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I tend to take the French and German side over all of this and very definitely oppose Blair.
The thing is if you invest in free education, there is less crime, less racism, less bigotry and more balance.
Now the area I live in once had a terrific education system in the fifties and sixties. We had the best education system in Europe and better than the U.S., for that matter. All that has gone. Now we have large groups of kids who are semi-literate, don't go in for sports and hang around the streets smoking. Not enough money has been invested in their future and education so they drift into crime.
With the drift towards crime, Blair helps these people by locking them up in under-funded prisons. Blair spends thousands of pounds of taxpayers money on prisons and that's a fact. Blair has put more people in prison than Thatcher ever did. Most of these folks are working class which is why Krushchev would have made mincemeat of Blair if he was still around.
The French believe high social security and protection from poverty plus free education will keep crime lower. Crime in France is way lower than in the U.K. France spends far less on prisons than in the U.K. and invests more in skills for the people or support for the unemployed.
The downside is that the French economy grows less quickly than the U.S. and life in France is slower and calmer. So big business struggles more in France than it does in the U.S. or China.
But let me relate what Americans who lived in France tell me: They say the French live far better, have more holiday time, have a better diet and crime is far lower.
So, do you want to live well and maybe have less economic expansion or do you prefer a faster growing economy but with less socialism and more inequality? There is no ideal solution but I would definitely prefer the French way of life to our system in the U.K.

wolfix said:
I will agree with you on the death penalty. El Paso would seem to be the violent capitol of Texas. I am from Texas originally and it is not the big bad place it is thought to be. It has that image from TV. Go east in America to their cities if a you want to see violence.

The free education thing is the tough one. And I can only comment on America and not over the pond. If a person wants to get an education in America they can. There are so many grants and other types of loans available. University students are my main customers now so I am in the flow somewhat and have 2 daughters at University. I have faced that personally.
Here is my problem with anything that the government has to provide. It simply raises taxes. One of the things I do love about my country is that we have the ability to start our own businesses. And it seems to me that it is most men's dream to own his own business. When the taxation of society is high, it becomes harder for the common man to get going..... Then he not only becomes a slave to big business [rich], he becomes a slave to the government. I do not believe in punishing the motivated people in society.
The conversations around the topic "Is America Failing," should address the problem of trying to make everything a level playing field for everyone. Not everyone is born equal. We cannot legislate fairness. I wish it was different.
We end up with an inferior product to compete with when we do not shackle our best and brightest.
Big government is a free man's prison.
 
Carrera said:
...There is no ideal solution but I would definitely prefer the French way of life to our system in the U.K.
Much preferrable to the typical U.S. lifestyle as well. I'd bet the French have a lot more time to ride their bikes too, which is never a bad thing. :)
 
The U.S. lifestyle was fine in the fifties and sixties and maybe O.K. in the seventies. Employment was freely available back then. But now unemployment is everywhere and people need protection from poverty and education to be made available for free.

Wurm said:
Much preferrable to the typical U.S. lifestyle as well. I'd bet the French have a lot more time to ride their bikes too, which is never a bad thing. :)
 
In that context, I would put it this way, Carrera: it was fine in the 50's, 60's, early 70's, when white-collar AND blue-collar wages were actually enough to sustain a family. Since the days of the Oil Embargo (Lie) in 1973-74, not only is unemployment the problem, but if you can get a job you'll have to hog 2 or 3 of them from your neighbors in order to support the cost of living in the U.S.
 
Carrera said:
The U.S. lifestyle was fine in the fifties and sixties and maybe O.K. in the seventies. Employment was freely available back then. But now unemployment is everywhere and people need protection from poverty and education to be made available for free.
The unemployment rate is low at this time. Unemployment is not everywhere.Unemployment was about the same in the 70's as it is now.
 
wolfix said:
The unemployment rate is low at this time. Unemployment is not everywhere.Unemployment was about the same in the 70's as it is now.
You're not counting the unemployed that aren't counted in the official gov't stats, and those that have given up looking for work, etc. With the total of the the real unemployed, I've seen figures as high as 10% and more.

Also, you're not mentioning the fact that many if not most of the "jobs" created in the past few years are low-wage ones, not the higher-wage jobs of the Clinton years and previous.

The U.S. loss of jobs during the GWB years, as Kerry said during his '04 campaign, has been the greatest of ANY admin. since the Great Depression.
 
Clinton's strength was the economy. The U.S. was doing far better under Clinton and there was far more respect for the U.S. worldwide under the penultimate pres.
I think George W Bush and Blair are both lame ducks.
Both are about as much use as a chocolate fireguard.

Wurm said:
You're not counting the unemployed that aren't counted in the official gov't stats, and those that have given up looking for work, etc. With the total of the the real unemployed, I've seen figures as high as 10% and more.

Also, you're not mentioning the fact that many if not most of the "jobs" created in the past few years are low-wage ones, not the higher-wage jobs of the Clinton years and previous.

The U.S. loss of jobs during the GWB years, as Kerry said during his '04 campaign, has been the greatest of ANY admin. since the Great Depression.
 
bush news releases re mfg goods were revealed to include #of burgers flipped




Wurm said:
Also, you're not mentioning the fact that many if not most of the "jobs" created in the past few years are low-wage ones, not the higher-wage jobs of the Clinton years and previous.

The U.S. loss of jobs during the GWB years, as Kerry said during his '04 campaign, has been the greatest of ANY admin. since the Great Depression.
 

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