I blew it!

Discussion in 'Road Cycling' started by Roger Zoul, Aug 7, 2004.

  1. Roger Zoul

    Roger Zoul Guest

    I went on a metric century today with about 3700+ feet of climbing.
    According to my Polar 720i, that's about 1800 more feet than I normally do
    on 65 miles. Well, the ride as going great. Finally we got to this one
    longish climb...some guy came past me....I decided to follow....I finally
    pasted him back....HR hit 173 (my theoretical max) and stayed there a
    while...I was huffing and puffing...only going about 5 mph or so...but I got
    that hill. My buddy who was with me at the beginning said I was out of
    sight by the time he got to the top of that hill. He must weigh some 60 lbs
    less than me.

    Well, the next time a major hill came...I started having cramps in my left
    quad...the muscle to the left of the knee cap (inner front thigh)...got off
    and massaged it for a bit...it felt better. Went on...another hill...this
    time it started locking up. Got off...I couldn't bend my leg....it was
    stuck straight....that muscle as hard as a rock...it took about 3 minutes
    before it relaxed. That was at 46 miles. I rode to 50 miles (3400ft of
    ascent) where the next rest stop was. I got in the sag wagon. Dammit.

    I must learn to respect the climb. I must find some better climbing
    material, too.
     
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  2. Bill Baka

    Bill Baka Guest

    On Sat, 7 Aug 2004 15:20:42 -0400, Roger Zoul <[email protected]>
    wrote:

    > I went on a metric century today with about 3700+ feet of climbing.
    > According to my Polar 720i, that's about 1800 more feet than I normally
    > do
    > on 65 miles. Well, the ride as going great. Finally we got to this one
    > longish climb...some guy came past me....I decided to follow....I finally
    > pasted him back....HR hit 173 (my theoretical max) and stayed there a
    > while...I was huffing and puffing...only going about 5 mph or so...but I
    > got
    > that hill. My buddy who was with me at the beginning said I was out of
    > sight by the time he got to the top of that hill. He must weigh some 60
    > lbs
    > less than me.
    >
    > Well, the next time a major hill came...I started having cramps in my
    > left
    > quad...the muscle to the left of the knee cap (inner front thigh)...got
    > off
    > and massaged it for a bit...it felt better. Went on...another hill...this
    > time it started locking up. Got off...I couldn't bend my leg....it was
    > stuck straight....that muscle as hard as a rock...it took about 3 minutes
    > before it relaxed. That was at 46 miles. I rode to 50 miles (3400ft of
    > ascent) where the next rest stop was. I got in the sag wagon. Dammit.
    >
    > I must learn to respect the climb. I must find some better climbing
    > material, too.
    >
    >

    Were you at least out of the saddle attacking the hill or did you just
    mash the pedals seated?
    Doing the 'Lance Dance' gets me up the hills and saves my legs for the
    straight stuff while getting my heart going a little faster.
    2 cents mode off.
    Bill Baka


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  3. psycholist

    psycholist Guest

    "Roger Zoul" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > I went on a metric century today with about 3700+ feet of climbing.
    > According to my Polar 720i, that's about 1800 more feet than I normally do
    > on 65 miles. Well, the ride as going great. Finally we got to this one
    > longish climb...some guy came past me....I decided to follow....I finally
    > pasted him back....HR hit 173 (my theoretical max) and stayed there a
    > while...I was huffing and puffing...only going about 5 mph or so...but I

    got
    > that hill. My buddy who was with me at the beginning said I was out of
    > sight by the time he got to the top of that hill. He must weigh some 60

    lbs
    > less than me.
    >
    > Well, the next time a major hill came...I started having cramps in my left
    > quad...the muscle to the left of the knee cap (inner front thigh)...got

    off
    > and massaged it for a bit...it felt better. Went on...another hill...this
    > time it started locking up. Got off...I couldn't bend my leg....it was
    > stuck straight....that muscle as hard as a rock...it took about 3 minutes
    > before it relaxed. That was at 46 miles. I rode to 50 miles (3400ft of
    > ascent) where the next rest stop was. I got in the sag wagon. Dammit.
    >
    > I must learn to respect the climb. I must find some better climbing
    > material, too.
    >
    >


    Hi Roger,

    I do the Lance Dance, too. I don't necessarily do that much of it out of
    the saddle, but I've worked on my aerobic ability to spin the smaller gears.
    That keeps me in the game on the longer climbs. It also saves your legs
    when you're doing longer rides.

    So how was Tigerville? Sorry I didn't make it up there. Who woulda thought
    they could move the date from October to early August and still have the
    same Fall weather? I just wasn't up for 4 hours of driving to do a 3 hour
    ride. I did 82 miles ... half of that solo and half with an old training
    buddy from Anderson. What a glorious morning!

    Sorry to hear that you ended up in the sag wagon. Work on using small gears
    on those hills. When you mash the big gears, you work your muscles harder
    and they give out sooner.

    We'll talk more about this.

    Bob C.
     
  4. Roger Zoul

    Roger Zoul Guest

    Bill Baka wrote:
    || On Sat, 7 Aug 2004 15:20:42 -0400, Roger Zoul
    || <[email protected]> wrote:
    ||
    ||| I went on a metric century today with about 3700+ feet of climbing.
    ||| According to my Polar 720i, that's about 1800 more feet than I
    ||| normally do
    ||| on 65 miles. Well, the ride as going great. Finally we got to
    ||| this one longish climb...some guy came past me....I decided to
    ||| follow....I finally pasted him back....HR hit 173 (my theoretical
    ||| max) and stayed there a while...I was huffing and puffing...only
    ||| going about 5 mph or so...but I got
    ||| that hill. My buddy who was with me at the beginning said I was
    ||| out of sight by the time he got to the top of that hill. He must
    ||| weigh some 60 lbs
    ||| less than me.
    |||
    ||| Well, the next time a major hill came...I started having cramps in
    ||| my left
    ||| quad...the muscle to the left of the knee cap (inner front
    ||| thigh)...got off
    ||| and massaged it for a bit...it felt better. Went on...another
    ||| hill...this time it started locking up. Got off...I couldn't bend
    ||| my leg....it was stuck straight....that muscle as hard as a
    ||| rock...it took about 3 minutes before it relaxed. That was at 46
    ||| miles. I rode to 50 miles (3400ft of ascent) where the next rest
    ||| stop was. I got in the sag wagon. Dammit.
    |||
    ||| I must learn to respect the climb. I must find some better climbing
    ||| material, too.
    |||
    |||
    || Were you at least out of the saddle attacking the hill or did you
    || just mash the pedals seated?

    I was mashing but I was in the lower gear on the bike. I didn't stand,
    though. I was already at my limit, so there wouldn't have been much point
    to standing.

    || Doing the 'Lance Dance' gets me up the hills and saves my legs for
    || the straight stuff while getting my heart going a little faster.

    I'm not sure what the "Lance Dance" is, sadly.
     
  5. Roger Zoul

    Roger Zoul Guest

    psycholist wrote:
    || "Roger Zoul" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    || news:[email protected]
    ||| I went on a metric century today with about 3700+ feet of climbing.
    ||| According to my Polar 720i, that's about 1800 more feet than I
    ||| normally do on 65 miles. Well, the ride as going great. Finally
    ||| we got to this one longish climb...some guy came past me....I
    ||| decided to follow....I finally pasted him back....HR hit 173 (my
    ||| theoretical max) and stayed there a while...I was huffing and
    ||| puffing...only going about 5 mph or so...but I got that hill. My
    ||| buddy who was with me at the beginning said I was out of sight by
    ||| the time he got to the top of that hill. He must weigh some 60 lbs
    ||| less than me.
    |||
    ||| Well, the next time a major hill came...I started having cramps in
    ||| my left quad...the muscle to the left of the knee cap (inner front
    ||| thigh)...got off and massaged it for a bit...it felt better. Went
    ||| on...another hill...this time it started locking up. Got off...I
    ||| couldn't bend my leg....it was stuck straight....that muscle as
    ||| hard as a rock...it took about 3 minutes before it relaxed. That
    ||| was at 46 miles. I rode to 50 miles (3400ft of ascent) where the
    ||| next rest stop was. I got in the sag wagon. Dammit.
    |||
    ||| I must learn to respect the climb. I must find some better climbing
    ||| material, too.
    |||
    |||
    ||
    || Hi Roger,
    ||
    || I do the Lance Dance, too. I don't necessarily do that much of it
    || out of the saddle, but I've worked on my aerobic ability to spin the
    || smaller gears. That keeps me in the game on the longer climbs. It
    || also saves your legs when you're doing longer rides.

    I was in the smallest gear! Pedal pretty fast, really, even though I don't
    recall the cadence.

    ||
    || So how was Tigerville?

    Lovely. Absolutely lovely. I was quite disappointed I didn't complete such
    a ride ride on such a beautiful day with such lovely scenery.

    Sorry I didn't make it up there. Who woulda
    || thought they could move the date from October to early August and
    || still have the same Fall weather?

    I was all set to be unhappy about them moving the date, but they apparently
    put in a special order for fantastic weather.


    I just wasn't up for 4 hours of
    || driving to do a 3 hour ride. I did 82 miles ... half of that solo
    || and half with an old training buddy from Anderson. What a glorious
    || morning!
    ||

    Wow. This would have been a cakewake for you.

    || Sorry to hear that you ended up in the sag wagon. Work on using
    || small gears on those hills. When you mash the big gears, you work
    || your muscles harder and they give out sooner.

    I've got a lot of stuff to work on, it would seem! :)

    ||
    || We'll talk more about this.
    ||

    Yes, let's do, as I need some work!
     
  6. Bill Baka

    Bill Baka Guest

    On Sat, 7 Aug 2004 17:34:50 -0400, Roger Zoul <[email protected]>
    wrote:

    > I was mashing but I was in the lower gear on the bike. I didn't stand,
    > though. I was already at my limit, so there wouldn't have been much
    > point
    > to standing.
    >
    > || Doing the 'Lance Dance' gets me up the hills and saves my legs for
    > || the straight stuff while getting my heart going a little faster.
    >
    > I'm not sure what the "Lance Dance" is, sadly.
    >
    >

    You didn't watch the tour? One of the commentators called it when he got
    out of the saddle and creamed the competition going up a hill.
    Standing and rocking the bike to add arm power and making it look easy.
    Bill Baka
    Going back to observer mode, dull day.


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  7. Pat

    Pat Guest

    I think you got sucked into trying something beyond your range of expertise,
    stayed at it for too long, and paid the price for the lesson. I almost had
    this happen to me today. A couple went by at 24 mph and I jumped on their
    tails. Funny thing, though, I could get no closer than a bike's length
    behind them. Of course, I kept trying harder and harder while they looked
    as if they were pedaling easily (and having a chat at the same time). I was
    killing myself trying to keep close on their rear wheels when I finally came
    to my senses and realized that I am not "there" yet. Maybe I will be next
    time, but today, it was slightly beyond my abilities. I was so close that I
    wanted desperately to keep trying, so I know the feeling you had. I finally
    had to go back into my comfort mode at about 18 mph and think about that
    lesson.

    On the other hand, you probably learned some things that will help you next
    time. No experience is worthless, after all.

    Pat in TX
     
  8. The Real Bev

    The Real Bev Guest

    Bill Baka wrote:
    >
    > On Sat, 7 Aug 2004 17:34:50 -0400, Roger Zoul <[email protected]>
    > wrote:
    >
    > > I was mashing but I was in the lower gear on the bike. I didn't stand,
    > > though. I was already at my limit, so there wouldn't have been much
    > > point
    > > to standing.
    > >
    > > || Doing the 'Lance Dance' gets me up the hills and saves my legs for
    > > || the straight stuff while getting my heart going a little faster.
    > >
    > > I'm not sure what the "Lance Dance" is, sadly.
    > >

    > You didn't watch the tour? One of the commentators called it when he got
    > out of the saddle and creamed the competition going up a hill.
    > Standing and rocking the bike to add arm power and making it look easy.


    I've long wondered what rocking back and forth does. Explanation
    please?

    --
    Cheers, Bev
    ===================================================
    Red ship crashes into blue ship - sailors marooned.
     
  9. Fx199

    Fx199 Guest

    >I've long wondered what rocking back and forth does. Explanation
    >please?
    >
    >--
    >Cheers, Bev


    Go back to robbing the wishing well, you're way too old to learn at this point.
     
  10. The Real Bev

    The Real Bev Guest

    Fx199 wrote:
    >
    > >I've long wondered what rocking back and forth does. Explanation
    > >please?

    >
    > Go back to robbing the wishing well, you're way too old to learn at this point.


    Did somebody once tell you that you were clever? Did she owe you
    money?

    --
    Cheers,
    Bev
    ------------------------------------------------------
    "Give me all your brains or I'll blow your money out!"
    --Anonymous Unsuccessful Bank Robber
     
  11. Dan Daniel

    Dan Daniel Guest

    On Sat, 07 Aug 2004 19:46:45 -0700, The Real Bev
    <[email protected]> wrote:


    >
    >I've long wondered what rocking back and forth does. Explanation
    >please?


    By standing, you add a good amount of body weight to the downstroke.
    By 'pulling the handlebar up' on the same side, you can also use the
    arm and shoulder to help push the leg down.

    But all this downward force on one side of the bike wouldn't work if
    you didn't tilt the bike in the opposite direction. Reverse and
    repeat, and the bike goes rocking back and forth.
     
  12. R15757

    R15757 Guest

    Roger Zoul wrote:

    <snip tale of massive cramp>

    Roger,

    Water! That's all you needed there man. Of course by the time you got the cramp
    it was too late. You need to drink more water, before, after, during the ride.

    Robert
     
  13. Roger Zoul

    Roger Zoul Guest

    R15757 wrote:
    || Roger Zoul wrote:
    ||
    || <snip tale of massive cramp>
    ||
    || Roger,
    ||
    || Water! That's all you needed there man. Of course by the time you
    || got the cramp it was too late. You need to drink more water, before,
    || after, during the ride.
    ||
    || Robert

    Perhaps. I didn't feel overly thirsty and I had drank before the ride and
    at the 15-mile point too. But who knows if I had enough. Interesting,
    when I got back to the start inthe sag wagon I noticed that I had even
    worked up my usual sweat -- I'm usually sweating down the front so badly
    that I look like someone spilled a lot of water on my belly. I think
    drinking more it something to try....
     
  14. Peter Cole

    Peter Cole Guest

    "Roger Zoul" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > I went on a metric century today with about 3700+ feet of climbing.
    > According to my Polar 720i, that's about 1800 more feet than I normally do
    > on 65 miles. Well, the ride as going great. Finally we got to this one
    > longish climb...some guy came past me....I decided to follow....I finally
    > pasted him back....HR hit 173 (my theoretical max) and stayed there a
    > while...I was huffing and puffing...only going about 5 mph or so...but I got
    > that hill.


    > Well, the next time a major hill came...I started having cramps in my left
    > quad...


    > I rode to 50 miles (3400ft of
    > ascent) where the next rest stop was. I got in the sag wagon. Dammit.
    >
    > I must learn to respect the climb. I must find some better climbing
    > material, too.


    Pacing is everything on long rides. Cramps are a sign of deep muscle fatigue,
    you just pushed them too far. When you're asking more from your muscles than
    you have accustomed them to, you've got to pace it very carefully. You want to
    keep peak efforts as low as possible, I think of it as the "no burn" rule, try
    to avoid any effort that results in muscle burn, as that is accumulating
    fatigue, which will lead to early cramping. Charging on a long climb was the
    very last thing you should have done if you wanted to finish that ride.

    You can continue to ride with cramping, I did the last 75 of a 125 miler that
    way a few years back. Frequent stretches and massaging the legs (hard when
    hands start cramping, too), perhaps walking some hills, will get you home. I
    wouldn't do it unless absolutely necessary though, just too unpleasant.
     
  15. Peter Cole

    Peter Cole Guest

    "Dan Daniel" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > On Sat, 07 Aug 2004 19:46:45 -0700, The Real Bev
    > <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >
    > >
    > >I've long wondered what rocking back and forth does. Explanation
    > >please?

    >
    > By standing, you add a good amount of body weight to the downstroke.
    > By 'pulling the handlebar up' on the same side, you can also use the
    > arm and shoulder to help push the leg down.


    This really only helps with sprinting.


    > But all this downward force on one side of the bike wouldn't work if
    > you didn't tilt the bike in the opposite direction. Reverse and
    > repeat, and the bike goes rocking back and forth.


    Rocking a bike is really hard on the wheels, and not really necessary.
     
  16. Dan Daniel

    Dan Daniel Guest

    On Sun, 08 Aug 2004 13:14:08 GMT, "Peter Cole"
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    >"Dan Daniel" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >news:[email protected]
    >> On Sat, 07 Aug 2004 19:46:45 -0700, The Real Bev
    >> <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >> >
    >> >I've long wondered what rocking back and forth does. Explanation
    >> >please?

    >>
    >> By standing, you add a good amount of body weight to the downstroke.
    >> By 'pulling the handlebar up' on the same side, you can also use the
    >> arm and shoulder to help push the leg down.

    >
    >This really only helps with sprinting.
    >
    >


    Well, no matter what the effort, you will be doing this with the arms
    to some extent. I've found it helps to do it deliberatley at times.
    Maybe if only to take my mind off the pain in my legs? :)

    >> But all this downward force on one side of the bike wouldn't work if
    >> you didn't tilt the bike in the opposite direction. Reverse and
    >> repeat, and the bike goes rocking back and forth.

    >
    >Rocking a bike is really hard on the wheels, and not really necessary.
    >


    Again like the arm thing, rocking will happen. I didn't mean to imply
    that someone should deliberately rock the bike hard in the opposite
    direction. A silly waste of motion, and as you say hard on wheels.
     
  17. Bill Baka

    Bill Baka Guest

    On Sun, 08 Aug 2004 08:21:00 -0700, Dan Daniel
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    > On Sun, 08 Aug 2004 13:14:08 GMT, "Peter Cole"
    > <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >> "Dan Daniel" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >> news:[email protected]
    >>> On Sat, 07 Aug 2004 19:46:45 -0700, The Real Bev
    >>> <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> >
    >>> >I've long wondered what rocking back and forth does. Explanation
    >>> >please?
    >>>
    >>> By standing, you add a good amount of body weight to the downstroke.
    >>> By 'pulling the handlebar up' on the same side, you can also use the
    >>> arm and shoulder to help push the leg down.

    >>
    >> This really only helps with sprinting.
    >>
    >>

    >
    > Well, no matter what the effort, you will be doing this with the arms
    > to some extent. I've found it helps to do it deliberatley at times.
    > Maybe if only to take my mind off the pain in my legs? :)
    >
    >>> But all this downward force on one side of the bike wouldn't work if
    >>> you didn't tilt the bike in the opposite direction. Reverse and
    >>> repeat, and the bike goes rocking back and forth.

    >>
    >> Rocking a bike is really hard on the wheels, and not really necessary.
    >>

    >
    > Again like the arm thing, rocking will happen. I didn't mean to imply
    > that someone should deliberately rock the bike hard in the opposite
    > direction. A silly waste of motion, and as you say hard on wheels.


    I have found it just happens, especially when attacking a serious hill.
    Not too much on sprints, just hills for me. LA does it sometimes, not
    always, so it may just be the person and the circumstances.
    Bill Baka



    --
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  18. Fx199

    Fx199 Guest

    >Subject: Re: I blew it!
    >From: The Real Bev [email protected]
    >Date: 8/8/2004 12:51 AM US Eastern Standard Time
    >Message-id: <[email protected]>
    >
    >Fx199 wrote:
    >>
    >> >I've long wondered what rocking back and forth does. Explanation
    >> >please?

    >>
    >> Go back to robbing the wishing well, you're way too old to learn at this

    >point.
    >
    >Did somebody once tell you that you were clever? Did she owe you
    >money?
    >


    No, actually I buy and sell people like you based only on my cleverness.
    Sorry to tell you this this, but I'm rich, based only on my smart
    mouth.(writing)
    Be happy with what you have anyway.
    I have to screen my calls because of the "her(s)" you mentioned.
    Bye bye spiderweb-crotch.
     
  19. Rick Onanian

    Rick Onanian Guest

    On 09 Aug 2004 01:35:59 GMT, [email protected] (Fx199) wrote:
    >Bye bye spiderweb-crotch.


    I miss a couple weeks of r.b.m. messages, and this is what I come
    back to see?

    I guess I haven't missed much. <G>
    --
    Rick Onanian
     
  20. Pbwalther

    Pbwalther Guest

    >I've long wondered what rocking back and forth does. Explanation
    >>please?

    >


    >By standing, you add a good amount of body weight to the downstroke.
    >By 'pulling the handlebar up' on the same side, you can also use the
    >arm and shoulder to help push the leg down.


    >But all this downward force on one side of the bike wouldn't work if
    >you didn't tilt the bike in the opposite direction. Reverse and
    >repeat, and the bike goes rocking back and forth.


    Good explanation.

    I have found that on very steep hills, I can get out of the saddle and my pedal
    will not budge and I have to rock the bike and use my upper body to turn over
    the pedals. Now I am talking about very steep (right around 20%).

    I really do not keep that sort of thing up for very long. The pros seem to do
    it for miles. Of course, it is their living otherwise they wouldn't be pros
    now would they?
     
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