FL Confidential? for those who don´t believe

Discussion in 'Professional Cycling' started by acpinto, Jul 20, 2006.

  1. acpinto

    acpinto New Member

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    Just starting the thread to ear those who don´t believe in miracles, explain what they believe it happens.
     
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  2. DV1976

    DV1976 New Member

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    This is a good question.
    I don't believe in miracles but I also don't believe in magic pills.
    I also can't see how he did what de did today having bonked yesterday. So I don't think that he bonked. But surely something happened to him yesterday. What? I would like to know and I would like to know what he did to overcome it. Heatstroke is one explanation and it explains a lot of things but I don't know how long it takes to recuperate from a heatstroke and whether it is possible to do it overnight.
    Just curious...
     
  3. TrekDedicated

    TrekDedicated New Member

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    You have to be kidding me?!

    People, I know there are all these drug things going around, but we cannot lose that sight people can do amazing things. If your heart and mind are there, sometimes you are able to do something spectacular. Go ahead and calm me and idiot, but I will simply laugh at you. Stop wearing a tin foil hat and believe in amazing events.

    Not ignorant to drugs, but believe in being in a 'different' zone sometimes.
     
  4. acpinto

    acpinto New Member

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    People can say that in the mountains be procted by the team doesn´t help you a lot.

    But in those 30 Km in plain CSC and TMO with four riders only caught 1.30 minute. and then when they start climb he won time to all except to Sastre. What happened did the all peloton bonked!!

    I still want Landis to win, but today exibition is weird.

    I remember in the tour of 2003 LA lost time in the ITT, the next stage endended in a mountain, and he managed to minimize losses, then i heard "marco Chagas" former portuguese rider that won portuguese tour four times,
    saying that after de rest day they had a plain stage so Armstrong could be good in the mountains.

    Landiis had a bigger bonk and recover from it in one night.

    With complete confidence in is shape he and his team attacked without every test his strengt first and from a distance over 120 Kms.

    Just strange
     
  5. DV1976

    DV1976 New Member

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    I don't know whether it's called idiocy or not but for sure you are being sarcastic without any reason. I stated in the beginning of my post that (and I quote):"I don't believe in magic pills" so so much for drugs. Now last night he did something and it was the right thing to do. I would like to know what that "something" was. I want to know what his preparation mental and physical was and what was the reason for his blow out yesterday. I believe these are valid questions that in way diminish his achievement. Now if you want to believe in divine intervention, amazing events, zones etc be my guest but the world went forward by asking questions not taking things on face value. I'm not calling Landis a cheat, I'm not even implying that he cheated. So before you laugh at me again have that in mind. I won't be polite again though.
     
  6. limerickman

    limerickman Moderator

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    I can't see the merit in having this thread quite frankly.

    If no one has any objection, I think we ought to close this subject.
     
  7. JRMDC

    JRMDC New Member

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    How does this thread manage to rate below all sorts of others?

    Heck, while you are at it, why not wipe out some anti-DC or anti-JU stuff?

    Seriously, what is your measure of "merit"? This thread seems to be a nascent discussion of, potentially, how recovery might have occurred after a big setback. Seems pertinent. As pertinent, as, say, a thread saying Boonen is a whiner. Or whatever.
     
  8. DV1976

    DV1976 New Member

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    It might be. But chemistry cannot explain what we saw. Ok he may be taking some cortisone for his hip and that aids recovery but if that's the case is moderated by the UCI and I'm sure with all the bruhaha that surrounds that Tour they are carefull. Right now my explanation is that he didn't bonk yesterday. Something else happened and he didn't go catabolic so he could go hard today.
    Another factor is that he got lucky. Everybody underestimated him and by the time they realised the mistake he had a 9 minute lead. Actually they did manage to take it down to about 7 and a half before the Joux Plane but it was only CSC and Gonchar that tried to bring him back and they didn't go about it in a very efficient way.
    Finally, although I don't believe in the supernatural there were times where I thought he was in a trance. It has happened before just not in the Tour. Hugo Koblet springs to mind and his famous 160km solo ride (don't remember the race right now)...
     
  9. limerickman

    limerickman Moderator

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    Hmmm?

    I have my doubts, I've got to say.


    OK - let's let it roll and see where we go
     
  10. acpinto

    acpinto New Member

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    That was my spirit hear what others have to say.

    And i think most of the people was afraid to say something without being called an anti-american
     
  11. Durangodave

    Durangodave New Member

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    Some factors to consider:

    1. It sounded like he had a waterfall going over him, what with the unlimited bidons from the team car. I wouldn't underestimate that on a hot day.

    2. On-demand nourishment and drinks.

    3. Pure speculation: is it possible that his meltdown on La Toussuire actually saved his LEGS a bit? While his metabolic systems flatlined, he just poked up the mountain, while everyone else busted absolute ass.

    4. It seems like the favorites took a calculated risk to not chase until it was too late. Sure, once they got to the flats leading to Joux-Plane the big motors got to work. Bit late though.

    5. Floyd just put on a SPECTACULAR show of strength and will. Anything less would not have won the day, even considering all of the above.
    ...
     
  12. acpinto

    acpinto New Member

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    Maybee, if you are right that would explain the full confidence of the team in Landis to Pull the pelloton like that on the first climb!
     
  13. Bjorn P.Dal

    Bjorn P.Dal New Member

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    Landis had 9 minutes at most, he was brought back to 6 minutes at the foot of the joux-plane. That was more or less according to plan, look at Rasmussens loss on the Toussuire yesterday. Only problem was landis refused to fade, only sastre, menchov, (and cunego?=) rode the joux-plane faster than he did, and his great descent gave him almost 6 minutes again at the finish.

    Unfortunately no PT victory is without doubt these days given recent happenings. Then there's the history of phonak and it's GC riders, camenzind, santi peres, hamilton, santos gonzales, gutieres...

    Either way csc, tmob, rabo et al let the door open and floyd went through it.
     
  14. limerickman

    limerickman Moderator

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    Agree 100%
     
  15. Durangodave

    Durangodave New Member

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    Good point, but it seems awfully risky on the LAST alpine stage, to spot him winning time at the foot of the LAST climb. (especially with his proven descending skills.)
    ...
     
  16. Mansmind

    Mansmind New Member

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    Could be a combination of all of that.

    Obviously something happened yesterday..looked like a bonk, maybe heatstroke? Maybe just overheated but not quite heatstroke? It's all speculation unless he tells us.

    Today? I think is pretty simple. Floyd has the physical capability. I think at some point last night he got angry...his anger turned to desire.

    Simply, he had the will to succeed!!

    I'm not a professional racer, nor an amateur racer. There are many times in life that a will to succeed will allow you to do things above and beyond what others are capable of. That goes for athletics as well as business...whatever.

    He had a very obvious determination in his face. He made up his mind at some point today (or last night) about what he wanted to accomplish.. and focused on it entirely...and did it.

    Everyone needs to give the guy a huge amount of respect, he's earned it.
     
  17. Mansmind

    Mansmind New Member

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    Another thought... it's also possible that no one else in the peloton COULD ride with him today.

    The results say that.. at least.
     
  18. AbsoluteCarl

    AbsoluteCarl New Member

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    Well, except for a very obvious bonk yesterday, Landis has been the strongest man in this field. He proved as much today. His main competition consists of Kloden, who has never wanted to or has never had the ability to be a true number team #1; Evans who I believe is in only his second tour; Sastre who has always had talent, but has played second fiddle to many many riders and Pereiro who never really felt like a tour de france winner.

    After yesterday's stage, I thought that Kloden was the favorite, but he has always been a paint-by-numbers cyclist. and today was a rather unique stage. Landis, deservedly so, is now favorite. Whether you liked him before this tour, or didn't, he is now deserving of at least respect, and I'd say admiration.
     
  19. patch70

    patch70 New Member

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    Certainly it was a phenomenal ride that will be remembered a very long time. Definitely respect to FL. But I don't believe in miracles.
     
  20. wicklow200

    wicklow200 New Member

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    What about astrology? Have we analysed that - maybe Floyd's stars were aligned and he decided to go for it

    Give us a break!
     
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