Garmin 60Cx possible design flaw - units break like crazy on a MTB!!



D

Domagoj Malovic

Guest
Hi!

I was a proud owner of a very nice GPS Map 60C unit. I used it mainly on my
mountain bike. The unit probably had more than 3000 miles of dirt road and
trail riding mounted on the handlebars of my bike before I decided to sell
it and buy a new and improved 60Cx unit.

What a mistake (or maybe not?). I used my first unit for just a few months
and discovered that it was behaving strangely. Riding on a flat asphalt
road, I would notice that the unit would report a full set of batteries
empty, only to jump back to full four bars batt. reading seconds later. It
was like the battery meter went crazy. As I rode more, the unit started
powering down on its own, reporting abnormal shutdowns. It got so bad that
it was enough to just squeeze the case on the sides and the screen would
fade out :(.

It was not the problem with the battery compartment. I tried both the NiMH
and Alkaline cells, I tried making the cells bigger by wrapping electrical
tape around them, stuffing the batt. compartment with foam and everything.
After all, it was obvious that it was not the batt. contact problem because
I could shut down the unit by simply gently squeezing it on the sides. You
can see that on a small video I made, at
http://www.dizmal.hr/garmin/60cx.avi. There are other people who describe
exactly the same problems, like here: http://tinyurl.com/ke942.

Garmin was nice to me, as we have all come to expect, and they replaced my
unit with a brand new one. I started using it at the beginning of this
month. It was on my bike for not more than 200 miles. On my ride a few days
ago, I started noticing strange power meter readings again and I thought to
myself - oh, no, this can't be happening to me again :(! I rode some more,
not even on dirt roads, and all of a sudden my new unit powered down, less
then a month after I got it :( Needles to mention, I was so disappointed
that trying to repeat the shutdown problem I almost crashed really badly
from my bike :)

Now Garmin replaced me with the third unit, but now I am really anxious as
far as how long the new one will last. I firmly believe from my experience
and the experience of others that there is a hardware design flaw, or a
manufacturing process flaw with the new units. Those of you who use the unit
for hiking or driving are not very likely to experience it because the unit
is not undergoing violent vibrations that it undergoes mounted on a mountain
bike, riding through nature.

BUT, at the same time, these units are DESIGNED to withstand the vibrations
on a bike. The old GPSMap 60C units including mine still work without a
hitch, after thousands of miles, but the new units keep braking down. The
Edge 305 is made for biking, many other electronic bike accessories like
cycling computers and heart rate and altitude monitors are all made in large
quantities, and they last, mounted on a bike, forever. Garmin 60Cx should
also. I also like to point out that I am a VERY conservative rider, I don't
jump, don't ride over rocks, stairs and such, and do not subject the unit to
all the beating it could sustain from a bicycle.

I would really appreciate if other people with similar problems would speak
up. I think we need to contact Garmin and help them see that this is not
just an odd problem but a flaw of some kind with at least the 60Cx units.

Thank you for your input and opinions!

Domagoj
 
Domagoj Malovic wrote:
> Hi!
>
> I was a proud owner of a very nice GPS Map 60C unit. I used it mainly on my
> mountain bike. The unit probably had more than 3000 miles of dirt road and
> trail riding mounted on the handlebars of my bike before I decided to sell
> it and buy a new and improved 60Cx unit.
>


OMG what is your point . . nice book on a pointless subject. Garmin will
figure out the problem when users like you repeatedly report the same
problem. Get them to give you another model and move on . . .


cc
 
Domagoj Malovic wrote:
> BUT, at the same time, these units are DESIGNED to withstand the vibrations
> on a bike. The old GPSMap 60C units including mine still work without a
> hitch, after thousands of miles, but the new units keep braking down.


They aren't *designed* to withstand vibrations on a bike or else they
would have have improved their battery compartment design by this time.
They're only designed to be mountable to a bike.

> I would really appreciate if other people with similar problems would speak
> up. I think we need to contact Garmin and help them see that this is not
> just an odd problem but a flaw of some kind with at least the 60Cx units.


I have an older Etrex Vista that exhibits similar vibration sensitivity
and will occasionally shutdown on small bumps. This is a natural
consequence of how the battery compartment is designed.

If you're using rechargrables I would recommend going back to
alkalines. The intermittent connections caused by vibration kills NiCd
and NIMH batteries very quickly. The higher internal resistance of
alkalines buffers them from the continual surges caused intermittent
contact. I experience unexpected shutdowns very infrequently with this
approach.
 
Domagoj Malovic wrote:
> Hi!
>
> I was a proud owner of a very nice GPS Map 60C unit. I used it mainly on my
> mountain bike. The unit probably had more than 3000 miles of dirt road and
> trail riding mounted on the handlebars of my bike before I decided to sell
> it and buy a new and improved 60Cx unit.
>


My 60CS isn't reliable on a bicycle or a motorcycle even on pavement due
to the crappy design of the battery compartment. The motorcycle groups
say if you wire it to the central supply, it'll work ok, but that's not
much help on bicycles.

I doubt I'll buy another Garmin.
 
This isn't just a problem with the 60Cx. My Vista C has done the same
thing. The first time I had a problem was the well known shutdown problem.
I replaced my Radio Shack rechargeables with Energizer rechargeables, which
fit much more snugly into the batter compartment. Everything was fine until
about 2 weeks ago. I was riding on a one track trail (nothing aggressive by
any means) and I got the pop-up message telling me the batteries were low.
I had just recharged them that morning and they usually last about 15 hours.
I shut the thing off and then back on and the problem went away. I havent'
contacted Garmin yet, but now I think I will since I'm obviously not the
only one having this problem.


"Domagoj Malovic" <[email protected]> wrote in
message news:[email protected]...
> Hi!
>
> I was a proud owner of a very nice GPS Map 60C unit. I used it mainly on
> my
> mountain bike. The unit probably had more than 3000 miles of dirt road and
> trail riding mounted on the handlebars of my bike before I decided to sell
> it and buy a new and improved 60Cx unit.
>
> What a mistake (or maybe not?). I used my first unit for just a few months
> and discovered that it was behaving strangely. Riding on a flat asphalt
> road, I would notice that the unit would report a full set of batteries
> empty, only to jump back to full four bars batt. reading seconds later. It
> was like the battery meter went crazy. As I rode more, the unit started
> powering down on its own, reporting abnormal shutdowns. It got so bad that
> it was enough to just squeeze the case on the sides and the screen would
> fade out :(.
>
> It was not the problem with the battery compartment. I tried both the NiMH
> and Alkaline cells, I tried making the cells bigger by wrapping electrical
> tape around them, stuffing the batt. compartment with foam and everything.
> After all, it was obvious that it was not the batt. contact problem
> because
> I could shut down the unit by simply gently squeezing it on the sides. You
> can see that on a small video I made, at
> http://www.dizmal.hr/garmin/60cx.avi. There are other people who describe
> exactly the same problems, like here: http://tinyurl.com/ke942.
>
> Garmin was nice to me, as we have all come to expect, and they replaced my
> unit with a brand new one. I started using it at the beginning of this
> month. It was on my bike for not more than 200 miles. On my ride a few
> days
> ago, I started noticing strange power meter readings again and I thought
> to
> myself - oh, no, this can't be happening to me again :(! I rode some more,
> not even on dirt roads, and all of a sudden my new unit powered down, less
> then a month after I got it :( Needles to mention, I was so disappointed
> that trying to repeat the shutdown problem I almost crashed really badly
> from my bike :)
>
> Now Garmin replaced me with the third unit, but now I am really anxious as
> far as how long the new one will last. I firmly believe from my experience
> and the experience of others that there is a hardware design flaw, or a
> manufacturing process flaw with the new units. Those of you who use the
> unit
> for hiking or driving are not very likely to experience it because the
> unit
> is not undergoing violent vibrations that it undergoes mounted on a
> mountain
> bike, riding through nature.
>
> BUT, at the same time, these units are DESIGNED to withstand the
> vibrations
> on a bike. The old GPSMap 60C units including mine still work without a
> hitch, after thousands of miles, but the new units keep braking down. The
> Edge 305 is made for biking, many other electronic bike accessories like
> cycling computers and heart rate and altitude monitors are all made in
> large
> quantities, and they last, mounted on a bike, forever. Garmin 60Cx should
> also. I also like to point out that I am a VERY conservative rider, I
> don't
> jump, don't ride over rocks, stairs and such, and do not subject the unit
> to
> all the beating it could sustain from a bicycle.
>
> I would really appreciate if other people with similar problems would
> speak
> up. I think we need to contact Garmin and help them see that this is not
> just an odd problem but a flaw of some kind with at least the 60Cx units.
>
> Thank you for your input and opinions!
>
> Domagoj
>
 
> contacted Garmin yet, but now I think I will since I'm obviously not the
> only one having this problem.
>

Oh, no you are NOT. I just don't understand why more people don't react to
messages like these. We need to get Garmin to fix those issues, or at least
come out and say we cannot use their devices on a bike. And believe me, it
is not the battery contacts either. Something breaks or somes unsoldered
inside. I am sick of replacing the unit once a month!!!!!!!

greetings,

Domi
 
Eric Williams wrote:
> This isn't just a problem with the 60Cx. My Vista C has done the same
> thing. The first time I had a problem was the well known shutdown problem.
> I replaced my Radio Shack rechargeables with Energizer rechargeables, which
> fit much more snugly into the batter compartment. Everything was fine until
> about 2 weeks ago. I was riding on a one track trail (nothing aggressive by
> any means) and I got the pop-up message telling me the batteries were low.
> I had just recharged them that morning and they usually last about 15 hours.
> I shut the thing off and then back on and the problem went away. I havent'
> contacted Garmin yet, but now I think I will since I'm obviously not the
> only one having this problem.


Is the voltage of the rechargeable batterys the same as non-rechargable
batterys?

Rechargeable are 1.2 volts and non-rechargable batterys are 1.5 volts,
so your voltage is down to start with.



Friday


>
>
> "Domagoj Malovic" <[email protected]> wrote in
> message news:[email protected]...
>
>>Hi!
>>
>>I was a proud owner of a very nice GPS Map 60C unit. I used it mainly on
>>my
>>mountain bike. The unit probably had more than 3000 miles of dirt road and
>>trail riding mounted on the handlebars of my bike before I decided to sell
>>it and buy a new and improved 60Cx unit.
>>
>>What a mistake (or maybe not?). I used my first unit for just a few months
>>and discovered that it was behaving strangely. Riding on a flat asphalt
>>road, I would notice that the unit would report a full set of batteries
>>empty, only to jump back to full four bars batt. reading seconds later. It
>>was like the battery meter went crazy. As I rode more, the unit started
>>powering down on its own, reporting abnormal shutdowns. It got so bad that
>>it was enough to just squeeze the case on the sides and the screen would
>>fade out :(.
>>
>>It was not the problem with the battery compartment. I tried both the NiMH
>>and Alkaline cells, I tried making the cells bigger by wrapping electrical
>>tape around them, stuffing the batt. compartment with foam and everything.
>>After all, it was obvious that it was not the batt. contact problem
>>because
>>I could shut down the unit by simply gently squeezing it on the sides. You
>>can see that on a small video I made, at
>>http://www.dizmal.hr/garmin/60cx.avi. There are other people who describe
>>exactly the same problems, like here: http://tinyurl.com/ke942.
>>
>>Garmin was nice to me, as we have all come to expect, and they replaced my
>>unit with a brand new one. I started using it at the beginning of this
>>month. It was on my bike for not more than 200 miles. On my ride a few
>>days
>>ago, I started noticing strange power meter readings again and I thought
>>to
>>myself - oh, no, this can't be happening to me again :(! I rode some more,
>>not even on dirt roads, and all of a sudden my new unit powered down, less
>>then a month after I got it :( Needles to mention, I was so disappointed
>>that trying to repeat the shutdown problem I almost crashed really badly
>>from my bike :)
>>
>>Now Garmin replaced me with the third unit, but now I am really anxious as
>>far as how long the new one will last. I firmly believe from my experience
>>and the experience of others that there is a hardware design flaw, or a
>>manufacturing process flaw with the new units. Those of you who use the
>>unit
>>for hiking or driving are not very likely to experience it because the
>>unit
>>is not undergoing violent vibrations that it undergoes mounted on a
>>mountain
>>bike, riding through nature.
>>
>>BUT, at the same time, these units are DESIGNED to withstand the
>>vibrations
>>on a bike. The old GPSMap 60C units including mine still work without a
>>hitch, after thousands of miles, but the new units keep braking down. The
>>Edge 305 is made for biking, many other electronic bike accessories like
>>cycling computers and heart rate and altitude monitors are all made in
>>large
>>quantities, and they last, mounted on a bike, forever. Garmin 60Cx should
>>also. I also like to point out that I am a VERY conservative rider, I
>>don't
>>jump, don't ride over rocks, stairs and such, and do not subject the unit
>>to
>>all the beating it could sustain from a bicycle.
>>
>>I would really appreciate if other people with similar problems would
>>speak
>>up. I think we need to contact Garmin and help them see that this is not
>>just an odd problem but a flaw of some kind with at least the 60Cx units.
>>
>>Thank you for your input and opinions!
>>
>>Domagoj
>>

>
>
>
 
I have noticed the exact same problem with my Garmin etrex Vista, although
the symptoms did not show up until after I switched the unit from my road
bike to my mountain bike and even then the symptoms were not coincident
exactly with the switch.

Now the problem pops up whether the unit is operated as handheld, on my road
bike or on my mountain bike.

I had assumed the problem was due to unit aging, but now I have my doubts.

kamal

"Friday" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Eric Williams wrote:
>> This isn't just a problem with the 60Cx. My Vista C has done the same
>> thing. The first time I had a problem was the well known shutdown
>> problem.
>> I replaced my Radio Shack rechargeables with Energizer rechargeables,
>> which
>> fit much more snugly into the batter compartment. Everything was fine
>> until
>> about 2 weeks ago. I was riding on a one track trail (nothing aggressive
>> by
>> any means) and I got the pop-up message telling me the batteries were
>> low.
>> I had just recharged them that morning and they usually last about 15
>> hours.
>> I shut the thing off and then back on and the problem went away. I
>> havent'
>> contacted Garmin yet, but now I think I will since I'm obviously not the
>> only one having this problem.

>
> Is the voltage of the rechargeable batterys the same as non-rechargable
> batterys?
>
> Rechargeable are 1.2 volts and non-rechargable batterys are 1.5 volts, so
> your voltage is down to start with.
>
>
>
> Friday
>
>
>>
>>
>> "Domagoj Malovic" <[email protected]> wrote in
>> message news:[email protected]...
>>
>>>Hi!
>>>
>>>I was a proud owner of a very nice GPS Map 60C unit. I used it mainly on
>>>my
>>>mountain bike. The unit probably had more than 3000 miles of dirt road
>>>and
>>>trail riding mounted on the handlebars of my bike before I decided to
>>>sell
>>>it and buy a new and improved 60Cx unit.
>>>
>>>What a mistake (or maybe not?). I used my first unit for just a few
>>>months
>>>and discovered that it was behaving strangely. Riding on a flat asphalt
>>>road, I would notice that the unit would report a full set of batteries
>>>empty, only to jump back to full four bars batt. reading seconds later.
>>>It
>>>was like the battery meter went crazy. As I rode more, the unit started
>>>powering down on its own, reporting abnormal shutdowns. It got so bad
>>>that
>>>it was enough to just squeeze the case on the sides and the screen would
>>>fade out :(.
>>>
>>>It was not the problem with the battery compartment. I tried both the
>>>NiMH
>>>and Alkaline cells, I tried making the cells bigger by wrapping
>>>electrical
>>>tape around them, stuffing the batt. compartment with foam and
>>>everything.
>>>After all, it was obvious that it was not the batt. contact problem
>>>because
>>>I could shut down the unit by simply gently squeezing it on the sides.
>>>You
>>>can see that on a small video I made, at
>>>http://www.dizmal.hr/garmin/60cx.avi. There are other people who describe
>>>exactly the same problems, like here: http://tinyurl.com/ke942.
>>>
>>>Garmin was nice to me, as we have all come to expect, and they replaced
>>>my
>>>unit with a brand new one. I started using it at the beginning of this
>>>month. It was on my bike for not more than 200 miles. On my ride a few
>>>days
>>>ago, I started noticing strange power meter readings again and I thought
>>>to
>>>myself - oh, no, this can't be happening to me again :(! I rode some
>>>more,
>>>not even on dirt roads, and all of a sudden my new unit powered down,
>>>less
>>>then a month after I got it :( Needles to mention, I was so disappointed
>>>that trying to repeat the shutdown problem I almost crashed really badly
>>>from my bike :)
>>>
>>>Now Garmin replaced me with the third unit, but now I am really anxious
>>>as
>>>far as how long the new one will last. I firmly believe from my
>>>experience
>>>and the experience of others that there is a hardware design flaw, or a
>>>manufacturing process flaw with the new units. Those of you who use the
>>>unit
>>>for hiking or driving are not very likely to experience it because the
>>>unit
>>>is not undergoing violent vibrations that it undergoes mounted on a
>>>mountain
>>>bike, riding through nature.
>>>
>>>BUT, at the same time, these units are DESIGNED to withstand the
>>>vibrations
>>>on a bike. The old GPSMap 60C units including mine still work without a
>>>hitch, after thousands of miles, but the new units keep braking down. The
>>>Edge 305 is made for biking, many other electronic bike accessories like
>>>cycling computers and heart rate and altitude monitors are all made in
>>>large
>>>quantities, and they last, mounted on a bike, forever. Garmin 60Cx should
>>>also. I also like to point out that I am a VERY conservative rider, I
>>>don't
>>>jump, don't ride over rocks, stairs and such, and do not subject the unit
>>>to
>>>all the beating it could sustain from a bicycle.
>>>
>>>I would really appreciate if other people with similar problems would
>>>speak
>>>up. I think we need to contact Garmin and help them see that this is not
>>>just an odd problem but a flaw of some kind with at least the 60Cx units.
>>>
>>>Thank you for your input and opinions!
>>>
>>>Domagoj
>>>

>>
>>
 
I installed my two-year old Vista C this year and have 300 km off-road
riding plus a similar amount of commuting, no problems so far. I am
using a RAM mount[1], which provides some shock absorbtion -- this may
be helping, or I just may be lucky.

Regards,
Anthony

[1] http://www.ram-mount.com/
 
"Anthony DeLorenzo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I installed my two-year old Vista C this year and have 300 km off-road
> riding plus a similar amount of commuting, no problems so far. I am
> using a RAM mount[1], which provides some shock absorbtion -- this may
> be helping, or I just may be lucky.
>


Wow, you're using that big ass mount on a bicycle? Off-road?

Greg
 
Anthony DeLorenzo wrote:
> G.T. wrote:
>
>>Wow, you're using that big ass mount on a bicycle? Off-road?

>
>
> Not sure which one you were looking at, mine isn't that big. RAM makes
> a specific set-up for just about every purpose. Here is a photo of my
> bike in action:
>
> http://www.geocaching.com/seek/log....93c2&IID=6ec0331b-ea07-498c-b7ba-a676b0b9cd52
>
> I have a 3 inch arm on mine, you can also go for a 1-inch arm if you
> wanted a smaller profile.
>


Yep, those are the ones. I'll pass and continue with my rubber mounted
Garmin handlebar mount in the hopes it will be fine. So far it has.

Greg

--
"All my time I spent in heaven
Revelries of dance and wine
Waking to the sound of laughter
Up I'd rise and kiss the sky" - The Mekons