Hit by cyclist

Discussion in 'UK and Europe' started by Marcgan, Feb 6, 2004.

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  1. Marcgan

    Marcgan New Member

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    This morning, 10.00 London - Chenies Road at the junction with Tottenham Court Road. I was crossing the road and was almost at the other side when a cylclist travelling fast shouted at me and raced through the 3' gap between me and the kerb. Struck my hand and a bag I was carrying and continued still shouting at me towards Gower Street. I suspect that if he hadn't been travelling so fast he might have lost his balance.

    The cyclist was a tall man about 55-58 years old, glasses, helmet, light blue shirt or top and, I think, shorts. Carrying a bag on his back. I had the impressions that he was on his way to work and was going to change there. From the direction he was travelling and the time of the morning he could well have been heading to London University.
    If you know this man maybe you could suggest that he might like to email me so that we could arrange a drink (I'll pay) so that we can discuss peacably his particular style of cycling.
     
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  2. Elyob

    Elyob Guest

    "Marcgan" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > This morning, 10.00 London - Chenies Road at the junction with Tottenham Court Road. I was
    > crossing the road and was almost at the other side when a cylclist travelling fast shouted at me
    > and raced through the 3' gap between me and the kerb. Struck my hand and a bag I was carrying and
    > continued still shouting at me towards Gower Street. I suspect that if he hadn't been travelling
    > so fast he might have lost his balance.
    >
    > The cyclist was a tall man about 55-58 years old, glasses, helmet, light blue shirt or top and, I
    > think, shorts. Carrying a bag on his back. I had the impressions that he was on his way to work
    > and was going to change there. From the direction he was travelling and the time of the morning he
    > could well have been heading to London University. If you know this man maybe you could suggest
    > that he might like to email me so that we could arrange a drink (I'll pay) so that we can discuss
    > peacably his particular style of cycling.
    >

    It was me .. well actually it wasn't but I'll have the free drink.
     
  3. W K

    W K Guest

    "Marcgan" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > This morning, 10.00 London - Chenies Road at the junction with Tottenham Court Road. I was
    > crossing the road and was almost at the other side when a cylclist travelling fast shouted at me
    > and raced through the 3' gap between me and the kerb

    So you were jaywalking.

    Be glad you didn't do it in front of a car.
     
  4. On Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:42:25 +0000 (UTC), in
    <[email protected]>, "W K" <[email protected]>
    wrote:

    >
    >"Marcgan" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >news:[email protected]...
    >> This morning, 10.00 London - Chenies Road at the junction with Tottenham Court Road. I was
    >> crossing the road and was almost at the other side when a cylclist travelling fast shouted at me
    >> and raced through the 3' gap between me and the kerb
    >
    >So you were jaywalking.
    >
    >Be glad you didn't do it in front of a car.
    >
    What is "jaywalking"? Since when did a pedestrian lose the right to cross the road at any point he
    chooses unless there is a specific prohibition (e.g. No Pedestrian Sign) in place?
    --
    I remember when the internet was only in black & white. It only had a few pages but at least they
    all worked. Email: Put only the word "richard" before the @ sign.
     
  5. W K wrote:

    >"Marcgan" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >news:[email protected]...
    >
    >
    >>This morning, 10.00 London - Chenies Road at the junction with Tottenham Court Road. I was
    >>crossing the road and was almost at the other side when a cylclist travelling fast shouted at me
    >>and raced through the 3' gap between me and the kerb
    >>
    >>
    >
    >So you were jaywalking.
    >
    >
    >
    No such thing this side of the pond.
     
  6. >So you were jaywalking.
    >
    >Be glad you didn't do it in front of a car.

    Somewhat harsh.

    The original poster could be

    1. A troll trying to illicit the kind of respose you gave, thus perpetuating the myth that
    "cyclists" think themselves above the law.

    2. An entirely honest poster who was almost run-over by a cyclist behaving in a stupid and dangerous
    manner. Not all cyclists are paragons of virtue and *if* the original poster is legitimate and
    not trolling - such bad behaviour by a cyclist, or any road user, should not be condoned.

    Cheers, helen s

    --This is an invalid email address to avoid spam-- to get correct one remove dependency on fame &
    fortune h*$el*$$e**nd***$o$ts***i*$*$m**m$$o*n**[email protected]$*$a$$o**l.c**$*$om$$
     
  7. Marcgan

    Marcgan New Member

    Joined:
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    The original poster i.e. me, falls into category No.2 on Helen's list.

    I fully appreciate that many cyclists are poisoned against motorists - and probably with some justification. However, those cyclists who dole out the sort of comment made by WK (above) have clearly lost their sense of place and have become to pedestrians as many motorists are to cyclists.
    I should be very sorry as a pedestrian to find myself obliged to reconsider my attitude towards cyclists.
     
  8. W K

    W K Guest

    "dirtylitterboxofferingstospammers" <[email protected]> wrote in
    message news:[email protected]...
    > >So you were jaywalking.
    > >
    > >Be glad you didn't do it in front of a car.
    >
    > Somewhat harsh.

    Yes. In one of those moods.

    > The original poster could be
    >
    > 1. A troll trying to illicit the kind of respose you gave, thus
    perpetuating
    > the myth that "cyclists" think themselves above the law.

    I thought it was a troll, but uk.t types would be (in fact, _regularly_are_) quite happy to blame
    pedestrians crossing in front of vehicles.

    > 2. An entirely honest poster who was almost run-over by a cyclist behaving
    in a
    > stupid and dangerous manner. Not all cyclists are paragons of virtue and
    *if*
    > the original poster is legitimate and not trolling - such bad behaviour by
    a
    > cyclist, or any road user, should not be condoned.

    I do not condone such things, and you may note a post on a similar matter a couple of days ago.

    OTOH what do you do if someone is crossing the road in front of you? I've certainly cycled towards
    pedestrians in the road, and been gobsmacked that they just haven't spotted me etc.

    There are other explanations of how it happened than the OP's version. We don't know quite how fast
    he was going (either of them for that matter), or to what extent the cyclist was being cocky, or
    actually approaching with the assumption that someone crossing the road would see them before it
    was too late.

    Its a "bad call" to keep on cycling towards a pedestrian - but this OAP lycra lout may well have
    thought that he could have got past without hitting them.
     
  9. Stephen \

    Stephen \ Guest

    dirtylitterboxofferingstospammers wrote:
    >> So you were jaywalking.
    >>
    >> Be glad you didn't do it in front of a car.
    >
    > Somewhat harsh.
    >
    > The original poster could be
    >
    > 1. A troll trying to illicit the kind of respose you gave, thus perpetuating the myth that
    > "cyclists" think themselves above the law.
    >
    > 2. An entirely honest poster who was almost run-over by a cyclist behaving in a stupid and
    > dangerous manner. Not all cyclists are paragons of virtue and *if* the original poster is
    > legitimate and not trolling - such bad behaviour by a cyclist, or any road user, should not be
    > condoned.
    >
    3. A pedestrian who looks out for cars but not for bikes when crossing

    4. A pedestrian that looks for neither cars nor bikes when crossing.

    etc
     
  10. "Richard Bates" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...

    > What is "jaywalking"? Since when did a pedestrian lose the right to cross the road at any point he
    > chooses unless there is a specific prohibition (e.g. No Pedestrian Sign) in place?

    It is however customary to wait for a gap in the traffic. I did recently see a man who looked like a
    tramp cross the busy 4 lane road outside my flat by just walking out and put his hand out to stop
    the traffic, which I guess is legal, but I'm not sure I'd go for that method!
     
  11. Cicero

    Cicero Guest

    <snipped>
    >
    > Its a "bad call" to keep on cycling towards a pedestrian - but this OAP lycra lout may well have
    > thought that he could have got past without
    hitting
    > them.
    >
    >
    =============
    The 'lycra lout' wasn't an OAP. According to the OP he was '55-58 years old'. Please don't blame us
    respectable oldies for the sins of the uncaring and reckless youth.

    Cic.
     
  12. "Cicero" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:O%[email protected]...

    > The 'lycra lout' wasn't an OAP. According to the OP he was '55-58 years old'......

    Cycling can make you look quite a bit younger due to the regular excercise, so he *could* easily
    have been a youthful OAP.
     
  13. Sandy Morton

    Sandy Morton Guest

    In article <O%[email protected]>, Cicero
    <[email protected]> wrote:
    > Please don't blame us respectable oldies for the sins of the uncaring and reckless youth.

    I don't want to be a responsible "oldie" - I've spent all my life being respectabe;! I want to be a
    mad and impetuous geriatric :))

    --
    A T (Sandy) Morton on the Bicycle Island In the Global Village http://www.sandymillport.fsnet.co.uk
     
  14. W K

    W K Guest

    "Adrian Boliston" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > "Cicero" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:O%[email protected]
    > text.cableinet.net...
    >
    > > The 'lycra lout' wasn't an OAP. According to the OP he was '55-58 years old'......
    >
    > Cycling can make you look quite a bit younger due to the regular
    excercise, so he
    > *could* easily have been a youthful OAP.
    >

    yeah ... I was going to say that.
     
  15. Mseries

    Mseries Guest

    Marcgan wrote:
    > This morning, 10.00 London - Chenies Road at the junction with Tottenham Court Road. I was
    > crossing the road and was almost at the other side when a cylclist travelling fast shouted at me
    > and raced through the 3' gap between me and the kerb. Struck my hand and a bag I was carrying and
    > continued still shouting at me towards Gower Street. I suspect that if he hadn't been travelling
    > so fast he might have lost his balance.
    >
    > The cyclist was a tall man about 55-58 years old, glasses, helmet, light blue shirt or top and, I
    > think, shorts. Carrying a bag on his back. I had the impressions that he was on his way to work
    > and was going to change there. From the direction he was travelling and the time of the morning he
    > could well have been heading to London University. If you know this man maybe you could suggest
    > that he might like to email me so that we could arrange a drink (I'll pay) so that we can discuss
    > peacably his particular style of cycling.

    Sounds to me like one of those 'lyrca lout' types that Ms Hoey writes about. A clear case of
    Furious Cycling.

    --
    The Reply & From email addresses are checked rarely. http://www.mseries.freeserve.co.uk
     
  16. Tony Raven

    Tony Raven Guest

    Stephen (aka steford) wrote:
    >>
    > 3. A pedestrian who looks out for cars but not for bikes when crossing
    >
    > 4. A pedestrian that looks for neither cars nor bikes when crossing.
    >

    Since it appears he was most of the way across the road when it happened, neither are valid excuses.
    The cyclists had plenty of opportunity to avoid him and should have done. If a car had done the same
    to a cyclist, everyone here would be up in arms about the driver's behaviour.

    Tony
     
  17. David Martin

    David Martin Guest

    On 6/2/04 1:24 pm, in article [email protected],
    "Marcgan" <[email protected]> wrote:

    > The original poster i.e. me, falls into category No.2 on Helen's list.
    >
    > I fully appreciate that many cyclists are poisoned against motorists - and probably with some
    > justification. However, those cyclists who dole out the sort of comment made by WK (above) have
    > clearly lost their sense of place and have become to pedestrians as many motorists are to
    > cyclists. I should be very sorry as a pedestrian to find myself obliged to reconsider my attitude
    > towards cyclists.
    >

    I'm trying to understand what happened here..

    You were crossing TCR when a cyclist travelling along TCR nearly collided with you?

    If this is the case (and the cyclist hadn't just jumped red lights etc.) :

    Given the width of TCR and the time it takes to cross, the cyclist must have been clearly visible
    for some time (or you were dodging through traffic so the view was obscured, either ay your
    description isn't complete)

    If you saw him then you must have known that you were on a collision course and have expected him to
    brake sharply or otherwise take avoiding action which could be difficult or hazardous at speed. If
    you didn't see him then either you weren't looking (and failing then to proceed with due care and
    attention) or views were obscured and he was as surprised as you were.

    It is not normal to expect pedestrians to just walk in front of you. When he is travelling slower
    than a car, but obviously faster than he can just stop on a sixpence, it is not unreasonable to
    expect all road users to act with a degree of consideration and look where they are going and at
    what impact their actions will have on other road users.

    More explaination of the event is needed to be able to work out who was actually in the wrong.

    ..d
     
  18. W K

    W K Guest

    "Marcgan" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > The original poster i.e. me, falls into category No.2 on Helen's list.
    >
    > I fully appreciate that many cyclists are poisoned against motorists - and probably with some
    > justification. However, those cyclists who dole out the sort of comment made by WK (above) have
    > clearly lost their sense of place

    This is usenet. What I said there to what I consider to be a whinging troll does not represent the
    way I cycle. Am I wrong to think that you have just come to these newsgroups to whinge? I posted
    something entirely different to a bloke who thought it was his fault in almost identical conditions,
    when a cyclist hit him.

    > and have become to pedestrians as many motorists are to cyclists. I should be very sorry as a
    > pedestrian to find myself obliged to reconsider my attitude towards cyclists.

    Ha. If only that were true. I'm guessing you had that attitude for a start anyway.

    When you walked into the road in front of a cyclist, the old guy didn't behave in a sensible way. If
    whilst out on the road I see someone behave in a strange way, I do not always slam on the brakes. In
    a case very similar to your own I thought (fairly reasonably), that the pedestrian would look, see,
    and stop before getting half way across the road. I made the correct decisions and missed. He may
    have made very similar decisions and hit you. Yet you paint him in a very bad light and seem to want
    to "speak to him".

    What exactly do you want to say? I'd say "be aware that pedestrians are often "bike blind".

    BTW - how fast were you crossing the road? You obviously hadn't seen him, but did he have enough
    time to react more sensibly?
     
  19. On Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:27:11 -0000, in
    <[email protected]>, "Adrian Boliston"
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    >"Richard Bates" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >news:[email protected]...
    >
    >> What is "jaywalking"? Since when did a pedestrian lose the right to cross the road at any point
    >> he chooses unless there is a specific prohibition (e.g. No Pedestrian Sign) in place?
    >
    >It is however customary to wait for a gap in the traffic. I did recently see a man who looked like
    >a tramp cross the busy 4 lane road outside my flat by just walking out and put his hand out to stop
    >the traffic, which I guess is legal, but I'm not sure I'd go for that method!

    I agree that nowadays that seems to be the accepted norm (not that I think it should be). However
    there is an onus upon users of cars and bicycles to look out for people crossing the road.

    The highway code states that when turning into a side road, pedestrians crossing that side road have
    priority over you. It says nothing about situations when there is no junction involved.

    Somebody knowledgeable may know the answer to this: The highway code many years ago lost the phrase
    "the pedestrian has right of way at all times". Even though it is no longer in the HC, does it still
    appear in the Road Traffic Act ?

    --
    I remember when the internet was only in black & white. It only had a few pages but at least they
    all worked. Email: Put only the word "richard" before the @ sign.
     
  20. David Martin

    David Martin Guest

    On 6/2/04 1:45 pm, in article [email protected],
    "Tony Raven" <[email protected]> wrote:

    > Since it appears he was most of the way across the road when it happened, neither are valid
    > excuses. The cyclists had plenty of opportunity to avoid him and should have done. If a car had
    > done the same to a cyclist, everyone here would be up in arms about the driver's behaviour.
    >

    For a cyclist riding across the flow of traffic? One would normally expect the road user making a
    change of direction or crossing the main flow of traffic to make some effort to impede other road
    users as little as possible.

    If it had been a car travelling int eh same direction/speed as the cyclist would the OP be ranting
    about car drivers now? Or do they expect everyone to magically get out of the way no matter which
    direction they happen to decide to be travelling in.

    ..d
     
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