If you love Christmas, thank a Pagan



On Thu, 22 Dec 2005 15:05:57 -0600, OmManiPadmeOmelet
<[email protected]> wrote:

>In article <[email protected]>,
> Pan Ohco <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 22 Dec 2005 00:33:57 GMT, GQ wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> >>>The facts are that Pagans were using the Yule tree long before your
>> >>>religion took it over.

>>
>> >>Gq that was a Yule and was burned. There is some debate ,as to when
>> >>(before A.D. or not) this practice started. And in some scandinavian
>> >>countries a fir tree was brought into the home as a symbol of
>> >>continuing life, again debate as to when this practice started.
>> >>I never heard the story about Martin Luther starting the Christmas
>> >>tree custom, a germanic custom.
>> >
>> >What you are thinking about is the Yle Log and not the tree and the
>> >Yule tree still came from the Pagans and not Martin Luther at all.

>>
>> GQ Please reread my above message.
>> Notice that I agree with you about the Martin Luther statement.
>> Also notice that there,I said there is some debate about the timing of
>> the beginning of the pagan yule tradition.
>> I believe that there is a similarities in the celebrations.
>>
>> Now as to your definite statement that the custom of Christmas tree
>> absolutely comes from a Pagan ritual, prove it.

>
>Here's a start:
>
>http://www.christmas-tree.com/where.html
>
>Google for "origins of the Christmas tree".
>
>It sure as heck isn't from any "Christian" origin. ;-)
>
>Cheers!


Thanks. I hadn't had a chance to get back to this post.

The first retail Christmas stand was set up by Mark Carr in New York
City in 1851;


Franklin Pierce was the first president to introduce the Christmas
tree to the White House in 1856 for a group of Washington Sunday
School children;


The first lighted Christmas tree in public was in Boston in 1912;19;


The first national Christmas Tree was lighted in the year 1923 on the
White House lawn by President Calvin Coolidge.

The exact origin of the Christmas tree seems under debate, but it is
safe to say that this symbol evolved from Pagan tradition.

The Norse pagans and Celtic Druids revered evergreens as
manifestations of deity because they did not "die" from year to year
but stayed green and alive when other plants appeared dead and bare.
The trees represented everlasting life and hope for the return of
spring.

The druids decorated their trees with symbols of prosperity -- a
fruitful harvest, coins for wealth and various charms such as those
for love or fertility. Scandinavian Pagans are thought to be the first
to bring their decorated trees indoors as this provided a warm and
welcoming environment for the native fairy folk and tree elementals to
join in the festivities. The Saxons, a Germanic pagan tribe, were the
first to place lights on the their trees in the form of candles.
Ancient Romans decorated their homes with greens at the Festival of
Saturnalia, their New Year and exchanged evergreen branches with
friends as a sign of good luck.

The first Christian use of the Christmas tree symbol is credited to
16th century when devout Christians also brought decorated trees into
their homes. German born Prince Albert, husband of Queen Victoria, is
credited with starting the trend in England in 1841 when he brought
the first Christmas Tree to Windsor Castle.

While Europe had already been celebrating Christmas for some time, the
first recorded sighting of a Christmas tree in America came in 1830's
Pennsylvania. It seems a local church erected the tree as a
fundraising effort. Christmas trees were generally not thought kindly
of in early America, as many people saw them as Pagan symbols, which
is in fact, their origin. By the 1890's, however, Christmas ornaments
were being imported from Germany and Christmas trees were in high
fashion.

While Europeans generally favored smaller trees about three to four
feet in height, Americans, as usual, liked to do things big. Their
trees proudly stretched from floor to ceiling. Popular ornaments with
the German-Americans were natural items like apples, nuts, berries,
marzipan and cookies. Popcorn, an American addition, eventually was
added to the mix.

With the advent of electricity, Christmas trees began to appear in
town squares across America and the traditional "lighting of the tree"
quickly became the official symbols of the beginning of the holiday
season.
 
Bob Terwilliger sez:

> Wow, it's been something like twenty years since I thought about Gor. (I
> used to belong to the Science Fiction Book Club.) Back in my DJ days, I
> once irked a feminazi by playing the song "Pleasure Slave" by Manowar. The
> lyrics are:
>
>
> She is waiting to kiss my hand
> But she will wait for my command
> My chains and collar brought her to her knees
> She now is free to please
>
> Woman, be my slave
> That's your reason to live
> Woman, be my slave
> The greatest gift I can give
> Woman, be my slave
>
> Before her surrender she had no life
> Now she's a slave, not a wife
> Her only sorrow is for women who live with lies
> She's taken off her disguise
>
> Woman, be my slave
> That's your reason to live
> Woman, be my slave
> The greatest gift I can give
> Woman, be my slave
>
> Your body belongs to me
>
> Woman, come here
> Remove your garments
> Kneel before me
> Please me
>
> Woman, be my slave
> That's your reason to live
> Woman, be my slave
> The greatest gift I can give
> Woman, be my slave
>
>
> There was about a minute of stunned disbelief (and blessed silence) before
> the fallout started. :)
>
> Bob


Hah! You DAWG, you!! I can only imagine the avalanche of protest from the
mightily offended in your audience; you must've gotten an earful.

A college boyfriend of mine was a DJ on the campus station, the
nine-to-midnight shift. He'd pick his eclectic playlists carefully,
alternating John Coltrane with Frank Zappa with Maria Callas with B.B. King
with Patsy Cline . . .

Spitz
--
"Home, James, and don't spare the horses!"
 
Gregory Morrow sez:

> On a cold winter night like this he is probably all snuggled up with
> his six kitties...
>
> ^oo^
> > -- <

>
> --
> Best
> Greg


Kitties can be good snugglers, true; having some good bourbon or single malt
at hand speeds up the warming factor considerably.

Snuggle well, Sheldon darlin'.

Spitz
--
"Home, James, and don't spare the horses!"
 
Spitzmaus wrote:
> Bob Terwilliger sez:
>
>
>>Wow, it's been something like twenty years since I thought about Gor. (I
>>used to belong to the Science Fiction Book Club.) Back in my DJ days, I
>>once irked a feminazi by playing the song "Pleasure Slave" by Manowar. The
>>lyrics are:
>>
>>
>>She is waiting to kiss my hand
>>But she will wait for my command
>>My chains and collar brought her to her knees
>>She now is free to please
>>
>>Woman, be my slave
>>That's your reason to live
>>Woman, be my slave
>>The greatest gift I can give
>>Woman, be my slave
>>
>>Before her surrender she had no life
>>Now she's a slave, not a wife
>>Her only sorrow is for women who live with lies
>>She's taken off her disguise
>>
>>Woman, be my slave
>>That's your reason to live
>>Woman, be my slave
>>The greatest gift I can give
>>Woman, be my slave
>>
>>Your body belongs to me
>>
>>Woman, come here
>>Remove your garments
>>Kneel before me
>>Please me
>>
>>Woman, be my slave
>>That's your reason to live
>>Woman, be my slave
>>The greatest gift I can give
>>Woman, be my slave
>>
>>
>>There was about a minute of stunned disbelief (and blessed silence) before
>>the fallout started. :)
>>
>>Bob

>
>
> Hah! You DAWG, you!! I can only imagine the avalanche of protest from the
> mightily offended in your audience; you must've gotten an earful.
>
> A college boyfriend of mine was a DJ on the campus station, the
> nine-to-midnight shift. He'd pick his eclectic playlists carefully,
> alternating John Coltrane with Frank Zappa with Maria Callas with B.B. King
> with Patsy Cline . . .
>
> Spitz


sounds like my kind of radio show :)

--

saerah

"Peace is not an absence of war, it is a virtue, a state of mind, a
disposition for benevolence, confidence, justice."
-Baruch Spinoza

"There is a theory which states that if ever anybody discovers exactly
what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear
and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. There
is another theory which states that this has already happened."
-Douglas Adams
 
In article <[email protected]>,
"Spitzmaus" <[email protected]> wrote:

> Gregory Morrow sez:
>
> > On a cold winter night like this he is probably all snuggled up with
> > his six kitties...
> >
> > ^oo^
> > > -- <

> >
> > --
> > Best
> > Greg

>
> Kitties can be good snugglers, true; having some good bourbon or single malt
> at hand speeds up the warming factor considerably.
>
> Snuggle well, Sheldon darlin'.
>
> Spitz


Brandy... ;-)
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-*****." -Jack Nicholson
 
You're welcome. Merry Meet. (he he he)


An' it harm none, do as ye will.
Wiccan Maxim
 
In article <[email protected]>,
Larry LaMere <[email protected]> wrote:

> You're welcome. Merry Meet. (he he he)
>
>
> An' it harm none, do as ye will.
> Wiccan Maxim
>
>


----------

Let's share it all, shall we? :)

Listen to the words of the Great Mother, who of all was called Artemis,
Astarte, Dione, Melusine, Aphrodite, Cerridwen, Diana, Arienrhod, Brigid
and by many other names.

"Whenever you have a need of anything, once in the month, and better it
be when the moon is full, you shall assemble in some secret place and
adore the spirit of Me who is Queen of all the Wise. You shall be free,
naked in your rites. Sing, feast, dance, make music and love, all in My
presence, and Mine is the ecstacy of the spirit and the Mine is also the
joy on earth. For my law is love of unto all beings. Mine is the secret
that open upon the door of youth and Mine is the cup of wine of life
that is the Cauldron of Cerriwden that is the holy grail of immortality.
I give the knowledge of the spirit eternal and beyond death, I give
peace and freedom and reunion with those that have gone before. Nor do I
demand aught of sacrifice, for behold, I am mother of all things, and My
love is poured upon the earth."

Hear the words of the Star Goddess, the dust of whose feet are the hosts
of heaven, whose body encircles the universe: "I who am the beauty of
the green earth and the white moon among the stars and the mysteries of
the waters, I call upon your soul to arise and come unto Me. For I am
the soul of nature that gives to the universe. From Me, all things
proceed and unto Me they must return. Let my worship be in the heart
that rejoices, for behold all acts of love and pleasure are my rituals."

Let there beauty and strength, power and compassion, honor and humility,
mirth and reverence within you. And you who see to know Me, know that
your seeking and yearning will avail you not, unless you know the
Mystery; for if that which you seek, you find not within your self, you
will never find it without. For behold, I have been with you from the
beginning and I am that which is attained at the end of desire.

----------

A far, far cry from most Christian doctrine.
I was raised a Christian and spent up thru the 5th grade in parochial
schools memorizing bible verses.

I think it sux that many Christian sects seem to feel that, if it feels
good, it's a sin. :-(

Life is meant to be a joy, not a sacrifice!

Cheers!
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-*****." -Jack Nicholson
 
Shaun wrote:

> I just love this kind of thread! Maybe I should be a member of a chaos
> religioin, or even a worshipper or Eris and discord LOL! Brilliant stuff.
> Pleased to be keeping it coming?!? Heheheheh... ',;~}~


Might was well throw Loki in there too, right?

How long before you begin screaming "Blood and souls for my Lord Arioch"?

Bob