Hey, Guy...

Discussion in 'UK and Europe' started by [Not Responding], Oct 15, 2004.

  1. Tags:


  2. On Fri, 15 Oct 2004 18:25:02 +0100, " [Not Responding] "
    <[email protected]> wrote in message
    <[email protected]>:

    >Someone's swallowed PS's view of the world hook, line & sinker.


    It's the "ABD's Lonely Factoid" again.

    Guy
    --
    May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
    http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

    88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University
     
  3. the.Mark

    the.Mark Guest

  4. On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 18:57:46 +0000 (UTC), "the.Mark"
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    > [Not Responding] wrote:
    >> Take a look at this page
    >>
    >> http://www.transwatch.co.uk/transport-speed-cameras.htm
    >>

    >
    >They've put a picture of a bus on the page that goes past my house.



    The Government and official bodies such as the TRL and DTLR have put
    it about that some 30% of road accidents are attributable to
    "excessive speed". That turns out to be a misrepresentation by a
    factor of up to 10. The 30% depends on assigning "excessive speed" to
    the following categories:

    1 Failure to judge other person's path or speed 10.7%
    Alternatively worded as "driving too fast to take decisive action"

    2 Excessive speed (Include exceeding the speed limit by 1 mph)
    7.3%

    3 Following too closely 4.1%
    Alternatively worded as "driving to fast for the braking distance"

    4 Slippery road 3.0%
    Alternatively worded as "driving too fast for the conditions"

    5 Aggressive Driving 1.4%
    Alternatively worded as "driving too fast"

    6 Weather, e.g. mist or sleet 0.8%
    Alternatively worded as "driving too fast for the conditions"

    7 Other, local conditions 0.4%
    Alternatively worded as "driving too fast for the conditions"

    8 Total
    --
    Warning: This user suffers from narcolepppppppppp
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  5. Simon Brooke

    Simon Brooke Guest

  6. Simon Brooke

    Simon Brooke Guest

    in message <[email protected]>, Richard Bates
    ('[email protected]') wrote:

    > On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 18:57:46 +0000 (UTC), "the.Mark"
    > <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >> [Not Responding] wrote:
    >>> Take a look at this page
    >>>
    >>> http://www.transwatch.co.uk/transport-speed-cameras.htm
    >>>

    >>
    >>They've put a picture of a bus on the page that goes past my house.

    >
    >
    > The Government and official bodies such as the TRL and DTLR have put
    > it about that some 30% of road accidents are attributable to
    > "excessive speed". That turns out to be a misrepresentation by a
    > factor of up to 10. The 30% depends on assigning "excessive speed" to
    > the following categories:
    >
    > 1 Failure to judge other person's path or speed 10.7%
    > Alternatively worded as "driving too fast to take decisive action"
    >
    > 2 Excessive speed (Include exceeding the speed limit by 1 mph)
    > 7.3%
    >
    > 3 Following too closely 4.1%
    > Alternatively worded as "driving to fast for the braking distance"
    >
    > 4 Slippery road 3.0%
    > Alternatively worded as "driving too fast for the conditions"
    >
    > 5 Aggressive Driving 1.4%
    > Alternatively worded as "driving too fast"
    >
    > 6 Weather, e.g. mist or sleet 0.8%
    > Alternatively worded as "driving too fast for the conditions"
    >
    > 7 Other, local conditions 0.4%
    > Alternatively worded as "driving too fast for the conditions"
    >
    > 8 Total


    And which of those, in your opinion, cannot be accurately described as
    excessive speed?


    --
    [email protected] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

    Morning had broken, and there was nothing left for us to do
    but pick up the pieces.
     
  7. Howard

    Howard Guest

    Richard Bates <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    >
    > The Government and official bodies such as the TRL and DTLR have put
    > it about that some 30% of road accidents are attributable to
    > "excessive speed". That turns out to be a misrepresentation by a
    > factor of up to 10...



    Oh, dear, yet more misrepresentation of the use of Supplementary stats
    19 forms. For one thing the guidance for these forms suggests that
    'excessive speed' usually means ONLY 'excessive speed for the
    conditions that is ALSO above the legal speed limit, not excessive
    speed for the conditions that is otherwise 'legal'. This has caused
    much confusion and in a recent review of these forms the DfT is
    considering having a separate category for excessive speed for the
    conditions that is above and that which is below the legal limit.

    Also, excessive speed is not even listed as the main or precipitating
    cause of a crash, so it is hardly surprising that the Stats 19 forms
    don't show speed as a major factor. This was done quite deliberately
    as when the use of these forms was standardised a few years back it
    was accepted that speed played a intimate role in the causal chain of
    events leading to most crashes and given this what was needed was a
    better understanding of just how the inappropriate use of speed led to
    a crash in a given situation. In any case the list of factors includes
    items such as 'losing control' which only a fool would argue have
    nothing to do with driving at excessive speed, however they might be
    recorded.

    Also, and this is very important, the '7%' figures relate to all
    crashes. A closer examination of the current figures, which downplay
    the role of speed in many ways, nontheless still show that excessive
    speed plays a central role in the causation of around 30% of fatal
    crashes. This is exactly what we would expect. Attempting to argue
    that figures which include low speed parking shunts and so on somehow
    show that high speeds have nothing to do with the likelihood of a
    serious or fatal crash occurring seems like nothing more than a
    calculated deceit...
     
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