D
P
Phil, Squid-in-Training
Guest
"Werehatrack" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 08:12:48 GMT, "Phil, Squid-in-Training"
> <[email protected]> may have said:
>
>>I'm embarrassed to tell this story.
> [snip]
>
> So, how did it come out?
Came out not so bad in the end, financially.
There are two bosses, as I mentioned earlier. One is much more laid back
than the other. The laid-back one is there more to take on debt (buying
bikes/accessories) than to manage. He's also the lead tech at this point.
They disagree on some things, and in this situation, he's going behind the
back of the other boss to make this happen:
My coworker and I are going to be paying, collectively, 1/2 the cost of the
overnighted replacement parts, which have amounted to $160, so $40 me and
$40 him. It shouldn't have happened in the first place, and the whole thing
is a learning experience. I'm not sure how the customer feels at this
point. He's got a brand new fork, though.
The tool is now gone so we won't make the same mistake again. I'm happy
with the outcome.
Keep in mind that if any of you guys ever come through Gainesville, FL, need
service, and end up at my shop, I'll work on your bike personally
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
news:[email protected]...
> On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 08:12:48 GMT, "Phil, Squid-in-Training"
> <[email protected]> may have said:
>
>>I'm embarrassed to tell this story.
> [snip]
>
> So, how did it come out?
Came out not so bad in the end, financially.
There are two bosses, as I mentioned earlier. One is much more laid back
than the other. The laid-back one is there more to take on debt (buying
bikes/accessories) than to manage. He's also the lead tech at this point.
They disagree on some things, and in this situation, he's going behind the
back of the other boss to make this happen:
My coworker and I are going to be paying, collectively, 1/2 the cost of the
overnighted replacement parts, which have amounted to $160, so $40 me and
$40 him. It shouldn't have happened in the first place, and the whole thing
is a learning experience. I'm not sure how the customer feels at this
point. He's got a brand new fork, though.
The tool is now gone so we won't make the same mistake again. I'm happy
with the outcome.
Keep in mind that if any of you guys ever come through Gainesville, FL, need
service, and end up at my shop, I'll work on your bike personally
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
P
Phil, Squid-in-Training
Guest
> Mistakes happen. I try to be reasonable about it. I think most good
> managers realize that if you create a lot of pressure about it, the result
> is more mistakes ... not fewer.
Then "good manager" only includes 1 of my 2 bosses.
> It's clear from reading your post that you sincerely feel badly for your
> mistake and for the consequences to your customer and your boss. And
> you've said it won't happen again. The only thing further I'd expect from
> you is that you see it through to whatever extent you have to in order to
> get the customer rolling again. If I owned the shop, I'd pay for the
> out-of-pockets. You'd get your normal pay, but anything extra you had to
> do for that customer would be on you. But that's easy for me to say. I
> don't own the shop.
I would expect to have to pay at least a nominal amount. I'm of the
mentality that if I were a boss, a monetary charge (even if small) would
send a stronger message that it's really important not to screw up,
especially since I probably didn't come off as sorry as I originally felt.
Everybody here on the newsgroup has gotten the story on a friend-to-friend
level, not a employee-to-boss level. It communicates more emotion. The
e-to-b level is different... more formality and less emotion.
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
> managers realize that if you create a lot of pressure about it, the result
> is more mistakes ... not fewer.
Then "good manager" only includes 1 of my 2 bosses.
> It's clear from reading your post that you sincerely feel badly for your
> mistake and for the consequences to your customer and your boss. And
> you've said it won't happen again. The only thing further I'd expect from
> you is that you see it through to whatever extent you have to in order to
> get the customer rolling again. If I owned the shop, I'd pay for the
> out-of-pockets. You'd get your normal pay, but anything extra you had to
> do for that customer would be on you. But that's easy for me to say. I
> don't own the shop.
I would expect to have to pay at least a nominal amount. I'm of the
mentality that if I were a boss, a monetary charge (even if small) would
send a stronger message that it's really important not to screw up,
especially since I probably didn't come off as sorry as I originally felt.
Everybody here on the newsgroup has gotten the story on a friend-to-friend
level, not a employee-to-boss level. It communicates more emotion. The
e-to-b level is different... more formality and less emotion.
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
P
Phil, Squid-in-Training
Guest
> It sounds as though the cutter has also crimped the setter to the steerer
> at this point. You didn't mention where on the steerer you were making the
> cut, but don't count on having any usable length above this point, and I
> doubt that heat will free the setter.
Low, so as to possibly be able to cut the tool off longitudinally,
autopsy-style. In retrospect, I should have chosen high so as to be able
to cut the top of the setter off, exposing a slightly longer steerer, and
then be able to pull both the setter and race off with the race remover.
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
> at this point. You didn't mention where on the steerer you were making the
> cut, but don't count on having any usable length above this point, and I
> doubt that heat will free the setter.
Low, so as to possibly be able to cut the tool off longitudinally,
autopsy-style. In retrospect, I should have chosen high so as to be able
to cut the top of the setter off, exposing a slightly longer steerer, and
then be able to pull both the setter and race off with the race remover.
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
P
Phil, Squid-in-Training
Guest
"Zog The Undeniable" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:41f53fa7.0@entanet...
> [email protected] wrote:
>
>> Be glad that it was only an inanimate object, fix or replace
>> it if you can, and resolve to be understanding if a plumber
>> ever makes a mistake and floods your basement.
>
> Or burn the shop and claim force majeure.
It's funny that you mention that. The previous owners of my shop actually
burned the shop down to collect on insurance. The second, later attempt
resulted in the insurance company proving arson. The current owners bought
up the shop because of this.
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
news:41f53fa7.0@entanet...
> [email protected] wrote:
>
>> Be glad that it was only an inanimate object, fix or replace
>> it if you can, and resolve to be understanding if a plumber
>> ever makes a mistake and floods your basement.
>
> Or burn the shop and claim force majeure.
It's funny that you mention that. The previous owners of my shop actually
burned the shop down to collect on insurance. The second, later attempt
resulted in the insurance company proving arson. The current owners bought
up the shop because of this.
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
P
Phil, Squid-in-Training
Guest
"David B." <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> OK, let's review...
>
> This coworker of yours -
> * Can't disassemble a headset without losing the bearings
> * Doesn't know what a crown race is
> * Uses an impact tool on an expensive part without understanding
> exactly what he's doing
My coworker has been working in the shop for a couple of months now. He
hasn't really done the more intricate repairs, such as thread chasing or
shell/headtube facing, and he hasn't fully developed wheel-truing skills
yet. He's also not on a newsgroup such as this one that explains the hows
and whys of the bicycle, but he's in his second year of mechanical
engineering, just getting started in the core engineering classes. He's
very enthusiastic, and is easy to work with.
> The real question is why this guy was on the shop floor in the first
> place. Its the shop's fault for hiring this idiot...
His mechanical aptitude is not actually that bad.
I actually work only 6-8 hours a week. At $6.00/hr, I don't have much
incentive to work more hours. He works at least 15-20. I was under the
impression that he knew what he was doing after having worked many hours
over these couple of months. I was also distracted by a high-end bicycle
build I was doing at the time for another customer who would be in the first
thing the next morning.
Its very nice that
> you take so much ownership of your work, if I had a shop I'd hire you
> in a second. But this isn't your fault at all. If you get fired, its
> probably a blessing in disguise...what a lousy shop.
Thank you, and your words ring true. One of the bosses makes the experience
much less enjoyable. Pressure, deadlines, and him getting frustrated used
to make me frustrated and sloppy. Once I learned to filter out the emotion
given off by him, it doesn't bother me anymore, and I can work at the right
pace for the job.
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
news:[email protected]...
> OK, let's review...
>
> This coworker of yours -
> * Can't disassemble a headset without losing the bearings
> * Doesn't know what a crown race is
> * Uses an impact tool on an expensive part without understanding
> exactly what he's doing
My coworker has been working in the shop for a couple of months now. He
hasn't really done the more intricate repairs, such as thread chasing or
shell/headtube facing, and he hasn't fully developed wheel-truing skills
yet. He's also not on a newsgroup such as this one that explains the hows
and whys of the bicycle, but he's in his second year of mechanical
engineering, just getting started in the core engineering classes. He's
very enthusiastic, and is easy to work with.
> The real question is why this guy was on the shop floor in the first
> place. Its the shop's fault for hiring this idiot...
His mechanical aptitude is not actually that bad.
I actually work only 6-8 hours a week. At $6.00/hr, I don't have much
incentive to work more hours. He works at least 15-20. I was under the
impression that he knew what he was doing after having worked many hours
over these couple of months. I was also distracted by a high-end bicycle
build I was doing at the time for another customer who would be in the first
thing the next morning.
Its very nice that
> you take so much ownership of your work, if I had a shop I'd hire you
> in a second. But this isn't your fault at all. If you get fired, its
> probably a blessing in disguise...what a lousy shop.
Thank you, and your words ring true. One of the bosses makes the experience
much less enjoyable. Pressure, deadlines, and him getting frustrated used
to make me frustrated and sloppy. Once I learned to filter out the emotion
given off by him, it doesn't bother me anymore, and I can work at the right
pace for the job.
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
P
Phil, Squid-in-Training
Guest
> If a customer knocks a jar off the shelf at a grocery store, the store
> covers the jar. It's a cost of doing business.
>
> If a mechanic makes a minor mistake and destroys something in a bike
> shop, the shop should cover the price of the mistake. It's a cost of
> doing business. A professional mechanic should only do this rarely,
> e.g. maybe a couple of times per year.
The last (first) remotely problematic mistake I can remember doing is
crimping a V-brake yoke back closed and bending the yoke a little bit.
> I do not envy you and especially your friend. I would say that even
> if you got together and paid for the cost of the fork, your friend's
> job might still be in jeopardy.
The financial cost ended up being relatively low, and through the graces of
the more understanding boss of the two, we are each responsible for less
than a typical vanilla front wheel would cost. The problem is that the shop
can't fire either of us because finding competent help here in college town
is very hard. There are many people eager to work for the shop, and very
few who are trustworthy and mechanically adept at doing so.
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
> covers the jar. It's a cost of doing business.
>
> If a mechanic makes a minor mistake and destroys something in a bike
> shop, the shop should cover the price of the mistake. It's a cost of
> doing business. A professional mechanic should only do this rarely,
> e.g. maybe a couple of times per year.
The last (first) remotely problematic mistake I can remember doing is
crimping a V-brake yoke back closed and bending the yoke a little bit.
> I do not envy you and especially your friend. I would say that even
> if you got together and paid for the cost of the fork, your friend's
> job might still be in jeopardy.
The financial cost ended up being relatively low, and through the graces of
the more understanding boss of the two, we are each responsible for less
than a typical vanilla front wheel would cost. The problem is that the shop
can't fire either of us because finding competent help here in college town
is very hard. There are many people eager to work for the shop, and very
few who are trustworthy and mechanically adept at doing so.
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
P
Phil, Squid-in-Training
Guest
"Vee" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> David B. wrote:
>> OK, let's review...
>>
>> This coworker of yours -
>> * Can't disassemble a headset without losing the bearings
>> * Doesn't know what a crown race is
>> * Uses an impact tool on an expensive part without understanding
>> exactly what he's doing
>
> King headsets use cartridge bearings. When cartridge bearings go bad,
> they sometimes fall apart upon disassembly. Whether the balls are lost
> is inconsequential. The rest sounds like simple inexperience...
It seemed that way to me too, so I did not think very much of it.
> Do you think bike shop pay attracts anything other than "idiots"? I
> partially agree with you - it's unfortunate that this guy was working
> on a fancy bike, but he has to learn somehow. Aspiring bike mechanics
> don't usually have the money for Barnett's training, and shops don't
> usually have the time and resources to fully train all their monkeys.
As I've said in a previous thread, $6.00/hr, in my opinion, is not a wage I
think most bike shops would need to pay their employees to keep them. As
for me, I will be glad to move on when I'm done with school.
Training during assembly and more common repairs is pretty much the only
method of training at my shop.
> Even with lots of training, I don't think a mechanic has learned much
> until he's seriously botched a few repairs, anyways. The guys who made
> this mess (hopefully) learned a lot from the experience, and, if the
> shop promptly and properly fixes the bike, I don't see much to get
> worked up about.
The bike has already been repaired as I speak, and everything is settled.
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
news:[email protected]...
> David B. wrote:
>> OK, let's review...
>>
>> This coworker of yours -
>> * Can't disassemble a headset without losing the bearings
>> * Doesn't know what a crown race is
>> * Uses an impact tool on an expensive part without understanding
>> exactly what he's doing
>
> King headsets use cartridge bearings. When cartridge bearings go bad,
> they sometimes fall apart upon disassembly. Whether the balls are lost
> is inconsequential. The rest sounds like simple inexperience...
It seemed that way to me too, so I did not think very much of it.
> Do you think bike shop pay attracts anything other than "idiots"? I
> partially agree with you - it's unfortunate that this guy was working
> on a fancy bike, but he has to learn somehow. Aspiring bike mechanics
> don't usually have the money for Barnett's training, and shops don't
> usually have the time and resources to fully train all their monkeys.
As I've said in a previous thread, $6.00/hr, in my opinion, is not a wage I
think most bike shops would need to pay their employees to keep them. As
for me, I will be glad to move on when I'm done with school.
Training during assembly and more common repairs is pretty much the only
method of training at my shop.
> Even with lots of training, I don't think a mechanic has learned much
> until he's seriously botched a few repairs, anyways. The guys who made
> this mess (hopefully) learned a lot from the experience, and, if the
> shop promptly and properly fixes the bike, I don't see much to get
> worked up about.
The bike has already been repaired as I speak, and everything is settled.
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
P
Phil, Squid-in-Training
Guest
> I'd want to know that you understood and accept responsibility for the
> damge the damage both in terms of the cost of parts and making the shop
> look like a bunch of cowboys.
I sincerely didn't care about the cost of the replacement. I cared most
about the cowboy aspect, as you put it. I almost had to throw up out back
afterwards.
> I'd also hope that you can work out the root cause, in terms of not
> understanding your co-workers ability, of not understanding the risks
> involved when delegating delicate tasks to juinor staff who my be either
> overconfident and keep wacking away, or to timid and keep wacking away
> because you told them to.
I've definitely learned that lesson.
> Theres are also issues of allowing yourself to be pressured into doing a
> hasty job, of the reasons we don't do work in front of customers, of why
> we don't chat to customers while we work.
Good point.
> If you can learn from all that, you'll be ok.
Whew!
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
> damge the damage both in terms of the cost of parts and making the shop
> look like a bunch of cowboys.
I sincerely didn't care about the cost of the replacement. I cared most
about the cowboy aspect, as you put it. I almost had to throw up out back
afterwards.
> I'd also hope that you can work out the root cause, in terms of not
> understanding your co-workers ability, of not understanding the risks
> involved when delegating delicate tasks to juinor staff who my be either
> overconfident and keep wacking away, or to timid and keep wacking away
> because you told them to.
I've definitely learned that lesson.
> Theres are also issues of allowing yourself to be pressured into doing a
> hasty job, of the reasons we don't do work in front of customers, of why
> we don't chat to customers while we work.
Good point.
> If you can learn from all that, you'll be ok.
Whew!
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
P
Phil, Squid-in-Training
Guest
"B.B." <[email protected]> wrote in message
news[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>,
> "Phil, Squid-in-Training" <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
> [...stuck thing woes...]
>
> If you ever again have a destroyable round thing pressed around a
> non-destroyable round thing, use and anvil and a cold chisel. In this
> case set the setter on an anvil (or a vise's fixed jaw, or concrete
> floor, even) and use a cold chisel to put score marks around the
> outside. Ought to make little lines parallel to the tube. Do a bunch,
> like eight or twelve, space 'em as even as you can. Thicker things need
Put score marks before grinding on them?
> more lines. If you can, grind the outside down first. THEN try a
> puller. Sometimes it'll loosen enough to pop off by hand.
> No chisel? Ball-peen hammer can do it too, but not quite as well.
> Has worked for me even on big, nasty, non-bike parts.
> Also, teach the other guy to do a stupidity check before making any
> moves. Teach him to ask questions like "will this fly apart?" "Will it
> stick?" "What's behind it?" "What will bend?"
He's definitely going to be using a delicate touch from now on.
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
news
[email protected]...> In article <[email protected]>,
> "Phil, Squid-in-Training" <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
> [...stuck thing woes...]
>
> If you ever again have a destroyable round thing pressed around a
> non-destroyable round thing, use and anvil and a cold chisel. In this
> case set the setter on an anvil (or a vise's fixed jaw, or concrete
> floor, even) and use a cold chisel to put score marks around the
> outside. Ought to make little lines parallel to the tube. Do a bunch,
> like eight or twelve, space 'em as even as you can. Thicker things need
Put score marks before grinding on them?
> more lines. If you can, grind the outside down first. THEN try a
> puller. Sometimes it'll loosen enough to pop off by hand.
> No chisel? Ball-peen hammer can do it too, but not quite as well.
> Has worked for me even on big, nasty, non-bike parts.
> Also, teach the other guy to do a stupidity check before making any
> moves. Teach him to ask questions like "will this fly apart?" "Will it
> stick?" "What's behind it?" "What will bend?"
He's definitely going to be using a delicate touch from now on.
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
D
Derk
Guest
> This guy had been hanging around the shop for hours....... and
> then kinda weaseled his way into the repair area
I hope it doesn't function this way in hospitals: I must remember to ask my
wife this question tonight: she works in the O.R........
Greets, Derk
> then kinda weaseled his way into the repair area
I hope it doesn't function this way in hospitals: I must remember to ask my
wife this question tonight: she works in the O.R........
Greets, Derk
D
David B.
Guest
> As I've said in a previous thread, $6.00/hr, in my opinion, is not a
wage I
> think most bike shops would need to pay their employees to keep them
$6/hr??? In NYC??? Jeez, its worse than I thought.
wage I
> think most bike shops would need to pay their employees to keep them
$6/hr??? In NYC??? Jeez, its worse than I thought.
J
Jim Smith
Guest
Derk <[email protected]> writes:
>> This guy had been hanging around the shop for hours....... and
>> then kinda weaseled his way into the repair area
> I hope it doesn't function this way in hospitals: I must remember to ask my
> wife this question tonight: she works in the O.R........
C-sections are about the only time a nutcase (other than the usually
supects) inadvertantly gets invited into the OR. If they get really
out of hand security can escort the no-longer-welcome father out of
the room.
>> This guy had been hanging around the shop for hours....... and
>> then kinda weaseled his way into the repair area
> I hope it doesn't function this way in hospitals: I must remember to ask my
> wife this question tonight: she works in the O.R........
C-sections are about the only time a nutcase (other than the usually
supects) inadvertantly gets invited into the OR. If they get really
out of hand security can escort the no-longer-welcome father out of
the room.
B
B.B.
Guest
In article <[email protected]>,
"Phil, Squid-in-Training" <[email protected]>
wrote:
>"B.B." <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news[email protected]...
>> In article <[email protected]>,
>> "Phil, Squid-in-Training" <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> [...stuck thing woes...]
>>
>> If you ever again have a destroyable round thing pressed around a
>> non-destroyable round thing, use and anvil and a cold chisel. In this
>> case set the setter on an anvil (or a vise's fixed jaw, or concrete
>> floor, even) and use a cold chisel to put score marks around the
>> outside. Ought to make little lines parallel to the tube. Do a bunch,
>> like eight or twelve, space 'em as even as you can. Thicker things need
>
>Put score marks before grinding on them?
Nope. Those score marks are actually "peening" to expand the metal
on the outside. Actual score marks are more for breaking stuff along a
line. You aren't trying to break anything, you just want to stretch it
out a bit. Wherever you leave a chisel line/dent it will slightly
compress the metal underneath, squeezing a small amount out to either
side. On a thick chunk there's more room for the metal to just compress
without squeezing out to the sides very much. On thinner stuff this
works better because the metal moves out to the sides by a larger
distance with the same amount of hammering. Grinding is just to get you
as thin a metal surface as possible, so that peening afterward is more
effective (you could peen first and grind second without hurting
anything, but you wouldn't gain anything by it).
However, that might be overkill, depending on the metal that collar
is/was made of. If it's some aluminum alloy, don't bother
grinding--just peen it. Same goes for most steels. But if it's
something really hard like a bearing race, or something springy like
titanium, you'll save yourself some pain by grinding first.
I use this to remove seals, bushings, or extremely tightly seized
bearings on farm equipment and trucks. Should work just find for
bicycles, too--you'll just need a smaller hammer.
>> more lines. If you can, grind the outside down first. THEN try a
>> puller. Sometimes it'll loosen enough to pop off by hand.
>> No chisel? Ball-peen hammer can do it too, but not quite as well.
>> Has worked for me even on big, nasty, non-bike parts.
>> Also, teach the other guy to do a stupidity check before making any
>> moves. Teach him to ask questions like "will this fly apart?" "Will it
>> stick?" "What's behind it?" "What will bend?"
>
>He's definitely going to be using a delicate touch from now on.
--
B.B. --I am not a goat! thegoat4 at airmail dot net
http://web2.airmail.net/thegoat4/
"Phil, Squid-in-Training" <[email protected]>
wrote:
>"B.B." <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news
[email protected]...>> In article <[email protected]>,
>> "Phil, Squid-in-Training" <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> [...stuck thing woes...]
>>
>> If you ever again have a destroyable round thing pressed around a
>> non-destroyable round thing, use and anvil and a cold chisel. In this
>> case set the setter on an anvil (or a vise's fixed jaw, or concrete
>> floor, even) and use a cold chisel to put score marks around the
>> outside. Ought to make little lines parallel to the tube. Do a bunch,
>> like eight or twelve, space 'em as even as you can. Thicker things need
>
>Put score marks before grinding on them?
Nope. Those score marks are actually "peening" to expand the metal
on the outside. Actual score marks are more for breaking stuff along a
line. You aren't trying to break anything, you just want to stretch it
out a bit. Wherever you leave a chisel line/dent it will slightly
compress the metal underneath, squeezing a small amount out to either
side. On a thick chunk there's more room for the metal to just compress
without squeezing out to the sides very much. On thinner stuff this
works better because the metal moves out to the sides by a larger
distance with the same amount of hammering. Grinding is just to get you
as thin a metal surface as possible, so that peening afterward is more
effective (you could peen first and grind second without hurting
anything, but you wouldn't gain anything by it).
However, that might be overkill, depending on the metal that collar
is/was made of. If it's some aluminum alloy, don't bother
grinding--just peen it. Same goes for most steels. But if it's
something really hard like a bearing race, or something springy like
titanium, you'll save yourself some pain by grinding first.
I use this to remove seals, bushings, or extremely tightly seized
bearings on farm equipment and trucks. Should work just find for
bicycles, too--you'll just need a smaller hammer.
>> more lines. If you can, grind the outside down first. THEN try a
>> puller. Sometimes it'll loosen enough to pop off by hand.
>> No chisel? Ball-peen hammer can do it too, but not quite as well.
>> Has worked for me even on big, nasty, non-bike parts.
>> Also, teach the other guy to do a stupidity check before making any
>> moves. Teach him to ask questions like "will this fly apart?" "Will it
>> stick?" "What's behind it?" "What will bend?"
>
>He's definitely going to be using a delicate touch from now on.
--
B.B. --I am not a goat! thegoat4 at airmail dot net
http://web2.airmail.net/thegoat4/
P
Phil, Squid-in-Training
Guest
"David B." <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>> As I've said in a previous thread, $6.00/hr, in my opinion, is not a
> wage I
>> think most bike shops would need to pay their employees to keep them
> $6/hr??? In NYC??? Jeez, its worse than I thought.
>
In my town: Gainesville, FL. I meant to say that our shop should pay more
for the experience needed.
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
news:[email protected]...
>> As I've said in a previous thread, $6.00/hr, in my opinion, is not a
> wage I
>> think most bike shops would need to pay their employees to keep them
> $6/hr??? In NYC??? Jeez, its worse than I thought.
>
In my town: Gainesville, FL. I meant to say that our shop should pay more
for the experience needed.
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
T
Tom Sherman
Guest
Phil, Squid-in-Training wrote:
> ...The problem is that the shop can't fire either of us because finding competent help
> here in college town is very hard. There are many people eager to work for the shop,
> and very few who are trustworthy and mechanically adept at doing so.
Phil,
It is a problem that you did not get fired?
--
Tom Sherman - Earth
> ...The problem is that the shop can't fire either of us because finding competent help
> here in college town is very hard. There are many people eager to work for the shop,
> and very few who are trustworthy and mechanically adept at doing so.
Phil,
It is a problem that you did not get fired?
--
Tom Sherman - Earth
L
Luke
Guest
In article <[email protected]>, Phil,
Squid-in-Training <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Werehatrack" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 08:12:48 GMT, "Phil, Squid-in-Training"
> > <[email protected]> may have said:
> >
> >>I'm embarrassed to tell this story.
> > [snip]
> >
> > So, how did it come out?
>
> Came out not so bad in the end, financially.
>
<snip>
Hey Phil, I'm glad that the outcome was, relatively speaking,
satisfactory. Given the tenor and sensibilities expressed in your
posts, I'm sure that you'd be a credit to a any bike shop.
Now that the matter's resolved, would you indulge me? I'm unclear as to
how the race setter was stuck. For instance, was it forced onto the
steerer's crown race seat so that it was stuck (independently of the
Record's crown race) to the steerer itself? Or was the setter jammed
onto the Record's crown race which in turn was partially set on the
steerer's crown race seat?
You mentioned that the setter was incorrect for the job. How so?
luke
Squid-in-Training <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Werehatrack" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 08:12:48 GMT, "Phil, Squid-in-Training"
> > <[email protected]> may have said:
> >
> >>I'm embarrassed to tell this story.
> > [snip]
> >
> > So, how did it come out?
>
> Came out not so bad in the end, financially.
>
<snip>
Hey Phil, I'm glad that the outcome was, relatively speaking,
satisfactory. Given the tenor and sensibilities expressed in your
posts, I'm sure that you'd be a credit to a any bike shop.
Now that the matter's resolved, would you indulge me? I'm unclear as to
how the race setter was stuck. For instance, was it forced onto the
steerer's crown race seat so that it was stuck (independently of the
Record's crown race) to the steerer itself? Or was the setter jammed
onto the Record's crown race which in turn was partially set on the
steerer's crown race seat?
You mentioned that the setter was incorrect for the job. How so?
luke
W
whinds
Guest
In article <[email protected]>, "Phil,
Squid-in-Training" <[email protected]> writes:
>As I've said in a previous thread, $6.00/hr, in my opinion, is not a wage I
>think most bike shops would need to pay their employees to keep them. As
>for me, I will be glad to move on when I'm done with school.
>
>Training during assembly and more common repairs is pretty much the only
>method of training at my shop.
I've always wondered why some LBS don't hire older people? You know ones
already retired from a career of some kind and looking for a small job. They
would be more interested in working in a bike shop for the love of bikes and
not expecting to get rich at the same time. Is it bias against older riders? A
lot of riders come back to bikes in their 60's or never really left. Of course
they would make some of the same mistakes as younger mechanics but then they
may have made many of those already while learning on their own bikes. I don't
recall seeing a wrench in his/her 40s ever. ( I'm deliberatly excluding owners
and managers and of course many who participate in these NG.
Squid-in-Training" <[email protected]> writes:
>As I've said in a previous thread, $6.00/hr, in my opinion, is not a wage I
>think most bike shops would need to pay their employees to keep them. As
>for me, I will be glad to move on when I'm done with school.
>
>Training during assembly and more common repairs is pretty much the only
>method of training at my shop.
I've always wondered why some LBS don't hire older people? You know ones
already retired from a career of some kind and looking for a small job. They
would be more interested in working in a bike shop for the love of bikes and
not expecting to get rich at the same time. Is it bias against older riders? A
lot of riders come back to bikes in their 60's or never really left. Of course
they would make some of the same mistakes as younger mechanics but then they
may have made many of those already while learning on their own bikes. I don't
recall seeing a wrench in his/her 40s ever. ( I'm deliberatly excluding owners
and managers and of course many who participate in these NG.
P
Phil, Squid-in-Training
Guest
> Hey Phil, I'm glad that the outcome was, relatively speaking,
> satisfactory. Given the tenor and sensibilities expressed in your
> posts, I'm sure that you'd be a credit to a any bike shop.
>
> Now that the matter's resolved, would you indulge me? I'm unclear as to
> how the race setter was stuck. For instance, was it forced onto the
> steerer's crown race seat so that it was stuck (independently of the
> Record's crown race) to the steerer itself? Or was the setter jammed
> onto the Record's crown race which in turn was partially set on the
> steerer's crown race seat?
It was the first situation.
> You mentioned that the setter was incorrect for the job. How so?
It was an old Campy headset setter that may have been intended for older
forks with a different steerer diameter, or it may have needed a shim before
contacting the race. It sits in a tin can that holds many other oft-used
tools such as a cassette lockring remover, bead breaker, etc. I had never
seen or heard of it being used so I have no idea why I chose it to give to
my coworker. Why it was even in the bin is also beyond me. I'll take a
picture of the fork tomorrow.
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
> satisfactory. Given the tenor and sensibilities expressed in your
> posts, I'm sure that you'd be a credit to a any bike shop.
>
> Now that the matter's resolved, would you indulge me? I'm unclear as to
> how the race setter was stuck. For instance, was it forced onto the
> steerer's crown race seat so that it was stuck (independently of the
> Record's crown race) to the steerer itself? Or was the setter jammed
> onto the Record's crown race which in turn was partially set on the
> steerer's crown race seat?
It was the first situation.
> You mentioned that the setter was incorrect for the job. How so?
It was an old Campy headset setter that may have been intended for older
forks with a different steerer diameter, or it may have needed a shim before
contacting the race. It sits in a tin can that holds many other oft-used
tools such as a cassette lockring remover, bead breaker, etc. I had never
seen or heard of it being used so I have no idea why I chose it to give to
my coworker. Why it was even in the bin is also beyond me. I'll take a
picture of the fork tomorrow.
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
D
Derk
Guest
whinds wrote:
> I've always wondered why some LBS don't hire older people? You know ones
> already retired from a career of some kind and looking for a small job.
> They would be more interested in working in a bike shop for the love of
> bikes and not expecting to get rich at the same time.
Wait a minute: why wouldn't good mechanics earn a decent living? When I look
at my LBS I see a very rich owner, who owns several houses in th etown
where he lives, so why wouldn't he pay his workers well? Looking at bike
and parts prices, someone must be making an awful lot of money.
I don't see a diffrence between a good plumber and a good bike mechanic:
both repair (and create) things. A plumber can get very rich here, though.
I know on in the UK, btw, who drives a Porsche........
Here I see the same thing happening at my LBS: they hire young mechanics and
fire them when they get older and thus more expensive. It makes me sick:
I'm willing to pay more for someone who has expereince and doesn't ruin my
bike.
Greets, Derk
> I've always wondered why some LBS don't hire older people? You know ones
> already retired from a career of some kind and looking for a small job.
> They would be more interested in working in a bike shop for the love of
> bikes and not expecting to get rich at the same time.
Wait a minute: why wouldn't good mechanics earn a decent living? When I look
at my LBS I see a very rich owner, who owns several houses in th etown
where he lives, so why wouldn't he pay his workers well? Looking at bike
and parts prices, someone must be making an awful lot of money.
I don't see a diffrence between a good plumber and a good bike mechanic:
both repair (and create) things. A plumber can get very rich here, though.
I know on in the UK, btw, who drives a Porsche........
Here I see the same thing happening at my LBS: they hire young mechanics and
fire them when they get older and thus more expensive. It makes me sick:
I'm willing to pay more for someone who has expereince and doesn't ruin my
bike.
Greets, Derk
