I have spun

Raptor said:

Per Elmsäter said:

There are other reasons to stay in the lower zones for long times and that is to build
mitochondria which is very important for the aerobic fitness. The more mítochondria we have the
easier it is to feed oxygen to the muscles and the better our endurance will be. The better our
endurance gets the more fat we can burn at higher workloads and the less dependent we get upon
carb renewals etc.

Another point was made to me recently about the usefulness of the lower intensity. It impacts your
glycogen stores less (since you're burning a higher %age of fat), which might lead to less of a
sugar crash after a workout. Good for dieters.

--

Now that sounds like true BS. I'd put some pressure on whoever said that if I were you. Due to the
*glycogen window* you don't have to worry about sugar crashes after a workout. During this window,
maybe up to 30 minutes after your workout you can and should eat pure sugar to restore your
glycogen. This will go straight into restoring the supplys and will not even raise the insulin
level. If you wait like an hour you'll have to maintain sugar and insulin levels like normal.

So I still say if somebody is on a diet. The harder you workout the better off you are. It is a very
simple formula of calories in vs calories out.

--
Perre

You have to be smarter than a robot to reply.

Penny S said:

ps, thanks for the card!!

oops, that would be the other Per...

Raptor said:

Penny S said:

good info. Now I'm just waiting to corner my trainer pal ( a real trainer, not a "got my
certificate out of a crackerjack box ) who works at the college, to do a sub max test so I can
some better personal numbers to work with. Instead of guidelines and general formulas.

Penny

ps, thanks for the card!!

I just got mine off the web, not from a box. For what it's worth. 🙂 (My cert is from a well-
respected organization [NASM].)

From what I know about the industry's standards, a CPT alone is not qualified to do a sub max
test. Does your friend have other quals, or am I an ignorant n00b?

--

Notice I didn't say she was a **personal** trainer; she's a collegiate athletic trainer. She's got a
master's degree in exercise physiology ( I think that's the degree) and a few of the right
certifications, and has been training athletes at the collegiate level for about 18 years. She's the
one that taught me that not all "personal training" certifications are the same thing. She gets
rather rabid about the way the term is loosely used these days. She told me all her letters once,
and told me the good certifications to look for. Not that I remember theme. Keep in mind, I don't
use trainers, I just have a few that I ride and ski with, and pick their brains if they are in the
mood to share. So don't worry, I'm in good hands. It's great to know someone like her.. everytime I
hurt myself, she throws me in her ice tanks. and then, if I"m lucky I get therapeutic massage
afterwords.

penny

On 2004-01-24, Raptor penned:

Quoted message said:

Monique Y. Herman said:

If you don't care for spinning, I can understand. But I think it will fill a niche for me. It
will never be something I choose to do instead of mountain biking, but it will be something I do
in addition to mountain biking, and I do think it will help me enjoy mountain biking more.

The danger is that the niche will get bigger. Your standards for good riding weather might slip.
Don't have too much fun. 🙂

I'll try to be aware of the dangers =) It shouldn't have too much of an impact, though; I generally
ride on weekends, and the spinning classes are only offered on weekdays.

--
monique

Raptor said:

Penny S said:

Monique, you might considereing getting a heart rate monitor for use during class. I found it
really helped me a lot. Here they use the "percieved exertion" on a scale of 1-10 instead of
percentages, and found that working with my %'s helps me a lot with the different intesity
levels. Also, I'm reading a cool book, Heart Zone Training by Sally Edwards which is very easy to
understand. You can get HRM's on sale at performance any time.

Penny

I use and like my HRM. But given that all training zones are based on your Max HR, how useful is
it really? The problem is, you don't know your max. You can't know it unless you go as hard as
physically possible to see how fast you can make your heart beat. Then re-check it every 20
minutes or so. Not something recommended... With long use and casual statistical analysis ("watch
your numbers for a while"😉, you can put some loose boundaries around different levels of exertion,
but that's about it.

I did some threshold training a few weeks ago. It was a special class that they held . Again, just
guidelines, and the same method is outlined as a guideline in the Sally Jones book I just read. It
was where you did 20 minute intervals at the highest level you could maintain, recover and do it
again, just try and establish an idea of where your aerobic/anaerobic threshold is.

granted, I know just enough to be dangerous...

Penny

Quoted message said:

So don't worry, I'm in good hands. It's great to know someone like her.. everytime I hurt myself,
she throws me in her ice tanks. and then, if I"m lucky I get therapeutic massage afterwords.

penny

I'd pay good money for a friend like that!
--
Slacker

Per Elmsäter said:

Raptor said:

Per Elmsäter said:

There are other reasons to stay in the lower zones for long times and that is to build
mitochondria which is very important for the aerobic fitness. The more mítochondria we have the
easier it is to feed oxygen to the muscles and the better our endurance will be. The better our
endurance gets the more fat we can burn at higher workloads and the less dependent we get upon
carb renewals etc.

Another point was made to me recently about the usefulness of the lower intensity. It impacts your
glycogen stores less (since you're burning a higher %age of fat), which might lead to less of a
sugar crash after a workout. Good for dieters.

--

Now that sounds like true BS. I'd put some pressure on whoever said that if I were you. Due to the
*glycogen window* you don't have to worry about sugar crashes after a workout. During this window,
maybe up to 30 minutes after your workout you can and should eat pure sugar to restore your
glycogen. This will go straight into restoring the supplys and will not even raise the insulin
level. If you wait like an hour you'll have to maintain sugar and insulin levels like normal.

So I still say if somebody is on a diet. The harder you workout the better off you are. It is a
very simple formula of calories in vs calories out.

Well, I'm not sure how much glycogen gets burned by a given person at a given intensity. Maybe blood
sugar measurement would pin it down. For a relatively fit but heavy dieter to pound sugar after a
20-minute walk around the park doesn't sound like a very good idea to me, but the blood test might.

I'll check though. Can't afford to stop learning about this stuff.

--
--
Lynn Wallace xmission.com~lawallOpen ↗
"We should not march into Baghdad. ... Assigning young soldiers to
a fruitless hunt for a securely entrenched dictator and condemning
them to fight in what would be an unwinnable urban guerilla war, it
could only plunge that part of the world into ever greater
instability." George Bush Sr. in his 1998 book "A World Transformed"

Penny S said:

Raptor said:

I just got mine off the web, not from a box. For what it's worth. 🙂 (My cert is from a well-
respected organization [NASM].)

From what I know about the industry's standards, a CPT alone is not qualified to do a sub max
test. Does your friend have other quals, or am I an ignorant n00b?

--

Notice I didn't say she was a **personal** trainer; she's a collegiate athletic trainer. She's got
a master's degree in exercise physiology ( I think that's the degree) and a few of the right
certifications, and has been training athletes at the collegiate level for about 18 years. She's
the one that taught me that not all "personal training" certifications are the same thing. She
gets rather rabid about the way the term is loosely used these days. She told me all her letters
once, and told me the good certifications to look for. Not that I remember theme. Keep in mind, I
don't use trainers, I just have a few that I ride and ski with, and pick their brains if they are
in the mood to share. So don't worry, I'm in good hands. It's great to know someone like her..
everytime I hurt myself, she throws me in her ice tanks. and then, if I"m lucky I get therapeutic
massage afterwords.

penny

Sounds fun, and good for you. Want to introduce us?

There are programs out there that will certify you as a PT for less than $200. I went with the one
the trainers at the gym recommended, and I've learned that it is indeed pretty good, if not one of
the largest. I suppose my puny little numbers won't ever let me train a national class athlete.

--
--
Lynn Wallace xmission.com~lawallOpen ↗
"We should not march into Baghdad. ... Assigning young soldiers to
a fruitless hunt for a securely entrenched dictator and condemning
them to fight in what would be an unwinnable urban guerilla war, it
could only plunge that part of the world into ever greater
instability." George Bush Sr. in his 1998 book "A World Transformed"

Raptor wrote: I

Quoted message said:

suppose my puny little numbers won't ever let me train a national class athlete.

Shoulda been "letters."

--
--
Lynn Wallace xmission.com~lawallOpen ↗
"We should not march into Baghdad. ... Assigning young soldiers to
a fruitless hunt for a securely entrenched dictator and condemning
them to fight in what would be an unwinnable urban guerilla war, it
could only plunge that part of the world into ever greater
instability." George Bush Sr. in his 1998 book "A World Transformed"

Slacker said:

Quoted message said:

So don't worry, I'm in good hands. It's great to know someone like her.. everytime I hurt myself,
she throws me in her ice tanks. and then, if I"m lucky I get therapeutic massage afterwords.

penny

I'd pay good money for a friend like that!

Hmmm. Maybe that's why you don't have friends like that. Not that I have any either 😉

--
Perre

You have to be smarter than a robot to reply.

Raptor said:

Per Elmsäter said:

Raptor said:

Per Elmsäter wrote:

> There are other reasons to stay in the lower zones for long times and that is to build
> mitochondria which is very important for the aerobic fitness. The more mítochondria we have the
> easier it is to feed oxygen to the muscles and the better our endurance will be. The better our
> endurance gets the more fat we can burn at higher workloads and the less dependent we get upon
> carb renewals etc.

Another point was made to me recently about the usefulness of the lower intensity. It impacts
your glycogen stores less (since you're burning a higher %age of fat), which might lead to less
of a sugar crash after a workout. Good for dieters.

--

Now that sounds like true BS. I'd put some pressure on whoever said that if I were you. Due to
the *glycogen window* you don't have to worry about sugar crashes after a workout. During this
window, maybe up to 30 minutes after your workout you can and should eat pure sugar to restore
your glycogen. This will go straight into restoring the supplys and will not even raise the
insulin level. If you wait like an hour you'll have to maintain sugar and insulin levels like
normal.

So I still say if somebody is on a diet. The harder you workout the better off you are. It is a
very simple formula of calories in vs calories out.

Well, I'm not sure how much glycogen gets burned by a given person at a given intensity. Maybe
blood sugar measurement would pin it down. For a relatively fit but heavy dieter to pound sugar
after a 20-minute walk around the park doesn't sound like a very good idea to me, but the blood
test might.

I'll check though. Can't afford to stop learning about this stuff.

I don't think a 20 minute walk in the park will open the glycogen window. Unfortunately I can't tip
you off to any good literature since the reading I've done on this has been by swedish authors. If
you do a search on "glycemic index" you'll be sure to come up with something. Maybe somebody else on
this ng can recommend something for the english speaking world 😉 GI is interesting stuff both
fitness wise and performace wise for endurance athletes.

--
Perre

You have to be smarter than a robot to reply.

Raptor said:

Penny S said:

Notice I didn't say she was a **personal** trainer; she's a collegiate athletic trainer. She's
got a master's degree in exercise physiology ( I think that's the degree) and a few of the right
certifications, and has been training athletes at the collegiate level for about 18 years. She's
the one that taught me that not all "personal training" certifications are the same thing. She
gets rather rabid about the way the term is loosely used these days. She told me all her letters
once, and told me the good certifications to look for. Not that I remember theme. Keep in mind, I
don't use trainers, I just have a few that I ride and ski with, and pick their brains if they are
in the mood to share. So don't worry, I'm in good hands. It's great to know someone like her..
everytime I hurt myself, she throws me in her ice tanks. and then, if I"m lucky I get therapeutic
massage afterwords.

penny

Sounds fun, and good for you. Want to introduce us?

For those of you that aren't familiar with an ice tank, it's a big stainless tank ( like a water
trough) next to an ice cube machine. It gets filled half way with cold water, and then you scoop ice
out of the machine to fill it up. Then, the injured body part gets submereged for 20 minutes in
water that's about 34 degree for 20 minutes. Then out for 20 minutes, then back in. You think you
need to ice an injury? Try this at thome with a cooler or a bucket, instead of using a baggie full
of cubes. She first did this to me when I broke my arm - we'd take off the splint and and do this
several times a week. It's excruciatingly painful, but the injury feels so much better afterwards.

I know, with friends like this who need enemies.

Penny

"Penny S" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Raptor said:

Penny S said:

Notice I didn't say she was a **personal** trainer; she's a collegiate athletic trainer. She's
got a master's degree in exercise physiology ( I think that's the degree) and a few of the
right certifications, and has been training athletes at the collegiate level for about 18
years. She's the one that taught me that not all "personal training" certifications are the
same thing. She gets rather rabid about the way the term is loosely used these days. She told
me all her letters once, and told me the good certifications to look for. Not that I remember
theme. Keep in mind, I don't use trainers, I just have a few that I ride and ski with, and pick
their brains if they are in the mood to share. So don't worry, I'm in good hands. It's great to
know someone like her.. everytime I hurt myself, she throws me in her ice tanks. and then, if
I"m lucky I get therapeutic massage afterwords.

penny

Sounds fun, and good for you. Want to introduce us?

For those of you that aren't familiar with an ice tank, it's a big stainless tank ( like a water
trough) next to an ice cube machine. It

gets

Quoted message said:

filled half way with cold water, and then you scoop ice out of the machine to fill it up. Then,
the injured body part gets submereged for 20 minutes in water that's about 34 degree for 20
minutes. Then out for 20 minutes, then back in. You think you need to ice an injury? Try this at
thome with

a

Quoted message said:

cooler or a bucket, instead of using a baggie full of cubes. She first

did

Quoted message said:

this to me when I broke my arm - we'd take off the splint and and do this several times a week.
It's excruciatingly painful, but the injury feels

so

Quoted message said:

much better afterwards.

I remember an interview with an orthodedic surgeon where he claimed ice to be a wonder drug. Even
with no injuries there's nothing better after a long, difficult ride then to soak my legs in the
nearest snow melt filled stream or the ice chest if I've brought my full size one along.

Greg

"Monique Y. Herman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Attended a spinning class today. Was very glad I didn't have lunch beforehand. The instructor is
active with both mountain biking and roadie stuff. She chose great music and came up with enough
scenarios to keep me engaged.

Spinning classes are included in my Y membership, so it's effectively free to me. It's not as fun
as actually being on my bike, but it's infinitely better than working a treadmill or a stationary
bike on my own. I can't make it through half an hour on those; I had no problem staying motivated
through an hour-long session of spinning.

Spinning has two main benefits to me. One, there are plenty of days when I'm not motivated enough
to go biking in the cold, let alone the dark cold -- but even on days when I'm feeling like a
slug, having an instructor egging me on gets me going. Two, I can focus purely on wringing the
most energy out of my legs, so that when I do bike for real, my legs will be in better shape and I
will be able to focus more on the obstacles rather than on not collapsing.

If you don't care for spinning, I can understand. But I think it will fill a niche for me. It will
never be something I choose to do instead of mountain biking, but it will be something I do in
addition to mountain biking, and I do think it will help me enjoy mountain biking more.

Sorry to reply so late to this thread, but spinning really turned my biking around. I did it the
winter after I got into biking and lost all my weight(-60 pounds makes the biking a lot easier). I
kind of reached plateau and couldn't get any better. I bought a road bike that year because I had a
MTB and a BMX. I scared the [censored] out of myself road riding (+45 mph is not meant to be felt on a
bicycle in my opinion). So, I figured I would spin with the bike shop's roadie team for the winter.
I built my lungs and heart up to the point where climbing on the trails causes no pain in the
chest/legs. I can concentrate on the trail and obstacles and basically know that my legs/lungs will
just keep chugging in whatever direction I point them. Now I still spin, but for a different
benefit. I don't have much time to go to a class, so I do this routine watching TV or listening to
the radio. Basically, I stand only during commercials or only when a certain character speaks, the
rest of the time I aim for ~80-90 cadence sitting. I picked this up from a fellow MTB'er at the
spinning class I mentioned. By taking the decision to stand, sit, increase or decrease resistance
taken out of your hands, it resembles the surprise uphill or downhill in the worng gear or the
missed shift at the bottom of a climb that makes MTBing fun. If that doesn't make sense, just ask
for a better explaination and I'll try again.

Brad and Julie Vaughn

On 2004-01-29, Brad and Julie Vaughn penned:

Quoted message said:

Sorry to reply so late to this thread, but spinning really turned my biking around. I did it the
winter after I got into biking and lost all my weight(-60 pounds makes the biking a lot easier). I
kind of reached plateau and couldn't get any better. I bought a road bike that year because I had
a MTB and a BMX. I scared the [censored] out of myself road riding (+45 mph is not meant to be felt on a
bicycle in my opinion). So, I figured I would spin with the bike shop's roadie team for the
winter. I built my lungs and heart up to the point where climbing on the trails causes no pain in
the chest/legs. I can concentrate on the trail and obstacles and basically know that my legs/lungs
will just keep chugging in whatever direction I point them. Now I still spin, but for a different
benefit. I don't have much time to go to a class, so I do this routine watching TV or listening to
the radio. Basically, I stand only during commercials or only when a certain character speaks, the
rest of the time I aim for ~80-90 cadence sitting. I picked this up from a fellow MTB'er at the
spinning class I mentioned. By taking the decision to stand, sit, increase or decrease resistance
taken out of your hands, it resembles the surprise uphill or downhill in the worng gear or the
missed shift at the bottom of a climb that makes MTBing fun. If that doesn't make sense, just ask
for a better explaination and I'll try again.

No, it makes sense.

It's hard for me to get motivated indoors, but for some reason, having someone tell me what to do
works wonders. So for me, the instructor aspect -- someone else choosing the cadence, the
"obstacles," etc, not to mention forcing me to stretch at the end -- is nice.

--
monique

"Monique Y. Herman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Attended a spinning class today.

Spinning as in pedalling really fast in low gear? Spinning as in turning raw wool into yarn? What's
"Spinning"?

Trentus said:

"Monique Y. Herman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Attended a spinning class today.

Spinning as in pedalling really fast in low gear? Spinning as in turning raw wool into yarn?
What's "Spinning"?

sigh, I hope you aren't trolling. Too early and not enough caffeine to be able to discern.

spinning.comabout.aspxOpen ↗

indoor cycle classes, usually at a gym or health club.. trademark name of "spinning" "precision
cycling" "Johnny G cycle" or "cycle X". Set to music, choose your own resistance
healthworksrf.commorgprecision.cfmOpen ↗

penny

she could be driving on ice, too...?

"Trentus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Monique Y. Herman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Attended a spinning class today.

Spinning as in pedalling really fast in low gear? Spinning as in turning raw wool into yarn?
What's "Spinning"?

A marketing tool to part naive soccer moms from their money.

Greg

On 2004-02-06, Penny S penned:

Quoted message said:

she could be driving on ice, too...?

Yes, I was spinning in this (driving) sense this morning =)

--
monique

On 2004-02-06, G.T. penned:

Quoted message said:

"Trentus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ReLUb.44667$Wa.35268@news-
server.bigpond.net.au...

Quoted message said:

Spinning as in pedalling really fast in low gear? Spinning as in turning raw wool into yarn?
What's "Spinning"?

A marketing tool to part naive soccer moms from their money.

G.T.:

God, you're boring.

Trentus:

Spinning may or may not be of any interest to you. It's just an hour spent indoors on a stationary
bike while an instructor motivates you and gives you drills. It's much more fun than using a
stationary bike by yourself, and much less fun than actually getting on a bike. I happen to like it
because it allows me to focus on building my muscles and endurance without worrying about balance
and obstacls; then, when I do ride my bike, I am more capable, and it's therefore more fun.

--
monique