Flyer (Question)

[MJtje]

Wow still *****-fighting over who dopes and who doesn't. We need to have a poll who thinks it is the end of the world and who does not. Who does think it is the end of the world needs to take a close look in the world he/she lives in. It ain't a perfect world......will never be..........as long as there are humans. And put things in perspective..........I wil lose more sleep over another stupid war in iran then over a cyclist who was caught for doping or who dies.

Now I will leave the rest to debate again if he (or an other cyclist) doped or not doped. Which btw no one knows on this forum........only 3/4 people around him probably!

Wow a post without the standard name calling. Only liar--is that the best you have?

Has Gatorade consumption and processed sugar abuse adversely affected your already limited vocabulary?

Coward, liar? These are your core weapons---and your only feeble points.

The AIS doping scandal is no lie.

The Lance Armstrong/Michele Ferrari's conviction is no lie. The six lawsuits and two criminal investigations against Lance are no lie.

The 1990/1991 USCF Junior Road Team doping and lawsuits---no lie.

The dozens of heart-failure deaths are no lie.

Eddie Merckx's 3 failed dope tests---no lie.

Eddie Merckx's doping confession in retirement---no lie---though you campaigned hard for it to be one.

David Millar's Eprex EPO abuse---no lie.

Your pathetic behavior and doping apologies reveal your true passion---the promotion of illegal doping.

You must be a drug salesman under the pretence of a 'trusted coach'. There is no other explanation for your hostile behavior and utter contempt for anti-doping.

You oppose doping discussion, disclosure and have a 'shoot the messaenger reaction' to every new death, suspension, confession and arrest.

You have been outed as a drug dealer!

 

[Flyer]

The War in Iraq is debated on another post. Me thinks you ought to follow those.

This is about cycling---and the widespread practice of doping children (under age 18) and those chosing to earn a living by racing bicycles.

Modern doping, and the methods and products appear to 1) be highly effective at adding sustainable power/speed and 2) increase the risk of cancer and auto-immune illnesses and 3) heart failures.

Rather than change the subject---or proclaim your feelings of apathy---why not read other posts?

What's up with your need to supress doping disclosure?

Wow still *****-fighting over who dopes and who doesn't. We need to have a poll who thinks it is the end of the world and who does not. Who does think it is the end of the world needs to take a close look in the world he/she lives in. It ain't a perfect world......will never be..........as long as there are humans. And put things in perspective..........I wil lose more sleep over another stupid war in iran then over a cyclist who was caught for doping or who dies.

Now I will leave the rest to debate again if he (or an other cyclist) doped or not doped. Which btw no one knows on this forum........only 3/4 people around him probably!

 

[House]

Wow a post without the standard name calling. Only liar--is that the best you have?

Has Gatorade consumption and processed sugar abuse adversely affected your already limited vocabulary?

Coward, liar? These are your core weapons---and your only feeble points.

You mean the only ones you choose to see.

No, just the things you say about them, lies,assumptions and half-truths mixed in with a fact or two

The 1990/1991 USCF Junior Road Team doping and lawsuits---no lie.

The dozens of heart-failure deaths are no lie.

Eddie Merckx's 3 failed dope tests---no lie.

Eddie Merckx's doping confession in retirement---no lie---though you campaigned hard for it to be one.

Show me where I "campaigned" I asked you for the quotes and after saying it wasn't on the net because it was in the 70's, changing that to 1988 you never did find it, simply started crowing **** like this when someone else did. Once again you lie to try to make your point.

David Millar's Eprex EPO abuse---no lie.

When did I say that was a lie??? Typical tactic by you, lie about what someone said or simply imply they said something they didn't.

Your pathetic behavior and doping apologies reveal your true passion---the promotion of illegal doping.

Show me where I have "promoted" doping or made "apologies" for it. You just can't handle that someone doesn't buy into 100% of your ****. Remember "100%?" what you kept saying was the percentage of the peloton who is doping, strangely you backed off of that since you got your ass handed to you...again.

You must be a drug salesman under the pretence of a 'trusted coach'. There is no other explanation for your hostile behavior and utter contempt for anti-doping.

You oppose doping discussion, disclosure and have a 'shoot the messaenger reaction' to every new death, suspension, confession and arrest.

You have been outed as a drug dealer!

Ahhhh, here we go, making ad hominim attacks, personal attacks. the exact kind that you cry like a little baby about. The funny part is that absolutely nothing I have ever said on here even implys that i am pro doping to anyone but you. Another funny thing is that YOU are the one who told us about how you mentored someone into the 100% doped (according to you for a time) peloton. Obviously using your logic you are pro doping.

Look it's fun handing your ass to you over and over, but at least make an effort above the third grade level. Still cowering from my challenge that would have knowcked one of us off here permanently???? If the shoe fits. LOL

 

[MJtje]

I do read youre posts and others and ask questions (on the lotz case for example) from time to time. But I stil think that some, including you, are making it a TOO big deal. And it seems that you and others are making doping like a world problem.....which it isn't by far.

But then again I've never met dopers......i don't have friends who have doped. Maybe I would view it differently then!

The War in Iraq is debated on another post. Me thinks you ought to follow those.

This is about cycling---and the widespread practice of doping children (under age 18) and those chosing to earn a living by racing bicycles.

Modern doping, and the methods and products appear to 1) be highly effective at adding sustainable power/speed and 2) increase the risk of cancer and auto-immune illnesses and 3) heart failures.

Rather than change the subject---or proclaim your feelings of apathy---why not read other posts?

What's up with your need to supress doping disclosure?

 

[Flyer]

Thank you MJtje for your candid remarks.

But it is definitely a world problem. A tremendous one. It involves thousands of people, billions of dollars ($263 billion/year in the USA alone) advertisers and whole echosystem of professionals who draw income off exploitation of the athletes. In the process, a fraud is committed as it involved deception and lying to the public and to the families of the dopers, trainers, coaches, directors and corporate employees who visit the Hospitality Tents at Sporting Events.

It's one big lucrative lie. Entertaining, but a lie!

Then you have medical research being conducted on athletes---voluntary--- but without adequate 'informed consent'. No scientist knows how these new drugs work---that's why they test.

Then you have the corporate profit need to fuel new drug sales----over the cure of illnesses. Revenues must be grown each year--no matter what.

The consequences of a medicated society will lead to more bizarre behavior---and more wars for oil too.

Bi-polar will become 'normal' and Xanax an Prozac like aspirin. If it has not already.

I am passionate re: what is a standard practice of doping in both elite sport and professional.

The elites are doping too---because they are just below the 'commercially contracted level' and they what a job. Young people are seduced into this life of toxic doping--and then the lying and denials.

If an athlete is unwilling to dope---or is too stuborn
or 'independent minded' he will cut--or he quit on his/her own once they realize that there is no future
for them. (never going to win a race, always be tired and demoralized w/o dope)

I have no doubt Tyler Hamilton could pass a lie detector test---proclaiming his innocence. He has been at this game for half of his life (17 of 34 years)

I feel doping and the cover-ups are a very big deal.

Thanks MJitje. Peace.

I do read youre posts and others and ask questions (on the lotz case for example) from time to time. But I stil think that some, including you, are making it a TOO big deal. And it seems that you and others are making doping like a world problem.....which it isn't by far.

But then again I've never met dopers......i don't have friends who have doped. Maybe I would view it differently then!

 

[Drock]

I would have to agree with Flyer on this one. Its like Mr. Olympia claiming that he is "drug free" and Mr. Weider claiming that everyone in "Muscle and Fitness" is "drug free". I think someone famous once said "if you aint cheating, you aint trying"

That's utter bull. You go back and reread my posts.

Why cannot you grasp the obvious? Is it really so challenging to see the truth? Is the fog that soupy?

You have many public admissions on the record:

Merckx, Coppi, Moser, Anquetil, Plankaert, Chiotti, Thevenet, Van Der Velde, Laurent, Geminiani, Dotto, Letort, Winnen, Millar, Gaumont, Manzano, Camenzind, Lotz, Zulle, Virenque, Herve, Brochard, Moreau, amongst others---most of these confessions ocurring in retirement except for the Festina boys who cried under oath in a October 2000 Lille Courtroom.

Then you have the dozens of riders caught by customs agents, housekeepers, and police---not dope controllers:

Millar, Museeuw, French, Pantani, Stephens, Vandenbroucke, Sassone, Simeoni, et al...

Then you have the admission of team directors---years later such as in PDM & Festina whereby systematic EPO and other illegal drugs abuse was a standard practice.

Did you think things changed after 1991 or 1998?

Then you have a rider dying every 60 days.

Then you have Tyler Hamilton, Perez, Hawaiin Triathletes going blood doping positive. You have 6 of the top 10 Tour of Guademala riders going EPO positive--you have a 16 year South African going EPO positive. You have the winners of the past 4 years of junior world sprinter going drug positive.

You have Lance's trainer, Michele Ferrari's conviction.

You have Sandro Donati dossier and description of Francesco Conconi's corruption at the IOC. (Ferrari's mentor)

What additional proof do you require? How many more deaths? How many more convictions? How many more disgraces? How many more bi-polar behaviors?

Tearful confessions of each and every drug addict?

Guess what fellas, drug addict tend to live in denial which is where many fans prefer to live as well.

So, let's wake up and smell the IV feeds before the Tour de France throws up another big surprise 'doping scandal'

More than sufficient proof of widespread doping. Frankly, it's inescapable.

If you don't believe me---go ask a professional. They know what up with the meds.

Otherwise accept what corporate advertisers portray as 'clean sport' and buy their products.

No I do not own Nike stock nor wear their shoes.

But I am fond of life-science firms.