frame geometries

Discussion in 'Cycling Equipment' started by hwttdz, Dec 12, 2003.

  1. hwttdz

    hwttdz New Member

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    Does anyone know what frame companies make frames in 1cm increments rather than the standard 2cm increments. I'm pretty sure that trek, giant, cannondale, bianchi, litespeed are all two.
     
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  2. boudreaux

    boudreaux New Member

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    colnago,Pinarello,Merckx,and many other european makes.One may be able to get Cdales in frames only in odd sizes in addition to the even sizes speced on built bikes.
     
  3. BaCardi

    BaCardi New Member

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    Just find a frame size that fits you. Then find the frame. Not the other way around.
     
  4. boudreaux

    boudreaux New Member

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    Doh geeze! Maybe he knows what he needs. I have a 57 Cdale,in addition to several other 57s and also several other 58s, but would take a 55 lemond. If you knew anything you would also know all frames of the same size don't fit the same and frames of the same nominal size are measuerd differently.
     
  5. dhk

    dhk New Member

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    Buyers need to remember that manufacturers size frames a little differently, eg, C-C, C-T, C-clamp, BB-T. And, that top tube length can vary within the designated frame "size" a good bit. Top tube range was the more critical dimension for me, since I wanted to hit a total reach of 68.5 to 69.5 cm with an 11 or 12 cm stem.

    Also the saddle to handlebar drop is good to know....I was looking for 8-9 cm drop with the seat height set at my dimension of 76.5 cm from BB center.

    What I did recently was decide on the seat tube and top tube dimensions I was looking for, and their acceptable ranges. Then I could look at geometry charts online, or go measure the frames at the LBS. Fortunately the frame I decided to buy hit my target dimensions right on the money.

    Dan
     
  6. dhk

    dhk New Member

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    Sorry boudreaux, we overlapped posts here. Didn't mean to repeat what you said.
     
  7. puma

    puma New Member

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    Does a centimeter really matter?
     
  8. boudreaux

    boudreaux New Member

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    Sometimes,Very much so. Even more if you are AR.
     
  9. BaCardi

    BaCardi New Member

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    Unless you're a pro, a centimeter measurement doesn't really matter that much especially for the seat tube, for which you could move the seat post higher or lower.

    What you really want to do to get the proper fit is have the bike fit you vertically and horizontally (reach). There are some different schools of thought on proper bike fit. If you don't have much experience to go off, some good resources would be reading some online tutorials. For example, I think Colorado Cyclist had some free info on their website about measuring your inseam, and other measurements that correlate into a size frame. Of course, nothing beats experience, but this is a good start.
     
  10. puma

    puma New Member

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    I just think enough can be said for the manipulation of seatpost and seat positions, stem lengths/rises/position on the fork steerer, crank lengths, etc. when discussing a 1+/- centimeter difference.
     
  11. boudreaux

    boudreaux New Member

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    Buy what you will. And,sure most of the time you can work around small differences. But sometimes even if you can it's still not just right. My 58 Cdale was ok.The 57 is just right. If you know what works the wrong one just doesn't fly. So maybe I know enough about what works for ME to be AR about it. If you don't know the difference,then it does not matter.
     
  12. hwttdz

    hwttdz New Member

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    I was under the impression it was usually a bad idea to have a stem out of the 9-11 cm range because frames were designed with those rough dimensions in mind and it has the possibility of adversely affecting handling characteristics.

    Yeah the reason I ask is because I recently bought a bike and was wavering between two sizes, I could have gone 54 and had a little bit longer stem, and moved the seat way back and up or gone 56 and had the seat near the top tube, and a shorter stem. I went with 54 with an 11 cm stem which is totally functional but as someone mentioned you can still tell that it's not totally perfect, but I'm happy as anything to ride it . :D Maybe if you have dimensions for all the different measurments in mind custom is the way to go. I think that the larger manufacturers can use more complex procedures and materials to get the exact result they want. That's why I was interested in frames that come in 1 cm increments.
     
  13. puma

    puma New Member

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    Oh yeah, totally, my post wasn't intended to undermine anyone's question or responses. I was just a bit skeptical of 1cm differences in frames being such a concern when other components could be altered/modified to compensate.
     
  14. boudreaux

    boudreaux New Member

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    Nothing wrong with a 9-11 cm range as a generalization or place to start. I ride 12- 13depending on TT length and have no handling issues...FWIW, moving the seat is not the way to get proper reach to the bars.Seat for and aft is for getting prefered KOP position.
     
  15. dhk

    dhk New Member

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    The advice I've heard years ago is that if you are racing, buy the smaller size, so you could have the seat up and gain a bigger drop to the handlebars, plus save weight and get quicker handling. On the other hand, for long club rides and touring, go with the biggest frame you can standover, for more comfort, a smoother ride, and more stability.

    Letting LBS's sell me bikes, I got the first one for club rides that's too big....60 cm C-T, and the newer one for crit racing that's too small...56 cm C-T. Both work, but neither are quite right.

    Dan
     
  16. BaCardi

    BaCardi New Member

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    KOP is merely a starting point for getting individual rider fore/aft position. There are way more variables involved than that. :rolleyes:
     
  17. boudreaux

    boudreaux New Member

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    Read it again genius. And try some COMPREHENSION.I said preferred KOP. Not the Martha Stewart good for everyone textbook plumbob method.
     
  18. hwttdz

    hwttdz New Member

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    For those of us who don't speak cycle, what do kop and FWIW stand for?
     
  19. Allen H

    Allen H New Member

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    FWIW is just internet/email speak for "for what it's worth".

    KOP = "knee over pedal" fit
     
  20. BaCardi

    BaCardi New Member

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    You'll have to pardon bourdreaux. He often introduces acronyms and cycling abbreviations into a thread because he he thinks he's preaching to the choir.

    KOP = Knee over Pedal. It refers to the knee directly over the pedal when the cranks are in the 3' oclock and 9' oclock position. In this case, it is the knee that is over the pedal that is in the 3 oclock position. Depending on your type of cycling discipline, track, road, mountain, etc. you may want the knee to be directly over the pedal, in front of the pedal, or behind the pedal.

    Get a little experience first and then tinker with your position. Good rule of thumb is to start with the knee directly over the pedal. You can adjust the saddle forward or backwards to tailor where you eventually want your KOP position to be. It all comes down to efficiency and personal preference.
     
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