Giro 2008 Stage 16 - May 26: San Vigilio di Marebbe => Plan de Corones (ITT), 12.85km

[NJK]

i have to agree. AC has ridden brilliantly. he has conserved his energies and used them only when required. bruyneel and sean yates asked kloden and leipheimer to hold back in the early mountain stages to be ready to support alberto in the final week when he is wearing the coveted maglia rosa. the strategy has worked perfectly and the sweetest taste is that the italians have fallen into the contador/bruyneel trap. it reminds me of armstrongs winning blueprint from his seven successive victories in the tour de france. this one sweeter as astana only had one weeks preparation.

Only a weeks preparation. They probably did what most teams did in the last week before a tour, not alot. He was in decent shape prior to the Giro, winning small tours etc. Look at the GC other contenders they weren't exactly prolific in the spring races.

 

[musette]

It doesn't matter if if Astana has been deliberately saving his riders or undertaking other strategy. The bottom line is that Astana did not need to expend whatever energies their riders had, if others were willing to do the work in part for them. Why reject a gift if one has strategically capable enough to see the potential gift?

The virtual maglia rosa argument is even more attenuated. The fact there is another team had the maglia rosa, with a rider that nobody expected, even at the time he was wearing a maglia rosa, to be the GC winner in the end. Yet, to that team, every single day their rider is in pink is a glory, and is wonderful for that team's more limited objectives FOR THAT DAY (which do not necessarily including winning the GC with that particular wearer). So, why shouldn't the ACTUAL maglia rosa team be trying to control things so that they keep the maglia rosa another day, which that team (unlike Astana) may view as very valuable in and of itself (even if the relevant day is not the final day of the Giro)?

 

[thunder]

It doesn't matter if if Astana has been deliberately saving his riders or undertaking other strategy. The bottom line is that Astana did not need to expend whatever energies their riders had, if others were willing to do the work in part for them. Why reject a gift if one has strategically capable enough to see the potential gift?

The virtual maglia rosa argument is even more attenuated. The fact there is another team had the maglia rosa, with a rider that nobody expected, even at the time he was wearing a maglia rosa, to be the GC winner in the end. Yet, to that team, every single day their rider is in pink is a glory, and is wonderful for that team's more limited objectives FOR THAT DAY (which do not necessarily including winning the GC with that particular wearer). So, why shouldn't the ACTUAL maglia rosa team be trying to control things so that they keep the maglia rosa another day, which that team (unlike Astana) may view as very valuable in and of itself (even if the relevant day is not the final day of the Giro)?

everyone knows Astana get their refills on the rest day Musie

 

[TheDarkLord]

Only a weeks preparation. They probably did what most teams did in the last week before a tour, not alot. He was in decent shape prior to the Giro, winning small tours etc. Look at the GC other contenders they weren't exactly prolific in the spring races.

The "weeks preparation" is just a BS spin of JB to cover his ass. Micron posted that Sean Yates said that they knew for a month at least that they were going to the Giro (although he immediately backtracked) http://www.cyclingforums.com/showpost.php?p=3809192&postcount=4. What is really funny is how the cultists swallow all this BS, and then go around accusing others of doping.

 

[limerickman]

It doesn't matter if if Astana has been deliberately saving his riders or undertaking other strategy. The bottom line is that Astana did not need to expend whatever energies their riders had, if others were willing to do the work in part for them. Why reject a gift if one has strategically capable enough to see the potential gift?

The virtual maglia rosa argument is even more attenuated. The fact there is another team had the maglia rosa, with a rider that nobody expected, even at the time he was wearing a maglia rosa, to be the GC winner in the end. Yet, to that team, every single day their rider is in pink is a glory, and is wonderful for that team's more limited objectives FOR THAT DAY (which do not necessarily including winning the GC with that particular wearer). So, why shouldn't the ACTUAL maglia rosa team be trying to control things so that they keep the maglia rosa another day, which that team (unlike Astana) may view as very valuable in and of itself (even if the relevant day is not the final day of the Giro)?

..........................................................I think that's what can best be described as waffling.

 

[Bro Deal]

I'll make my one Giro post, since I have recently lost nearly all interest in pro cycling:

Yay Pellizotti. Too bad you'll only be a lacky to Basso next year. It's also just not the same with a helmet hiding a toker hairdo worthy of Jeff Spicoli

Go Simoni. It does not look like there is any reason not to come back next year.

 

[whiteboytrash]

I'll make my one Giro post, since I have recently lost nearly all interest in pro cycling:

Yay Pellizotti. Too bad you'll only be a lacky to Basso next year. It's also just not the same with a helmet hiding a toker hairdo worthy of Jeff Spicoli

Go Simoni. It does not look like there is any reason not to come back next year.

Why have you lost interest ? The doping or just that Contador is cheating his way to victory (again) ?

Yes "yay" for Pellizotti. Watching the mountain TT stage again this morning I have to say Pellizotti looked absolutely farked when he finished. He couldn't speak... even when they interviewed him some 6 or 7 minutes later he was still breathing hard.... again Contador looked like he could have taken a mobile call as he crossed the line. Didn't get to see Ricco after his finish.

However I not sure how Contador could have "prepared" for this Giro the way he wanted. ie getting the blood bags in etc. I think he maybe riding clean not because he wants to but it was his only choice..... hence all the statements about not having time to prepare etc etc.

 

[Bro Deal]

Why have you lost interest ? The doping or just that Contador is cheating his way to victory (again) ?

I basically lost faith that the sport will improve. It's a combination of seeing the ProTour ethical code get thrown out the window with the hiring of Basso, DiLuca getting off, Jaskche and Sinkewitz not being able to find a team, the RSA taking bribes to allow Astana in the Giro, continued screw ups by the UCI and McQuaid, etc.

The thought of watching a super doped up DiLuca battle with a super doped up Contador and a super doped up Ricco and a super doped up Pellizotti does not excite me in the least.

However I not sure how Contador could have "prepared" for this Giro the way he wanted. ie getting the blood bags in etc. I think he maybe riding clean not because he wants to but it was his only choice..... hence all the statements about not having time to prepare etc etc.

One of the Astana riders dropped that they knew they were going to the Giro two weeks in advance. The "negotiations" between the Kazakhs and the RSA must have taken some time before that, so they might have suspected they had a good chance of racing a month or more in advance. Frozen blood taken during the off-season could easily be used. Ricco already stated the obvious truth.

 

[whiteboytrash]

Yes fair call on all fronts. It was a promising start to the season with Paris-Nice. Things were looking good. But once the GT's roll around the blood bags come out of the fridge. Its a bit sad really. Its hard to know whats going on but what gets me is the total adoration for Contador by 99% of the media. Its beyond just liking the way he rides its like.... well its like Microsoft from the early 90's.... they knew the best marketing was not paid advertisements but news articles of their products written in a good light. Therefore a lot of journalists were paid to write nice things or more to the point the articles were written for them because journalist are generally lazy........

I basically lost faith that the sport will improve. It's a combination of seeing the ProTour ethical code get thrown out the window with the hiring of Basso, DiLuca getting off, Jaskche and Sinkewitz not being able to find a team, the RSA taking bribes to allow Astana in the Giro, continued screw ups by the UCI and McQuaid, etc.

The thought of watching a super doped up DiLuca battle with a super doped up Contador and a super doped up Ricco and a super doped up Pellizotti does not excite me in the least.


One of the Astana riders dropped that they knew they were going to the Giro two weeks in advance. The "negotiations" between the Kazakhs and the RSA must have taken some time before that, so they might have suspected they had a good chance of racing a month or more in advance. Frozen blood taken during the off-season could easily be used. Ricco already stated the obvious truth.

 

[earth_dweller]

Yes fair call on all fronts. It was a promising start to the season with Paris-Nice. Things were looking good. But once the GT's roll around the blood bags come out of the fridge. Its a bit sad really. Its hard to know whats going on but what gets me is the total adoration for Contador by 99% of the media. Its beyond just liking the way he rides its like.... well its like Microsoft from the early 90's.... they knew the best marketing was not paid advertisements but news articles of their products written in a good light. Therefore a lot of journalists were paid to write nice things or more to the point the articles were written for them because journalist are generally lazy........

Yeah, I also find interesting the nonstop positive coverage that both cyclingnews & velonews give to Astana and especially Contador. I've always wondered if they have a hidden business relationship between the organizations. They give more coverage to non-American Astana than to American and (supposedly) clean Slipstream and High Road. Shows you that fans and mainstream cycling media only care about who is winning and not if they are clean.

 

[earth_dweller]

'The Tuesday Comment' in Cycling Weekly sums up what a lot are feeling...

Now Alberto Contador, Riccardo Ricco and Gilberto Simoni may be poised to strike at the weekend. We could be treated to an all-out battle on the Gavia and it may be edge-of-the-seat stuff.

But what is it we're watching here? Is this Giro credible or incredible?

There are question marks over the leading three.

 

[whiteboytrash]

'The Tuesday Comment' in Cycling Weekly sums up what a lot are feeling...

Good article. I liked this comment although I don't believe it..... “They're climbing faster in Portuguese races than the do in the Tour de France now.”

 

[Klodifan]

i have to agree. AC has ridden brilliantly. he has conserved his energies and used them only when required. bruyneel and sean yates asked kloden and leipheimer to hold back in the early mountain stages to be ready to support alberto in the final week when he is wearing the coveted maglia rosa. the strategy has worked perfectly and the sweetest taste is that the italians have fallen into the contador/bruyneel trap. it reminds me of armstrongs winning blueprint from his seven successive victories in the tour de france. this one sweeter as astana only had one weeks preparation.

I doubt Klodi was holding back. He simply isn't riding well

 

[thoughtforfood]

Yeah, I also find interesting the nonstop positive coverage that both cyclingnews & velonews give to Astana and especially Contador. I've always wondered if they have a hidden business relationship between the organizations. They give more coverage to non-American Astana than to American and (supposedly) clean Slipstream and High Road. Shows you that fans and mainstream cycling media only care about who is winning and not if they are clean.

Well, they advertise LA's new secret "never be tired again" snake oil, and The Hog's book to go along with their suckie suckie of all things Contadope. I am watching, and while there hasn't been a single person destroying the field, the question marks are hanging in the air almost visibly. The observation about Contadope is spot on also...it is not beyond considering that he really is doing just enough to win, but not enough to show just how "special" he is.

 

[padawan]

I basically lost faith that the sport will improve. It's a combination of seeing the ProTour ethical code get thrown out the window with the hiring of Basso, DiLuca getting off, Jaskche and Sinkewitz not being able to find a team, the RSA taking bribes to allow Astana in the Giro, continued screw ups by the UCI and McQuaid, etc.

The thought of watching a super doped up DiLuca battle with a super doped up Contador and a super doped up Ricco and a super doped up Pellizotti does not excite me in the least.


One of the Astana riders dropped that they knew they were going to the Giro two weeks in advance. The "negotiations" between the Kazakhs and the RSA must have taken some time before that, so they might have suspected they had a good chance of racing a month or more in advance. Frozen blood taken during the off-season could easily be used. Ricco already stated the obvious truth.

Amen.

 

[poulidor]

Contadope, and other riders with less power than precedent years!

Only 410-420 normalised Watt!
Where are the "Champions" of the recent past who were able to produce easily 450Watt.

Sella développe 415 watts à Corones

Sur le Tour d’Italie, Emanuele Sella (CSF Navigare) vient de réaliser une traversée des Dolomites assez phénoménale. Après ses 405 watts à Pampeago puis ses 390 watts au Fedaia après de longues échappées, le coureur de CSF a montré aussi ses capacités de récupération avec 415 watts sur la première partie de la montée du contre la montre du Plan de Corones jusqu'au Passo Furcia.
Franco Pellizotti (Liquigas) a été le plus rapide sur la fin de cette ascension avec une vitesse moyenne de 16,3 km/h sur la piste à 10% de moyenne. Nous n'avons pas évalué la puissance sur ce tronçon, en raison de la perte d'adhérence possible de la roue arrière et manque de connaissance sur le coefficient de frottement sur ce type de route.
Les meilleurs coureurs du Giro (Contador, Riccò, Simoni) ont développé des puissances comprises entre 410 et 420 watts pour les montées étudiées (Pampeago, Fedaia et Corones). Ils conservent un niveau très élevé en deçà tout de même de ce que nous ont montré ces dernières années Armstrong ou Basso.