Hybrid vs Flat Bar Road bike

[jj]

On 10 Sep 2005 09:17:07 -0700, "Ken M" <[email protected]> wrote:

>** Point is, a customer is a customer. Besides, they treat a bike buyer
>right
>and he'll be back to buy his gear, typically spending an amount equal
>to
>the cost of the bike in about 2 years for an active rider.**
>
>I agree, a customer is a customer, but IMO it depends on how much of
>thier time they think you are wasting. I went down there again this
>morning, pretty busy on Saturday mornings, so I wasn't expecting anyone
>to spend anytime on a ' browser ', seeing as how I have been in there
>' browsing ' three times this week. But I went in to see if they had
>any 1000c, no way. Not a one. One had 6 or 7 road bikes on display,
>lots of mtb's and hybrids. But anyway, I was looking at a bunch of
>different models, and I had spent some time there, and then a 'wrench'
>from the back made a comment that sent me out the door. He said "
>Picked one out yet?" but the sarcasm in his voice said okay this guy is
>a jerk. But that is why he's just a paid ' wrench' I guess. Good thing
>they all don't have that attitude.
>
>Ken

Don't be discouraged, many bike shops owners and employees are like this -
they are somewhat elitist, catering to the crowd of choice. My LBS treated
me like this even after I had bought a bike. Hell they treated me like a
second-rate customer on the day I picked it up just before they got my
money!

I would have said "well I thought of ordering a Madone for my wife and me,
but since you're too busy, I'll go elsewhere". ;-)

Though it might be a bit of a hassle, I wouldn't rule out going to the shop
50 miles away. Though some say it's important to establish a relationship
with the shop and that you get free tuneups, that's over-rated in regard to
the way they treat you. I bought my second bike at a shop that's 150 miles
away and those guys have treated me very well so far. I get any tune ups
needed at another local shop that has a great staff and for me, I don't
mind paying. You may have heard my story of how my original LBS did my
first free tune up? They hung the bike on the wall hook and when I returned
a day later the took it down and said it was tuned. Truth is they did
nothing to the bike - zero. (the hook was in the same spot on the back
tire, next to the valve).

BTW, you say they haven't 'offered' to have you to test ride? Why not -ask-
for a test ride? If they are a 'named' shop, say based on Giant, or Trek,
you can always ask for the number of the association and complain to them
that the shop is not meeting your needs.

Good luck!

jj

 

[Roger Zoul]

Ken M <[email protected]> wrote:
:> ** You have to be careful. Lots of manufacturers want to set riders
:> up with a
:> racer's position, which means the bars are lower than the saddle by
:> 2-4
:>
:> inches. This position makes me very uncomfortable. It bothers my
:> neck, and
:> makes my hands really numb. I ride a 52, but it's a semi-compact
:> frame and I
:> do have the bars at the same height as the saddle. Do you feel too
:> stretched
:> out on your current bikes? Lots of fit issues can be corrected with a
:> stem
:> swap.**
:>
:> Yeah I do feel stretched, particularly on the drops, not so much on
:> the bar tops.
:> Well I think the 52 would be the max I should be on in a road frame.
:> And I have tried different bar to saddle heights, and the ' best '
:> position I have found put the bar tops a couple of inches OVER the
:> saddle.
:>
:> Ken

I'm a big guy...and I feel comfortable in the drops, not stretched. However,
I rarely ride far with my hands in that position.

 

[Roger Zoul]

Ken M <[email protected]> wrote:
:>:> ** I use a Nitto Noodle Bar:
:> :> http://www.rivbike.com/html/parts_noodlebar.html
:> :> **
:> :>
:> :> Yeah I have seen those, they look a little funky, but look like
:> :> you get a couple more hand positions.
:> :>
:> :> Well, I have been looking around trying to be an educated consumer
:> :> and not buy something that I am not going to like, therefore not
:> :> going to ride. The guy at the Giant dealer has offered to let me
:> :> test ride a couple of bike, something the other LBS didn't do.
:>
:> Didn't offer or won't let you? I can't imagine buying any bike in a
:> bike
:> shop without test riding. I spent lots of time test riding the
:> bikes I
:> considered, on several different occasions, too. Press the issue to
:> ensure
:> you get to ride as many bikes as possible so you can make a fully
:> informed
:> choice from the options available to you.
:>
:> The Trek dealer hasn't offered to let me test ride any of thier
:> bikes.

Ask the Trek dealer for a test ride.

:>
:>
:> Ken

 

[Geezer Boy]

On Sat, 10 Sep 2005 12:40:16 -0400, jj<[email protected]> wrote:

>On 10 Sep 2005 09:17:07 -0700, "Ken M" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>** Point is, a customer is a customer. Besides, they treat a bike buyer
>>right
>>and he'll be back to buy his gear, typically spending an amount equal
>>to
>>the cost of the bike in about 2 years for an active rider.**
>>
>>I agree, a customer is a customer, but IMO it depends on how much of
>>thier time they think you are wasting. I went down there again this
>>morning, pretty busy on Saturday mornings, so I wasn't expecting anyone
>>to spend anytime on a ' browser ', seeing as how I have been in there
>>' browsing ' three times this week. But I went in to see if they had
>>any 1000c, no way. Not a one. One had 6 or 7 road bikes on display,
>>lots of mtb's and hybrids. But anyway, I was looking at a bunch of
>>different models, and I had spent some time there, and then a 'wrench'
>>from the back made a comment that sent me out the door. He said "
>>Picked one out yet?" but the sarcasm in his voice said okay this guy is
>>a jerk. But that is why he's just a paid ' wrench' I guess. Good thing
>>they all don't have that attitude.
>>
>>Ken
>
>Don't be discouraged, many bike shops owners and employees are like this -
>they are somewhat elitist, catering to the crowd of choice. My LBS treated
>me like this even after I had bought a bike. Hell they treated me like a
>second-rate customer on the day I picked it up just before they got my
>money!
>
>I would have said "well I thought of ordering a Madone for my wife and me,
>but since you're too busy, I'll go elsewhere". ;-)
>
>Though it might be a bit of a hassle, I wouldn't rule out going to the shop
>50 miles away. Though some say it's important to establish a relationship
>with the shop and that you get free tuneups, that's over-rated in regard to
>the way they treat you. I bought my second bike at a shop that's 150 miles
>away and those guys have treated me very well so far. I get any tune ups
>needed at another local shop that has a great staff and for me, I don't
>mind paying. You may have heard my story of how my original LBS did my
>first free tune up? They hung the bike on the wall hook and when I returned
>a day later the took it down and said it was tuned. Truth is they did
>nothing to the bike - zero. (the hook was in the same spot on the back
>tire, next to the valve).
>
>BTW, you say they haven't 'offered' to have you to test ride? Why not -ask-
>for a test ride? If they are a 'named' shop, say based on Giant, or Trek,
>you can always ask for the number of the association and complain to them
>that the shop is not meeting your needs.
>
>Good luck!
>
>jj

No need to deal with jerks and jerk-offs, if that's all you find
within reasonable driving distancees. Lots of people learn to do their
own tuneups and maintenance. Much free info at Sheldon Brown's
website, Park Tool, and other places online. Perhaps Barnett's manual
is still available online also? Lennard Zinn has a fourth edition of
MTB maintenance out (check the Velo News website) and there are other
books as well. Parts are available online or through your local shop.

Except for a very few special tools that are really pricey, it isn't
expensive to do your own work.' And in those rare cases, you can take
it in to the jerks. Too bad that's all you have because there are
plenty of good shops.

*Working on bikes isn't rocket surgery.*

BTW, the current issue of Mountain Bike Action has a very good article
from Fox's "master," on setting up forks and rear shocks properly,
depending upon the bike and type of riding you do. If you have a FS
bike, it's worth getting.

G.B.

 

[Mykal]

"Ken M" <[email protected]> wrote >
> My back doesn't like the drop bars that are on a 1000.
>
> Ken
>

In my estimation, you either have a severe back problem or you have not yet
experienced the (comfortable) thrill of riding a road bike that fits you.
--
Mykal C
Seattle, WA

 

[Mike McGuire]

Ron Ruff wrote:
> Ken M wrote:
>
>>** Why get a flat-bar road bike? **
>>
>>For the the more upright position.
>>
>>** Why not a Trek 1000? **
>>
>>My back doesn't like the drop bars that are on a 1000.
>>
>>Ken
>
>
> IMO drop bars are superior for road riding... at least if you plan on
> riding fair distances. There should be no problem getting them in the
> right place... giving you that "more upright position" that you prefer.
> You just need a stem with a good rise (and the shop should be happy to
> swap this out for free) and maybe an uncut steerer tube on the fork.
> Make sure that it feels comfortable when you are on the hoods. You can
> reserve the drops for descents and headwinds.
>

To enlarge on this, with drop bars, you have several different hand
positions your can use, but really only one with the flat bar. This
greatly alleviates the numb hand problem by at least varying the
pressure on the ulnar nerve.

Mike

 

[Ken M]

** In my estimation, you either have a severe back problem or you have
not yet
experienced the (comfortable) thrill of riding a road bike that fits
you.**

Well i don't know that it is a severe back problem, but I was in a
couple of car wrecks and injured my back somewhat. I don't know the
exact extend of the injuries, or if they have worsened over time. I
live a normal life, I am not confined to a bed or wheelchair.. I think
it is probably more of a fit issue.

Ken

 

[jj]

On 11 Sep 2005 05:10:21 -0700, "Ken M" <[email protected]> wrote:

>** In my estimation, you either have a severe back problem or you have
>not yet
>experienced the (comfortable) thrill of riding a road bike that fits
>you.**
>
>Well i don't know that it is a severe back problem, but I was in a
>couple of car wrecks and injured my back somewhat. I don't know the
>exact extend of the injuries, or if they have worsened over time. I
>live a normal life, I am not confined to a bed or wheelchair.. I think
>it is probably more of a fit issue.
>
>Ken

Thing is, if you are able to, say, touch your toes (with knees straight),
and are not overweight, then you should easily and without pain be able to
ride on the hoods of a Trek 1000, or 1000c.

Some riders with a gut have a little trouble getting arched over because
the gut gets in the way. But at 160lbs, even at 5'6, this seems unlikely to
be your problem. ;-)

So, yes, for a rider of normal proportions to have pain and suffering on a
normal road bike, and, in fact to need a riser 1-2" higher than the saddle
to be comfortable, means there is some kind of strange biomechanical
problem or relatively severe back problem.

Now, certainly a person who does not ride very frequently might experience
a little bit of back and neck pain if they ride for over an hour early in
their 'break-in' period, but according to your commentary this is not the
case.

jj

 

[Ken M]

** Thing is, if you are able to, say, touch your toes (with knees
straight),
and are not overweight, then you should easily and without pain be able
to
ride on the hoods of a Trek 1000, or 1000c **

I can do that, perhaps not as easily as I could when I was a bit
younger, but still able to bend.

** But at 160lbs, even at 5'6, this seems unlikely to
be your problem. ;-) **

Yeah I might have a few I could stand to get rid of, but I would not
really concider myself overweight or obese.

** So, yes, for a rider of normal proportions to have pain and
suffering on a
normal road bike, and, in fact to need a riser 1-2" higher than the
saddle
to be comfortable, means there is some kind of strange biomechanical
problem or relatively severe back problem.**

Well as I said I was in a couple of back car wrecks when I was younger,
and had to see a chiropractor to get it straightened out, and I think
perhaps it has worsened somewhat over time.

** Now, certainly a person who does not ride very frequently might
experience
a little bit of back and neck pain if they ride for over an hour early
in
their 'break-in' period, but according to your commentary this is not
the
case. **

I would say that I have tried just about everything, including riding
through the pain, to try to ' get used to it ' again. And even this did
not improve on the ache.

Ken

 

[Gooserider]

"Ken M" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> ** Did you look at the 1000C? **
>
> Yeah I just looked it up, okay I guess I was slightly wrong, they are
> not that far apart, but then I think I was looking at the other 1000.
> Headtube angle is only like 1/2 degree different and the seat tube
> angle is the same, and actually the top tube lenght is shorter on the
> 1000c than on the 7300. So thanks for pointing that out. I think this
> may put the 1000c in the running for my money.
>
> Ken

The guys at my LBS told me they sold a 1000C to a fellow who lost his DL due
to DUIs. He rides it on his 20 mile commute 5 days a week. I looked at one
and it seemed like a nice bike.

 

[Mykal]

"Ken M" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> ** In my estimation, you either have a severe back problem or you have
> not yet
> experienced the (comfortable) thrill of riding a road bike that fits
> you.**
>
> Well i don't know that it is a severe back problem, but I was in a
> couple of car wrecks and injured my back somewhat. I don't know the
> exact extend of the injuries, or if they have worsened over time. I
> live a normal life, I am not confined to a bed or wheelchair.. I think
> it is probably more of a fit issue.
>
> Ken
>

The drop bars characteristically found on road bikes provide a variety of
hand positions. While this diversity of seating and hand positions may have
evolved to provide racers with a competitive edge, it also serves
recreational riders well by providing a range of ergonomic positions that
help the rider to favorably adapt to the demands of cycling despite their
individual limitations. For example, I suffer neural disorders that cause my
hands to get numb if I don't change my hand and arm positioning periodically
during any long ride. Moreover, my back also does better when I use the range
of positions supported by drop bars. All that said, choosing a road bike for
riding on the road is one thing, getting that good fit is another, and the
ergonomic versatility of a conventional road bike may be negated more
severely by bad fit than it would be on a flatbar, hybrid bike.

--
Mykal Crooks
Seattle, WA

 

[wafflycat]

"Mykal" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>
> The drop bars characteristically found on road bikes provide a variety of
> hand positions. While this diversity of seating and hand positions may
> have
> evolved to provide racers with a competitive edge, it also serves
> recreational riders well by providing a range of ergonomic positions that
> help the rider to favorably adapt to the demands of cycling despite their
> individual limitations. For example, I suffer neural disorders that cause
> my
> hands to get numb if I don't change my hand and arm positioning
> periodically
> during any long ride. Moreover, my back also does better when I use the
> range
> of positions supported by drop bars. All that said, choosing a road bike
> for
> riding on the road is one thing, getting that good fit is another, and the
> ergonomic versatility of a conventional road bike may be negated more
> severely by bad fit than it would be on a flatbar, hybrid bike.
>
> --
> Mykal Crooks
> Seattle, WA
>
>

I'm a recreational cyclist and use it for transport when I've only light
shopping to do. I'm also a convert to drop handlebars. Basically I was
bought a bike with drops about three years ago and up to that point, I'd not
used drops. It took me a while to get used to drops but now I'd not
willingly go back to flat handlebars. The drops give such a range of hand
positions that make a long cycle ride much more comfortable than using flat
handlebars. I'm much more comfortable on a long ride when I use either my
tourer or race bike than doing the same distance on my hybrid (which has
flat handlebars).

Cheers, helen s

 

[wafflycat]

"Mykal" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>
> The drop bars characteristically found on road bikes provide a variety of
> hand positions. While this diversity of seating and hand positions may
> have
> evolved to provide racers with a competitive edge, it also serves
> recreational riders well by providing a range of ergonomic positions that
> help the rider to favorably adapt to the demands of cycling despite their
> individual limitations. For example, I suffer neural disorders that cause
> my
> hands to get numb if I don't change my hand and arm positioning
> periodically
> during any long ride. Moreover, my back also does better when I use the
> range
> of positions supported by drop bars. All that said, choosing a road bike
> for
> riding on the road is one thing, getting that good fit is another, and the
> ergonomic versatility of a conventional road bike may be negated more
> severely by bad fit than it would be on a flatbar, hybrid bike.
>
> --
> Mykal Crooks
> Seattle, WA
>
>

I'm a recreational cyclist and use it for transport when I've only light
shopping to do. I'm also a convert to drop handlebars. Basically I was
bought a bike with drops about three years ago and up to that point, I'd not
used drops. It took me a while to get used to drops but now I'd not
willingly go back to flat handlebars. The drops give such a range of hand
positions that make a long cycle ride much more comfortable than using flat
handlebars. I'm much more comfortable on a long ride when I use either my
tourer or race bike than doing the same distance on my hybrid (which has
flat handlebars).

Cheers, helen s