How many of you carry a gun as part of your cycling equipment?

[biker7]

excuse me lokstah for butting in but please. You are incensed about the spirit of this forum being violated...when you don't have the guts to speak out against the most derogatory person on the board when he is perpetrating his hate speak like water under a bridge? What a joke. And for the record, I am not a gun owner but respect the right to bare arms. Save your sanctimonious tripe for someone who gives a dam. Some ride in very rural areas and if accosted they want recourse....their right. Statistically there are one hundred serial murders planning their next random killing in the US at any given time.
Smell the coffee and wake up.
George

 

[artmichalek]

excuse me lokstah for butting in but please. You are incensed about the spirit of this forum being violated...when you don't have the guts to speak out against the most derogatory person on the board when he is perpetrating his hate speak like water under a bridge? What a joke. And for the record, I am not a gun owner but respect the right to bare arms. Save your sanctimonious tripe for someone who gives a dam. Some ride in very rural areas and if accosted they want recourse....their right. Statistically there are one hundred serial murders planning their next random killing in the US at any given time.
Smell the coffee and wake up.
George

Statistically, there are also 3.9million miles of paved roads in the US (Earth Policy Institute, 2001). That's 39,000 miles per supposedly random killer.

 

[lokstah]

excuse me lokstah for butting in but please. You are incensed about the spirit of this forum being violated...when you don't have the guts to speak out against the most derogatory person on the board when he is perpetrating his hate speak like water under a bridge? What a joke. And for the record, I am not a gun owner but respect the right to bare arms. Save your sanctimonious tripe for someone who gives a dam. Some ride in very rural areas and if accosted they want recourse....their right. Statistically there are one hundred serial murders planning their next random killing in the US at any given time.
Smell the coffee and wake up.
George

Firstly, I'm quite sure I've dedicated more total verbage to arguing with boudreaux than you have, for the record.

Secondly, though he's a toxic *******, his offerings are nearly always topical. That is, unless he's goaded into exchanging insults with someone similarly combative. It's unlikely he'll ever be added to my Friendster list, but he knows cogsets.

Thirdly, you've illustrated my point by suggesting that I've put forth a "sanctimonious" dismissal of gun ownership rights, which I haven't. That's the natural course for this discussion to head, and thankfully, the administrators have set aside a section for it (hint: this isn't it). Unlike boudreaux, Joe doesn't seem to be a bad guy, but there's a deliberately antagonistic ring about his insistence to dedicate a 50-page thread in the cycling equipment forum to handgun selection.

Whether chasing boudreaux around is a current pursuit of mine shouldn't matter much to you; it certainly doesn't have any meaningful bearing on whether Joe's thread is misplaced. You're no more or less a valid arbiter than I am, pot or kettle (watch who you're calling "sanctimonious," for tthat matter). I simply find this an astonishingly mislocated thread.

 

[Joe West]

Carrying a handgun doesn't make me a "tough-guy". It just helps me from becoming a victim.

Take a look at the number of people who have viewed this thread; do you still think that this isn't appropriate? I suppose 8,000 plus views of this thread indicate apathy on the subject?

The number of views on the thread bear out that this topic is interesting, relevant, and appropriate. There is no valid argument to the contrary.

Joe

....Your unwillingness to acknowledge that simply reinforces that you're a combative dude here to make a tough-guy point... and it ain't a point about bikes.

 

[lokstah]

Carrying a handgun doesn't make me a "tough-guy". It just helps me from becoming a victim.

Take a look at the number of people who have viewed this thread; do you still think that this isn't appropriate? I suppose 8,000 plus views of this thread indicate apathy on the subject?

The number of views on the thread bear out that this topic is interesting, relevant, and appropriate. There is no valid argument to the contrary.

Joe

The "tough-guy" reference was a distraction; I can retract that.

I stand by the rest of my post, though. The question isn't whether this is a discussion topic that attracts participants. The question is whether or not a better platform exists among the 27 other sub-forums provided by this website, let alone the hundreds of thousand of venues elsewhere in cyberspace.

I appreciate that deep down you, and a small but proud group of other cyclists, feels a good-faith committment to packing heat while riding. But it's hardly as resolutely a standard piece of cycling equipment as it is a resolutely hot ethical and legal issue in this country: in other words, it's a cultural debate first, and a harmless chat about bike parts second (a distant second).

This discussion belongs in another CyclingForums.com room, plain and simple; the Bloody Soapbox comes to mind, but even the Bike Cafe would be a reasonable fit.

 

[martin_j001]

lokstah, similar to the religion thread in the bike cafe, you are correct that this thread turned into an argument on law, culture and society. Although that was not its intended purpose at all. The thread starter in no way asked what everyones opinion on carrying while they rode--but if they carry, and I'm sure he would have liked to know what they carry. In terms of those two questions, this is in fact a cycling equipment question. On the other hand, the thread on religion in the bike cafe forum is not related to cycling at all--that thread needs to be "concealed" long before this one does (and in every other forum I'm a member of, it certainly would have been deleted--or moved to a more appropriate place at the least). As some have already pointed out, this topic is getting a lot of attention, with most of its posts still relevant and on topic--discussion between those who carry and about what they carry. I stress again, that in terms of the thread starters post, this thread is still a cycling equipment topic.
Also, similar to the religion topic, you will always get people who want to post just to argue about who is right and who is wrong. In every post that has anything remotely to do with politics, religion, guns, cyclist rights, doping--it will ALWAYS turn into a pissing contest between those who think one way and those who think another way, and the most vocal ones will be the most closed minded ones (usually the case).

 

[capwater]

380 auto with hollowpoints, unless of course I'm in a race or group ride.

 

[lokstah]

Martin, I appreciate your explanation. I've visited this thread from time to time roughly since it was a baby, and I understand the perspective--there is a contingent of cyclists who think little of carrying a handgun on a Sunday ride.

That said, it's a tremendous stretch to consider a firearm a piece of "cycling equipment," whether there's a dedicated circle of armed cyclists or not. If 8,000 of the country's billion automobile commuters religiously carry PowerBars in their cars for the sake of feeding the homeless at intersections, that wouldn't qualify PowerBars as "car equipment," suitable for discussion alongside steering columns and luggage racks. You'll never find handguns listed in the QBP catalogue, despite the fact that Joe and Capwater pack while riding.

That said, the non-contentious gun talk which has occured here is pretty bike-removed. It's vanilla gun-enthusiast chatter.

It's also undeniable that gun ownership is, unlike groupset choice and tubeset material, a culturally and ethically contentious issue, period. It has been for years. To characterize the lightning-rod effect this thread has had as being the fault of noisy anti-gun folks, and not the natural effect of discussing guns in a forum about bikes, is silly.

 

[biker7]

It is you lohstah who is the lightening rod and perpetuating this thread...lol. As a non gun owner I do not take exception to the placement or the content of this thread at all. It has in fact been informative as I would have never imagined that so many car a gun when they ride their bike. I will be more careful who I outrun out there on the bike trails for fear of reprisal...lol.
Take it easy brother.
George

 

[howierart]

When I go cycling I carry as little as possible, who wants to carry soemthing heavy up the hills with you? I even empty the essentials from my wallet into a plastic bag to keep the weight down. Though in these modern times Ive found towing a gas chamber comes in useful. Just in case I see someone who might be a threat...No to be honest im lucky to live in a part of England werethe birds sing and the sun shines. I say hi to my neigbours and everythings nice. Every now and again if we got problems we get drunk and fight it out like men..Ha ha ha ha or take it all out in a time trial or a football game... Peace and love to one and all! Ive learnt soemthing from this, something I already knew.. Ive no reason and no desire to ever go to America..

 

[lokstah]

It is you lohstah who is the lightening rod and perpetuating this thread...lol.

Take it easy brother.
George

I do question your statement, above, particularly since you've compared my objection to the presence of this thread, with your objection to the presence of Boudreaux. On more than one occasion, in discussing the latter, you've criticized myself and others for not speaking out against him, all the while perpetuating extended shouting matches of your own. Don't you think you're qualifying these respective crusades a little oddly?

I just don't find this a remotely relevant thread. There are plenty who find the subject interesting, but the only substantial discussion which has arisen has been either heated discourse on gun ownership, or pure gun-enthusiast tech chatter which simply can't be qualified as discussion about cycling equipment.

I'm calm here at my desk (trust me... all the coffee in the world isn't going to perk this guy up right now), but that's my opinion, George. It's my take. Like you, I'm willing to dedicate some thread space from time to time to object to material I think is misplaced or inappropriate; that's all.

Stay cool.

 

[Hazmat]

Why a .22 or .25 ACP? Why not something substantial, like a .380?

why not a compact .45? there are some very light models on the market and when its at the base of your back, 4-6oz is not a whole lot

 

[Weisse Luft]

why not a compact .45? there are some very light models on the market and when its at the base of your back, 4-6oz is not a whole lot

The difference in effectiveness between a .380 and a compact .45 is much less than that between a .22/.25 and a .380. I have a few .45's but they are all full size. The lightest .45 is still about 20 oz, loaded. Or twice that of the Kel Tec P3AT, also loaded. When I ride in bear country, and that is grizzly, not black, I carry my steel frame Para Ord that has been converted to .45 Super. 200 grain truncated cone FMJ's at 1200 FPS is barely adequate bear stopper, pun intended. The only saving grace is the 14 round magazine. Yes, it kicks a bit more than the P3AT

 

[Hazmat]

The difference in effectiveness between a .380 and a compact .45 is much less than that between a .22/.25 and a .380. I have a few .45's but they are all full size. The lightest .45 is still about 20 oz, loaded. Or twice that of the Kel Tec P3AT, also loaded. When I ride in bear country, and that is grizzly, not black, I carry my steel frame Para Ord that has been converted to .45 Super. 200 grain truncated cone FMJ's at 1200 FPS is barely adequate bear stopper, pun intended. The only saving grace is the 14 round magazine. Yes, it kicks a bit more than the P3AT

.


my oldest brother has a few Paras and he's converted one of the .45s to a super .45, I've only used it at the range a few times, but its a very smooth peice, though I am not a fan of the grip he put on.

 

[Alpha]

I guess its just a cultural difference. Here... a gun is nothing more than a tool. It can be used for fun (target shooting), sport (shooting competitions, hunting), or for protection (against two or four legged animals).

The movie "Bowling for Columbine" is pure fiction... snippets of reality strung together between fictional script to tell a fictional story. I assume you are from another country, so I suspect you would not be able to detect American truth from American fiction.

And to answer your question; yes, I carry a gun into a theater with my wife (former girlfriend)... and my wife also carries a gun. In fact; she is out on a hiking trail right now packing a .40S&W Glock. Pitty the two or four legged animal which threatens her or the friends she is hiking with.

If you have more questions or comments... please, rather than be openly irritated on this forum... feel free to contact me at:

[email protected]

Kind Regards,

Joe

Joe, how would a foreigner detect american truth from american fiction when americans don't know the difference!

 

[Joe West]

Some Americans do

Joe, how would a foreigner detect american truth from american fiction when americans don't know the difference!

 

[ritcho]

Some Americans do

It's nice to see this thread pop up again, I thought it was dead, but someone woke it up again.

Fwiw, I don't carry a gun as cycling equipment or as any equipment. Gun ownership is heavily restricted in this country, for pretty good reasons and I've never had a situation would require one. Not a single person I know has been in such a situation either, though I suspect there may be some luck involved.

Nevertheless, there are lots of people in this country that need to use firearms - security guards, police, farmers and they use them for their intended purpose.

At the very least, though I don't share all his views, Joe W (and others) advocate intensive training in the safe use of firearms, for those that want them and are allowed to have them.

Next time you're down under, come for a ride, have a beer, but you'll have to leave the gun at home...

Ritch

 

[martin_j001]

At the very least, though I don't share all his views, Joe W (and others) advocate intensive training in the safe use of firearms, for those that want them and are allowed to have them.

Ritch

I'm glad someone else is picking up on that too. All too often, gun owners are given the stereotype as reckless people who have a way to kill people, and thats not always the truth. Similar to the stereotype that a legal, law abiding gun carrier is a more dangerous person (completely opposite of the truth). Training is what every gun owner needs to have--with their specific firearm. However, as with cars, training doesn't always make everyone the perfect car/gun owner.

 

[capwater]

Unless were talking mounting a 5.56 mm SAW on carbon fiber aero bars, what say we 86 this thread gents?

 

[Joe West]

Agreed.

My bicycle carry weapon is a NAA Guardian 380 loaded with Hydrashock hollow points. For an eyeball gun; this would be very effective.

All my other handguns are .45acp, but I just couldn't find a small, lightweight, effective 45.

Joe

The difference in effectiveness between a .380 and a compact .45 is much less than that between a .22/.25 and a .380. I have a few .45's but they are all full size. The lightest .45 is still about 20 oz, loaded. Or twice that of the Kel Tec P3AT, also loaded. When I ride in bear country, and that is grizzly, not black, I carry my steel frame Para Ord that has been converted to .45 Super. 200 grain truncated cone FMJ's at 1200 FPS is barely adequate bear stopper, pun intended. The only saving grace is the 14 round magazine. Yes, it kicks a bit more than the P3AT