Hincapie the Cause of the T-Mobile Demise?



P

Phil Holman

Guest
"John Forrest Tomlinson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
> On Sat, 8 Dec 2007 18:33:23 -0800, "Phil Holman"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>
>>"MagillaGorilla" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>news:[email protected]
>>> chiefhia[email protected] wrote:
>>>
>>>> LeMond comes out of that conversation looking really bad. Both of
>>>> them
>>>> do. Laughing and talking about what George's baby is going to look
>>>> like.
>>>
>>>
>>> LemonD was using a little Boonesfarm small talk to get Stephanie to
>>> "open up."
>>>
>>> It worked.
>>>
>>> Well, at least we now know why Hincapie's leg veins look like he got
>>> them from an alien.
>>>

>>Why, are his parents aliens? It's statements like these that blur the
>>facts.

>
> His father was, I think, but I'm pretty sure he's a US citizen now.
>
> http://www.crca.net/news/200509.htm#12 (scroll down a bit on the
> right)
>
>
> Nice guy, as is George (though that doesn't mean hs is or isn't
> doping).


Only in the US is a creature from another planet confused with a person
from another country.

Phil H
 
M

Morten Reippuert Knudsen

Guest
Mike Jacoubowsky <[email protected]> wrote:
>> You know, come to think of it, Hincapie probably was on dope in that stage
>> like you suggest even if it was a trashcan break they let go up the road.
>> Without dope, Hincapie should be no better than Rich Hincapie running into
>> a barricade at the Tour of Nutley.
>>
>> I'm sure JT knows the details.
>>
>> Magilla

>
> If Hincapie was doped on that stage, you really think he would have gone for
> the win?


Why not? Basso, Hamilton, Perez, Herras, Ulrich, Jachkse, Landis,
Vinokurov, Millar and a lot of other riders hasn't had any problems
passing doping test while doped during the last 5 years. Why should
Hincapee be any different?

Do your really think passing an ordianry in-competition doping test
means that you are not doping?

Micro dosing of EPO, growthhormones, kortizone, bloddping with your
own blood can not be detected. If your clever you can increase the
dosage further when beeing out of competition.

Ulrich, Basso, Jachkse and Millar never tested positive and all of
them won races and passed tests while beeing juiced up.
Hamilton managed to win a lot before getting caucht with forrign blood
in his vains. From the Fuentes files we now know that durring 2003 he
used EPO, growthhormones and kortizone while winning races as LBL,
Tour de romandie and stages in TDF and the basqe country.

I'm only mentioning riders who has officially been caught. this is
2007 and only ignorants can assume that a negative doping test can
clear a rider from suspission.

--
Morten Reippuert Knudsen :) <http://blog.reippuert.dk>

Merlin Works CR-3/2.5 & Campagnolo Chorus 2007.
 
M

Morten Reippuert Knudsen

Guest
MagillaGorilla <[email protected]> wrote:

>> If Hincapie was doped on that stage, you really think he would have gone for
>> the win?

>
> You mean like Vino going for the win in the TT or Landis going for the
> win in Morzine or Tylenol going for the win in Athens while pregnant
> with twins?
>
> Why dope if you're not going to go for the win, Einstein? These pros
> are pros in micro-dosing and thinking they can defeat the tests.


Usually they can, but sometimes, although rarely, bad luck hits hits.

--
Morten Reippuert Knudsen :) <http://blog.reippuert.dk>

Merlin Works CR-3/2.5 & Campagnolo Chorus 2007.
 
M

Morten Reippuert Knudsen

Guest
MagillaGorilla <[email protected]> wrote:

> It's actually very low risk and the guys getting caught are either
> accidentally getting the wrong bags of blood, getting tested by the
> BRAND NEW out-of-competition tests by the UCI (Kashechkin), or are
> keeping the gel patch on for too long (Sinkabitch, Fraud, Papp Smear).


Actually the biggest fish beeing caught so far is because of
police investigations or truth campaings following those
investigations. (Festina, Corfidis, Oil for Drugs, Fuentes, Telecom)

--
Morten Reippuert Knudsen :) <http://blog.reippuert.dk>

Merlin Works CR-3/2.5 & Campagnolo Chorus 2007.
 
M

Morten Reippuert Knudsen

Guest
Carl Sundquist <[email protected]> wrote:

> And why are you mixing UCI and USADA? Once again, apples and oranges. Was
> Rasmussen afraid of the Danish ADA when he he was in Italy and lied?


ADA only has juristiction to test Rasmussen durrinmg races in denmark
- only the Monegascan federation and UCI has juristiction to do out of
competition tests.

Secondly he also hasn't tested positive although the blood values he
publicised from the TDF looks suspicious.

BTW Contador, Evans and Leipheimers blood values from TDF 07 could be
interesting reading as well but i doubt they dare gp public with them.

--
Morten Reippuert Knudsen :) <http://blog.reippuert.dk>

Merlin Works CR-3/2.5 & Campagnolo Chorus 2007.
 
M

Morten Reippuert Knudsen

Guest
MagillaGorilla <[email protected]> wrote:

> Kashechkin was. Ulrich was nailed in a non-race test for all intents
> and purposes which can be classified as OOC, as was Basshole. The
> rest were caught because they were sloppy and I think you can concede
> that I know the details of their cases. Rasmussen missed numerous OOC
> tests - he was kicked out of the Tour and fired because of that.


Interesingly, Thor Hushovd, one of the most prominent critics of M.
Rasmussens participation in this years TDF rode the TDF with /two/
warnings due to missed out-of-competition tests.

Publication of riders with missed out-of-competion tests could make
an interestning reading.

> The Dutch riders are all apparently lying about their whereabouts so the
> OOC testers can't find them. Technically those must count as failed
> tests under WADA protocol (there's little discretion). But thhey're not
> enforced like they are in the U.S.
>
> I bet you if you looked at all those riders who you claim were NOT
> caught by OOC tests, they probably were had the OOC rules been ennforced
> correctly as they are by USADA.
>
> Answer this question, Carl - how many OOC tests did the Americans living
> in Spain have from 1999-2005? I bet you the answer is ZERO.


It is, as i remember, Armstrong for one never ever did an out of
competition test.


--
Morten Reippuert Knudsen :) <http://blog.reippuert.dk>

Merlin Works CR-3/2.5 & Campagnolo Chorus 2007.
 
R

Ryan Cousineau

Guest
In article <[email protected]>,
Morten Reippuert Knudsen <[email protected]> wrote:

> MagillaGorilla <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > Kashechkin was. Ulrich was nailed in a non-race test for all intents
> > and purposes which can be classified as OOC, as was Basshole. The
> > rest were caught because they were sloppy and I think you can concede
> > that I know the details of their cases. Rasmussen missed numerous OOC
> > tests - he was kicked out of the Tour and fired because of that.

>
> Interesingly, Thor Hushovd, one of the most prominent critics of M.
> Rasmussens participation in this years TDF rode the TDF with /two/
> warnings due to missed out-of-competition tests.
>
> Publication of riders with missed out-of-competion tests could make
> an interestning reading.
>
> > The Dutch riders are all apparently lying about their whereabouts so the
> > OOC testers can't find them. Technically those must count as failed
> > tests under WADA protocol (there's little discretion). But thhey're not
> > enforced like they are in the U.S.
> >
> > I bet you if you looked at all those riders who you claim were NOT
> > caught by OOC tests, they probably were had the OOC rules been ennforced
> > correctly as they are by USADA.
> >
> > Answer this question, Carl - how many OOC tests did the Americans living
> > in Spain have from 1999-2005? I bet you the answer is ZERO.

>
> It is, as i remember, Armstrong for one never ever did an out of
> competition test.


Wha? Are you talking only "in Spain," or ever? Because in his second
autobio he has a charming story about getting ready to take his wife to
the hospital (she was in labor), when the local dope testers show up for
an OOC.

Mind you, that was in Texas, but I would have thought it was just as
easy for WADA to find him in Girona,

--
Ryan Cousineau [email protected] http://www.wiredcola.com/
"My scenarios may give the impression I could be an excellent crook.
Not true - I am a talented lawyer." - Sandy in rec.bicycles.racing
 
M

MagillaGorilla

Guest
Ryan Cousineau wrote:

> In article <[email protected]>,
> Morten Reippuert Knudsen <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>MagillaGorilla <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Kashechkin was. Ulrich was nailed in a non-race test for all intents
>>>and purposes which can be classified as OOC, as was Basshole. The
>>>rest were caught because they were sloppy and I think you can concede
>>>that I know the details of their cases. Rasmussen missed numerous OOC
>>>tests - he was kicked out of the Tour and fired because of that.

>>
>>Interesingly, Thor Hushovd, one of the most prominent critics of M.
>>Rasmussens participation in this years TDF rode the TDF with /two/
>>warnings due to missed out-of-competition tests.
>>
>>Publication of riders with missed out-of-competion tests could make
>>an interestning reading.
>>
>>
>>>The Dutch riders are all apparently lying about their whereabouts so the
>>>OOC testers can't find them. Technically those must count as failed
>>>tests under WADA protocol (there's little discretion). But thhey're not
>>>enforced like they are in the U.S.
>>>
>>>I bet you if you looked at all those riders who you claim were NOT
>>>caught by OOC tests, they probably were had the OOC rules been ennforced
>>>correctly as they are by USADA.
>>>
>>>Answer this question, Carl - how many OOC tests did the Americans living
>>>in Spain have from 1999-2005? I bet you the answer is ZERO.

>>
>>It is, as i remember, Armstrong for one never ever did an out of
>>competition test.

>
>
> Wha? Are you talking only "in Spain," or ever? Because in his second
> autobio he has a charming story about getting ready to take his wife to
> the hospital (she was in labor), when the local dope testers show up for
> an OOC.
>
> Mind you, that was in Texas, but I would have thought it was just as
> easy for WADA to find him in Girona,



Sure, in the U.S. Lance was subjected to OOC tests (though if you read
Mike Anderson's lawsuit, LA scammed his way out of one), but Lance was
never tested in Spain. One of the main reasons all the U.S. pros live
in Girona is because there is no OOC testing in Spain. The UCI recently
started doing OOC tests in like 2005, but only a handful of people get
those and this is what all the cyclists are afraid of today.

But most cyclists just scam their way out of them (Lying about there
whereabouts) and there are no penalties.

WADA doesn't do OOC tests on cyclists in Europe. The only reason OOC
testing happens in the U.S. is because USADA does it. USADA doesn't
send people to Europe.


Magilla
 
M

Morten Reippuert Knudsen

Guest
Ryan Cousineau <[email protected]> wrote:

> Mind you, that was in Texas, but I would have thought it was just as
> easy for WADA to find him in Girona,


When did WADA begin out of competition tests?

--
Morten Reippuert Knudsen :) <http://blog.reippuert.dk>

Merlin Works CR-3/2.5 & Campagnolo Chorus 2007.
 
M

MagillaGorilla

Guest
Morten Reippuert Knudsen wrote:

> Mike Jacoubowsky <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>>You know, come to think of it, Hincapie probably was on dope in that stage
>>>like you suggest even if it was a trashcan break they let go up the road.
>>>Without dope, Hincapie should be no better than Rich Hincapie running into
>>>a barricade at the Tour of Nutley.
>>>
>>>I'm sure JT knows the details.
>>>
>>>Magilla

>>
>>If Hincapie was doped on that stage, you really think he would have gone for
>>the win?

>
>
> Why not? Basso, Hamilton, Perez, Herras, Ulrich, Jachkse, Landis,
> Vinokurov, Millar and a lot of other riders hasn't had any problems
> passing doping test while doped during the last 5 years. Why should
> Hincapee be any different?
>
> Do your really think passing an ordianry in-competition doping test
> means that you are not doping?
>
> Micro dosing of EPO, growthhormones, kortizone, bloddping with your
> own blood can not be detected. If your clever you can increase the
> dosage further when beeing out of competition.
>
> Ulrich, Basso, Jachkse and Millar never tested positive and all of
> them won races and passed tests while beeing juiced up.
> Hamilton managed to win a lot before getting caucht with forrign blood
> in his vains. From the Fuentes files we now know that durring 2003 he
> used EPO, growthhormones and kortizone while winning races as LBL,
> Tour de romandie and stages in TDF and the basqe country.
>
> I'm only mentioning riders who has officially been caught. this is
> 2007 and only ignorants can assume that a negative doping test can
> clear a rider from suspission.
>



Morten gave the answer I would have given. The riders who are subjected
to the most stringent doping controls are U.S. athletes due to the OOC
testing by USADA.

Euro pros are for the most part only tested before or after a race, both
of which can be easily defeated. And the UCI doesn't really enforce
riders who lie about their out-of-competition whereabouts.

In 2007, the UCI started getting aggressive with their new OOC testing,
which is how they caught Kash-n-Check in Turkey. But my guess is the UCI
only does a handful of OOC tests (maybe 20-40 a year?).

I bet you Pantani, DiLuca, Armstrong, Ullrich, Hincapie, Landis,
Hamilton....none those guys have ever been surprised tested once in Europe.


Magilla
 
M

MagillaGorilla

Guest
Morten Reippuert Knudsen wrote:

> Ryan Cousineau <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>Mind you, that was in Texas, but I would have thought it was just as
>>easy for WADA to find him in Girona,

>
>
> When did WADA begin out of competition tests?
>



Americans think that because USADA does OOC tests in the U.S., that WADA
does the OOC tests in Europe. Not true. WADA has never done and never
will do OOC testing in Europe.

OOC tests are the responsibility of national federations and
international federations, most of whom are corrupt and want to suppress
positive findings. Only recently has the UCI started OOC testing.

USADA has done OOC testing since 2001.



Magilla
 
M

Mike Jacoubowsky

Guest
>>
>> If Hincapie was doped on that stage, you really think he would have gone
>> for
>> the win?

>
> Why not? Basso, Hamilton, Perez, Herras, Ulrich, Jachkse, Landis,
> Vinokurov, Millar and a lot of other riders hasn't had any problems
> passing doping test while doped during the last 5 years. Why should
> Hincapee be any different?


Because if he was (doping), he was part of one of the very few teams that
didn't have problems with tests, for any of their members. If Postal/Disco
was doping, they were doing it better, more cautiously than the rest. They
were clearly under more control than other teams; better directed, more
organized. I simply don't think they'd take a chance.

> Do your really think passing an ordianry in-competition doping test
> means that you are not doping?


No.

> Micro dosing of EPO, growthhormones, kortizone, bloddping with your
> own blood can not be detected. If your clever you can increase the
> dosage further when beeing out of competition.


Except that, all things being equal, doping well below the levels of
detection aren't going to get the advantage you might wish. It simply might
equalize you with others out thee. The thread began with allegations that
George was doped heavily enough to be likely to win an event he wouldn't
normally do well in.

> Ulrich, Basso, Jachkse and Millar never tested positive and all of
> them won races and passed tests while beeing juiced up.
> Hamilton managed to win a lot before getting caucht with forrign blood
> in his vains. From the Fuentes files we now know that durring 2003 he
> used EPO, growthhormones and kortizone while winning races as LBL,
> Tour de romandie and stages in TDF and the basqe country.


Hamilton presumably got caught because of a screw-up (blood bags switched).

> I'm only mentioning riders who has officially been caught. this is
> 2007 and only ignorants can assume that a negative doping test can
> clear a rider from suspission.


I never said that. A negative test is obviously not proof of lack of doping,
but I maintain that fear of failing a test remains motivation for a
rational, intelligent system of doping & riding. A system which minimizes
risk and maximizes potential gain. Such systems don't encourage random
efforts (winning a state unexpectedly).

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com




"Morten Reippuert Knudsen" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
> Mike Jacoubowsky <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> You know, come to think of it, Hincapie probably was on dope in that
>>> stage
>>> like you suggest even if it was a trashcan break they let go up the
>>> road.
>>> Without dope, Hincapie should be no better than Rich Hincapie running
>>> into
>>> a barricade at the Tour of Nutley.
>>>
>>> I'm sure JT knows the details.
>>>
>>> Magilla

>>
>> If Hincapie was doped on that stage, you really think he would have gone
>> for
>> the win?

>
> Why not? Basso, Hamilton, Perez, Herras, Ulrich, Jachkse, Landis,
> Vinokurov, Millar and a lot of other riders hasn't had any problems
> passing doping test while doped during the last 5 years. Why should
> Hincapee be any different?
>
> Do your really think passing an ordianry in-competition doping test
> means that you are not doping?
>
> Micro dosing of EPO, growthhormones, kortizone, bloddping with your
> own blood can not be detected. If your clever you can increase the
> dosage further when beeing out of competition.
>
> Ulrich, Basso, Jachkse and Millar never tested positive and all of
> them won races and passed tests while beeing juiced up.
> Hamilton managed to win a lot before getting caucht with forrign blood
> in his vains. From the Fuentes files we now know that durring 2003 he
> used EPO, growthhormones and kortizone while winning races as LBL,
> Tour de romandie and stages in TDF and the basqe country.
>
> I'm only mentioning riders who has officially been caught. this is
> 2007 and only ignorants can assume that a negative doping test can
> clear a rider from suspission.
>
> --
> Morten Reippuert Knudsen :) <http://blog.reippuert.dk>
>
> Merlin Works CR-3/2.5 & Campagnolo Chorus 2007.
 
J

John Forrest Tomlinson

Guest
On Sun, 16 Dec 2007 13:24:57 -0500, MagillaGorilla
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Morten Reippuert Knudsen wrote:
>
>> Ryan Cousineau <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Mind you, that was in Texas, but I would have thought it was just as
>>>easy for WADA to find him in Girona,

>>
>>
>> When did WADA begin out of competition tests?
>>

>
>
>Americans think that because USADA does OOC tests in the U.S., that WADA
>does the OOC tests in Europe. Not true. WADA has never done and never
>will do OOC testing in Europe.
>
>OOC tests are the responsibility of national federations and
>international federations, most of whom are corrupt and want to suppress
>positive findings. Only recently has the UCI started OOC testing.
>
>USADA has done OOC testing since 2001.


You Ess Ay! You Ess Ay!
 
M

MagillaGorilla

Guest
Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:



>>Micro dosing of EPO, growthhormones, kortizone, bloddping with your
>>own blood can not be detected. If your clever you can increase the
>>dosage further when beeing out of competition.

>
>
> Except that, all things being equal, doping well below the levels of
> detection aren't going to get the advantage you might wish. It simply might
> equalize you with others out thee. The thread began with allegations that
> George was doped heavily enough to be likely to win an event he wouldn't
> normally do well in.
>



He doesn't mean that. These athletes dope to the gills and simply stop
7 days before a race where they will get 95% of the benefits of EPO but
not go above the 80% on the BAP electrophoresis.

Autologous blood doping, which goes back to the '84 Olympics, is still
undetectable. Vaughters stated in his IM's with Andreu that's the
program Postal prefers and the blood bags arrive via refrigerated
panniers on motorcycles.

Also, there is no OOC testing in Europe for the most part except for the
last year or so, and it's still a very limited test pool.

But when Lance was winning all those Tours, he knew neither him or his
teammates would ever be surprised tested in Girona. Never.

During the Tour, they did blood transfusiuons, HgH, and testosterone and
EPO leading up to July. It's unlikey they were using EPO during the
Tour because they were afraid to test positive.

Dude...if you took the dope out of these Pro Tour riders, they'd have a
tough time beating HealthNet in an NRC race.


Magilla
 
M

MagillaGorilla

Guest
Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:

>>>If Hincapie was doped on that stage, you really think he would have gone
>>>for
>>>the win?

>>
>>Why not? Basso, Hamilton, Perez, Herras, Ulrich, Jachkse, Landis,
>>Vinokurov, Millar and a lot of other riders hasn't had any problems
>>passing doping test while doped during the last 5 years. Why should
>>Hincapee be any different?

>
>
> Because if he was (doping), he was part of one of the very few teams that
> didn't have problems with tests, for any of their members. If Postal/Disco
> was doping, they were doing it better, more cautiously than the rest. They
> were clearly under more control than other teams; better directed, more
> organized. I simply don't think they'd take a chance.
>
>
>>Do your really think passing an ordianry in-competition doping test
>>means that you are not doping?

>
>
> No.
>
>
>>Micro dosing of EPO, growthhormones, kortizone, bloddping with your
>>own blood can not be detected. If your clever you can increase the
>>dosage further when beeing out of competition.

>
>
> Except that, all things being equal, doping well below the levels of
> detection aren't going to get the advantage you might wish. It simply might
> equalize you with others out thee. The thread began with allegations that
> George was doped heavily enough to be likely to win an event he wouldn't
> normally do well in.
>
>
>>Ulrich, Basso, Jachkse and Millar never tested positive and all of
>>them won races and passed tests while beeing juiced up.
>>Hamilton managed to win a lot before getting caucht with forrign blood
>>in his vains. From the Fuentes files we now know that durring 2003 he
>>used EPO, growthhormones and kortizone while winning races as LBL,
>>Tour de romandie and stages in TDF and the basqe country.

>
>
> Hamilton presumably got caught because of a screw-up (blood bags switched).
>
>
>>I'm only mentioning riders who has officially been caught. this is
>>2007 and only ignorants can assume that a negative doping test can
>>clear a rider from suspission.

>
>
> I never said that. A negative test is obviously not proof of lack of doping,
> but I maintain that fear of failing a test remains motivation for a
> rational, intelligent system of doping & riding. A system which minimizes
> risk and maximizes potential gain. Such systems don't encourage random
> efforts (winning a state unexpectedly).
>
> --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
> www.ChainReactionBicycles.com



Completely wrong. Pro's view the probability of failing a dope test as
merely a means to hone the timing and methodology so they can defeat the
tests.

As I stated before, there is no test for HgH or autologous blood
transfusions, so no need to fear the reaper on those two.

Neither is there fear of testing positive for EPO so long as you stop 7
days before the race. I'm not sure what other drugs a GC rider would
need to be quite honest, Mike.

And if you need something to open up your lungs during the race, just
get the resident doctor in Italy or Spain that all the guidos use to get
you the TUE.

You're making general statements. Pros employ very precise techniques
and strategies to beat the system. They don't sit around and decide not
to dope because of a philosophy discussion, which is what you wrongly
assume.

Look at Tylenol - dude is a pathological doper (and liar). And then he
got all his deep throating fans to pay for his laywer's fees.

If you went to Colorado and Hamilton showed up to a group ride, 90% of
the people in that ride would get an erection. And those who didn't
have a *****.



Magilla
 
On Dec 16, 4:02 pm, MagillaGorilla <[email protected]> wrote:

>
> As I stated before, there is no test for HgH or autologous blood
> transfusions, so no need to fear the reaper on those two.
>


dumbass,

the fact that when puerto happened only two out seventy (or whatever)
riders volunteered to do a DNA test should tell you everything you
need to know about the popularity of autologous blood doping.
 
M

MagillaGorilla

Guest
[email protected] wrote:

> On Dec 16, 4:02 pm, MagillaGorilla <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>As I stated before, there is no test for HgH or autologous blood
>>transfusions, so no need to fear the reaper on those two.
>>

>
>
> dumbass,
>
> the fact that when puerto happened only two out seventy (or whatever)
> riders volunteered to do a DNA test should tell you everything you
> need to know about the popularity of autologous blood doping.



You mean 69, not 70. Bo Derek was "cleared" by the Colombian Federation.

Ask the fashion designer for the details.

Magilla
 
On Dec 16, 8:06 am, Morten Reippuert Knudsen <[email protected]>
wrote:
> MagillaGorilla <[email protected]> wrote:
> > It's actually very low risk and the guys getting caught are either
> > accidentally getting the wrong bags of blood, getting tested by the
> > BRAND NEW out-of-competition tests by the UCI (Kashechkin), or are
> > keeping the gel patch on for too long (Sinkabitch, Fraud, Papp Smear).

>
> Actually the biggest fish beeing caught so far is because of
> police investigations or truth campaings following those
> investigations. (Festina, Corfidis, Oil for Drugs, Fuentes, Telecom)
>


dumbass,

that's correct. because i) the best dopers will evade the test, so
testing won't catch them and ii) ADAs don't have to authority to raid
apartments in madrid or wiretap cellphones.
 
W

William Asher

Guest
[email protected] wrote:

> On Dec 16, 4:02 pm, MagillaGorilla <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>
>> As I stated before, there is no test for HgH or autologous blood
>> transfusions, so no need to fear the reaper on those two.
>>

>
> dumbass,
>
> the fact that when puerto happened only two out seventy (or whatever)
> riders volunteered to do a DNA test should tell you everything you
> need to know about the popularity of autologous blood doping.


It also might explain why the top GC riders focus on only one tour. There
is only so much blood you can save up in the off-season.

--
Bill Asher