Having a VO2 Max test on Tuesday looking for suggestions..

[azdroptop]

Hi guru's,

I'm having the test on Tuesdy and looking for any suggestions on info I should get from the test beyong the obvious stuff. An overview from the tester said they will record the following:

Anaerobic Threshold (AT, or point where body begins to rely significantly
on anaerobic energy systems to supply energy), Ventilatory Threshold (VT,
synonymous w/ Lactate Threshold, but measured using O2 intake and CO2
output)

Any ideas would be great!
Rick

 

[beerco]

Hi guru's,


Any ideas would be great!
Rick

Make sure they give you the results in watts, not HR, HR is useless. (I actually think VO2 max tests are pretty useless too, but that's not what you aksed.)

 

[azdroptop]

Make sure they give you the results in watts, not HR, HR is useless. (I actually think VO2 max tests are pretty useless too, but that's not what you aksed.)

Why useless? When I got my degree in Ex phys 15 years ago they were really in.

 

[beerco]

Why useless? When I got my degree in Ex phys 15 years ago they were really in.

They may be interesting, but I just don't see how they're "usefull". i.e. once you know your VO2max, VT AT etc. etc, how is it going to change your life? How will it affect your training? What changes will you make to your training the day after your test that you couldn't have made before the test?

I'd say a MLSS test would be more useful, but even that's really unecessary now that we have cheap powermeters.

 

[azdroptop]

They may be interesting, but I just don't see how they're "usefull". i.e. once you know your VO2max, VT AT etc. etc, how is it going to change your life? How will it affect your training? What changes will you make to your training the day after your test that you couldn't have made before the test?

I'd say a MLSS test would be more useful, but even that's really unecessary now that we have cheap powermeters.

For me I was really interested in getting a 'true' max HR. I guess I was hoping it would help me figure out my "ideal" TT HR as well. I don't have a power meter so I base workouts on HR for the most part.

 

[beerco]

For me I was really interested in getting a 'true' max HR. I guess I was hoping it would help me figure out my "ideal" TT HR as well. I don't have a power meter so I base workouts on HR for the most part.

Save the money from the VO2 max test, buy one and learn to use it. You'll be much better off. Used Powertaps can be had for less than $500.

 

[azdroptop]

Save the money from the VO2 max test, buy one and learn to use it. You'll be much better off. Used Powertaps can be had for less than $500.

Well I appreciate the advise, but I'm going through with the test anyway. I'll have to keep my eyes open for a cycle opps power meter, but to date I've not seen any for that cheap! Thanks again for the comments.

Rick

 

[artemidorus]

For me I was really interested in getting a 'true' max HR. I guess I was hoping it would help me figure out my "ideal" TT HR as well. I don't have a power meter so I base workouts on HR for the most part.

It's pretty cheap to get a true cycling HRmax - all you need is a big hill, an HRM and a very strained look on your face!

 

[beerco]

I'll have to keep my eyes open for a cycle opps power meter, but to date I've not seen any for that cheap! Thanks again for the comments.

Rick

Look harder, there's a brand new PTSL on an open pro wheel for $300 with 11 hours left on e-bay. It will almost surely go for less than $500. There's a PT pro with 13hours left for $200 with out wheel.

 

[azdroptop]

Look harder, there's a brand new PTSL on an open pro wheel for $300 with 11 hours left on e-bay. It will almost surely go for less than $500. There's a PT pro with 13hours left for $200 with out wheel.

Thanks! I'll check it out.

 

[Eden]

Two things
One, I think VT and LT/AT are a little different. LT is the point at which your cardio system won't work much harder without a drop in performance right? I'm pretty sure VT is the point at which you just can't move any more O2 through your lungs. They are probably interrelated, but still a bit different.

And the other, I had a V02 a little while ago and one of the really helpful things that it will tell you is if you have enough base. The way mine was done it measures your active metabolic rate too - so it tells you what percentage of the calories you are using for each zone are fat vs carbs. If you start burning more carbs early on you need more base workouts.

Now I did one as part of an exercise physiology study that someone was doing that was totally useless - it didn't measure most of the important stuff and he did it without regard to my personall fitness. He took me up to a hr that was pretty much my zone 2 (since they were basing max on the bogus 220 minus your age formula)..... stopped the test and did an interpolation. I showed the results to my coach and we had a good laugh.

 

[azdroptop]

Two things
One, I think VT and LT/AT are a little different. LT is the point at which your cardio system won't work much harder without a drop in performance right? I'm pretty sure VT is the point at which you just can't move any more O2 through your lungs. They are probably interrelated, but still a bit different.

And the other, I had a V02 a little while ago and one of the really helpful things that it will tell you is if you have enough base. The way mine was done it measures your active metabolic rate too - so it tells you what percentage of the calories you are using for each zone are fat vs carbs. If you start burning more carbs early on you need more base workouts.

Now I did one as part of an exercise physiology study that someone was doing that was totally useless - it didn't measure most of the important stuff and he did it without regard to my personall fitness. He took me up to a hr that was pretty much my zone 2 (since they were basing max on the bogus 220 minus your age formula)..... stopped the test and did an interpolation. I showed the results to my coach and we had a good laugh.

Cool. I remember Rq value from my Ex Pys days and it can be helpful for being in the right 'zone' for calorie burning.

 

[beerco]

And the other, I had a V02 a little while ago and one of the really helpful things that it will tell you is if you have enough base.

CTL will tell you that even better, as will riding in a race.

 

[artemidorus]

Two things
One, I think VT and LT/AT are a little different. LT is the point at which your cardio system won't work much harder without a drop in performance right? I'm pretty sure VT is the point at which you just can't move any more O2 through your lungs. They are probably interrelated, but still a bit different.

Not so, Eden. The ventilatory threshold occurs at about the same time as the lactate threshold/OBLA. The term anaerobic threshold is less specific and can mean VT or OBLA. If you plot VO2 on the x axis vs VCO2 on the y axis for an exercise study, the VT is the inflection point at which the slope of the plot increases. There are a number of different plots that also show the VT, such as Ve vs VO2. In a sedentary individual, the VT/OBLA can occur at less than 50% of VO2max, while in a TdF rider it occurs at about 85% of VO2max. The point at which you can't move any more O2 through your lungs into your blood is your VO2max. The point at which you can't move any more air through your lungs is your Vemax or Vimax (these two are almost the same thing).

 

[sidewind]

And the other, I had a V02 a little while ago and one of the really helpful things that it will tell you is if you have enough base. The way mine was done it measures your active metabolic rate too - so it tells you what percentage of the calories you are using for each zone are fat vs carbs. If you start burning more carbs early on you need more base workouts.

What is the reference for that? All the discussions on this board I have read have ended up that the carbs vs fat utilisation is depending on the FTP (Functional threshold Power) of the individual, not on the amount of "base" training one has done. Although, maybe "base" in this context just refers to the LT or FTP training?

 

[Eden]

What is the reference for that? All the discussions on this board I have read have ended up that the carbs vs fat utilisation is depending on the FTP (Functional threshold Power) of the individual, not on the amount of "base" training one has done. Although, maybe "base" in this context just refers to the LT or FTP training?

Its probably just a semantics thing. I'm using a slightly different vocabulary than you are. The way it was explained to me - if you are a person who starts burning up more carb calories v/s fat calories very early in the test, say Zone 2, you need more low intensity training. If you go out and always do a lot of training in the higher zones your body won't make the adaptations (or it least it will happen very, very sloooowly) that it needs to start burning up more fats v/s carbs at lower intensities, thus you need more lower intensity (base) training. I actually blew up my rear rim during the test... so I did not get to complete the whole thing (I was about 2 - 3 min from finshed by her estimate), but she got to see what she wanted to know, which was whether or not to move me out of base training into build.

 

[azdroptop]

Did the test and here are the results. Overall I'm where I thought I would be VO2 max wise with LT and AT actually close to what I "felt" while riding. Quick background on me. Only riding for about 4.5 years, "seriously" for about 2(seriously meaning 8 to 12 hours a week, 4 to 5K miles a year) This year is my first year racing USCF as a cat 5, weigh in at 179 from 205 when I started (bodybuilding background) Hope to hit 175 soon.

VO2 4.83L/min or VO2 59.4ml/kg/min

RER at AT = .92 (What is RER?)
RER at VO2 Max 1.9
HR 180(I've seen 183 on rides)

Watts at AT = 210 w/ HR of 155. It seems I am also in need of more base training-Doesn't surprise me at all since I tend to work up in my HR ranges.
Watts at LT = 270 w/ HR of 164

Watts at VO2 Max 330 though I did about 20 seconds at 360 before stopping.

Comments? Suggestions? And thanks.

 

[artemidorus]

Did the test and here are the results. Overall I'm where I thought I would be VO2 max wise with LT and AT actually close to what I "felt" while riding. Quick background on me. Only riding for about 4.5 years, "seriously" for about 2(seriously meaning 8 to 12 hours a week, 4 to 5K miles a year) This year is my first year racing USCF as a cat 5, weigh in at 179 from 205 when I started (bodybuilding background) Hope to hit 175 soon.

VO2 4.83L/min or VO2 59.4ml/kg/min

RER at AT = .92 (What is RER?)
RER at VO2 Max 1.9
HR 180(I've seen 183 on rides)

Watts at AT = 210 w/ HR of 155. It seems I am also in need of more base training-Doesn't surprise me at all since I tend to work up in my HR ranges.
Watts at LT = 270 w/ HR of 164

Watts at VO2 Max 330 though I did about 20 seconds at 360 before stopping.

Comments? Suggestions? And thanks.

Without Googling it, I think that RER is VCO2/VO2. If so, that would make RER at rest the same as the respiratory quotient.
That's a pretty reasonable VO2max. Shame that you hadn't lost ~300-400g beforehand, for then you would have broken 60!

 

[azdroptop]

Without Googling it, I think that RER is VCO2/VO2. If so, that would make RER at rest the same as the respiratory quotient.
That's a pretty reasonable VO2max. Shame that you hadn't lost ~300-400g beforehand, for then you would have broken 60!

Should have used the bathroom before hand. LOL I was hoping for 60, but will be there soon!

 

[sidewind]

Its probably just a semantics thing. I'm using a slightly different vocabulary than you are. The way it was explained to me - if you are a person who starts burning up more carb calories v/s fat calories very early in the test, say Zone 2, you need more low intensity training. If you go out and always do a lot of training in the higher zones your body won't make the adaptations (or it least it will happen very, very sloooowly) that it needs to start burning up more fats v/s carbs at lower intensities, thus you need more lower intensity (base) training. I actually blew up my rear rim during the test... so I did not get to complete the whole thing (I was about 2 - 3 min from finshed by her estimate), but she got to see what she wanted to know, which was whether or not to move me out of base training into build.

Maybe it's just semantics, but I'm confused anyway. All the abstracts I've read in the PubMed or corresponding places couple the fat vs carb utilisation with different enzymes or mitochondria or capillar etc amounts, and all of those are best trained with the FTP or LT level of training. So where does that originate, that lots of base is required? Or is it simply referring to people who really just have been a couple of months in training mode, and for whom the base level in practise is as effective as any higher level?