Foot pain

Discussion in 'Cycling Equipment' started by Bengt-Olaf Schneider, Jul 18, 2004.

  1. I could use a good measure of the wisdom of this group.

    I am riding Pearl Izumi shoes on SPD pedals. After about 3-4 hours of riding
    my feet are starting to hurt along the outside in the front half of the
    sole. It seems like I am pressing down on the pedals more with the outside
    of my foot instead of the ball of the foot. (When running, I also strike the
    groud with the outside of the heel.)

    I have been thinking of either getting shoes with varus wedges (like
    Specialized BG) or installing LeWedge. However, it seems these devices are
    intended to reduce knee problem .. which I don't have. So I am a bit
    uncertain about what to do. I am ready to replace the entire show-pedal
    combination (considering SPL-L for the increased platform), but I would like
    to get a better understanding of the problem before I spend money.

    Any ideas or suggestions would be greatly appreciated, as this seems to
    stand in the way of a successful double-century.

    Thanks !

    Bengt-Olaf.
     
    Tags:


  2. "Bengt-Olaf Schneider" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > I could use a good measure of the wisdom of this group.
    >
    > I am riding Pearl Izumi shoes on SPD pedals. After about 3-4 hours of

    riding
    > my feet are starting to hurt along the outside in the front half of the
    > sole. It seems like I am pressing down on the pedals more with the outside
    > of my foot instead of the ball of the foot. (When running, I also strike

    the
    > groud with the outside of the heel.)
    >
    > I have been thinking of either getting shoes with varus wedges (like
    > Specialized BG) or installing LeWedge. However, it seems these devices are
    > intended to reduce knee problem .. which I don't have. So I am a bit
    > uncertain about what to do. I am ready to replace the entire show-pedal
    > combination (considering SPL-L for the increased platform), but I would

    like
    > to get a better understanding of the problem before I spend money.
    >
    > Any ideas or suggestions would be greatly appreciated, as this seems to
    > stand in the way of a successful double-century.
    >
    > Thanks !
    >
    > Bengt-Olaf.


    I am bereft of foot problems too. I will share with you my understandings.

    First of all try wider shoes if the ones you use aren't wide. I think Sidi
    Mega are considered the widest. It sounds like you may be in a shoe that is
    too narrow, Have you tried loosening the straps or laces?

    Orthotics designed for running are not that helpful in cycling shoes. With
    cycling the forefoot is what needs correction. I just went to a specialist
    and for my problem they are messing around with metatarsal pads and bars.
    The device I ended up with is much like what Specialized uses in their shoes
    I think. But....orthotics like the ones I just got take up space in the shoe
    which then adds to their tightness. A low profile carbon orthotic isn't an
    option for me- I need cushioning under my toes.

    Through the past few years I have settled on Sidi touring shoes which have
    more flex than generally considered "good", and I use TA cage pedals and toe
    clips.
    I do hope to get into a clipless system, as the Sidi Touring shoes are no
    longer available and there isn't anything close to replace them with. I also
    have a double century in mind, and where as there'd be no way for me to do
    it with the foot pain I have when using Carnac Legends and Look system
    pedals, foot pain would not be the limiting factor with my present set up.
    Interestingly I saw a photo of a pair of PI shoes and they look slipperlike
    comfortable. Are they considered "wide"?

    Good luck.

    Gary Jacobson
    Rosendale, NY
     
  3. "Gary Jacobson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    >
    > "Bengt-Olaf Schneider" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]
    > > I could use a good measure of the wisdom of this group.
    > >
    > > I am riding Pearl Izumi shoes on SPD pedals. After about 3-4 hours of

    > riding
    > > my feet are starting to hurt along the outside in the front half of the
    > > sole. It seems like I am pressing down on the pedals more with the

    outside
    > > of my foot instead of the ball of the foot. (When running, I also strike

    > the
    > > groud with the outside of the heel.)
    > >
    > > I have been thinking of either getting shoes with varus wedges (like
    > > Specialized BG) or installing LeWedge. However, it seems these devices

    are
    > > intended to reduce knee problem .. which I don't have. So I am a bit
    > > uncertain about what to do. I am ready to replace the entire show-pedal
    > > combination (considering SPL-L for the increased platform), but I would

    > like
    > > to get a better understanding of the problem before I spend money.
    > >
    > > Any ideas or suggestions would be greatly appreciated, as this seems to
    > > stand in the way of a successful double-century.
    > >
    > > Thanks !
    > >
    > > Bengt-Olaf.

    >
    > I am bereft of foot problems too. I will share with you my understandings.
    >
    > First of all try wider shoes if the ones you use aren't wide. I think Sidi
    > Mega are considered the widest. It sounds like you may be in a shoe that

    is
    > too narrow, Have you tried loosening the straps or laces?


    I haven't tried that because the shoes never felt too tight, but I will give
    it a try
    on my next long ride. I'm a bit concerned that loosening would undo some of
    the
    benefits of a clipless pedal system, namely good connection to the pedal.
    But then, the best contact is worthless if the pain takes over.

    >
    > Orthotics designed for running are not that helpful in cycling shoes. With
    > cycling the forefoot is what needs correction. I just went to a specialist
    > and for my problem they are messing around with metatarsal pads and bars.
    > The device I ended up with is much like what Specialized uses in their

    shoes
    > I think. But....orthotics like the ones I just got take up space in the

    shoe
    > which then adds to their tightness. A low profile carbon orthotic isn't an
    > option for me- I need cushioning under my toes.
    >
    > Through the past few years I have settled on Sidi touring shoes which have
    > more flex than generally considered "good", and I use TA cage pedals and

    toe
    > clips.
    > I do hope to get into a clipless system, as the Sidi Touring shoes are no
    > longer available and there isn't anything close to replace them with. I

    also
    > have a double century in mind, and where as there'd be no way for me to do
    > it with the foot pain I have when using Carnac Legends and Look system
    > pedals, foot pain would not be the limiting factor with my present set up.


    Good luck working up to that ride. I am dreading it a bit, but it seems like
    like the next natural goal. And one can't be without goals, right.

    > Interestingly I saw a photo of a pair of PI shoes and they look

    slipperlike
    > comfortable. Are they considered "wide"?


    I don't think PI carries wide and narrow sizes. One width fits all.
    The PIs I have are comfortable on the foot, but I wouldn't call them
    slipperlike.
    I may give Specialized or Sidi shoes a try. Do Sidi road shoes have any
    built-in foot support like the Specialized? (I didn't find anything about
    that.)
     
  4. "Bengt-Olaf Schneider" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:p[email protected]
    > "Gary Jacobson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]
    > >
    > > "Bengt-Olaf Schneider" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > news:[email protected]
    > > > I could use a good measure of the wisdom of this group.

    > >
    > > I am bereft of foot problems too.> I may give Specialized or Sidi shoes

    a try. Do Sidi road shoes have any
    > built-in foot support like the Specialized?


    Rereading what I wrote: I am not bereft, but plagued by foot problems. Quite
    the opposite of what I wrote initially.

    Anyway, Sidi sock liners do not use any kind of metatarsal pad or bar. Not
    sure if one would help you. Before trying anything else, I would suggest
    simply going to the drug store and buying a metatarsal pad that can be glued
    to the top of the "sock liner" in the shoe that you use. It'll feel wierd at
    first, but it might help, and is worth a $5.00 investment. I use
    felt/moleskin pads- got them from my wife who has access to them.. Never
    seen them at a drug store where you usually find foam or silicon-like ones.

    It is strange that good cycling shoes don't come with at least "neutral"
    supportive sock liners- something that has a supportive arch and heel cup. A
    good one that I have used is the grey "Superfeet" liner. I have all kinds of
    orthotics, and actually ran a marathon with a pair of "orthotics" I made
    that began as Superfeet. The grey version has the lowest profile of all
    their models I think, and therefore most suitable for a low volume cycling
    shoe.

    The whole wedge thing probably would require a work up of your pedaling
    style. I think that is usually done in labs where they attach lights or
    sensors to your legs and feet and then look at your biomechanics. I'd think
    a high level USCF coach could take a look at you and give you some ideas.

    I still think loosening your shoes might help. I've had the pain you've
    described years ago, and got relief from loosening the lower strap.


    Gary Jacobson
    Rosendale, NY
     
  5. Phil Brown

    Phil Brown Guest

    >Any ideas or suggestions would be greatly appreciated, as this seems to
    >stand in the way of a successful double-century.


    Wedge 'em. Also you may have shoes too wide for your feet.
    phil Brown
     
  6. Peter Cole

    Peter Cole Guest

    "Bengt-Olaf Schneider" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > I could use a good measure of the wisdom of this group.
    >
    > I am riding Pearl Izumi shoes on SPD pedals. After about 3-4 hours of riding
    > my feet are starting to hurt along the outside in the front half of the
    > sole. It seems like I am pressing down on the pedals more with the outside
    > of my foot instead of the ball of the foot. (When running, I also strike the
    > groud with the outside of the heel.)
    >
    > I have been thinking of either getting shoes with varus wedges (like
    > Specialized BG) or installing LeWedge. However, it seems these devices are
    > intended to reduce knee problem .. which I don't have. So I am a bit
    > uncertain about what to do. I am ready to replace the entire show-pedal
    > combination (considering SPL-L for the increased platform), but I would like
    > to get a better understanding of the problem before I spend money.
    >
    > Any ideas or suggestions would be greatly appreciated, as this seems to
    > stand in the way of a successful double-century.


    I had exactly the same problems, which kept me from going beyond a double
    century for several seasons. A couple of easy things to try: first *loosen*
    those straps! After several hours, slightly tight shoes (in width) can become
    agonizing. It doesn't feel like your feet are being squeezed, but loosening
    provides almost immediate relief. You may find, as I did, that ultra-cycling
    means wearing your shoes almost "sloppy loose".

    SPD cleats can be tilted by placing washers under one bolt. You may need
    longer bolts for a lot of tilt, but they're easy to get in a hardware store.
    Also try moving the cleats as far back as possible, this can reduce the amount
    of pressure in the toe box.

    I found the solution to my problems was to get wider shoes. I have somewhat
    wide toes, but not a "thick" foot. I use a Sidi "Mega" MTB shoe to ultra with,
    that's actually a size or so too big. I took up some of the excess volume with
    a sorbothane (off the shelf) pad under the ball of the foot. This combo
    allowed me to do 400Ks for the first time without suffering sore feet. It's a
    tough problem to solve, because, if you're like me, no problems show up until
    after many hours of riding, making trial & error quite tedious and time
    consuming.
     
  7. Phil Brown

    Phil Brown Guest

    >
    >>Any ideas or suggestions would be greatly appreciated, as this seems to
    >>stand in the way of a successful double-century.

    >
    >Wedge 'em. Also you may have shoes too wide for your feet.
    >phil Brown


    Let me expand on this. I have very narrow feet and even with the narrowest
    Sidis-which were the narrowest shoes made-my foot slid to the outside so I
    wedged the cleats and that helped a lot without hurting my knees. Now that I
    were custom made shoes all those problems have disappeared.
    Phil Brown
     
  8. Doug

    Doug Guest

    Look at http://www.d2customfootwear.com/ A good pair of shoes and custom
    insoles likely will obviate the need for a canting device like leWedge.


    "Bengt-Olaf Schneider" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > I could use a good measure of the wisdom of this group.
    >
    > I am riding Pearl Izumi shoes on SPD pedals. After about 3-4 hours of

    riding
    > my feet are starting to hurt along the outside in the front half of the
    > sole. It seems like I am pressing down on the pedals more with the outside
    > of my foot instead of the ball of the foot. (When running, I also strike

    the
    > groud with the outside of the heel.)
    >
    > I have been thinking of either getting shoes with varus wedges (like
    > Specialized BG) or installing LeWedge. However, it seems these devices are
    > intended to reduce knee problem .. which I don't have. So I am a bit
    > uncertain about what to do. I am ready to replace the entire show-pedal
    > combination (considering SPL-L for the increased platform), but I would

    like
    > to get a better understanding of the problem before I spend money.
    >
    > Any ideas or suggestions would be greatly appreciated, as this seems to
    > stand in the way of a successful double-century.
    >
    > Thanks !
    >
    > Bengt-Olaf.
    >
    >
     
  9. "Peter Cole" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:p[email protected]_s04...
    > "Bengt-Olaf Schneider" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]
    > > I could use a good measure of the wisdom of this group.
    > >
    > > I am riding Pearl Izumi shoes on SPD pedals. After about 3-4 hours of

    riding
    > > my feet are starting to hurt along the outside in the front half of the
    > > sole. It seems like I am pressing down on the pedals more with the

    outside
    > > of my foot instead of the ball of the foot. (When running, I also strike

    the
    > > groud with the outside of the heel.)
    > >
    > > I have been thinking of either getting shoes with varus wedges (like
    > > Specialized BG) or installing LeWedge. However, it seems these devices

    are
    > > intended to reduce knee problem .. which I don't have. So I am a bit
    > > uncertain about what to do. I am ready to replace the entire show-pedal
    > > combination (considering SPL-L for the increased platform), but I would

    like
    > > to get a better understanding of the problem before I spend money.
    > >
    > > Any ideas or suggestions would be greatly appreciated, as this seems to
    > > stand in the way of a successful double-century.

    >
    > I had exactly the same problems, which kept me from going beyond a double
    > century for several seasons. A couple of easy things to try: first

    *loosen*
    > those straps! After several hours, slightly tight shoes (in width) can

    become
    > agonizing. It doesn't feel like your feet are being squeezed, but

    loosening
    > provides almost immediate relief. You may find, as I did, that

    ultra-cycling
    > means wearing your shoes almost "sloppy loose".


    You are the second person to suggest that might straps may be to tight.
    I will give sloppiness a try.

    >
    > SPD cleats can be tilted by placing washers under one bolt. You may need
    > longer bolts for a lot of tilt, but they're easy to get in a hardware

    store.
    > Also try moving the cleats as far back as possible, this can reduce the

    amount
    > of pressure in the toe box.


    My cleats are already all the way back. But the trick with the washer sounds
    like
    an easy experiment to try. At least it will let me know whether wedges are
    likely to
    help.
    >
    > I found the solution to my problems was to get wider shoes. I have

    somewhat
    > wide toes, but not a "thick" foot. I use a Sidi "Mega" MTB shoe to ultra

    with,
    > that's actually a size or so too big. I took up some of the excess volume

    with
    > a sorbothane (off the shelf) pad under the ball of the foot. This combo
    > allowed me to do 400Ks for the first time without suffering sore feet.

    It's a
    > tough problem to solve, because, if you're like me, no problems show up

    until
    > after many hours of riding, making trial & error quite tedious and time
    > consuming.


    Exactly ! That' s the biggest problem with all that. How often do I find 6-8
    hours
    to go riding ? Congratulations on the 400K. I have yet to tackle distances
    like that.

    Thanks !!
     
  10. "Phil Brown" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > >
    > >>Any ideas or suggestions would be greatly appreciated, as this seems to
    > >>stand in the way of a successful double-century.

    > >
    > >Wedge 'em. Also you may have shoes too wide for your feet.
    > >phil Brown

    >
    > Let me expand on this. I have very narrow feet and even with the narrowest
    > Sidis-which were the narrowest shoes made-my foot slid to the outside so I
    > wedged the cleats and that helped a lot without hurting my knees. Now that

    I
    > were custom made shoes all those problems have disappeared.
    > Phil Brown


    It is good to know that you can wedge without automatically incurring knee
    problems.

    I doubt that my shoes are too wide. .After reading the other posts, I now
    suspect that
    the opposite is true. The shoes fit comfortably when put them on, and I can
    imagine that
    the feet swell up a bit during the ride.

    Thanks, Bengt-Olaf.
     
  11. g.daniels

    g.daniels Guest

    i have a theory

    the foot doesn't get enough blood flow or nutrients
    yet the foot has a fairly large nerve supply compared to the butt or
    nose
    and after a good nights sleep, the feet relax, joints expand
    ahhhh
    and then before getting up and out or climbing down, crawling out
    and recrushing the feet
    one can wiggle the toes, ankles, pre stretch
    in fact after doing this for some time its possible to toe wiggle
    automatically at 3am after the freight goes by
    the practice is theraputic.
     
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