How about Lance Armstrong...?!

[rolfdevinci]

Yup...Lance is a great role model and has done a remarkable thing for cancer awareness and his inherent strength is well known but I wish you would give just a little credit for his survival and subsequent Tde F victories to some of the oncologists, doctors, cancer specialists and nurses who were responsible for his course of treatment and, ultimately, his remission.

In his book he often mentions how he put his fate in the hands of his medical team of doctors and trusted that their decisions would save his life....and his career.

Lance had the best of the best medical attention and it was a decision that probably saved his life. Like Sako Koivu of the Montreal Canadians having access to the best that medical science can offer is an advantage. I kinda wonder if my sister in law, father and best friend would have beat the odds if they had the resources that a pro athlete like Lance or Sako had?

Even the most mundane, ordinary folk have the potential for greatness if they have the opportunity to shine.

That said I agree Lance is a role model and I wear a livestrong bracelet with pride and in memory of all those I know who have been touched by cancer. I also appreciate, though, the dedication of those faceless medical professionals who save lives on a daily basis. They are the real heros but we never realize that until we need them.

I agree as well.......good to see North Americans getting into the Euro cycling scene. Heck...we let the Euros play hockey here so fairs fair huh? LOL.

 

[wolfix]

I dispute the authenticity of LA's performances, based on the fact that he itterly transformed himself (1992-1996 to 1999-now).
But that is only one issue.
I like the USA and it's people - I disagree with George Bush and his policies but that's it.
I don't think these views (LA and Bush) deem me to be anti-American.
Good knows I've enough in-laws, who are American !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yep, I know of Fred Rdriguez - saw him at Paris Nice this year.
Good cyclist as you say.

I hope that it is the start of something good from the USA in terms of pro joining the ranks and competing.
Naturally those other sports will still command most attention from youngsters
but maybe this might be the start, as was pointed out.
I think it would be a very positive development.

Limerickman,
I fully understand as to why someone would dispute Armstrongs wins after cancer..... I too thought "performance enhancing'" in the beginning ...... But if you look at his accomplishments at a young age , I think it becomes clear that he is a driven and a tremendous althlete..... He was beating national class tri athletes right after graduating from high school...... And he was cyclings World Champion at a very young age. And we forget that Pantani and Greg LeMond came back after major injuries to win the tour. Lance trains harder then most riders . And he is a tough competitor ..... Similar to your own Sean Kelly.....

 

[snyper0311]

Well, I also agree wholeheartedly with rolfdevinci. You have to give those in the medical profession two thumbs up! They are the modern day saints fo those of us who have had to place our lives in their hands. See, I also had a battle with cancer-which I am winning thanks to the doctors and medical people that have treated me. What they did for Lance is nothing short of a miracle.

I also have to say that cycling in the US is definately picking up. There are smaller stage races here in the US that are starting to gain in popularity. One such race is the Tour of The Gila in Silver City, New Mexico. Another is the Sea Otter Classic, in California.

One close positives that I've seen is my little brother. He was invited to Spain to try out (if that's what you call it) for a well known Spanish team. He was fortunate enough to train with the top pros and get a feel for the touring life. The only negative is that he had to go outside the US to get his chance. So, we may be behind the rest of the world, but we are starting to make a difference.

 

[Don Quijote]

As a general medicine physician assistant I appreciate your perspective.

The best medical treatment of the world will not best benefit the patient unless there is a firm therapeutic alliance between the healthcare team and the patient/family/significant others. I believe it is about team work, and Lance has demonstrated that he is a master at that.

The will to achieve healing and positive health outcomes is really up to the patient, and some of the best medicine is practice by "doctors without borders", where supplies are limited and improvisation with creativity in the the daily practice of medicine is the norm and a must to maximize positive health outcomes. The best treatments and medicines will not be as effective if the patient is not willing to trust and make it work! Don Q

Yup...Lance is a great role model and has done a remarkable thing for cancer awareness and his inherent strength is well known but I wish you would give just a little credit for his survival and subsequent Tde F victories to some of the oncologists, doctors, cancer specialists and nurses who were responsible for his course of treatment and, ultimately, his remission.

In his book he often mentions how he put his fate in the hands of his medical team of doctors and trusted that their decisions would save his life....and his career.

Lance had the best of the best medical attention and it was a decision that probably saved his life. Like Sako Koivu of the Montreal Canadians having access to the best that medical science can offer is an advantage. I kinda wonder if my sister in law, father and best friend would have beat the odds if they had the resources that a pro athlete like Lance or Sako had?

Even the most mundane, ordinary folk have the potential for greatness if they have the opportunity to shine.

That said I agree Lance is a role model and I wear a livestrong bracelet with pride and in memory of all those I know who have been touched by cancer. I also appreciate, though, the dedication of those faceless medical professionals who save lives on a daily basis. They are the real heros but we never realize that until we need them.

I agree as well.......good to see North Americans getting into the Euro cycling scene. Heck...we let the Euros play hockey here so fairs fair huh? LOL.

 

[meehs]

I often wonder how much most americans will ever really get into cycling. Lance has a good story and wins, and that's why americans like him. I can't imagine cycling will stay as popular in the US once lance retires.

But who knows? With OLN showing a race every sunday, maybe people will start to understand and like it. Even my redneck uncle is into it.

I also wonder how much attention will be paid to professional cycling by Americans when Armstrong isn't around anymore. There was a thread addressing this very topic that was pretty active on this forum not too long ago.

Rest assured that those of us that were fans of the sport long before Armstrong ever started winning (or even before LeMond started winning for that matter!) will still be fans. The only thing I'm afraid of is that all of the great television and press coverage that the sport has received in the USA during the Armstrong era will go by the wayside once he retires. Unless a new American rider (or riders) steps-up to garner the attention that has been focused on Lance.

But hey, if your redneck uncle is into it, that's a step in the right direction! My Mom asked me during the TdF last year "how's Lance Armstrong doing?"!

 

[limerickman]

I also wonder how much attention will be paid to professional cycling by Americans when Armstrong isn't around anymore. There was a thread addressing this very topic that was pretty active on this forum not too long ago.

Rest assured that those of us that were fans of the sport long before Armstrong ever started winning (or even before LeMond started winning for that matter!) will still be fans. The only thing I'm afraid of is that all of the great television and press coverage that the sport has received in the USA during the Armstrong era will go by the wayside once he retires. Unless a new American rider (or riders) steps-up to garner the attention that has been focused on Lance.

But hey, if your redneck uncle is into it, that's a step in the right direction! My Mom asked me during the TdF last year "how's Lance Armstrong doing?"!

Not wishing to go off topic, Meehs, but Greg LeMond is from your part of the world.
Did you ever meet the man ?
And if you did - what did you make of him ?

 

[rolfdevinci]

I also wonder how much attention will be paid to professional cycling by Americans when Armstrong isn't around anymore. There was a thread addressing this very topic that was pretty active on this forum not too long ago.

Rest assured that those of us that were fans of the sport long before Armstrong ever started winning (or even before LeMond started winning for that matter!) will still be fans. The only thing I'm afraid of is that all of the great television and press coverage that the sport has received in the USA during the Armstrong era will go by the wayside once he retires. Unless a new American rider (or riders) steps-up to garner the attention that has been focused on Lance.

But hey, if your redneck uncle is into it, that's a step in the right direction! My Mom asked me during the TdF last year "how's Lance Armstrong doing?"!

Agreed! Unfortunately Mr. Armstrong has raised the bar(of expectation) so high that any future American rider may always be compared(unfairly) to Lance. I`m sure there are many young French riders who find themselves compared to the likes of Hinault or Belgians compared to Eddy`s legacy. Since cycling is not as popular in NA the departure of Lance could result in a decline in interest.

 

[meehs]

Not wishing to go off topic, Meehs, but Greg LeMond is from your part of the world.
Did you ever meet the man ?
And if you did - what did you make of him ?

Actually I grew-up in a western suburb of Minneapolis that's right next to the town where LeMond lived at the time. Unfortunately I've never met him but by all accounts I've heard he's a really good guy.

Years ago (in the late eighties, back when Greg was still competing) a freind and I were out for a Sunday morning ride. We were on the home stretch and saw two riders approaching from the opposite direction wearing full "Team Z" kit. I said to my friend "hey look, here comes some dudes who think that they're Greg LeMond". As we passed them we saw that it WAS Greg LeMond! The other rider was evidently one of his team mates or a friend of Greg's. We had a good laugh.

I also saw LeMond in a video rental store years later, after he had retired I think. I'm not one to collect autographs or anything like that but I would certainly liked to have met him. I was too dumbstruck to say anything!

I feel that an apology is owed because in a couple of other threads on this forum I was bad-mouthing LeMond about the comments that he made concerning Armstrong's possible PED use. After thinking about it more, I realize that I was wrong to have said those things. LeMond was a great champion and he's very well respected. He has every right to give his opinion and as cycling fans, we should all listen.

There was another forum member - "Cipher" - from this area who is very good friends with Greg LeMond. I haven't seen him around lately. I'm sure he got tired of all of the posts (including my own) that were bad-mouthing LeMond after he came forth with his information about Lance's PED use. Sorry Cipher! I take it all back.

A lot of people forget about Greg LeMond's own comeback story because it has been overshadowed by Armstrong's. He was nearly dead when he was rescued from a hunting accident that left him with a collapsed lung and a huge amount of blood lost. He was able to comeback and win the TdF!

Also, who could forget LeMond's 8 second win over Fignon in 1989? Unbelievable!

 

[limerickman]

Actually I grew-up in a western suburb of Minneapolis that's right next to the town where LeMond lived at the time. Unfortunately I've never met him but by all accounts I've heard he's a really good guy.

Years ago (in the late eighties, back when Greg was still competing) a freind and I were out for a Sunday morning ride. We were on the home stretch and saw two riders approaching from the opposite direction wearing full "Team Z" kit. I said to my friend "hey look, here comes some dudes who think that they're Greg LeMond". As we passed them we saw that it WAS Greg LeMond! The other rider was evidently one of his team mates or a friend of Greg's. We had a good laugh.

I also saw LeMond in a video rental store years later, after he had retired I think. I'm not one to collect autographs or anything like that but I would certainly liked to have met him. I was too dumbstruck to say anything!

I feel that an apology is owed because in a couple of other threads on this forum I was bad-mouthing LeMond about the comments that he made concerning Armstrong's possible PED use. After thinking about it more, I realize that I was wrong to have said those things. LeMond was a great champion and he's very well respected. He has every right to give his opinion and as cycling fans, we should all listen.

There was another forum member - "Cipher" - from this area who is very good friends with Greg LeMond. I haven't seen him around lately. I'm sure he got tired of all of the posts (including my own) that were bad-mouthing LeMond after he came forth with his information about Lance's PED use. Sorry Cipher! I take it all back.

A lot of people forget about Greg LeMond's own comeback story because it has been overshadowed by Armstrong's. He was nearly dead when he was rescued from a hunting accident that left him with a collapsed lung and a huge amount of blood lost. He was able to comeback and win the TdF!

Also, who could forget LeMond's 8 second win over Fignon in 1989? Unbelievable!

The reason I ask is that I have a good friend living in St Paul and he is a cycling nut and he actually got to meet Greg MeMond a couple of years ago.
As you say, he was dumbstruck too but said that LeMond is very very approachable and easy going.
He got his autograph (my mate has TDF Yellow Jersey and he's trying to get autographs from all of the TDF winners).
So he now has Roche, Delgado, Hinault, Fignon, LeMond - we're working on getting Riis, Indurain and Armstrong's names added. (this has taken nearly 10
years !!!).

But yes, Greg is widely respected - throughout the cycling community over here.
His win in 1989, was the for me the best TDF ever - I'd even rate it higher
than our own Stephen Roche's victory in 1987 (and as an Irishman, i would naturally be biased toward 1987 TDF).
That final ITT in to Paris was something else - when Greg beat Fignon (who was a superb ITTist).
That was a great year for Greg - TDF and road race champion of the world in Chambery.
I thought Sean Kelly had it that day in Chambery but LeMond beat him !
He was a superb cyclist and popular in France too.

Next time you see him, Meehs, you should ask him for an autograph.

 

[meehs]

The reason I ask is that I have a good friend living in St Paul and he is a cycling nut and he actually got to meet Greg MeMond a couple of years ago.
As you say, he was dumbstruck too but said that LeMond is very very approachable and easy going.
He got his autograph (my mate has TDF Yellow Jersey and he's trying to get autographs from all of the TDF winners).
So he now has Roche, Delgado, Hinault, Fignon, LeMond - we're working on getting Riis, Indurain and Armstrong's names added. (this has taken nearly 10
years !!!).

But yes, Greg is widely respected - throughout the cycling community over here.
His win in 1989, was the for me the best TDF ever - I'd even rate it higher
than our own Stephen Roche's victory in 1987 (and as an Irishman, i would naturally be biased toward 1987 TDF).
That final ITT in to Paris was something else - when Greg beat Fignon (who was a superb ITTist).
That was a great year for Greg - TDF and road race champion of the world in Chambery.
I thought Sean Kelly had it that day in Chambery but LeMond beat him !
He was a superb cyclist and popular in France too.

Next time you see him, Meehs, you should ask him for an autograph.

Yeah, Limerickman. That's the same thing that I've heard from everyone that I know of who has had the opportunity to meet LeMond. A very likable and approachable guy. If I ever do see him again (however I think that he no longer lives in Minnesota full-time) I'll have to make it a point to at least say hello. Maybe even ask for an autograph even though that's something I've never done before.

Have you seen Greg on television or in person lately? I saw him featured on HGTV ("Home and Garden Television", a cable station here in the USA that my wife loves to watch). They featured him on a show about unique homes because he owns a very unique cabin up in the mountains somewhere (sorry, I forget the details about the cabin). Anyway, Greg came riding up on his mountain bike and he's looking much more fit these days. For a while there he was looking quite overweight!

Your friend's yellow jersey/autograph collection sounds very cool! Now that's something worthy of getting an autograph for. He has an impressive list of autographs on it already. You need to add Eddy Merckx to the list of autographs that he needs to get. It just wouldn't be complete with out Merckx!

I think that LeMond's victory over Fignon in 1989 has to be my favorite TdF also. So exciting! I admit that I did feel bad for Fignon though. He was devestated! However, he was very gracious in defeat I thought. I have to say that I'm surprised that you rank it higher than Roche's victory in 1987 (also a memorable one, especially for Ireland I'm sure).

I remember when LeMond beat Kelly for the World Championship. I know that LeMond won the Worlds on at least one other occasion and maybe even two didn't he? Sean Kelly was one of my favorite riders back at that time. He was great in the classics! I always wanted him to see him win the TdF but I guess he was just more of a classics rider. A great rider none the less. I remember Kelly riding with clips and straps when almost the entire peleton had made the switch to clipless pedals!

 

[txzen]

I often wonder how much most americans will ever really get into cycling. Lance has a good story and wins, and that's why americans like him. I can't imagine cycling will stay as popular in the US once lance retires.

They said the same thing after the Lemond years. This current crop of American riders no doubt watched great Americans like Alexi Grewal and Lemond...and that's way before we got any decent TV coverage. I'm hopeful that there are some young guys who have watched Armstrong for the past years, and have seen American cycling really flourish.

In a way, it may be nice once Lance isn't in the Tour, just because OLN and the networks tend to focus only on him. Besides many of the other great, great international riders, there are several Americans who are racing beautifully these days.

 

[limerickman]

Yeah, Limerickman. That's the same thing that I've heard from everyone that I know of who has had the opportunity to meet LeMond. A very likable and approachable guy. If I ever do see him again (however I think that he no longer lives in Minnesota full-time) I'll have to make it a point to at least say hello. Maybe even ask for an autograph even though that's something I've never done before.

Have you seen Greg on television or in person lately? I saw him featured on HGTV ("Home and Garden Television", a cable station here in the USA that my wife loves to watch). They featured him on a show about unique homes because he owns a very unique cabin up in the mountains somewhere (sorry, I forget the details about the cabin). Anyway, Greg came riding up on his mountain bike and he's looking much more fit these days. For a while there he was looking quite overweight!

Your friend's yellow jersey/autograph collection sounds very cool! Now that's something worthy of getting an autograph for. He has an impressive list of autographs on it already. You need to add Eddy Merckx to the list of autographs that he needs to get. It just wouldn't be complete with out Merckx!

I think that LeMond's victory over Fignon in 1989 has to be my favorite TdF also. So exciting! I admit that I did feel bad for Fignon though. He was devestated! However, he was very gracious in defeat I thought. I have to say that I'm surprised that you rank it higher than Roche's victory in 1987 (also a memorable one, especially for Ireland I'm sure).

I remember when LeMond beat Kelly for the World Championship. I know that LeMond won the Worlds on at least one other occasion and maybe even two didn't he? Sean Kelly was one of my favorite riders back at that time. He was great in the classics! I always wanted him to see him win the TdF but I guess he was just more of a classics rider. A great rider none the less. I remember Kelly riding with clips and straps when almost the entire peleton had made the switch to clipless pedals!

LeMond was on Eurosport either last year or the year before - he was invited in to the commentary box with to talk with the resident commentators, Sean Kelly and David Duffield.
We don't get shots of the commentary box - so we only had words.
But there was photo of him in that months Cycle Sport and although he's put on some weight - he looks reasonably fresh (he was leading groups cycling up Alp D'Huez).
kelly commented after Greg left the commentary spot that he (LeMond) was one of the all time greats and a very hard man to beat in races.

Yeah i thought 1989 for sheer excitment was the best TDF of all.
1987 was great from an Irish perspective but 1989 was more exciting, from a pure cycling point of view.

Forgot to mention - my pal in St Paul has Merckx autogragh on the jersey.
How could I leave out Eddy !

And you're right about Sean refusing to go clipless - if I recall he said that he found it difficult to get used to the sensation of clipless pedals !

 

[Don Quijote]

Anyone knows about Lace's new sponsoring Discovery team and its new line up of some new faces, and their respective role and potential in the team's potential for success at the upcoming great Euro classics and the TDF? Don Q

 

[wolfix]

I had the chance to meet LeMond back before he went to Europe & fame......He sat in a group of us having a after race pizza ..... The interesting thing was that nobody really knew who he was at the time. { If I remember right , there were a few other juniors in that room that were stronger riders ...... Interesting } He was a great guy . He did not carry the arrogance that some riders with far less creditentials had......... My favorite moment was the TDF when he won in the final TT ...... I had mixed emotions the day he beat Sean though [my favorite rider at the time.] I felt Mr. Kelly should have worn the rainbow jersey at least once....... He really deserved one.
The "Lance Argument" is an interesting one......... But from an American viewpoint , we are not as lucky as Europeans to see the "Classics", the other "Tours", etc. etc, etc.......
So it's natural for riders like Lance and Greg and their sponsors to target theTDF.......
I started folllowing the TDF back in the very early 70's...... It was hard to find out who won, because our cycling publications were 6-9 weeks behind. I went to the local university and had to find a bi-lingual student to read the French press to me......... So , when I read the complaints about the lack of TV coverage and OLN ,I have to laugh .......
Then we have the ......
"The Lance winning the tour will help cycling in this country."
I do not believe so ....... Grassroot racing in my area is down from the 70's as far as road racing goes........ The mountain bike scene is larger.......... I would rather see our federation money staying here in this country to help the local races rather then trying to develope riders so they can leave for Europe........ But don't get me started on that .......
In America , we have too many mainstream sports for cycling ever to get major network attention ..... But that's ok ....... There are plenty of local races with-in 100 miles to enjoy live........

 

[wolfix]

Hey limerickman,
Did your friend in St. Paul catch the St. Pat's Day festival there ?..... I missed it this year..... I went a few times , and to be honest , I was impresseed..... Normally , I always thought that people from St. Paul were rather repressed...... The beer always flows in St. Paul on that day ........

 

[strummer_fan]

LeMond was on Eurosport either last year or the year before - he was invited in to the commentary box with to talk with the resident commentators, Sean Kelly and David Duffield.
We don't get shots of the commentary box - so we only had words.
But there was photo of him in that months Cycle Sport and although he's put on some weight - he looks reasonably fresh (he was leading groups cycling up Alp D'Huez).
kelly commented after Greg left the commentary spot that he (LeMond) was one of the all time greats and a very hard man to beat in races.

Yeah i thought 1989 for sheer excitment was the best TDF of all.
1987 was great from an Irish perspective but 1989 was more exciting, from a pure cycling point of view.

Forgot to mention - my pal in St Paul has Merckx autogragh on the jersey.
How could I leave out Eddy !

And you're right about Sean refusing to go clipless - if I recall he said that he found it difficult to get used to the sensation of clipless pedals !

What is Sean Kelly up to these days? Does he still live in Carrick on Suir? His twins must be teenagers by now. Have either of them taken up the sport?

Kelly remains one of my absolute favorites and I'm curious as to what he's been doing.

 

[limerickman]

Hey limerickman,
Did your friend in St. Paul catch the St. Pat's Day festival there ?..... I missed it this year..... I went a few times , and to be honest , I was impresseed..... Normally , I always thought that people from St. Paul were rather repressed...... The beer always flows in St. Paul on that day ........

I mailed him earlier this week - but he hasn't told me if he was out celebrating
Patricks Day.

 

[limerickman]

What is Sean Kelly up to these days? Does he still live in Carrick on Suir? His twins must be teenagers by now. Have either of them taken up the sport?

Kelly remains one of my absolute favorites and I'm curious as to what he's been doing.

Sean is living back in Carrick on Suir with his wife Linda and his two children,
Nigel and Stacy.
I know Sean quite well, having got to know him quite well over the past few years.
His kids are 12 or 13 now.
Nigel shows no interest in cycling - Sean would tell you this himself !

He built a magnificent house in Carrick and has invested his money wisely.
He still cycles though - regularly goes out with his old club Carrick Wheelers
at weekends.
He actually took part in a few amateur races here in Ireland during the past few years and finished very respectably against the top amateur guys.
He does commentary work for Eurosport as well.