GPS Contour maps for UK

Discussion in 'General Fitness' started by GSV Three Minds in a Can, Feb 8, 2005.

  1. These are now available (and the price is right too). Rob apparently
    didn't post his announcement in 'walking', so I assume it only came out
    in 'climbing', but anyway you should be able to find the maps at:

    http://www.smc.org.uk/books/books_contour_maps.htm

    In summary, they were created from space shuttle data using public
    domain data and software, as discussed here. In addition to contours,
    there are also UK outline (coastline), trig points and summits UK and
    Ireland) and some place names.

    --
    GSV Three Minds in a Can
    Outgoing Msgs are Turing Tested,and indistinguishable from human typing.
     
    Tags:


  2. Nigel Cliffe

    Nigel Cliffe Guest

    GSV Three Minds in a Can wrote:
    > These are now available (and the price is right too). Rob apparently
    > didn't post his announcement in 'walking', so I assume it only came
    > out in 'climbing', but anyway you should be able to find the maps at:
    >
    > http://www.smc.org.uk/books/books_contour_maps.htm
    >
    >


    You swine :) I'll have to buy a mapping GPS unit !




    --
    NC - Webmaster for http://www.2mm.org.uk/
    Replies to newsgroup postings to the newsgroup please.
     
  3. Bitstring <[email protected]>, from the wonderful person
    Nigel Cliffe <[email protected]> said
    >GSV Three Minds in a Can wrote:
    >> These are now available (and the price is right too). Rob apparently
    >> didn't post his announcement in 'walking', so I assume it only came
    >> out in 'climbing', but anyway you should be able to find the maps at:
    >>
    >> http://www.smc.org.uk/books/books_contour_maps.htm
    >>
    >>

    >
    >You swine :) I'll have to buy a mapping GPS unit !


    If you don't have one already I'm not sure this is a 'must have' ..
    they're only contours (and summits and trig points and coastline).
    However, once you learn how to turn your own tracks into maps ....

    --
    GSV Three Minds in a Can
    SC recommends the use of Firefox; Get smart, or get assimilated.
     
  4. Alan Bremner

    Alan Bremner Guest

    On Wed, 9 Feb 2005 20:44:50 -0000, "Nigel Cliffe" <[email protected]>
    wrote:

    >You swine :) I'll have to buy a mapping GPS unit !


    If you do, make sure it's got plenty of memory for uploaded maps. My
    8Mb Legend will only hold 3 or 4 of the Scottish contour maps, so I'll
    have to load maps selectively depending on where I'm going. That's a
    small price to pay for the convenience of useful map data though.

    --
    Al

    [This space intentionally left blank]
     
  5. Bitstring <[email protected]>, from the
    wonderful person Alan Bremner <[email protected]> said
    >On Wed, 9 Feb 2005 20:44:50 -0000, "Nigel Cliffe" <[email protected]>
    >wrote:
    >
    >>You swine :) I'll have to buy a mapping GPS unit !

    >
    >If you do, make sure it's got plenty of memory for uploaded maps. My
    >8Mb Legend will only hold 3 or 4 of the Scottish contour maps, so I'll
    >have to load maps selectively depending on where I'm going. That's a
    >small price to pay for the convenience of useful map data though.


    Feedback appreciated. It would be possible to compile the maps slightly
    smaller, but the redraw speed on the handset increases (I already pushed
    that envelope a bit on the two or three biggest maps - otherwise your
    8MB would have held only 1.5 of them!).

    Or we could leave out some of the contours (map size directly relates to
    how many contours there are, and how much they've been simplified). 10m
    may be overkill for really hilly terrain (although a 50m interval looks
    really stupid in places like SE England, where they then only have one
    contour for all of East Anglia. 8>.)

    If you have unique requirements, and limited memory space, you could
    load them into gpsmapedit, trim the areas you don't want (or draw a box
    round the area you do want and 'trim outside') and recompile .. I
    actually did that for my South Shropshire contour map, since it spanned
    more than one SRTM 'tile', and I couldn't be doing with loading several
    maps (all too big) to get the area I actually wanted.

    It's also fairly easy (once you have them back in .mp mapedit format) to
    write a simple program to go delete all the 20m (or whatever) contours
    and leave the rest (you can do it from an Excel VBA program).

    However memory is now free (unless you buy it from Garmin, when it costs
    more than it should) .. a 76C or CS would let you load the whole set I
    believe .. Ireland too! You know you deserve one ....

    --
    GSV Three Minds in a Can
    SC recommends the use of Firefox; Get smart, or get assimilated.
     
  6. Alan Bremner

    Alan Bremner Guest

    On Thu, 10 Feb 2005 01:02:38 +0000, GSV Three Minds in a Can
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    >Bitstring <[email protected]>, from the
    >wonderful person Alan Bremner <[email protected]> said


    >> My 8Mb Legend will only hold 3 or 4 of the Scottish contour maps, so I'll
    >>have to load maps selectively depending on where I'm going. That's a
    >>small price to pay for the convenience of useful map data though.


    >Feedback appreciated. It would be possible to compile the maps slightly
    >smaller, but the redraw speed on the handset increases


    I think you've found a good compromise. The Legend is showing its age
    these days with its limited capacity, and function should always take
    precedence over form. :)

    >Or we could leave out some of the contours (map size directly relates to
    >how many contours there are, and how much they've been simplified). 10m
    >may be overkill for really hilly terrain


    I'm quite happy with the 10m intervals, as they give a better overview
    of the terrain underfoot. My GPS is carried mainly as an emergency
    backup for poor conditions, and in these circumstances having detailed
    contour information will be a definite advantage.

    >If you have unique requirements, and limited memory space, you could
    >load them into gpsmapedit, trim the areas you don't want (or draw a box
    >round the area you do want and 'trim outside') and recompile ..


    That's certainly something I'll look at. I'm planning a summer trek
    across the Monadh Ruadh and it would be useful to take a custom
    contour map covering only the area required.

    >a 76C or CS would let you load the whole set I
    >believe .. Ireland too! You know you deserve one ....


    Nonono... stop it! :))
    --
    Al

    [This space intentionally left blank]
     
  7. Nigel Cliffe

    Nigel Cliffe Guest

    GSV Three Minds in a Can wrote:
    > Bitstring <[email protected]>, from the wonderful person
    > Nigel Cliffe <[email protected]> said
    >> GSV Three Minds in a Can wrote:
    >>> These are now available (and the price is right too). Rob apparently
    >>> didn't post his announcement in 'walking', so I assume it only came
    >>> out in 'climbing', but anyway you should be able to find the maps
    >>> at: http://www.smc.org.uk/books/books_contour_maps.htm
    >>>
    >>>

    >>
    >> You swine :) I'll have to buy a mapping GPS unit !


    Much more seriously, having downloaded some of the data on the SMC site and
    played with GPSmapedit, I'm seriously impressed with the results.

    > If you don't have one already I'm not sure this is a 'must have' ..
    > they're only contours (and summits and trig points and coastline).
    > However, once you learn how to turn your own tracks into maps ....



    I understand what you mean. However, at the entry level there isn't a big
    jump in price from the Venture to the Legend. I'd originally planned on a
    Venture for only POI data (trig points, summits, etc). However, the Legend
    can give me contours as well for about £20 extra. Much as the colour
    screens, larger memory, and (more importantly) the improved battery life of
    newer models is impressive, I find it hard to justify doubling or trebling
    the price at this stage.

    I've noted the stuff elsewhere in the thread about memory capacity limits,
    etc of the Legend.


    - Nigel

    --
    NC - Webmaster for http://www.2mm.org.uk/
    Replies to newsgroup postings to the newsgroup please.
     
  8. Bitstring <[email protected]>, from the wonderful person
    Nigel Cliffe <[email protected]> said
    <snip>
    >I understand what you mean. However, at the entry level there isn't a big
    >jump in price from the Venture to the Legend. I'd originally planned on a
    >Venture for only POI data (trig points, summits, etc). However, the Legend
    >can give me contours as well for about £20 extra.


    Yep, if you are buying one anyway then the mapping version is probably
    worth the extra. if you already have a Venture then dumping it and
    upgrading is hard to justify (although I did just that, with a 6 month
    old model). Of course, I've got the time to sit and code maps for the
    thing..

    --
    GSV Three Minds in a Can
    SC recommends the use of Firefox; Get smart, or get assimilated.
     
  9. Jeff C

    Jeff C Guest

    On Thu, 10 Feb 2005 19:49:14 +0000, GSV Three Minds in a Can wrote:
    > Bitstring <[email protected]>, from the wonderful
    > person Nigel Cliffe <[email protected]> said <snip>
    >
    >> I understand what you mean. However, at the entry level there
    >> isn't a big jump in price from the Venture to the Legend. I'd
    >> originally planned on a Venture for only POI data (trig points,
    >> summits, etc). However, the Legend can give me contours as well
    >> for about £20 extra.
    >>

    >
    > Yep, if you are buying one anyway then the mapping version is
    > probably worth the extra. if you already have a Venture then
    > dumping it and upgrading is hard to justify (although I did just
    > that, with a 6 month old model). Of course, I've got the time to
    > sit and code maps for the thing..


    I was happy with my late twentieth century Garmin 38 until it slipped
    out of my pocket and onto a concrete floor, from which it never
    recovered :..-(

    Its replacement is a Venture and I absolutely hate it! The screen
    contrast is diabolical ranging from mud to "as clear as mud" and
    though you can change some of the text to a larger size, some of the
    text is not configurable. I can't wait to be rid of it to be truthful!



    Regards Jeff.

    www.astrecks.co.uk

    If it works..............DON'T fix it
    No Virus Checker? try this free one from AVG it is very good:-
    http://www.grisoft.com/us/us_dwnl_free.php
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  10. Bitstring <[email protected]>, from the wonderful person Jeff C
    <[email protected]> said
    >
    >
    >On Thu, 10 Feb 2005 19:49:14 +0000, GSV Three Minds in a Can wrote:
    >> Bitstring <[email protected]>, from the wonderful
    >> person Nigel Cliffe <[email protected]> said <snip>
    >>
    >>> I understand what you mean. However, at the entry level there
    >>> isn't a big jump in price from the Venture to the Legend. I'd
    >>> originally planned on a Venture for only POI data (trig points,
    >>> summits, etc). However, the Legend can give me contours as well
    >>> for about £20 extra.
    >>>

    >>
    >> Yep, if you are buying one anyway then the mapping version is
    >> probably worth the extra. if you already have a Venture then
    >> dumping it and upgrading is hard to justify (although I did just
    >> that, with a 6 month old model). Of course, I've got the time to
    >> sit and code maps for the thing..

    >
    >I was happy with my late twentieth century Garmin 38 until it slipped
    >out of my pocket and onto a concrete floor, from which it never
    >recovered :..-(
    >
    >Its replacement is a Venture and I absolutely hate it! The screen
    >contrast is diabolical ranging from mud to "as clear as mud" and
    >though you can change some of the text to a larger size, some of the
    >text is not configurable. I can't wait to be rid of it to be truthful!


    ? Sounds like your Venture may be broken - I assume you found out how to
    change the contrast ratio?? Mine was fine (a bit washed-out when in the
    carry case, but just fine out in the open). I'd still have it if I
    hadn't gotten into mapping ..

    --
    GSV Three Minds in a Can
    SC recommends the use of Firefox; Get smart, or get assimilated.
     
  11. Jeff C

    Jeff C Guest

    On Thu, 10 Feb 2005 20:58:35 +0000, GSV Three Minds in a Can wrote:
    > Bitstring <[email protected]>, from the wonderful person
    > Jeff C <[email protected]> said

    <snip>
    >> I was happy with my late twentieth century Garmin 38 until it
    >> slipped out of my pocket and onto a concrete floor, from which it
    >> never recovered :..-(
    >>
    >> Its replacement is a Venture and I absolutely hate it! The screen
    >> contrast is diabolical ranging from mud to "as clear as mud" and
    >> though you can change some of the text to a larger size, some of
    >> the text is not configurable. I can't wait to be rid of it to be
    >> truthful!
    >>

    >
    > ? Sounds like your Venture may be broken - I assume you found out
    > how to change the contrast ratio?? Mine was fine (a bit washed-out
    > when in the carry case, but just fine out in the open). I'd still
    > have it if I hadn't gotten into mapping ..


    No its working as it should be, at 48 going on 49 it is my eyes that
    are broken. The old GPS 38 had graphics like an old Sinclair Spectrum
    which suited my eyes fine, I could use it without specs with no
    problems.

    I had similar problems with my LCD mobile phone, but now I have a TFT
    colour screen phone it's much easier to see, so I am hoping that
    upgrading to a VistaC will be better for me.



    Regards Jeff.

    www.astrecks.co.uk

    If it works..............DON'T fix it
    No Virus Checker? try this free one from AVG it is very good:-
    http://www.grisoft.com/us/us_dwnl_free.php
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    http://www.spamjab.com/
     
  12. Alan Bremner

    Alan Bremner Guest

    On Thu, 10 Feb 2005 18:01:30 -0000, "Nigel Cliffe" <[email protected]>
    wrote:

    >I've noted the stuff elsewhere in the thread about memory capacity limits,
    >etc of the Legend.


    Just to clarify, I was referring to the original (greyscale) Legend.
    The new Legend C has an increased capacity of 24MB compared tor the
    old model's 8MB.
    --
    Al

    [This space intentionally left blank]
     
  13. Geoff Berrow

    Geoff Berrow Guest

    I noticed that Message-ID: <[email protected]>
    from Alan Bremner contained the following:

    >The new Legend C has an increased capacity of 24MB compared tor the
    >old model's 8MB.


    Wow. They really are lagging behind when you can get pen drives
    containing 128 MB for less than a tenner.

    --
    Geoff Berrow (put thecat out to email)
    It's only Usenet, no one dies.
    My opinions, not the committee's, mine.
    Simple RFDs http://www.ckdog.co.uk/rfdmaker/
     
  14. Geoff Berrow <[email protected]> wrote:

    >>The new Legend C has an increased capacity of 24MB compared tor the
    >>old model's 8MB.

    >
    > Wow. They really are lagging behind when you can get pen drives
    > containing 128 MB for less than a tenner.
    >


    Garmin don't seem to understand that memory is cheap, and gets
    cheaper all the time. Their new 60CS looked brilliant until I
    realised they hadn't allowed for memory expansion.

    The forthcoming Magellan 500 takes SD card memory and has USB
    download. And the UK topo maps, while not perfect, are already
    available - not vaporware.

    -adrian
     
  15. GSV Three Minds in a Can wrote:
    > These are now available (and the price is right too). Rob apparently
    > didn't post his announcement in 'walking', so I assume it only came

    out
    > in 'climbing', but anyway you should be able to find the maps at:
    >
    > http://www.smc.org.uk/books/books_contour_maps.htm
    >
    > In summary, they were created from space shuttle data using public
    > domain data and software, as discussed here. In addition to contours,


    > there are also UK outline (coastline), trig points and summits UK and


    > Ireland) and some place names.
    >
    > --
    > GSV Three Minds in a Can
    > Outgoing Msgs are Turing Tested,and indistinguishable from human

    typing.

    I've just spent four hours loading 5 maps plus the summits map into my
    Vista. That covers all the north east of Scotland plus Mid and West
    Lothian. Pretty amazing. I wonder if there will be a drain on battery
    life now, and perhaps I'll have to turn down the detail for the times
    when I don't need the contour data, but just having it is fantastic. I
    never shelled out for MapSource so until now the 24Mb on the Vista has
    been going to waste.

    Great stuff. I'm very impressed with it. I just wish the upload times
    were quicker. One thing I've noticed using the tools recommended on
    the SMC site is that if an upload of a map fails (say your batteries
    run out mid transfer), you seem to lose all the map data you've already
    uploaded. I make sure I have fully charged batteries when I loading
    the data now. Which begs another question, does the USB cable for
    RS232 GPS units provide power as well as data, and is there any speed
    increase in transfers?
     
  16. [email protected] wrote:

    > Great stuff. I'm very impressed with it. I just wish the upload times
    > were quicker. One thing I've noticed using the tools recommended on
    > the SMC site is that if an upload of a map fails (say your batteries
    > run out mid transfer), you seem to lose all the map data you've already
    > uploaded. I make sure I have fully charged batteries when I loading
    > the data now. Which begs another question, does the USB cable for
    > RS232 GPS units provide power as well as data, and is there any speed
    > increase in transfers?


    If you use a standard USB-serial adaptor it won't provide power, but
    this USB to eTrex cable will:
    http://www.gps4less.co.uk/usbcables.htm

    But it still won't make data transfer any quicker - if you want a faster
    connection you'll have to upgrade to a Vista C.
    --
    Craig Wallace
    http://craig.neogeo.org.uk
    http://www.neogeo.org.uk
     
  17. Bitstring <[email protected]>, from
    the wonderful person [email protected] said
    <snip>
    >I've just spent four hours loading 5 maps plus the summits map into my
    >Vista. That covers all the north east of Scotland plus Mid and West
    >Lothian. Pretty amazing. I wonder if there will be a drain on battery
    >life now, and perhaps I'll have to turn down the detail for the times
    >when I don't need the contour data, but just having it is fantastic. I
    >never shelled out for MapSource so until now the 24Mb on the Vista has
    >been going to waste.


    The increase in battery drain should be undetectable .. the unit uses
    the same power whether the 24MB is full of maps or zeros. And I doubt
    the redraw is affected either.

    >Great stuff. I'm very impressed with it. I just wish the upload times
    >were quicker. One thing I've noticed using the tools recommended on
    >the SMC site is that if an upload of a map fails (say your batteries
    >run out mid transfer), you seem to lose all the map data you've already
    >uploaded. I make sure I have fully charged batteries when I loading
    >the data now. Which begs another question, does the USB cable for
    >RS232 GPS units provide power as well as data, and is there any speed
    >increase in transfers?


    I think it depends on the USB cable you buy whether it also supplies
    power, but no it won't help with speed, the limit is how fast the serial
    port on the handset can accept bits. If you want 'faster' you need a
    handset with native USB support like a C-model eTrex of a 60/76C or CS.

    I'm not sure why a failed Xfer would leave you with no maps, but I can
    believe it. Step one of the map loading (whetehr you use mapsource of
    sendmap) is to blow away all previous maps, step two is to load the new
    maps as a 'lump'. If you only get half the lump delivered I can see the
    handset would quite probably flush the lot.

    --
    GSV Three Minds in a Can
    SC recommends the use of Firefox; Get smart, or get assimilated.
     
  18. Tim Jackson

    Tim Jackson Guest

    GSV Three Minds in a Can wrote on Tue, 8 Feb 2005 22:41:44 +0000....
    > These are now available (and the price is right too). Rob apparently
    > didn't post his announcement in 'walking', so I assume it only came out
    > in 'climbing', but anyway you should be able to find the maps at:
    >
    > http://www.smc.org.uk/books/books_contour_maps.htm
    >
    > In summary, they were created from space shuttle data using public
    > domain data and software, as discussed here. In addition to contours,
    > there are also UK outline (coastline), trig points and summits UK and
    > Ireland) and some place names.


    I've just spent a few happy hours downloading some of these maps.
    They look great; can't wait to take them on a walk. Many thanks, Dave
    - this must have taken a lot of work.

    A couple of minor feedback points (which don't really detract from the
    overall impression of a very useful product):

    I found that my Win98SE system refused to play with the contours.reg
    file. I tried changing the header in the file to REGEDIT4 (the
    version I have) but that didn't work. So I had to hack the registry
    manually.

    Looking at it again afterwards, I suspect that possibly it's in
    Unicode format and that Win 98 may be barfing at that, expecting a
    plain ASCII text file?

    Also, my copy of MapSource initially installed itself to C:\Garmin\ by
    default. I've now reinstalled it to C:\Program files\Garmin\ since
    that seems more sensible. But had I not done so a registry hack would
    have been necessary anyway, even if contours.reg had worked.

    The other point I've noticed is that the coastline file seems to have
    moved Derwentwater (one of the few inland lakes included). It's
    shifted to the west, suggesting that you'd get wet feet up Catbells.

    But hey, I'm not complaining. This is a great freebie.

    --
    Tim Jackson
    [email protected]lid
    (Change '.invalid' to '.co.uk' to reply direct)
    Absurd patents: visit http://www.patent.freeserve.co.uk
     
  19. Bitstring <[email protected]>, from the
    wonderful person Tim Jackson <[email protected]> said
    >GSV Three Minds in a Can wrote on Tue, 8 Feb 2005 22:41:44 +0000....
    >> These are now available (and the price is right too). Rob apparently
    >> didn't post his announcement in 'walking', so I assume it only came out
    >> in 'climbing', but anyway you should be able to find the maps at:
    >>
    >> http://www.smc.org.uk/books/books_contour_maps.htm
    >>
    >> In summary, they were created from space shuttle data using public
    >> domain data and software, as discussed here. In addition to contours,
    >> there are also UK outline (coastline), trig points and summits UK and
    >> Ireland) and some place names.

    >
    >I've just spent a few happy hours downloading some of these maps.
    >They look great; can't wait to take them on a walk. Many thanks, Dave
    >- this must have taken a lot of work.


    Couple of weeks actually, including finding all the pieces. Takes about
    24 hours now to clean up (interpolate) the SRTM data with Blackart, make
    contour files (Thanks to Brad for fixing Dem2Topo - used to take 24
    hours per map!) combine them as appropriate, and compile them to .img
    files. Spent most time chasing Gaelic spelling errors (on the Summits),
    disagreements about where the summits actually are, typos in OS trig
    positions, which put at least one trig pillar in the ocean, and
    wondering why a couple of trig points are 100m below ground level (turns
    out that in once case they really are - there is a China clay mine and
    spoil tip adjacent).

    >A couple of minor feedback points (which don't really detract from the
    >overall impression of a very useful product):
    >
    >I found that my Win98SE system refused to play with the contours.reg
    >file. I tried changing the header in the file to REGEDIT4 (the
    >version I have) but that didn't work. So I had to hack the registry
    >manually.
    >
    >Looking at it again afterwards, I suspect that possibly it's in
    >Unicode format and that Win 98 may be barfing at that, expecting a
    >plain ASCII text file?


    Good point - yes, the .reg file will likely only work under Win2k or
    WinXP, probably not even WinME. I don't have any antique systems around
    to test it on anymore. I guess a note on the website would probably be a
    good plan.

    >Also, my copy of MapSource initially installed itself to C:\Garmin\ by
    >default. I've now reinstalled it to C:\Program files\Garmin\ since
    >that seems more sensible. But had I not done so a registry hack would
    >have been necessary anyway, even if contours.reg had worked.


    That also probably comes with Win9x? ISTR that my WinXP install made a
    beeline for c:\program files\garmin.

    >The other point I've noticed is that the coastline file seems to have
    >moved Derwentwater (one of the few inland lakes included). It's
    >shifted to the west, suggesting that you'd get wet feet up Catbells.


    Possibly. I notice that most of the coastline data seems slightly
    shifted to the west. I do have a much more detailed coastline dataset
    but it is 3x bigger, and since the coastline is really only there as a
    'throw away' marker for the contour tiles, I didn't use the detailed
    one. Heaven help anyone who tries to sail round the UK by loading the
    coastline data from that mapset! If you want the detailed one, let me
    know and I'll arrange for it to get to you somehow .. however the 'more
    detailed' one has absolutely no inland lakes at all.

    >But hey, I'm not complaining. This is a great freebie.


    Glad you like it. Thanks to the SMC folks for hosting the files (and
    doing the upload - no broadband here so I'd still be waiting).

    --
    GSV Three Minds in a Can
    SC recommends the use of Firefox; Get smart, or get assimilated.
     
  20. Idris

    Idris Guest

    "Adrian Godwin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > Geoff Berrow <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > >>The new Legend C has an increased capacity of 24MB compared tor the
    > >>old model's 8MB.

    > >
    > > Wow. They really are lagging behind when you can get pen drives
    > > containing 128 MB for less than a tenner.
    > >

    >
    > Garmin don't seem to understand that memory is cheap, and gets
    > cheaper all the time. Their new 60CS looked brilliant until I
    > realised they hadn't allowed for memory expansion.
    >
    > The forthcoming Magellan 500 takes SD card memory and has USB
    > download. And the UK topo maps, while not perfect, are already
    > available - not vaporware.
    >
    > -adrian


    UK topo maps for a magellan, can you tell me where please?

    Gerald
     
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