How many of you carry a gun as part of your cycling equipment?



Heh! With or without trauma plates?

Last Saturday a wanted felon put some rounds out at a chasing Cleveland, Ohio police officer, striking him once in the chest. The cop's vest saved his life and allowed him to return fire at the criminal...striking him three times.

http://www.newsnet5.com/homepage-showcase/cleveland-police-officer-shot-early-saturday-morning

I'll see if I can dig up the report of the late night cyclist that was shot in the face/jaw IIRC. I think he survived his wound, but that story was a while ago.

So...ditch the Giro or Rudy and order up a Mil-Spec Kevlar helmet! Sure...it's more than a little heavy, but the lack of vents will make you the envy of all the aero-geeks.
 
Well not sure how this board has progressed, as I got through about the first 10 pages, with it just going around in circles.

I live in Australia and I would never consider riding with a gun. The reasons why I wouldn't consider riding with one in Australia are two fold.

Firstly, I would never feel like my life was in danger, other than from cars, (or avoid riding some where that I may think it could be ... as I avoid sections of road I believe are unsafe too). So pretty much I would ride in 99% of Australia (lower at night time), other than due to road conditions.

Secondly, in Australia the main risk that may require the carrying of a gun would be robbery (someone mugging me for my bike ... not sure how common this is in Australia, I would say extremely rare as car jackings are very rare too). In those circumstances I would gladly hand over my bike. Insurance is a lot lighter to carry than a hand gun and the guilt of killing someone.
The USA apparently has far "unsafer" areas than we have in Australia, so I am not sure what my stance would be in regards to riding there. Again though I'd probably chose prevention (avoid unsafe areas) over management (riding with a gun through unsafe areas) ... this is the basics of workplace safety, so I employ the same line of thought to cycling. When assessing a risk, the first question to ask is "do I need to go there?"

Thankfully I live in a country where I don't even need to consider this a question to ask myself.
 
sokorny said:
Well not sure how this board has progressed, as I got through about the first 10 pages, with it just going around in circles. I live in Australia and I would never consider riding with a gun. The reasons why I wouldn't consider riding with one in Australia are two fold. Firstly, I would never feel like my life was in danger, other than from cars, (or avoid riding some where that I may think it could be ... as I avoid sections of road I believe are unsafe too). So pretty much I would ride in 99% of Australia (lower at night time), other than due to road conditions. Secondly, in Australia the main risk that may require the carrying of a gun would be robbery (someone mugging me for my bike ... not sure how common this is in Australia, I would say extremely rare as car jackings are very rare too). In those circumstances I would gladly hand over my bike. Insurance is a lot lighter to carry than a hand gun and the guilt of killing someone. The USA apparently has far "unsafer" areas than we have in Australia, so I am not sure what my stance would be in regards to riding there. Again though I'd probably chose prevention (avoid unsafe areas) over management (riding with a gun through unsafe areas) ... this is the basics of workplace safety, so I employ the same line of thought to cycling. When assessing a risk, the first question to ask is "do I need to go there?" Thankfully I live in a country where I don't even need to consider this a question to ask myself.
My problem with your post that the last time I did any reading on the subject, the Aussie crime rates skyrocketed after your gun bans took effect. I'm too lazy to dig up the article, but your violent crime rates, and the likelihood of women in Australia to be raped increased far above the US. And after the recent standoff/hostage situation that occurred down there, didn't a certain amount of your government officials publicly state that had Australians had better firearm access they would be better able to defend themselves? I've been working long hours lately so maybe I'm fuzzy on the details...but I think I'm close. Anyway. I'm A free American where the Bill Of Rights clearly states that we can bear arms. I live in a state ranked 3rd for most guns owned per capita, and our gun laws make Texas look like a liberal stronghold. I am proplerly trained, qualified, and practiced. My gun goes on with my belt every morning and I don't have to justify it to anybody but if you insist, I have family in law enforcement and our family has received death threats. That is why I started carrying. Now it's just part of my routine. I put on my gun just like you probably put on your watch. It isn't a burden, clumsy, heavy, awkward or anything else people think it might be.
 
Quote:Originally Posted by BigSkyFatGuy .
My problem with your post that the last time I did any reading on the subject, the Aussie crime rates skyrocketed after your gun bans took effect. I'm too lazy to dig up the article, but your violent crime rates, and the likelihood of women in Australia to be raped increased far above the US.
And after the recent standoff/hostage situation that occurred down there, didn't a certain amount of your government officials publicly state that had Australians had better firearm access they would be better able to defend themselves?

I've been working long hours lately so maybe I'm fuzzy on the details...but I think I'm close.

Anyway. I'm A free American where the Bill Of Rights clearly states that we can bear arms. I live in a state ranked 3rd for most guns owned per capita, and our gun laws make Texas look like a liberal stronghold.
I am proplerly trained, qualified, and practiced. My gun goes on with my belt every morning and I don't have to justify it to anybody but if you insist, I have family in law enforcement and our family has received death threats. That is why I started carrying.
Now it's just part of my routine. I put on my gun just like you probably put on your watch. It isn't a burden, clumsy, heavy, awkward or anything else people think it might be.

None of your comments actually stick to the topic, but here are the facts: The number of homicides due to firearms has decreased steadily over the last two decades (you need to remember that the "gun ban" in Australia only related to semi and automatic weapons, as there were already strict regulations regarding the ownership of guns in Australia. These rules have changed slightly over the years.) Rape rates are similar between Australia and the USA (approaching 28 to 29/100,000), which suggest the determining factor isn't gun rights. Most rape cases occur at your personal home (or prison), involve women as the victim, and you usually know the offender (so I should be right riding my bike on the streets). Homicide rate in Australia is approx 1.2/100,000 in the USA it is 4.8 to 5.2/100,000 (so you're almost 4 to 5 times more likely to be murdered in the USA). Only 13% are by firearms in Australa, the USA is 68%. http://www.aic.gov.au/documents/0/B/6/%7B0B619F44-B18B-47B4-9B59-F87BA643CBAA%7Dfacts11.pdf http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/homicide.htm http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_statistics Back on topic. As I stated in Australia you will find very few if any cyclists that would carry a gun when they rode, even if they legally could. It is not part of our culture. I understand in America that many individuals have very different views to these, they are entitled to these. You clearly have a real and perceived "fear" that someone/anyone is out to get you. I may think differently if I was in a similar situation. But thankfully in my country very few people ("good" and "bad") have this culture. How "free" is America that you need to carry a gun to ride your bike?
 
Quote by sokorny:
"How "free" is America that you need to carry a gun to ride your bike?"

Every bit as free as...


God bless The United States of America!
 
Unsure what the Lindt Cafe has to with this subject or cycling? Perhaps I should refrain my question. Would you rather cycle without the need (or concern) for carrying a gun or not?
 
Would you rather be inside the Lindt Café with or without a firearm as the potential hostage of an ISIS lunatic? If grabbing a cup of joe in a high-end café in Sydney is considered 'safe' I would think cycling out among the masses to be much more dangerous. But you know statistics...they're just a bunch of meaningless numbers until you or I end up as one.

Cycling without a firearm is always an option. Here or where you are. It's a choice, here, thankfully. You can also go to work as a cartoon editor in downtown Paris without one and despite having two armed guards to protect you, still wind up dead. All that really doesn't change things a lick AFAIC.

Long before society devolved into what it is, cyclists often carried a pistol simply to dispatch dogs. Google "velodog". They used to call folks like that, "well prepared".

They still do.

There's still plenty of dogs running around. Many only have two legs.
 
I would much rather everyone be unarmed in the case of the Lindt Cafe. And the second part is the cultural difference between Australia and the USA (well a select few). It still is safe to go to a cafe, millions do it everyday, we don't live in fear. In regards to dogs again a non concern here in Australia. Living in fear is not living.
 
I think it's really a stretch to say we live in fear on a day to day basis here. When there is a mass shooting some people overreact and obsess, and the media just makes that so much bigger than it needs to be because of sensationalistic coverage design to attract viewers or sell papers. As far as riding with a gun, I would say two things - the first is that there are areas where crime is a problem, inner cities and some rural areas - drugs and poverty zones - but the majority of Americans don't live in those types of communities. The "typical suburban community" is very safe. My second point is that many Americans are very passionate about their 2nd Amendment rights and may choose to carry weapons as a political statement. America has some true problems, such as an obese population that lives on junk food - that is what ls killing Americans in shocking numbers. Guns - sorry just don 't see it in everyday life here in any major way.
 
Quote by sokorny:
"I would much rather everyone be unarmed in the case of the Lindt Cafe."

Wish in one hand...**** in the other. See which fills up faster. I'ld like to win the Tour de France, too...


"And the second part is the cultural difference between Australia and the USA (well a select few). It still is safe to go to a cafe, millions do it everyday, we don't live in fear."

No one that I know "live in fear". What do they have to fear? THEY are the prepared ones. They go confidently through life with the tools and knowledge to take care of themselves, their families and, quite possibly, some schmuck that didn't have the brains to take personal responsibility for his own well being.


"Living in fear is not living."

Apparently, your definition of being prepared and fear are different in Oz.

You must "live in fear" of a flat tire since you cycle with a spare tube, patch kit and pump. You must "live in fear" of a fire since you keep a fire extinguisher around. You must "live in fear" of the cold if you own a jacket.

Last night a friend from the Cleveland burbs sent me a pic of his newest rifle!



Sweet! Huh?




Now, please describe to us exactly what you think the owner of that AKSU-74 (and many more similar to it) is 'afraid' of?

Maybe if the cartoonists at Charlie Hebdo had had a dozen of them around the office casualties might have been fewer.
 
Wow, stumbled across this thread thinking it was just someone trolling. Not sure when a gun became part of cycling equipment. Sure as an American I have the "right" to carry a gun but how does this relate to personal responsibility or being prepared on a bike ride??? I'm more worried about some dolt texting while driving after a 3 martini lunch… My deepest sympathy to those who feel they need a gun for their personal safety.
 
Sympathy? This gentleman needs none of your 'deepest sympathy'...but, you may feel sympathy towards the little dindu's that ruthlessly attacked him.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/01/26/pennsylvania-man-65-fatally-shoots-teen-who-pushed-him-off-bicycle/

Pennsylvania man, 65, fatally shoots teen who pushed him off bicycle Published January 26, 2012 NewsCore

READING, Pa. – A 65-year-old man shot one teenager dead and wounded another after they pushed him off his bicycle and tried to rob him in Pennsylvania, police said.

The man was cycling on a trail in Reading, Pa., shortly before 11:00 am local time Wednesday morning, when a group of teens pushed him off the bicycle and two of them assaulted him, investigators said.
The 65 year old then took out a handgun and shot them both, the Reading Eagle reported.

One of the teens -- a 16 year old from Reading -- was pronounced dead at the scene at 12:17 p.m. local time.

The second teenager was taken to the hospital but his condition was unknown, according to the newspaper.

Cops arrested a third boy at the scene and took him in for questioning. The 15 year old was later taken to a county youth center in nearby Bern Township where he was held on unspecified charges.

Police decided to release the 65 year old and charge the juvenile after consulting with District

Attorney John Adams, who attended the scene with forensic detectives, the Reading Eagle reported.

Authorities did not release his name or the names of the teenagers.



Oh well. You want to lay there and get your ass kicked and face busted up by three ghetto thugs, be my guest. It's a free country last time I checked.
 
Those that have carried guns before have defended your right to make an a** of yourself on a bike today.
 
Originally Posted by CAMPYBOB
Sympathy? This gentleman needs none of your 'deepest sympathy'...but, you may feel sympathy towards the little dindu's that ruthlessly attacked him.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/01/26/pennsylvania-man-65-fatally-shoots-teen-who-pushed-him-off-bicycle/

Pennsylvania man, 65, fatally shoots teen who pushed him off bicycle Published January 26, 2012 NewsCore


Oh well. You want to lay there and get your ass kicked and face busted up by three ghetto thugs, be my guest. It's a free country last time I checked.
Ok, just for grins I'll play one round of this silly game. Match your two year old headline and raise you one - but I'll keep with current events. If you want to go with statistics (those pesky numbers which the insurance and gaming industries use to make billions) there are absolutely no statistics supporting the belief that having a gun makes one safer nor more prepared.
2 Year old kills mother...
http://www.nola.com/traffic/index.ssf/2014/12/2-year-old_accidentally_kills.html
Police chief shoots wife in bed, by accident...
http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/georgia-police-chief-shoots-wife-bedroom-hours-new-year-n278081

So go ahead knock yourself out and buy some more guns and ammo - if nothing else it'll help the economy grow. However, the things that are more likely to end or drastically change your life cannot be avoided with a gun. Sorry but cancer, viruses, bacteria, drunk and distracted drivers, and a whole long list of other things are not going to be affected by the lethality of one's cache.

Cheers,
Greg
 
If I rode in areas like Reading, or even some of the garden spots of my own state like New Bedford or Lowell, I'd probably have a gun on me. There are one or two neighborhoods on Cape Cod where one would be useful, but unless I want to plug some out of state asshole tourist (we call them tourons) who yells at me to get off the road, I don't have the need to. If I could carry a rifle, I might, just for the occasional drunken Wampanoag who decides to buzz me with his pick-up in Mashpee. He'd be out of range by the time I drew my handgun after picking my ass out of the weeds. I know there are arguments for various weapons for home defense, but I've always been a shotgun loyalist. Turkey loads make less of a mess to clean off the carpets after they haul the body away. LeMond can tell you what kind of job they can do on someone.
 
Quote by mpre53:
"(we call them tourons)"

For the last 40-some years me and a cycling friend have used that word to refer to cyclo-tourists!
big-smile.png


"He'd be out of range by the time I drew my handgun after picking my ass out of the weeds."

That's the trouble with most handguns. They are primarily a defensive weapon. Of course there's always an AKM with a wrist brace!



Without the wrist brace it's a mere 5-pounds strapped on your back. The intimidation factor will keep the sober morons off your back. Drunk and texting preachers...we haven't got a prayer!



30 rounds of 7.62 x 39 will Swiss cheese a lifted diesel brodozer in less than 3 seconds! (uh...that's a joke, for those born with no sense of humor or the unfortunate souls that had to undergo a humorectomy.)
 
Great argument for carrying guns:
http://www.smh.com.au/world/toddler-3-shoots-father-and-pregnant-mother-at-new-mexico-motel-20150201-133fx3.html
ONly in the USA.
 
I think you should Aussies better get to work on banning cricket bats. And knives. Might as well ban killer roos while you're at it.

In a free society, **** happens. I'll gladly take my chances WITH a firearm.

BTW, both parents of the boy that fired the pistil...lived. The kid hid widdy da ball bat and stabby stabby widdy da knoife...died.



By Jonathan Pearlman, Sydney
6:41AM GMT 13 Feb 2014
An Australian father used a cricket bat to beat his 11-year-old son to death in front of the child’s mother before being shot dead by police.
Greg Anderson, 54, who was said to be mentally ill, was practising with his son Luke at a suburban oval in Melbourne on Wednesday night when he attacked him.
Luke had been training with other members of his junior team, most of whom had left. But he asked his mother, Rosie Batty, if he could spend more time practising with his father. Mr Anderson apparently bowled several deliveries to his son and then attacked him with a cricket bat and reportedly a knife.
luke-mum_2820692c.jpg
Rosie Batty, mother of Luke, was just metres away when the attack took place (7news)
Police said they arrived to find Mr Anderson armed with a knife. They tried and failed to subdue him with pepper spray and he was shot once in the chest. He was airlifted to hospital but died yesterday.
Related Articles
They said the attack was likely to have been calculated and that Mr Anderson, who had a history of violence, planned to kill his son and then be killed by police. He reportedly struck a fatal blow to Luke’s head and then continued to attack him with a knife. Witnesses said the father chased the police and yelled at them to kill him.



Ms Batty, who moved to Australia from England 20 years ago, said she thought her son had been injured by a ball and that her estranged husband was trying to help. “From what I could see, Luke had been injured,” she said. “I thought it was an accident. It was just a little cricket practice. There were people there.
“I believed he was safe. I had no reason to be concerned. I thought it was in an open environment. That’s something I have to understand.”
luke-batty3_2820707c.jpg
Luke Batty
Ms Batty and Luke recently returned from a five-week holiday in Britain and she said she believed her son and his father were comfortable with each other. She said Mr Anderson had refused to accept help over the past 11 years and spent months homeless but she believed he posed a threat only to her.

“No one loved Luke more than Greg, his father,” she said. “What triggered this, I think, was a case of his dad having mental health issues … his life was failing, that everything was becoming worse in his life and Luke was the only bright light in his life.”

Ms Batty’s family is flying out from Britain to support her.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/australiaandthepacific/australia/10635054/British-child-beaten-to-death-with-cricket-bat-by-father-in-Australia.html
 
Originally Posted by mitosis
Great argument for carrying guns:
http://www.smh.com.au/world/toddler-3-shoots-father-and-pregnant-mother-at-new-mexico-motel-20150201-133fx3.html
ONly in the USA.
Just a head's up, you're about to get flogged with articles from long ago... Here's another one but I apologize in advance that it's only a few weeks old:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/01/20/missouri-9-month-old-fatally-shot-in-his-crib-by-5-year-old-brother-police-say/

Note that there are varying news reports of how the 5 year old got the gun as another report had a quote from the grandfather who claimed the gun was in a locked box and the 5 year old must've figured out how to open the box or found the key, but the above report said the gun was "just lying about".

I love playing this game with gun advocates. They find something from years ago and I get a few which happened recently. In 2013 America averaged about one mass shooting per day (2014 was slightly lower at 283 mass shootings). They're all documented with multiple news stories which one could use to get police reports etc. Interestingly with over 300,000,000 (yes, over 300 million) guns in America, one might expect most if not all of these mass shootings was ended by a gun packing "good guy" taking out the shooter(s). I'll leave it as an exercise for the gun advocates to identify how many of the mass shootings were stopped (ended) by a citizen who was packing.
 

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