G Strings : now banned in Virginia USA

[Carrera]

That was the amusing side to it all. Blair's accomplices set to producing some kind of official document they could present to Bush as an aid in convincing the neos to go to war in Iraq.
So, some bright-spark cruised the internet, downloaded a 10 year old university thesis on Saddam and WMD, sexed it up a wee bit and then presented the said missive to the Bush Administration.
Colin Powell perused the document and commented:
"This is a find document!"
A few days later it was exposed as a convenient computer download - to the embarrassment of the Bush Administration who must have been well ****** off with the Brits.
But I agree with you that Blair had a choice over Iraq and his decision was to push for war, in such a way he was even keener than Bush himself. Now, of course, he's travelling the country in sackcloth and ashes, trying to get across the message he was dragged into the Iraq war, hoping he'll be re-elected if he sheds a few tears here and there.
Likewise he pushed hard for war against Yugoslavia and gave a speech promising U.S. ground troops would be sent in. Rumour has it Clinton was livid and personally lambasted Blair by telephone for trying to get U.S. ground troops involved.

True, Blair could have stood aside as an impartial party much like switzerland of days gone by but his intelligence aparatus gave him the info. on yellow cake from nigeria(?) & he or his gov't relayed it to Bush (Complicity). Bush then ran w/ it, weak info as it may have been, because it served his purposes of going to war w/ iraq from the 1st day that he stepped into the oval office. That makes the British gov't culpable, no? All of that aside, Hussein was a destabilizing factor in the region that has had escalating tensions between the arabs & israeli's not to mention his siphoning of the oil for food program to the detriment of his own people. It's pay now or pay later. Granted, the U.S. was not in the best condition to undertake the operation in lives or money but does anyone think that the pricetag would go down as time goes by waiting for hussein to either die or implode

 

[limerickman]

I think Limerickman already commented on some of your points here:
"I believe that the Merkins approved Bush's actions, including his invasion of Iraq : which of course is their progative, despite the 49% who didn't vote for him."
The way I see it is there are a range of Americans who voted Bush into office and these can be classified as follows:
(1)Those Americans who were influenced by the media and genuinely believed Iraq was partly responsible for 9/11 and/or Saddam was already considering a chemical attack on the U.S. (a friend of mind in L.A. informed me she had been informed she should stock up on drinking water and pasta prior to the invasion of Baghdad.
(2)Those Americans who opposed the war but maybe feared a military call-up under John Kerry and calculated that Bush would more than likely be less bellicose than Kerry in a second term.
(3)Those Americans who are typically bible-belt, right-wing material who see nothing wrong in the essential idea that God has chosen the U.S. to protect Israel and reshape the entire Middle East.
However the case may be, the U.S. electorate finally went on to re-elect George W Bush and this has had clear implications since, to my mind, the re-election of Bush Junior constitutes a serious set-back for human rights and the 20th century philosophical deduction that war is essentially a destructive, double-edged sword. It should only ever be resorted to as a means of defence against aggression.
As for the U.K. I see no excuse for re-electing New Labour and simply don't swallow all of the current propaganda that Blair had apparently been forced into the policy by Bush. Myself I witnessed footage of U.K. troops throwing sandbags over the heads of terrified Iraqi looters and can you imagine the outcry there would have been had the Iraqis treated U.S. prisoners in such a manner (that is contrary to the Geneva Convention)?
Blair actively encouraged the Bush Administration to go to war, produced false evidence to back up an illegal invasion just as Campbell lambasted and intimidated anyone who questioned this policy (actions which led to the apparent suicide of David Kelly).
If the U.K electorate re-elect New Labour then the unfortunate case is they will be endorsing an imperialistic approach to policy in the Middle East and ignoring clear human rights abuses.

There is a notion going around US political circles that God is on Bush's side.

I don't know if this is supposed to be a joke or not but I read recently where
the Bush administration is formulating policy on the basis of The Rapture concept.
Where, at the end of time, only the righteous will be saved and this is due to take place at Armagedon which is located somewhere in Palestine, if I am not mistaken.

I don't know if the Bush gov. is in fact basing their entire Middle Eastern policy on this concept or it is just a critic having a go at them.

 

[davidmc]

There is a notion going around US political circles that God is on Bush's side.

I don't know if this is supposed to be a joke or not but I read recently where
the Bush administration is formulating policy on the basis of The Rapture concept.
Where, at the end of time, only the righteous will be saved and this is due to take place at Armagedon which is located somewhere in Palestine, if I am not mistaken.

I don't know if the Bush gov. is in fact basing their entire Middle Eastern policy on this concept or it is just a critic having a go at them.

It's a critic having a go at them because they said the EXACT same thing inre: Reagan. Bush gives me the "willies" w/ all of his religious pronouncements & praying in public. I say "Keep it to yourself" People already refer to us as "jesus-land & Bush is not helping matters. We have alot of the "braintrust" (anyone who cares to debate me on that can e-mail me at:[email protected]) on this planet & Bush is making all of us look like hillbillies.

 

[Carrera]

I did read in the Mail they had a meeting over the so-called Bible code that works on the original Hebrew script and spells out 9/11, Iraq, Saddam e.t.c. It's all taken quite seriously.
But it's a pity Howard Dean put his foot in it that day when he got over-excited. It surprises me the American public took that bit of enthusiasm so literally.
Did you hear about that, as it was quite amusing. Dean was accused of ranting when he shouted out something like:
"We're going all the way to Arizona, to Nevada, and then we're off to Kansas, to New Orleans, to Lousiana and all the way to Michigan and then we're off to the White House."
Dean followed all of this by screams and howls and some cartoons have men in white coats dragging him off the platform.
It was this outburst that is said to have ruined him.

There is a notion going around US political circles that God is on Bush's side.

I don't know if this is supposed to be a joke or not but I read recently where
the Bush administration is formulating policy on the basis of The Rapture concept.
Where, at the end of time, only the righteous will be saved and this is due to take place at Armagedon which is located somewhere in Palestine, if I am not mistaken.

I don't know if the Bush gov. is in fact basing their entire Middle Eastern policy on this concept or it is just a critic having a go at them.

 

[Carrera]

I guess it's a thought not to be dwelled on.
Dare I ask how many of you guys would hold out if you found yourself under Lyndie England's jurisdiction as a prison guard?
What a hideous thought. I wonder how Lim would cope with her?

She wasa reserve soldier from West Virginia. Worked in a poultry processing plant, not exactly rocket scientist/neuro surgeon material.

And with that I discovered the reason for sLime rick man's disdain for Hebrews...his trade. You see, in certain circles, accounting is known as "Hebrew Engineering".

 

[limerickman]

I guess it's a thought not to be dwelled on.
Dare I ask how many of you guys would hold out if you found yourself under Lyndie England's jurisdiction as a prison guard?
What a hideous thought. I wonder how Lim would cope with her?

Are you asking me a question here ?

I won't pull any punches.
I'd put her in the oven and let the gas do the rest.

 

[Ike90]

There is a notion going around US political circles that God is on Bush's side.

Really? I'm guessing those are fairly small circles. From what I've observed, while the far religious right takes a lot of credit for the republican congress and the re-election of Dubya, they aren't real fond of him. Believe it or not, he's far too liberal for their tastes. In fact, if you were to ask the average zealous religious right-winger who their most idealogically-minded presidential candidate is, they'll tell you Barry Goldwater in 1964.

I would contend that Dubya wasn't re-elected because of a strong conviction among Americans that he has God on his side. He was re-elected because he quite successfully played upon the fears of average voters. If you look at the country's (albeit brief) history, it's obvious that U.S. Presidents rarely lose a re-election bid during time of war. It's the old "don't switch horses in mid-stream" mentality.

It wasn't that voters forgot or forgave Bush for anything he said/did during his first term. Rather, they believed that the danger of terrorism might worsen under a new administration. In light of the apparent growing disdain for the U.S. among the RoW (which incidentally is a silly and incredibly over-simplified term), the exact opposite might very well occur.

 

[Carrera]

I've been perusing Google out of interest to see how Americans reacted to Lyndie England and those specific snaps.
I see the American media is very hostile to the whole business, possibly more shocked than we Europeans. One person writes:
"in the Arab culture among Muslims. I know if one were to try to design something that would completely and totally enrage people raised in that culture, one could not have designed a scenario worse than what happened. To have an American female in a prison where Iraqi men were naked, forced into homosexual positions, you could not design a circumstance that would more gravely enrage Muslim sensibilities than that."
The writer goes on to explain that amongst Arabs, various sexual acts as offensive to Allah should be punishable by death under Islamic law. Hence, whoever convinced Miss England to pose for the pics in question used her as a bit of a stooge to try and shock others who saw the pics into giving out information.

 

[limerickman]

[/QUOTE]
There is a notion going around US political circles that God is on Bush's side.
[/QUOTE]

Really? I'm guessing those are fairly small circles. From what I've observed, while the far religious right takes a lot of credit for the republican congress and the re-election of Dubya, they aren't real fond of him. Believe it or not, he's far too liberal for their tastes. In fact, if you were to ask the average zealous religious right-winger who their most idealogically-minded presidential candidate is, they'll tell you Barry Goldwater in 1964.

I would contend that Dubya wasn't re-elected because of a strong conviction among Americans that he has God on his side. He was re-elected because he quite successfully played upon the fears of average voters. If you look at the country's (albeit brief) history, it's obvious that U.S. Presidents rarely lose a re-election bid during time of war. It's the old "don't switch horses in mid-stream" mentality.

It wasn't that voters forgot or forgave Bush for anything he said/did during his first term. Rather, they believed that the danger of terrorism might worsen under a new administration. In light of the apparent growing disdain for the U.S. among the RoW (which incidentally is a silly and incredibly over-simplified term), the exact opposite might very well occur.

You have taken one line from a post - and have attempted to spin.

here is the full quotation :

There is a notion going around US political circles that God is on Bush's side.
I don't know if this is supposed to be a joke or not but I read recently where
the Bush administration is formulating policy on the basis of The Rapture concept.
Where, at the end of time, only the righteous will be saved and this is due to take place at Armagedon which is located somewhere in Palestine, if I am not mistaken.
I don't know if the Bush gov. is in fact basing their entire Middle Eastern policy on this concept or it is just a critic having a go at them.

I asked if the notion that God was on Bush's side real or not.
That's the question I posed - and not the edited quotation which you posted
above and spun.

Now that we have your attention.
Is Bush formulating a policy based on the Rapture ?

 

[limerickman]

I've been perusing Google out of interest to see how Americans reacted to Lyndie England and those specific snaps.
I see the American media is very hostile to the whole business, possibly more shocked than we Europeans. One person writes:
"in the Arab culture among Muslims. I know if one were to try to design something that would completely and totally enrage people raised in that culture, one could not have designed a scenario worse than what happened. To have an American female in a prison where Iraqi men were naked, forced into homosexual positions, you could not design a circumstance that would more gravely enrage Muslim sensibilities than that."
The writer goes on to explain that amongst Arabs, various sexual acts as offensive to Allah should be punishable by death under Islamic law. Hence, whoever convinced Miss England to pose for the pics in question used her as a bit of a stooge to try and shock others who saw the pics into giving out information.

A willing stooge, I would suggest.

I find this very ironic.
Lynndie England.
Remember the other female in Iraq - yes, dear old Private Jessica Lynch.

Remember all the malicious false allegations put about concerning her alleged rape at the hands of the Iraqi's ?

The Merkins make false allegations in one instance - and then try to deny the truth in another instance.

Merkins have been proven to have lied in both cases.

Seems lying is ok in Jesusland.

 

[Jupiler]

A willing stooge, I would suggest.

I find this very ironic.
Lynndie England.
Remember the other female in Iraq - yes, dear old Private Jessica Lynch.

Remember all the malicious false allegations put about concerning her alleged rape at the hands of the Iraqi's ?

The Merkins make false allegations in one instance - and then try to deny the truth in another instance.

Merkins have been proven to have lied in both cases.

Seems lying is ok in Jesusland.

At least that Jessica Lynch denounced all the hype and attention around her, she even said she felt abused for propaganda. For the US media she was ideal...she was blonde, young, pretty (well, for military standards...). There was also another woman captured, but she had the misfortune of being black, fat and ugly, so no attention and no million dollar deals for her story ...

It was funny watching those captured GI's getting a heroes welcome in the US...heroes for what? For being captured??

 

[Carrera]

I heard Lyndie England being interviewed on TV and kind of got the impression she was more stupid than anything else. She stated she had been asked to pose with an Iraqi prisoner while holding the dog leash but said she found it all very creepy and weird. But she was told if she went ahead with it she'd be helping out her country. So, she went along with it but got cut high and dry when the scandal was exposed.
Lyndie England strikes me as bit of a ***** cat on the quiet, not the sadist she was painted out to be, or we assumed she was.
By comparison I met a Russian train officer while traveliing through the USSR on a train and remember what a ***** she was. As I recall, she kicked the carriage door open at 1.00 a.m., shouted "pigs!" and "shtraf!" (Russian for "fine") and reduced the English girls in the carriage to tears (when she assured them she could have them sent to a Gulag camp if they didn't pay). However, she didn't scare me at all and I knew the Gulag stuff was a lot of hot air.

A willing stooge, I would suggest.

I find this very ironic.
Lynndie England.
Remember the other female in Iraq - yes, dear old Private Jessica Lynch.

Remember all the malicious false allegations put about concerning her alleged rape at the hands of the Iraqi's ?

The Merkins make false allegations in one instance - and then try to deny the truth in another instance.

Merkins have been proven to have lied in both cases.

Seems lying is ok in Jesusland.

 

[limerickman]

I heard Lyndie England being interviewed on TV and kind of got the impression she was more stupid than anything else. She stated she had been asked to pose with an Iraqi prisoner while holding the dog leash but said she found it all very creepy and weird. But she was told if she went ahead with it she'd be helping out her country. So, she went along with it but got cut high and dry when the scandal was exposed.
Lyndie England strikes me as bit of a ***** cat on the quiet, not the sadist she was painted out to be, or we assumed she was.
By comparison I met a Russian train officer while traveliing through the USSR on a train and remember what a ***** she was. As I recall, she kicked the carriage door open at 1.00 a.m., shouted "pigs!" and "shtraf!" (Russian for "fine") and reduced the English girls in the carriage to tears (when she assured them she could have them sent to a Gulag camp if they didn't pay). However, she didn't scare me at all and I knew the Gulag stuff was a lot of hot air.

I watched the Auschwitz prog on BBC last night.

The Russian soldier captured by the Germans - spent 4 years in Auschwitz.
On his release, he went back to the USSR and was then imprisoned in a gulag
because Stalin considered captured Soviet soldiers as potential spies.
He spent from 1945-1953 in a gulag.
Very very harsh treatment.

 

[Carrera]

Si senor, that is true. Stalin was denounced by Krushchev as well in the 20th Party Congress.
This is an old strategy used by Stalin, however. It would have been the same in ancient Sparta where surrender was considered an act of extreme cowardice. The Spartans typically never surrendered. Just a few hundred of them stood side by side and killed thousands of Persians during Persia's invasion of Greece. It is said Spartan men who surrendered were publically mocked by the women.
The early Romans adopted the same ethos. Roman generals didn't want any captured Roman soldiers back from captivity as they were considered to be cowards for laying down arms.
Saddam Hussein also tried to copy Stalin's old death squads as well. These were CHEKA units that stood behind infantry lines of Russian troops, gunning down those who tried to flee the Germans from behind the ranks.
This is what led ****** to finally renounce his ideas of so-called Slavic inferiority to the German when he saw how determined the Russians were. Even the American boxer Joe Luis shook ******'s faith as well when he defeated Max Schleming.
Sure, Stalinism was a rough time. You could get 10 years Gulag just for sitting on a newspaper photo of uncle Joe or criticizing the Party. Even children were taught to spy on their parents and report anything to the school Party Members. If you ever read Solzhenitsyn's Gulag you will find it quite depressing reading.
And finally if you want to find out how it was, there's an actual prison in Latvia where you can be treated in a similar way to a political prisoner. Tourists travel there to wear prison outfits and then spend a night in a freezing, damp Soviet cell with peep holes and shutters for guards to check on you.

I watched the Auschwitz prog on BBC last night.

The Russian soldier captured by the Germans - spent 4 years in Auschwitz.
On his release, he went back to the USSR and was then imprisoned in a gulag
because Stalin considered captured Soviet soldiers as potential spies.
He spent from 1945-1953 in a gulag.
Very very harsh treatment.