I finally used my Park Tensiometer - Wow!

[Ken Pisichko]

This past week end I replaced 3 broken spokes on a 26" wheel
from an old garage sale bike. I trued the wheel and there is
almost no lateral "wobble". I am not sure of the history of
this bike, but there are no dings in the rim - it just
adequate like a cheap Chinese make. Suitable as a knock-
about "beater'.

Then I took out the tensiometer and took readings as per
instructions of spokes on each side of this (rear) wheel.
Found the average tension - directly from the scale and did
not bother converting to "actual" units by using their
"chart". I was amazed to find some spokes were double the
average tension while some were half the tension with most
in the +/- 20% of average range that Park seems to
recommend.

After readjusting the wide tensions I checked the lateral
motion again and kept adjusting tensions so all were in the
+/- 20% range.

Took the bike out for a spin - no more creaks etc from the
rear wheel. Mind you, those creaks were there before the
spokes broke. In fact the creaks were there when i bought
the bike. Wheel is pretty true as well. That tensiometer is
simple to use.

Should I keep checking (and adjusting) the spoke tension
every few months, or just leave well enough alone with that
wheel? I don't put a lot of kms on it.

After readjusting the tension to the +/- range, should a
new average be taken and then go through another
"iteration" process?

 

[Drs]

"Ken Pisichko" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]

[...]

> Should I keep checking (and adjusting) the spoke tension
> every few months, or just leave well enough alone with
> that wheel? I don't put a lot of kms on it.
>
> After readjusting the tension to the +/- range, should a
> new average be taken and then go through another
> "iteration" process?

Yes and yes. You must never come to the idea that it is
possible to stop improving your bike.

--

A: Top-posters.
B: What is the most annoying thing on Usenet?

 

[Mark South]

"DRS" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Ken Pisichko" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]
>
> [...]
>
> > Should I keep checking (and adjusting) the spoke tension
> > every few months, or just leave well enough alone with
> > that wheel? I don't put a lot of kms on it.
> >
> > After readjusting the tension to the +/- range, should a
> > new average be taken and then go through another
> > "iteration" process?
>
> Yes and yes. You must never come to the idea that it is
> possible to stop improving your bike.

One corollary is that the bike must be continually
improved even if it is a beat-up piece of junk that cost
less than 5 dollars.
--
Mark South: World Citizen, Net Denizen

 

[daveornee]

Originally posted by Ken Pisichko
This past week end I replaced 3 broken spokes on a 26" wheel
from an old garage sale bike. I trued the wheel and there is
almost no lateral "wobble". I am not sure of the history of
this bike, but there are no dings in the rim - it just
adequate like a cheap Chinese make. Suitable as a knock-
about "beater'.

Then I took out the tensiometer and took readings as per
instructions of spokes on each side of this (rear) wheel.
Found the average tension - directly from the scale and did
not bother converting to "actual" units by using their
"chart". I was amazed to find some spokes were double the
average tension while some were half the tension with most
in the +/- 20% of average range that Park seems to
recommend.

After readjusting the wide tensions I checked the lateral
motion again and kept adjusting tensions so all were in the
+/- 20% range.

Took the bike out for a spin - no more creaks etc from the
rear wheel. Mind you, those creaks were there before the
spokes broke. In fact the creaks were there when i bought
the bike. Wheel is pretty true as well. That tensiometer is
simple to use.

Should I keep checking (and adjusting) the spoke tension
every few months, or just leave well enough alone with that
wheel? I don't put a lot of kms on it.

After readjusting the tension to the +/- range, should a
new average be taken and then go through another
"iteration" process?

Tension balance is one of the easiest and most important things you can do to make your wheels more reliable. You should make sure that they are also not over/under tensioned and that the are stress relieved.
You have the spoke tension device; why not give them a check once in a while? I would expect you will find that once they are tension balanced, they will stay that way unless you there is damage or something broke.
Spokes tend to bed into the hub and straighten themselves out ... both by very small amounts,,,.... and over riding dynamic load cycles. Since they are never starting from the exact point, they can benefit from a check. You can always do a quick check with the wheels on the bike, along with your examination of the spoke holes, tires, and true within the brake shoes. This takes about 2 minutes if everything is OK. If you want to get it down to less than a minute you can do spoke toning by ear.

 

[Matt O'Toole]

Mark South wrote:

> One corollary is that the bike must be continually
> improved even if it is a beat-up piece of junk that cost
> less than 5 dollars.

That's why I don't buy "$5" bikes anymore... no matter what
a "bargain" they seem to be.

Matt O.

 

[Art M]

"Ken Pisichko" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> This past week end I replaced 3 broken spokes on a 26"
> wheel from an old garage sale bike. I trued the wheel and
> there is almost no lateral "wobble". I am not sure of the
> history of this bike, but there are no dings in the rim -
> it just adequate like a cheap Chinese make. Suitable as a
> knock-about "beater'.
>
> Then I took out the tensiometer and took readings as per
> instructions of spokes on each side of this (rear) wheel.
> Found the average tension - directly from the scale and
> did not bother converting to "actual" units by using their
> "chart". I was amazed to find some spokes were double the
> average tension while some were half the tension with most
> in the +/- 20% of average range that Park seems to
> recommend.
>
> After readjusting the wide tensions I checked the lateral
> motion again and kept adjusting tensions so all were in
> the +/- 20% range.
>
> Took the bike out for a spin - no more creaks etc from the
> rear wheel. Mind you, those creaks were there before the
> spokes broke. In fact the creaks were there when i bought
> the bike. Wheel is pretty true as well. That tensiometer
> is simple to use.
>
> Should I keep checking (and adjusting) the spoke tension
> every few months, or just leave well enough alone with
> that wheel? I don't put a lot of kms on it.
>
> After readjusting the tension to the +/- range, should a
> new average be taken and then go through another
> "iteration" process?
>

It's not clear from your post as to weather you checked for
roundness in addition to lateral trueness. Sometimes spokes
on a old beater rim may need to be more than 20% from
average tension to correct for this.

--Art

 

[Paul Kopit]

On Wed, 09 Jun 2004 09:04:29 -0500, Ken Pisichko <[email protected]> wrote:

>Should I keep checking (and adjusting) the spoke tension
>every few months, or just leave well enough alone with that
>wheel? I don't put a lot of kms on it.
>
>After readjusting the tension to the +/- range, should a
>new average be taken and then go through another
>"iteration" process?

Wheels that have sufficient and balanced tension are boring.
There is little that need be done to them unless you bash
them hard enought to get some rim distortion.

 

[Ken Pisichko]

Mark South wrote:

> One corollary is that the bike must be continually
> improved even if it is a beat-up piece of junk that cost
> less than 5 dollars.

The bike actually cost $20. I had to custom build an
extended seat post with a piece of steel (actually the
original seat post) to move the seat "backwards' enough so I
wasn't right at the handlebars. It works for me.

Of course since I always want something better and have
decided to spend savings before I eventually leave this
mortal world, I will get a custom touring frame built soon,
here in Canada, with S&S connectors. Cost is about
%1500 CDN $$. Lots of machinations over the frame, but it
%certainly will fit
better than my 1973 Peugeot and the Chinese beater.

Also, lots of turmoil over the BB, the wheels, etc. Some
will be NOS, some used, and some new. The Brooks saddle
on the Chinese beater will naturally go on the new
touring frame.

I guess, from the comments in reply to my thread, that it
always pays to keep tweaking No point in "standing
still", eh?

Now for other esoteric decisions - like the colour:
should it be British "Racing Green", or a "copy" of
Lance's USPS colours??

Thanks all!

Ken

 

[Ken Pisichko]

Art M wrote:

> It's not clear from your post as to weather you checked
> for roundness in addition to lateral trueness. Sometimes
> spokes on a old beater rim may need to be more than 20%
> from average tension to correct for this.
>
> --Art

Thank you Art. I was amazed that there was only lateral
"wobble". The wheel is very round. Maybe a mm out at worst.

 

[Joe Riel]

Ken Pisichko wrote:

> After readjusting the wide tensions I checked the lateral
> motion again and kept adjusting tensions so all were in
> the +/- 20% range.

While you may find it interesting to check tension of each
spokes with the tensiometer, that isn't how it is normally
used. Rather, balance the tension by plucking the spokes,
listening to the tone, and adjusting accordingly. You'll
find this to be a lot faster than using a tensiometer. You
need to measure only one spoke for tension.

Joe

 

[Ken Pisichko]

Joe Riel wrote:

> Ken Pisichko wrote:
>

Sorry, but for a tone-deaf quantitative type like myself the
tensiometer route is obviously thenonly way to go (for me).
i have a handle on what i should be doing now with the
tensiometer. Basically a no-brainer. It just takes some time
and effort - both of which I am willing to expend in this
mortal world


I don't find it interesting! It is damn boring. However,
from what I have read between-the-lines) it is as necessary
(obviously) as a diabetic testing blood sugars 4X daily. I
just needed a handle on what should be done in the future
with the wheel -and others on my Peugeot - now that I have
the tensiometer.

> While you may find it interesting to check tension of each
> spokes with the tensiometer, that isn't how it is normally
> used. Rather, balance the tension by plucking the spokes,
> listening to the tone, and adjusting accordingly. You'll
> find this to be a lot faster than using a tensiometer. You
> need to measure only one spoke for tension.

 

[Rick Onanian]

On Wed, 9 Jun 2004 12:12:24 -0400, "Matt O'Toole"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Mark South wrote:
>> One corollary is that the bike must be continually
>> improved even if it is a beat-up piece of junk that cost
>> less than 5 dollars.
>
>That's why I don't buy "$5" bikes anymore... no matter what
>a "bargain" they seem to be.

You've got it all wrong. Since you must keep improving, a
$5 bike offers a lot more opportunities to improve it, and
can be improved cheaper. It's expensive to improve on a
$2000 bike.
--
Rick Onanian