during elections. But when you are making an important decision like choosing a president then maybe you should try to be informed rather than learning about your politicians from late night talk show hosts or Rush "Show me the Oxycontin" Limbaugh.
So Bush has a site somewhere that tracks Kerry's "flip-flops". Reader TK probably spent three seconds coming up with this list of Bush flip flops. It's not like they're hard to find:
Bush is against campaign finance reform; then he's for it.
Bush is against a Homeland Security Department; then he's for it.
Bush is against a 9/11 commission; then he's for it.
Bush is against an Iraq WMD investigation; then he's for it.
Bush is against nation building; then he's for it.
Bush is against deficits; then he's for them.
Bush is for free trade; then he's for tariffs on steel; then he's against them again.
Bush is against the U.S. taking a role in the Israeli Palestinian conflict; then he pushes for a "road map" and a Palestinian State.
Bush is for states right to decide on gay marriage, then he is for changing the constitution.
Bush first says he'll provide money for first responders (fire, police, emergency), then he doesn't.
Bush first says that 'help is on the way' to the military ... then he cuts benefits
Bush-"The most important thing is for us to find Osama bin Laden. Bush-"I don't know where he is. I have no idea and I really don't care.
Bush claims to be in favor of the environment and then secretly starts drilling on Padre Island.
Bush talks about helping education and increases mandates while cutting funding.
Bush first says the U.S. won't negotiate with North Korea. Now he will
Bush goes to Bob Jones University. Then say's he shouldn't have.
Bush said he would demand a U.N. Security Council vote on whether to sanction military action against Iraq. Later Bush announced he would not call for a vote
Bush said the "mission accomplished" banner was put up by the sailors. Bush later admits it was his advance team.
Bush was for fingerprinting and photographing Mexicans who enter the US. Bush after meeting with Pres. Fox, he's against it.
Unfortunately, the ball is already rolling and it will continue rolling regardless of who's in office for the next four years. In fact, whichever party is in power will probably wish they weren't, for they will be blamed for what comes next and there won't be much they can do to stop it. For instance, you can probably expect an escalation of the civil war in Iraq to kick in to high gear. The fact is that the reason we saw a somewhat lessoning of hostilities (countrywide) in Iraq was because it was the hot summer season and it is was simply too hot to fight, not because we're "winning the war on terror." Sure, you had some battles in key areas, but it was relatively quiet elsewhere. Now that the weather will start cooling down, expect a few more battles in formerly quiet territory as the insurgents test the resolve and capabilities of different areas. I wouldn't be surprised if a full-scale civil war breaks out sometime around Christmas. And US troops will be in the middle of it.
Then there's the spread of terrorism worldwide. The recent attacks in Russia and now Indonesia are prime examples. (Very worrisome, as Russia STILL is a nuclear power and they don't seem to have a problem with the idea of nuking someone.) Russia is now claiming the right to "preemptive strikes" and has warned Georgia that they reserve the right to enter their country to find terrorists. Hotspots to watch are Africa and Southeast Asia. I'm curious to see how the US responds to the spread. If we want to engage our military, we will NOT have the numbers to do so and remain effective. The draft is not outside the realm of possibility. We have two bills in Congress right now that will authorize the draft (they have no support...at the moment, anyway, but they are stepping stones to future legislation) and the administration has invested $28M into the selective service system with the goal of having it operational in June 2005 to handle major callups.
As I alluded to earlier, it's a bad time to want to be in office.
Then there's the spread of terrorism worldwide. The recent attacks in Russia and now Indonesia are prime examples. (Very worrisome, as Russia STILL is a nuclear power and they don't seem to have a problem with the idea of nuking someone.) Russia is now claiming the right to "preemptive strikes" and has warned Georgia that they reserve the right to enter their country to find terrorists. Hotspots to watch are Africa and Southeast Asia. I'm curious to see how the US responds to the spread. If we want to engage our military, we will NOT have the numbers to do so and remain effective. The draft is not outside the realm of possibility. We have two bills in Congress right now that will authorize the draft (they have no support...at the moment, anyway, but they are stepping stones to future legislation) and the administration has invested $28M into the selective service system with the goal of having it operational in June 2005 to handle major callups.
As I alluded to earlier, it's a bad time to want to be in office.
Good points Mr. Peabody?...You're wrong again...I suppose you just like posting false information like your hero Michael Moore? Let me clear up the reenlistment statement of yours. Been hanging out at lims house I see...davidmc said:
In order to meet the Congressionally-mandated size, the military needs to sign up a certain number of new recruits each year, and re-enlist a certain percentage of recruits already in. For the past several years, the services have been doing extremely well in both of these endeavors. Last year, the services turned away more recruits than they enlisted. Re-enlistments are at an all-time high. In fact, the Air Force found themselves in the embarrassing position of having too many troops this year (2004), and are actively encouraging several thousands to apply for early discharge. Recruiting is doing so well this year (2004), that new recruits, who are accepted, often have to wait six or seven months in the Delayed Enlistment Program (DEP) in order for a "slot" to open up for them.
Little wonder you feel this way. Could it be your Democratic hero Charles Rangle is trying to reenstate the draft and no ones buying? Yep...Only a Democrat would think of reenstating the draft while we are turning recruits away and offering early retirements again...
Try again homer.
