How did Armstrong do in Dauphiné? (spoiler)

Discussion in 'Road Cycling' started by Malte Lewan Nee, Jun 8, 2003.

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  1. He's beaten! You could follow it live (no pictures) on
    http://www.eurosport.fr/home/pages/TF1/V3/L3/S18/E5636/live_Lng3_Spo18_E
    vt5636_Mtc61777_SitTF1.shtml: "Lance Armstrong est battu ! Il ne peut faire mieux que 8'55" et
    termine en 3e position !" Tyler Hamilton was only 36th. Iban Mayo won, beating David Millar.

    So, was Armstrong trying? You might think he was, considering how well he did, after all. But he's
    expected to win the ITTs in TdF as usual (if not Botero interfers, like last year).

    Results and analysis on
    http://www.cyclingnews.com/road/2003/jun03/DauphineLibere03/?id=results/ prologue

    --
    «Wänn i de Schwitz s Volk redet, händ d Politikär ruhig sii.»
     
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  2. Us

    Us Guest

    10 seconds wow now that's a huge defecit to overcome.... and it's just the prolog my
    friend............. oh a ....short but challenging parcours of just 5.1km yeah i bet that
    hurt.........

    Malte Lewan Neelsen wrote:

    > He's beaten! You could follow it live (no pictures) on
    > http://www.eurosport.fr/home/pages/TF1/V3/L3/S18/E5636/live_Lng3_Spo18_E
    > vt5636_Mtc61777_SitTF1.shtml: "Lance Armstrong est battu ! Il ne peut faire mieux que 8'55" et
    > termine en 3e position !" Tyler Hamilton was only 36th. Iban Mayo won, beating David Millar.
    >
    > So, was Armstrong trying? You might think he was, considering how well he did, after all. But he's
    > expected to win the ITTs in TdF as usual (if not Botero interfers, like last year).
    >
    > Results and analysis on http://www.cyclingnews.com/road/2003/jun03/DauphineLibere03/?id=results/
    > prologue
     
  3. Nick Burns

    Nick Burns Guest

    As if.

    Who cares whether or not he even gets it back?

    "us" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > 10 seconds wow now that's a huge defecit to overcome.... and it's just the prolog my
    > friend............. oh a ....short but challenging parcours of just 5.1km yeah i bet that
    > hurt.........
    >
    > Malte Lewan Neelsen wrote:
    >
    > > He's beaten! You could follow it live (no pictures) on
    > > http://www.eurosport.fr/home/pages/TF1/V3/L3/S18/E5636/live_Lng3_Spo18_E
    > > vt5636_Mtc61777_SitTF1.shtml: "Lance Armstrong est battu ! Il ne peut faire mieux que 8'55" et
    > > termine en 3e position !" Tyler Hamilton was only 36th. Iban Mayo won, beating David Millar.
    > >
    > > So, was Armstrong trying? You might think he was, considering how well he did, after all. But
    > > he's expected to win the ITTs in TdF as usual (if not Botero interfers, like last year).
    > >
    > > Results and analysis on http://www.cyclingnews.com/road/2003/jun03/DauphineLibere03/?id=results/
    > > prologue
     
  4. Dashi Toshii

    Dashi Toshii Guest

  5. On Mon, 09 Jun 2003 00:49:10 GMT, "Nick Burns" <[email protected]> wrote:

    >As if.
    >
    >Who cares whether or not he even gets it back?
    >
    Mayo and Millar?

    Regards! Stephen
     
  6. David Ryan

    David Ryan Guest

    Malte Lewan Neelsen wrote:
    >
    > He's beaten! You could follow it live (no pictures) on
    > http://www.eurosport.fr/home/pages/TF1/V3/L3/S18/E5636/live_Lng3_Spo18_E
    > vt5636_Mtc61777_SitTF1.shtml: "Lance Armstrong est battu ! Il ne peut faire mieux que 8'55" et
    > termine en 3e position !" Tyler Hamilton was only 36th. Iban Mayo won, beating David Millar.
    >
    > So, was Armstrong trying? You might think he was, considering how well he did, after all. But he's
    > expected to win the ITTs in TdF as usual (if not Botero interfers, like last year).
    >
    > Results and analysis on http://www.cyclingnews.com/road/2003/jun03/DauphineLibere03/?id=results/
    > prologue

    He started last and I think he could pace to whatever finish he wanted to. Tyler Hamilton is the
    next ex-teammate to implode. (Just seems the history of ex-teammates.)
     
  7. Tritonrider

    Tritonrider Guest

    >From: David Ryan [email protected]

    >He started last and I think he could pace to whatever finish he wanted to. Tyler Hamilton is the
    >next ex-teammate to implode. (Just seems the history of ex-teammates.)
    >

    WOW! Tyler lost 43 seconds he's history, the career is over. How do you figure? If I was Tyler I'd
    be concentrating on my climbing. That's where he's going to make time to get on the podium, not in
    the TT. He's just got to hold on and not lose too much in the TTs. I think he will climb better
    than ever and hold his own in the TTs. Bill C
     
  8. Warren

    Warren Guest

    In article <[email protected]>, David Ryan <[email protected]> wrote:

    > He started last and I think he could pace to whatever finish he wanted to. Tyler Hamilton is the
    > next ex-teammate to implode. (Just seems the history of ex-teammates.)

    Yes, he imploded right into a classic win at L-B-L, which is something we haven't seen from the guys
    still on USPS.

    Read his diary at VeloNews.com if you care to enlighten yourself.

    -WG
     
  9. B. Lafferty

    B. Lafferty Guest

    "warren" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:090620032020389093%[email protected]...
    > In article <[email protected]>, David Ryan <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > > He started last and I think he could pace to whatever finish he wanted
    to.
    > > Tyler Hamilton is the next ex-teammate to implode. (Just seems the history of ex-teammates.)
    >
    > Yes, he imploded right into a classic win at L-B-L, which is something we haven't seen from the
    > guys still on USPS.
    >
    > Read his diary at VeloNews.com if you care to enlighten yourself.

    And won the T de Romandy.

    What interests me is the way Armstrong's upper body is looking. It might well be a combination of
    camera angle/lens length, but it looks like his upper body has thickened a bit, much like Lemonds
    did toward the end of his career.

    I think this could be Armstong's most difficult Tour since his comeback. I say that because of the
    above, and the impression (subjective yes) that I had when he was caught at LBL that he wasn't
    physically where he thought he should be. Not that he would ever admit that if it were the case.

    And a major thank you to God and Her infinate Wisdom for giving us OLN. July is going to be so much
    fun even if the Classics rule.
     
  10. Timbenz

    Timbenz Guest

    "B. Lafferty" <[email protected]> wrote in
    news:[email protected]:

    > What interests me is the way Armstrong's upper body is looking. It might well be a combination of
    > camera angle/lens length, but it looks like his upper body has thickened a bit, much like Lemonds
    > did toward the end of his career.

    [Deletia]

    Speaking of same, I'm noticing in camera angles just how under pressure Armstrong looks these days.
    He looks gaunt, with the sorts of hollows on his cheeks and under his eyes that you used to see on
    him only during mountain stages late in the TdF. I think his lack of condition at races where he has
    contentended in prior years, like Amstel where he couldn't dump the leading group on the final
    climb, is also an indicator.

    P.
     
  11. Dan

    Dan Guest

    TimBenz <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...

    > Speaking of same, I'm noticing in camera angles just how under pressure Armstrong looks these
    > days. He looks gaunt, with the sorts of hollows on his cheeks and under his eyes that you used to
    > see on him only during mountain stages late in the TdF. I think his lack of condition at races
    > where he has contentended in prior years, like Amstel where he couldn't dump the leading group on
    > the final climb, is also an indicator.
    >
    > P.

    Yup. On Graham Watson's site, in the photos from Liege:

    http://grahamwatson.com/gw/imagedocs.nsf/images/03lbl/$file/24.jpg

    I bet he was seeing double in that picture. He was obviously giving it his all, again and again, and
    could never get away.
     
  12. Dashi Toshii

    Dashi Toshii Guest

    "Dan" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > TimBenz <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    >
    > > Speaking of same, I'm noticing in camera angles just how under pressure Armstrong looks these
    > > days. He looks gaunt, with the sorts of hollows on his cheeks and under his eyes that you used
    > > to see on him only during mountain stages late in the TdF. I think his lack of condition at
    > > races where he has contentended in prior years, like Amstel where he couldn't dump the leading
    > > group on the final climb, is also an indicator.
    > >
    > > P.
    >
    >
    > Yup. On Graham Watson's site, in the photos from Liege:
    >
    > http://grahamwatson.com/gw/imagedocs.nsf/images/03lbl/$file/24.jpg
    >
    > I bet he was seeing double in that picture. He was obviously giving it his all, again and again,
    > and could never get away.

    Maybe he was just playing possum again. ;-)

    I hope to see Lance and Ullrich in a head to head duel again.

    Dashii
     
  13. Tom Kunich

    Tom Kunich Guest

    Really good to see you still around Dave. Plain to see the Tour is coming.

    "David Ryan" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Malte Lewan Neelsen wrote:
    > >
    > > He's beaten! You could follow it live (no pictures) on
    > >
    http://www.eurosport.fr/home/pages/TF1/V3/L3/S18/E5636/live_Lng3_Spo18 _E
    > > vt5636_Mtc61777_SitTF1.shtml: "Lance Armstrong est battu ! Il ne
    peut
    > > faire mieux que 8'55" et termine en 3e position !" Tyler Hamilton
    was
    > > only 36th. Iban Mayo won, beating David Millar.
    > >
    > > So, was Armstrong trying? You might think he was, considering how
    well
    > > he did, after all. But he's expected to win the ITTs in TdF as
    usual (if
    > > not Botero interfers, like last year).
    > >
    > > Results and analysis on
    > >
    http://www.cyclingnews.com/road/2003/jun03/DauphineLibere03/?id=result
    s/
    > > prologue
    >
    > He started last and I think he could pace to whatever finish he
    wanted to.
    > Tyler Hamilton is the next ex-teammate to implode. (Just seems the history of ex-teammates.)
     
  14. Timbenz

    Timbenz Guest

    [email protected] (Dan) wrote in news:[email protected]:

    > Yup. On Graham Watson's site, in the photos from Liege:
    >
    > http://grahamwatson.com/gw/imagedocs.nsf/images/03lbl/$file/24.jpg
    >
    > I bet he was seeing double in that picture. He was obviously giving it his all, again and again,
    > and could never get away.

    That is exactly what I'm talking about. He looked like that in LBL this year, and it was a similar
    "look" in Amstel when he screwed up Boogerd's race by not having the condition Boogerd thought he
    did. Compare how much more comfortable and less wasted he looked last year during the same one- day
    races, or consider how he is looking right now in the Daupine.

    For example, look at this picture from the current race:

    http://grahamwatson.com/gw/imagedocs.nsf/photos/03dauphineSt1-003000

    Armstrong not only looks bad on this relatively straightforward early stage in a longer stage race,
    but he looks _much_ worse than the riders around him. People are going to start noticing, if they
    haven't already. I have seen this look many times while racing: Armstrong is riding near the front
    on guts and suffering, not superior condition.

    P.
     
  15. Tom Kunich

    Tom Kunich Guest

    And indeed there is that large upper body that Jan loves to see. I agree with Bill that this is
    going to be his hardest Tour to date.

    "Dan" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > TimBenz <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    >
    > > Speaking of same, I'm noticing in camera angles just how under
    pressure
    > > Armstrong looks these days. He looks gaunt, with the sorts of
    hollows on
    > > his cheeks and under his eyes that you used to see on him only
    during
    > > mountain stages late in the TdF. I think his lack of condition at
    races
    > > where he has contentended in prior years, like Amstel where he
    couldn't
    > > dump the leading group on the final climb, is also an indicator.
    > >
    > > P.
    >
    >
    > Yup. On Graham Watson's site, in the photos from Liege:
    >
    > http://grahamwatson.com/gw/imagedocs.nsf/images/03lbl/$file/24.jpg
    >
    > I bet he was seeing double in that picture. He was obviously giving it his all, again and again,
    > and could never get away.
     
  16. David Ryan

    David Ryan Guest

    Tom Kunich wrote:
    >
    > Really good to see you still around Dave. Plain to see the Tour is coming.

    Thanks. Checking to see what people think. Maybe I'll be around a little more - if Armstrong ever
    does the Giro or stays around for the Vuelta again ;-)
     
  17. TimBenz <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > [email protected] (Dan) wrote in news:[email protected]:
    >
    > > Yup. On Graham Watson's site, in the photos from Liege:
    > >
    > > http://grahamwatson.com/gw/imagedocs.nsf/images/03lbl/$file/24.jpg
    > >
    > > I bet he was seeing double in that picture. He was obviously giving it his all, again and again,
    > > and could never get away.
    >
    > That is exactly what I'm talking about. He looked like that in LBL this year, and it was a similar
    > "look" in Amstel when he screwed up Boogerd's race by not having the condition Boogerd thought he
    > did. Compare how much more comfortable and less wasted he looked last year during the same one-
    > day races, or consider how he is looking right now in the Daupine.
    >
    > For example, look at this picture from the current race:
    >
    > http://grahamwatson.com/gw/imagedocs.nsf/photos/03dauphineSt1-003000
    >
    > Armstrong not only looks bad on this relatively straightforward early stage in a longer stage
    > race, but he looks _much_ worse than the riders around him. People are going to start noticing, if
    > they haven't already. I have seen this look many times while racing: Armstrong is riding near the
    > front on guts and suffering, not superior condition.

    It's hard to get a true story from that photograph. The results are a much better indicator.
    Lance is only 11 seconds behind. On the otherhand it's not improbable that that Lance might not
    be up to form.
    >
    > P.
     
  18. Wade Summers

    Wade Summers Guest

    "Heinz Getzler" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > TimBenz <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > >
    > > Armstrong not only looks bad on this relatively straightforward early stage in a longer stage
    > > race, but he looks _much_ worse than the riders around him. People are going to start noticing,
    > > if they haven't already. I have seen this look many times while racing: Armstrong is riding near
    > > the front on guts and suffering, not superior condition.
    >
    > It's hard to get a true story from that photograph. The results are a much better indicator.
    > Lance is only 11 seconds behind. On the otherhand it's not improbable that that Lance might not
    > be up to form.
    > >
    > > P.

    I'd agree. It can hard to tell from a snap shot. I've seen that look on Lance's face in dozens of
    photos from races he won...

    Wade
     
  19. Timbenz

    Timbenz Guest

    [email protected] (Heinz Getzler) wrote in news:[email protected]:

    > It's hard to get a true story from that photograph. The results are a much better indicator.
    > Lance is only 11 seconds behind. On the otherhand it's not improbable that that Lance might not
    > be up to form.

    No argument from me. But tomorrow will be a real test -- let's so how Lance looks in a longer TT
    with a climb. And the clincher will come in Stages 4 and 6. It could be a really intersting TdF
    this year.
     
  20. Dan

    Dan Guest

    "Wade Summers" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > "Heinz Getzler" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]osting.google.com...
    > > TimBenz <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:<[email protected]>...
    > > >
    > > > Armstrong not only looks bad on this relatively straightforward early stage in a longer stage
    > > > race, but he looks _much_ worse than the riders around him. People are going to start
    > > > noticing, if they haven't already. I have seen this look many times while racing: Armstrong is
    > > > riding near the front on guts and suffering, not superior condition.
    > >
    > > It's hard to get a true story from that photograph. The results are a much better indicator.
    > > Lance is only 11 seconds behind. On the otherhand it's not improbable that that Lance might not
    > > be up to form.
    > > >
    > > > P.
    >
    > I'd agree. It can hard to tell from a snap shot. I've seen that look on Lance's face in dozens of
    > photos from races he won...
    >
    > Wade

    Maybe his head feels like a casserole? Boogerd says:

    "Under this extreme heat in the Dauphiné, there is much more suffering on the climbs with a helmet
    on the head. On the Col de Premol, it felt like I had something cooking on my head, as if I had a
    casserole on. On the flats, I always rode with a helmet anyway, but on the climbs I really find it a
    disadvantage."

    "It's still to come, but when we soon have to ride for around 30 kilometres up the Col de Galibier
    in the heat, then it will really be a horror. And let's assume that once Mont Ventoux is part of the
    parcours, but the finish is at the bottom. Then you're also obliged to ride up that col with a
    helmet. That is murderous...Maybe the UCI has to adapt the rules for such climbs."

    But then again, LANCE does look far worse than the competition.
     
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