getting caught on the downhill/flats



jD_Empath

New Member
Sep 3, 2007
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for those of us who are of the "smaller mass" variety and climb hills fast...

I have noticed since I started racing this year that I very rarely get passed going uphill on hilly time trials (I do pass people). I do get passed downhill though, and on the flats. Lots of riders are heavier than me.

In road races, the same thing tends to be true. I can create a rather large gap on a long climb, but if there is a long flat stretch after the downhill, it is more likely that I will get chased down.

Of course I am doing my best to increase my watts output so that I can hold them off as long as possible, but I am wondering if anyone has any technique suggestions regarding descending and flats using a regular road bike (not a TT bike). Most of the descents around here are not full of sharp corners so I almost never have to use the brakes. Basically, I am just trying to get as aero as possible in the drops, and pedaling as fast as I can if necessary on the downhills to add some speed. Drafting is not possible if you are in the lead!

Anyone have any suggestions for holding off the pack? (other than the obvious "increase your watts")
 
jD_Empath said:
Anyone have any suggestions for holding off the pack? (other than the obvious "increase your watts")
If you have the money, have a set of wheels laced on some DT/Swiss 240 hubs (formerly, Hugi 240) ...

In an unscientific test, my wife coasted away from me on a long descent ... her bike has Hugi 240 hubs & I had some Shimano hubs on the particular bike. No allowances for other factors (e.g., wind resistance) ... I checked this phenomena more than once.

I built the wheels in both/all cases, if it matters to the equation ... same tires, same rims.

Other hubs/wheels may provide a similar benefit.
 
jD_Empath said:
I do get passed downhill though, and on the flats. Lots of riders are heavier than me.
They pass you because of other factors than the weight. A tall rider has many many more watts than you, because of long muscles, and more "good levers" to improve its speed in plain + when pedalling on downhill. Just think that, in scientifica tests, 5 mm of difference from 170 mm to 175 mm chainset means more than 20 watts... at constant rpm and with a constant force to win. During a climb, the "long lever" effect is neutralised and the weight factor overcomes it; in plain and descent, the weight effect does not count anymore and the "long lever" effect wins. (note that also the wind effect is overcome on flatland by the "long lever" effect, a tall one gest much more wind than a small rider, but not enough to limit his pace).

There's no problem, you just need more *accurate* training on the zones in which you go bad...
 
jD_Empath said:
for those of us who are of the "smaller mass" variety and climb hills fast...

I have noticed since I started racing this year that I very rarely get passed going uphill on hilly time trials (I do pass people). I do get passed downhill though, and on the flats. Lots of riders are heavier than me.

In road races, the same thing tends to be true. I can create a rather large gap on a long climb, but if there is a long flat stretch after the downhill, it is more likely that I will get chased down.

Of course I am doing my best to increase my watts output so that I can hold them off as long as possible, but I am wondering if anyone has any technique suggestions regarding descending and flats using a regular road bike (not a TT bike). Most of the descents around here are not full of sharp corners so I almost never have to use the brakes. Basically, I am just trying to get as aero as possible in the drops, and pedaling as fast as I can if necessary on the downhills to add some speed. Drafting is not possible if you are in the lead!

Anyone have any suggestions for holding off the pack? (other than the obvious "increase your watts")
The following 'rant' is aimed more at the downhill part of things:

I'm assuming that your little legs are spinning around like "bees wings" on the downhills. If you're pedalling as fast as you can then you're not using a big enough gear. Other than that you're suffering from the "little people" syndrome - unaero position......

Case in point. The bike you see me riding in the avatar - I knocked 4 minutes off my previous best time in a very hilly 25 mile time trial, mainly because I changed the gearing - and this was including riding almost 3 miles on a flat back tire ( I did 1hr 3min). Most people laughed at the fact that I had 57x11 top gear - yet I didn't see too many people on their tri-bars at over 45mph on the descents. I was doing over 100rpm in places and I don't like to pedal fast as it is, let alone on the aero bars.

If you're riding a road bike then think of it this way - you're most efficient at a specific rpm - if you have a critical part of the course that requires a "spectacular effort" then you need to be near optimal efficiency. Just because you're going downhill doesnt mean that you NEED to pedal at 130rpm in 53x12 just because someone says you have too. YOU need to define what you need to do.

IF the only way you can keep 55mph on a descent is with 55x11, for example, and you have a good descent on the course that your race is on, then it doesn't take rocket science to figure out what you need - regardless of what 'the regular people' say.

You spend hundreds of hours training each year to go faster - spend at least 2 hours of testing to figure out what makes you faster downhill each year and you may get a victory or two that you've not had before.

Good luck!

However, on the flats you'll need to make a special effort to be more aerodynamic. On the flats it's more "power to drag" ratio. It's a hard task - but look at those who are 'small of stature' like Chris Boardman. You're smaller but you need to somehow get yourself in that tucked position that only larger riders seem to be able to get themselves into. Don't worry too much - you're in the same boat as Iban Mayo. :p