HELP! Really bad stiffness and pain in neck, shoulders and elbows!

[kaian]

Okay, so I am not all that new to riding. I did road biking last year from August to October then sold the bike I had and got one that fit better in March of this year. I rode that on the trainer until May. Since May I've been doing 60-125 miles a week (slowly increasing my mileage) with my longest ride ever being 60 miles with little to moderate effort. Recently I've noticed that when I do any rides over 30 miles, my neck, shoulders and elbows get really sore and sometimes the next day I wake up with a "kink" in my neck. I've had sore elbows for about 3 weeks now. I felt slightly stretched and my arms didn't seem bent enough so on Monday I went to the LBS and had them swap out the stem to one that is 10mm shorter, but the same angle (25 degrees).

I still need to adjust the handlebar angle (tilt them up a bit) I think because the ride I did tonight was horribly painful and we only did 34 miles! My neck and shoulders are killing me! It feels worse than before the stem swap.

Anyway, what I am wondering is what steps should I take in order to get rid of this issue? The elbow pain is very annoying as is the shoulder/neck pain. Would a "comfort" bike or something with a more upright geometry be better? Would a steel bike make the ride less harsh? What if any any bikes should I possibly look at if I am not able to get this bike comfortable enough?

I am riding a 2005 Trek 1000 WSD. I'm 5'0" and have a size 43cm. I am fit, by the way, and have no problem riding far or somewhat fast. I do not intend to race and prefer to be in more of a 45 degree angle position when I ride.

The reason why I'm putting the question on this forum is because it's hard to get straight answers from bike shops around here. There is one that I trust, but they are bit pricey and only carry a couple of brands. It just seems hard to find someone to take time and really fit me and tell me what might work best for me.

Anyway, thanks for reading! Suggestions are appreciated as always!

 

[dhk]

Okay, so I am not all that new to riding. I did road biking last year from August to October then sold the bike I had and got one that fit better in March of this year. I rode that on the trainer until May. Since May I've been doing 60-125 miles a week (slowly increasing my mileage) with my longest ride ever being 60 miles with little to moderate effort. Recently I've noticed that when I do any rides over 30 miles, my neck, shoulders and elbows get really sore and sometimes the next day I wake up with a "kink" in my neck. I've had sore elbows for about 3 weeks now. I felt slightly stretched and my arms didn't seem bent enough so on Monday I went to the LBS and had them swap out the stem to one that is 10mm shorter, but the same angle (25 degrees).

I still need to adjust the handlebar angle (tilt them up a bit) I think because the ride I did tonight was horribly painful and we only did 34 miles! My neck and shoulders are killing me! It feels worse than before the stem swap.

Anyway, what I am wondering is what steps should I take in order to get rid of this issue? The elbow pain is very annoying as is the shoulder/neck pain. Would a "comfort" bike or something with a more upright geometry be better? Would a steel bike make the ride less harsh? What if any any bikes should I possibly look at if I am not able to get this bike comfortable enough?

I am riding a 2005 Trek 1000 WSD. I'm 5'0" and have a size 43cm. I am fit, by the way, and have no problem riding far or somewhat fast. I do not intend to race and prefer to be in more of a 45 degree angle position when I ride.

The reason why I'm putting the question on this forum is because it's hard to get straight answers from bike shops around here. There is one that I trust, but they are bit pricey and only carry a couple of brands. It just seems hard to find someone to take time and really fit me and tell me what might work best for me.

Anyway, thanks for reading! Suggestions are appreciated as always!

You didn't mention how much drop you have from your saddle top to the top of the handlebars. Although racers may have a 4 inch drop or more, some people have hand/arm/neck problems when the drop exceeds 2 inches.

When you are riding, do you always have a lot of weight on your hands? Are you in the drops mostly, or mostly ride with hands on brake hoods or top of bars? Are you aware of constantly having to hold your head up to see? If so, could be your fit on the bike is too extreme for your current level of bike conditioning.

Without knowing how you fit on your bike, suggest you might want to work with a trainer or PT at your local Y or fitness center. Massage and/or spa therapy and the right gentle stretching should help to relieve the pain and speed healing now.

Believe increased upper body strength and flexibility will be the ticket to avoiding this pain in the long term. It will likely take several months of daily stretching and strength exercises to get real improvement, but it's worth it to ride pain-free.

Forgot to mention the obvious of course....back off on the weekly mileage until your pain is healed. 100-150 miles a week is plenty for most of us to ride without injury, and it sounds like you ramped up to that level quickly. Suggest you go back to 50 miles a week and stay there until you're pain-free.

 

[kaian]

My saddle and handlebars are about even. I tend to ride on the hoods more than anything. Yes, I do seem to have to have my head up to see - like my neck might be cranked up a bit.

As for upper body strength, I've been working out with weights regularly for years (over 10 years). I'm probably stronger than most women my size!! Lately I've tried to do more back and ab stuff because I know it's important in biking. In general I feel like there's more weight on my arms than there should be.

Some things I intend to do are: back off a bit on mileage for a week or so, adjust the angle of my handle bars, possibly tip my seat up a bit. Right now my seat is level, but I still feel like I sit a little forward on it, so maybe tipping it up slightly will force more weight on my rear. I've also thought about replacing the saddle altogether because the one I have isn't all that comfy.

Maybe the fit isn't right (again)! Or maybe I need a different geometry. It's hard to say. I just don't want to stop riding, so that's why I'm here looking for suggestions to try. Thanks!

 

[Induray]

Try a wider handlebar.

Pay for a bike fit. Find someone who has good experience on one of your LBS. You might be supporting too much of your upper body weight through your arms into the handle bar. Your upper body should be relaxed not tensed. elbows should be bent. If you ride with stiff arms, that could cause a lot of pain in the neck shoulder region.


Stretch your neck and shoulder area on a daily basis. Remember , stretching is a exercise routine by itself , not a warm up.

 

[kaian]

I adjusted my handlebars a bit and got the elbow and shoulder pain to a minimum, but neck still feels sore and tense after a 30+ mile ride.

It is possible that my riding posture is wrong. I have no idea how to correct it because I don't have a coach or a trainer to tell me how to ride.

Looks like it could be a combination of posture and bike fit. Has anyone else had problems similar to this? I've wondered if maybe I am sensitive to road vibrations and if maybe a steel or "comfort" bike like a Trek Pilot would suit me better. Anyone else have to change bikes to be more comfortable?

 

[FastFloridian]

I adjusted my handlebars a bit and got the elbow and shoulder pain to a minimum, but neck still feels sore and tense after a 30+ mile ride.

It is possible that my riding posture is wrong. I have no idea how to correct it because I don't have a coach or a trainer to tell me how to ride.

Looks like it could be a combination of posture and bike fit. Has anyone else had problems similar to this? I've wondered if maybe I am sensitive to road vibrations and if maybe a steel or "comfort" bike like a Trek Pilot would suit me better. Anyone else have to change bikes to be more comfortable?

Hi, I am close to your height. 5'4".
I have short arms and legs and a long torso and I feel so much better when I installed a 120m stem with the same rise.
What it did for me was that it flattened my back making my neck not have to lookup as hard as before when I was using a shorter 110m stem. My back was kind of curved/hunch backed with that shorter stem and made looking forward more strenuous on my neck before I went to a longer stem.

Just something to think about.

Also, carbon fiber bars help on vibrations but usually help the wrist more than anything.

 

[ltmark]

I'm not a professional rider, but it's my understanding that your seat fore/aft may be the most likely cause. As your seat moves forward, more of you upper body weight is thrust to the handlebars. Also, moving it back places more weight rearward and relieves the arm strain. Just remember that as you move it either way, it changes the leg angle also

 

[new2bikes]

Hi. You've brought up the exact problem I've been dealing with. I've been riding a 2005 Trek 5000 WSD since April, so I've been riding for only 4 months. Take my 2 cents for what they're worth. I'm also 5'0" and have a 47cm with an inch of clearance. My seat and handlebars are level. When I first started riding, the neck pain was severe but after almost 800 miles, it has lessened greatly although it's still there. And this morning, I also had a "kink" in my neck. I read an article somewhere that said it takes at least 650 miles for your body to get used to a new bike or any new adjustments. This may or may not be true. My stem is 80mm and I've thought of changing it to a shorter one as well but don't know how that would affect the handling of the bike, or if it's necessary. Perhaps I just need more time on the bike. I have slowly increased my mileage to 60-75 miles per week, preferring to build up at a comfortable pace.

Regarding the Pilot, the 2005 catalog shows the smallest WSD Pilot, all models, as 50cm but maybe the geometry would work for you. I found them a bit too high for me.

I've thought about getting a bike fit but am not sure how to find a good fitter - someone who knows more than whether the hub is blocked out when your hands are in the drops and that there should be a slight bend in your knees at the bottom of the pedal stroke. There seems to be a variety of fits offered at different places, from a basic fit to a pro fit and these have prices to match. Anyone with info. on finding a good fitter? (Long Beach, CA area or in general) Also, any more comments on Kaian's original question? Thanks.

 

[catie]

Hi Maybe your bike is a little too big? are you riding with your arms totally straight or are they relaxed? If they are straight for so long that could be why they are sore - from the jarring.

I wouldn't recommend tilting the seat up - from female to female... Thats just going to cause ouch! If you are sitting too far forward on your seat then I am thinking again your bike could be too big.

Not just upper body strength important - you need to have flexibility. I had similar neck problems, becuase I was doing a lot of rowing I had a very strong neck and back, but oh so tight!! I imagine that massage and stretching as suggested would be great.

Cheers!

 

[kaian]

I can't imagine that this bike is too big. It's a 43cm WSD - it's the smallest adult bike Trek makes! I have a lot of standover clearance and I actually feel a bit "perched" on the bike even though my seat is about the same level as my handlebars.

I test rode a Specialized Sequoia Elite on Saturday (an XS or 48cm, but with compact geometry). It felt pretty comfortable. The top tube slopes a lot more and the head tube is a little higher - making the bike more "upright". The vibration absorbing stuff on it seemed cool, too - it was a smooth ride. So I am currently considering going to a shop that sells those, getting measured, and seeing if that bike will work or maybe the guys at the shop will find me an even a better fit. The bike is equipped with 105 components, so that's a plus!

I have pretty short arms, so that could play a factor. I also have a long neck. I've actually got the shoulder and neck pain down to a minimum by stretching and relaxing my shoulders when I ride and taking stretch breaks every 15-20 miles. My elbows are still hurting when I ride and they are not locked when I am riding. Maybe I do need to put more miles on ???? But I think I've put about 600 or so on so far...perhaps I need to strengthen my "core" so that I put less weight on my arms. I know that when I get tired (after riding for a while) the weight seems heavier on my arms, so maybe that would help. ??

Thanks for your comments, new2bikes! I know a 47cm in a Trek would be super long for me. You must have a long torso or long arms! I've heard that trying a new stem is a good step to take. You might want to try that out. I've swapped my stem out a couple of times. Right now I have a 70mm with a 25 degree rise. The bike came with a 60 and that felt too short, so I went to an 80, and now am on a 70. ???? I guess it depends on what kind of riding you want to do. For many, a stem with a higher rise works well for the longer distances.

 

[new2bikes]

Yeah, I think my arms are a little long. Can you reach the floor without bending your knees with your feet about 8 inches apart? That might give you a clue regarding flexibility.

I checked the catalog again regarding the Pilot. The 50cm has a top tube of 50cm. Your current bike has a top tube of 48.5cm ; mine 49.7. Stem plus top tube on yours = 55.5. Mine = 57.7. I just checked my stem - seems to have a 17 degree rise. I don't have enough knowledge to know how that compares to a 25 degree rise, not in numbers, of course, but what it means regarding fit and position on the bike. Can you explain? Thanks.

 

[kaian]

Yeah, I think my arms are a little long. Can you reach the floor without bending your knees with your feet about 8 inches apart? That might give you a clue regarding flexibility.

I checked the catalog again regarding the Pilot. The 50cm has a top tube of 50cm. Your current bike has a top tube of 48.5cm ; mine 49.7. Stem plus top tube on yours = 55.5. Mine = 57.7. I just checked my stem - seems to have a 17 degree rise. I don't have enough knowledge to know how that compares to a 25 degree rise, not in numbers, of course, but what it means regarding fit and position on the bike. Can you explain? Thanks.

Actually, I can reach the floor when I bend down. I think I am pretty flexible, but maybe I need to do even more stretching. As far as the degree of rise on a stem - the higher the number the more the stem will bring the handlebars upward. So...25 degrees would bring the handlebars 8 degrees more upright compared to 17 degree angled stem. I think being more upright is going to work best for me - not sure about the kind of riding you are doing, but maybe a shorter stem on a slightly higher angle will help you as well.

I actually went to a massage therapist earlier today and she gave me some insight. She said it appeared that some of the smaller muscles in my back were really stretched and a bit weak. She said that made sense from the position cyclists maintain. She also told me to check my seat position because my lower back was REALLY tight and she was concerned that maybe my position was putting more stress on my back and not enough on my hamstrings. It's amazing just how much effect a maladjusted bike can have on the body!

 

[kaian]

Well, I ended up getting fit and getting a new bike. The bike I got is actually not too much different than what I had. I had a Trek 1000 WSD 43cm and I ended up getting a Trek 1500 WSD 47cm. The fitter, who has a lot of experience and who used to work for a very reputable tri/road specialty shop prior to this LBS, spent about 2 hours with me 2 days in a row! His inital response to my telling him about the pain I was having and how my current bike was set up was that I was too crouched and not stretched out enough. He said that not being stretched out enough could cause the shoulder/neck pain as well as the sore elbows!

He measured me using the fit kit, plugged in all the info into the computer, and determined that my torso and reach is actually long for my height and while I need a bike small enough to have standover room, I still need a long enough top tube to get me in a good road position. So...he put me on a slightly bigger bike with a top tube 1 cm longer and a 100mm stem. Because my flexibility is excellent, the computer said my reach should be about 62cm (if I was in a performance road position). On my old bike I was at 53cm!!! So on the new bike, I got a stem with a slight rise, so that I am in a slightly upright road position and now my reach is at about 59cm. The handlebars are also a little higher because it's a taller bike, so that helps as well. It doesn't feel "comfy" at this point because it's new, but it doesn't feel bad either. I've heard that it can take a little while to get used to proper road bike posture, so I am going to give it some time. After about 5 hours of riding or so, if I am still in pain, I can take it back and have it re-adjusted or whatever.

I just thought I would share this info just in case other people are having similar problems. I initially thought that the solution was to bring everything in closer, but apparently, I needed to go the other direction! We'll see what happens!

 

[new2bikes]

Kaian - just wondering how the newest bike is working out. At close to 1000 miles, my neck pain is almost completely gone. Your size and bike fit so closely matching my own was a good validation for me. Do you think the new fit will work for you?

 

[kaian]

Well, I've only been able to take 2 rides on the new bike because I was out of town for a week. I took one ride that was about 90 minutes long and the other ride was about 2 hours long. So far it feels good. I feel like this new bike is a much better fit. I am also going to work on strengthening my lower back and stomach muscles as well as just keep putting in the miles to get more and more used to the position. Now that I know the fit and set-up of the bike is correct, I'll feel better about riding more. I'll keep you updated, but so far so good!