Hi, im new around here and need advice on some CL bikes

[JerDayton]

Hi people, I'm Jeremy and i'm completely new to the world of cycling. In the market for a road bike, need some pricing advice.

http://dayton.craigslist.org/bik/4539854505.html

Ive looked up some tips on things to look for when buying used for myself already, but if you have any additional advice on things I should look for when I go check these bikes out I'd really appreciate it.

Thanks in advance,
Jeremy

 

[Froze]

You didn't say what you will be using the bike for and how much will you be using it.

I was alive and riding bikes when those World Sports came out and they were just so so bikes with low end Shimano components. The were also on the upper end of the weight scale for year they were made, quite heavy, thus the bike was Schwinns second from the bottom of the line.

However if this bike is going to be a commuter bike for college or work and will be locked up outside then this is an ideal bike for that purpose because most bike thieves won't be interested in taking it. And it makes a great first bike as you mentioned, it will get your feet wet to see if you like the sport without breaking the bank only to find out later you hate it! Then you'll have expensive garage art.

Having said all of that, I would offer the guy $50 because it's essentially only worth that unless it's in like new condition then offer the $50 and see if he counters to say $70 for example.

If you will be using it for a commuter you'll need to get commuter worthy tires, those tires are a bit of hard to find size but there is still a couple of good tires (as well as some cheap not so good tires) you can get. The best tire for the money is the Panaracer Pasela TG you can find these for about $22 or so on Amazon, see: http://www.amazon.com/Panaracer-Pasela-Guard-Bicycle-27x1-1/dp/B001CK2DZM Or you can get the stock sized 27x1 1/4 but these cost about $48 on Amazon and the 1/8th size I showed first is just fine.

Tube wise there is no sweat simply use any 700c tube but 700c tubes come with a presta valve instead of a Schrader valve which means you have to convert the Schrader size hole in the rims to accept the smaller Presta valve by getting this: http://www.amazon.com/Wheels-Manufacturing-Presta-Schraeder-10-Pack/dp/B00FNM3FBQ/ref=pd_sim_sg_7?ie=UTF8&refRID=0PG65HV88N9F0AN8RVN7 These alloy ones work better than the plastic ones. You have to install them by first removing the rim tape where the valve hole is then insert the grommet and place the rim tape back over the hole and grommet. They still make 27" tubes by the way but their quality is horrid so it's much better to do the conversion plus you can find a 700c tube anywhere not true with a 27. While you're doing all of that it may be worth noting the condition of the rim strip, if cracked, brittle, frayed, or just looks old, save yourself a headache down the road and replace it.

If you take care of this bike it can last a long time, yes they were heavy, but all that steel that made up the components were almost all but indestructible.

 

[JerDayton]

I really appreciate the detailed reply Froze, I will be riding the bike around the city, and on paved bike trails. I'm not really in a big rush to make a purchase, I'm going to keep my eye on craigslist. I have a budget of about $200-250 to play around with, any particular names I should look out for in that price range?


Thank you for pointing out the components I would need to replace the tires, really helpful. You say those are a fairly hard to find size, is there a more common size I might consider looking out for?


Thanks,
Jeremy

 

[Froze]

Originally Posted by JerDayton
I really appreciate the detailed reply Froze, I will be riding the bike around the city, and on paved bike trails. I'm not really in a big rush to make a purchase, I'm going to keep my eye on craigslist. I have a budget of about $200-250 to play around with, any particular names I should look out for in that price range?


Thank you for pointing out the components I would need to replace the tires, really helpful. You say those are a fairly hard to find size, is there a more common size I might consider looking out for?


Thanks,
Jeremy

Tire wise the 700c tires are the most readily found tires on the market, but I own a 85 Schwinn Le Tour Luxe and kept it 27" because I bought those Panaracer tires, their great tires for what I do with the bike currently, hopefully next summer I'll take a long 30 day trip on it and Schwalbe makes a very good touring tire in that size, so I see no reason to change over to 700c.

$200 to $250 range will get you a decent bike but you have to be careful because some people are selling junk bikes as vintage bikes and demanding a lot more money than they're worth. I suggest when you find a bike on CL is to immediately get on the internet and do some research on that bike, try to get the year make and model so you can get the exact info. Then once you find the components it was spec'd with check the internet to find out what level of components those were. As a person starting it's impossible for me to type in all the stuff to look for, but you can also always come here and post the CL listing and hope for a quick response before the bike is sold, but coming here to do that does poise a risk of someone by chance living in that area and snatching the bike away before you can get it.

You also have to know what size of bike you ride too otherwise you'll be looking at all sorts of sizes of bikes and wasting time. Make sure you test ride every bike before you buy it and test all of it's functions and then try riding it with no hands to see if it has a tendency to pull to one side.

Here is an example of a good middle of the road bike: http://dayton.craigslist.org/bik/4520844239.html if the size fits you it would be a fantastic bike IF it has the original components. Keep in mind too when buying vintage try your best to maintain the vintage components because in the long run the bike will be worth more money should you decide to sell it. If you look at the Trek try to get the frame pump he has pictured in photo 3, that pump works fantastic! I would offer $180 for the Trek without mentioning the pump and see what he counters with, if he comes back with say $200 then say deal if you throw in the Zefal pump he had pictured.

This site will tell you what components came on that Trek; see: http://www.vintage-trek.com/TrekBrochures.htm click on 1985 Sport then scan down to the spec sheet and read about what should be on the 400.

 

[JerDayton]

Thanks for taking a quick look at my local CL Froze, the online size calculators I used tell me I need a 58cm or 23" frame. So that ones a little smaller but I've also read being an inch or so off isn't too big a deal?

If I make them an offer I will use the strategy you suggest,and I'll be sure to ask about the parts, thanks!

Jeremy

 

[Froze]

4 cm difference is a lot, I doubt it would fit, but what is your inseam length? I mean measure from the crotch to the floor

 

[JerDayton]

My inseam is 32 1/2"

 

[Froze]

32 1/2 inches is between 81.2 to 83.8 cm (with the 1/2 being in the middle) thus you need no less than a 56 and no more than a 58 with standard horizontal top tube which is what all vintage bikes were. Not all, for example only, 56 size bikes fit the same, so it's important that you ride them.

If you have a really short arm reach and or upper torso area a 58 will stretch you out to far which you could correct with a shorter reach stem (vintage bike stems are difficult to find but Nitto makes them), or if you have a long torso a 56 will be too short so a long reach stem will counter that. I think you should see the bike because Trek tended to run a bit larger than what they rated them for. I have a (1984) 56cm Trek 660 that fits like a glove but technically I should have been on a 58. If you do ride it try to adjust the seat but don't go past the limit line, if you have to do that then it won't fit. If you stand over the top tube with your feet flat on the ground you should be 1 to 2 inchs from your crotch to the top tube and you'll be safe. After you get the bike you may or may not have to fool with the stem reach and height.

In

 

[alfeng]

FWIW. I would be okay with paying the seller $89 for his bike ...

But, I have never managed to come across a "mint" bike (as has Froze) for $50 ...
Or, discard on the curb for the trash man to pick up ...
And, I like bikes with steel frames

So, MY perspective is different.

BTW. If the frame was smaller OR if I were taller then I would be all over that bike in a heart beat ... just for the frame ... BECAUSE I am okay with frames which were built with non-super-duper steel tubing AND I would eventually be replacing the downtube shifters with Campagnolo shifters + this-or-that in the drivetrain as I deemed to be necessary on an as-needed basis.

 

[Froze]

Originally Posted by alfeng
FWIW. I would be okay with paying the seller $89 for his bike ...

But, I have never managed to come across a "mint" bike (as has Froze) for $50 ...
Or, discard on the curb for the trash man to pick up ...
And, I like bikes with steel frames

So, MY perspective is different.

BTW. If the frame was smaller OR if I were taller then I would be all over that bike in a heart beat ... just for the frame ... BECAUSE I am okay with frames which were built with non-super-duper steel tubing AND I would eventually be replacing the downtube shifters with Campagnolo shifters + this-or-that in the drivetrain as I deemed to be necessary on an as-needed basis.

If a person looks long and hard these goofy mint or almost mint bikes do come up at garage sales, even on CL if someone doesn't know what they got. Unfortunately with E-Bay people are wising up and getting on E-bay first before pricing stuff, so deals are getting harder to find.

That Schwinn could be made better but one has to be careful not to go overboard with trying to make it better because the frame itself was lowest level cromoly frame made...but it is cromoly which is better than hi tensile steel! The fork on that bike is hi tensile but for a fork that's ok, it only adds no more than about 1/2 pound to the bike. The biggest improvement one could make to that bike is starting with the wheels, but make sure that if converting to 700c that the brake calipers will reach the rim without having to get all new calipers, it's that money situation where it could turn into a money pit, upgrade something only to find out you have to upgrade something else to make the first upgrade work. The bike isn't ever going to be worth $300 to $500 in new components...unless you just want to do that regardless of cost or worth.

 

[alfeng]

Originally Posted by Froze
If a person looks long and hard these goofy mint or almost mint bikes do come up at garage sales, even on CL if someone doesn't know what they got. Unfortunately with E-Bay people are wising up and getting on E-bay first before pricing stuff, so deals are getting harder to find.

That Schwinn could be made better but one has to be careful not to go overboard with trying to make it better because the frame itself was lowest level cromoly frame made...but it is cromoly which is better than hi tensile steel! The fork on that bike is hi tensile but for a fork that's ok, it only adds no more than about 1/2 pound to the bike. The biggest improvement one could make to that bike is starting with the wheels, but make sure that if converting to 700c that the brake calipers will reach the rim without having to get all new calipers, it's that money situation where it could turn into a money pit, upgrade something only to find out you have to upgrade something else to make the first upgrade work. The bike isn't ever going to be worth $300 to $500 in new components...unless you just want to do that regardless of cost or worth.

Yes.

Absolutely!

It is generally preferable for most of us to be a wise shopper when updating ANY component on ANY bike ...

BUT, for $350+ in carefully selected components (i.e., NEW-or-used Campagnolo shifters via eBay which can easily cost <$200 or more than 2x that amount if one must have the latest-and-greatest) + DIY time-and-energy one CAN update almost any bike and end up with a pretty nicely equipped bike (IMO) for which one would otherwise need to spend $1500+ ...

• remember, I am just not as impressed with the frame material as most other people are ... if I wanted a CF frame, I would probably buy one of those generic Chinese framesets
• if Nashbar still (?) sells aluminum frames, I would probably opt for one of those if I wanted an aluminum bike frame

AND, most of the "carefully selected" components can migrate to another bike in the future ... so, when the 'mistake' of a new bike with less-than 105 shifters/etc. "needs" to be updated/upgraded, those Campy shifters can find a happy home.

 

[Froze]

Originally Posted by alfeng

Yes.

Absolutely!

It is generally preferable for most of us to be a wise shopper when updating ANY component on ANY bike ...

BUT, for $350+ in carefully selected components (i.e., NEW-or-used Campagnolo shifters via eBay which can easily cost <$200 or more than 2x that amount if one must have the latest-and-greatest) + DIY time-and-energy one CAN update almost any bike and end up with a pretty nicely equipped bike (IMO) for which one would otherwise need to spend $1500+ ...

• remember, I am just not as impressed with the frame material as most other people are ... if I wanted a CF frame, I would probably buy one of those generic Chinese framesets
• if Nashbar still (?) sells aluminum frames, I would probably opt for one of those if I wanted an aluminum bike frame

AND, most of the "carefully selected" components can migrate to another bike in the future ... so, when the 'mistake' of a new bike with less-than 105 shifters/etc. "needs" to be updated/upgraded, those Campy shifters can find a happy home.

In my opinion I would not upgrade to Campy when Suntour was actually better back in those days. In fact a person could find Suntour V Gt Luxe or BL (short for Blue Line, maybe now more expensive then Cyclone but only due to difficulty finding.), or even Cyclone (probably the most expensive of the 3 but better shifting and lighter weight then the others) can be found relatively cheap. However either of those components would be cheaper than Campy and work just as well and odds are heavily in your favor they'll work better and last longer than Campy. As witnessed that I have 160,000 plus miles on my Suntour Superbe stuff.

See I'm the opposite of Alfeng, again just my opinion of course and not any way a slam against Alfeng, I put more emphasis on the frame because my reasoning is one can always upgrade components piece by piece as they either fail or you get money, but it's difficult to upgrade a frame and do it cheaply.

 

[alfeng]

Originally Posted by Froze

In my opinion I would not upgrade to Campy when Suntour was actually better back in those days. In fact a person could find Suntour V Gt Luxe or BL (short for Blue Line, maybe now more expensive then Cyclone but only due to difficulty finding.), or even Cyclone (probably the most expensive of the 3 but better shifting and lighter weight then the others) can be found relatively cheap.

See I'm the opposite of Alfeng, again just my opinion of course and not any way a slam against Alfeng, I put more emphasis on the frame because my reasoning is one can always upgrade components piece by piece as they either fail or you get money, but it's difficult to upgrade a frame and do it cheaply.

Correct, again ...

SunTour WAS superior ...

If not for reputation, Campagnolo would probably have gone the way of French component makers ...

• in retrospect, I was very fortunate to have already migrated to Shimano Crane & DA as replacement derailleurs during the middle-and-late 70s AND I was not cool enough to bother with Campagnolo's misbegotten components in the mid-80s-and-early-90s, so I missed most of Campagnolo's dark period.

 

[Froze]

Originally Posted by alfeng

Correct, again ...

SunTour WAS superior ...

If not for reputation, Campagnolo would probably have gone the way of French component makers ...

• in retrospect, I was very fortunate to have already migrated to Shimano Crane & DA as replacement derailleurs during the middle-and-late 70s AND I was not cool enough to bother with Campagnolo's misbegotten components in the mid-80s-and-early-90s, so I missed most of Campagnolo's dark period.

The darkest period I ever saw was the French ****! My god what trash that stuff was. I test rode a Peugeot PX10 (top of the line of the Peugeot models) back in the day when they were new and that thing was a noodle and felt dead, I was able to get the chain to rub both sides of the front derailleur thus no trimming would work, and got the rear wheel to rub both sides of the brake pads on hard sprints; add on top of that the poor shifting quality and I immediately returned the beautiful looking bike to the LBS and looked elsewhere. French did on occasion do it right though, so not all was bad, like the Huret Jubilee stuff which to this day is the lightest production made derailleur ever at around 140 grams. And some argue that the Simplex retrofriction shifters (down tube) were the best shifters ever made were just silky smooth, but what good is the best shifter if the most of the French derailleurs were junk?

I tested rode many Campy stuff back in the day and in fact my first bike was a 76 Trek TX900 with Campy Nuovo Record, and that thing did not shift well, but back in those days you lived with it because not much else shifted well anyways...until Suntour came out in full force! But back in the 70's Suntour was looked as inferior stuff that no racer in their right mind would be caught dead with, boy were we ignorant! Because in the mid 70's Suntour actually had derailleurs that were superior to anything else, it just took awhile for us bike snobs to catch on and most never did which is one of the reasons Suntour didn't survive, then add on top of that for a long while UCI would not allow Suntour to be on racing bikes! Don't ask me why, I hate UCI anyways!!! to this day they still stifle innovation.

 

[JerDayton]

Thanks for chiming in alfeng, appreciate it. Your conversation went over my head for sure, but im learning ;p

Can you guys give your opinion on this bike: http://dayton.craigslist.org/bik/4526503164.html

I've inquired about the Trek, no response yet.

EDIT: and this one: http://dayton.craigslist.org/bik/4524268369.html

 

[Froze]

Originally Posted by JerDayton
Thanks for chiming in alfeng, appreciate it. Your conversation went over my head for sure, but im learning ;p

Can you guys give your opinion on this bike: http://dayton.craigslist.org/bik/4526503164.html

I've inquired about the Trek, no response yet.

That bike is a dime store bike, stay away, the Schwinn is a lot better than this one. But keep trying on the Trek and check out the Schwinn too.

 

[JerDayton]

Ok thats what i needed to know! I ninja edited in another ad too, if you dont mind: http://dayton.craigslist.org/bik/4524268369.html

 

[jhuskey]

Looks like a good solid bike of course it has downtube shifters which dates it back several years. I used downtube shifters in the 80s but I am spoiled now.
Can't tell anything about the components but I am guessing they are dated.

 

[Froze]

I don't know much about those Specialized bikes, but according to the internet they sold new for $450 range so I think the bike is overpriced for a 23 year old bike? unless it's in mint condition? maybe someone else can advise better. It does look like a well made bike for the money back then and they were built sturdy because they came with eyelets for pannier racks and or fenders which means they will hold up to abuse, and they were lugged cromoly steel which for 91 that was sort of rare in a production bike, and I love the look of lugs.

I did find out they used the Suntour Accushift system which is similar to Shimano SIS, these did shift faster, both styles shift faster than the new STI and Ergo stuff found on todays bikes.

I suggest go look at it and ride it, offer $215 unless someone else here thinks they're worth a lot less, than after you two settle on a price ask for any extras like a pump and maybe a seat bag to throw into the deal if he has them laying around.

 

[jhuskey]

I would offer $150.00 if you like it after you test ride and go to $175.00. People generally price high with the intent of coming down and they may have no use for the bike and are just trying to get rid of it.