I'm being seduced and I need your help

Discussion in 'UK and Europe' started by Gadget, Jun 1, 2003.

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  1. Gadget

    Gadget Guest

    I'm a lover of speed (not the drug) and after reading comments on here I've learned that 'bents seem
    to have more speed than an upright. I was wondering what would be the ideal 'bent for me. I would
    keep my upright for the trails and, if I do decide to get a bent, use it on the road. I'm looking to
    spend no more than £400 and if possible even less. I hear there is a shop with its own test track in
    London. Is this true? So any ideas from you Dark Siders out there.

    Many Thanks

    Gadget
     
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  2. Gadget wrote:

    > I'm a lover of speed (not the drug) and after reading comments on here I've learned that 'bents
    > seem to have more speed than an upright. I was wondering what would be the ideal 'bent for me.

    Go for an Optima Baron. Best value imho. But you'll have to spend approx. 1600 EUR for entry
    level model.

    Greets

    Arno
     
  3. Danny Colyer

    Danny Colyer Guest

    Gadget wrote:
    > I'm looking to spend no more than £400 and if possible even less. I hear there is a shop with its
    > own test track in London. Is this true?

    For that price, you're looking at buying a mid-price bent second hand. If you keep an eye out you
    should be able to pick up an Orbit Crystal/Speed Ross or a Pashley PDQ for that sort of price. In
    fact there are two PDQ's in the back of this week's C+, for £400 & £595.

    The shop in London you're thinking of is probably London Recumbents. The first couple of times I
    visited them they were based at Herne Hill. They're now sometimes at Battersea Park, with the park
    being available for test rides, and they're sometimes at Dulwich Park, ditto. I strongly recommend
    phoning first to find out where they'll be: http://www.londonrecumbents.com/

    Bikefix in London doesn't have the advantage of being at a cycle stadium or in the middle of a park,
    but they to will let you test ride the bikes: http://www.bikefix.co.uk

    And if you're in the South East, Future Cycles in Forest Row is also well worth a look:
    http://www.futurecycles.co.uk/

    --
    Danny Colyer (remove safety to reply) ( http://www.juggler.net/danny ) Recumbent cycle page:
    http://www.speedy5.freeserve.co.uk/recumbents/ "He who dares not offend cannot be honest." -
    Thomas Paine
     
  4. Mike Causer

    Mike Causer Guest

    On Sun, 01 Jun 2003 20:50:14 +0100, Gadget wrote:

    > I'm a lover of speed (not the drug) and after reading comments on here I've learned that 'bents
    > seem to have more speed than an upright. I was wondering what would be the ideal 'bent for me. I
    > would keep my upright for the trails and, if I do decide to get a bent, use it on the road. I'm
    > looking to spend no more than £400 and if possible even less.

    £400 won't get you a new one, but they don't seem to hold their price very well :-(( so a s/hand one
    is within reach. The ads in the back of Cycling Plus magazine are the best place I know to look in
    the UK. The variations in the design of design of recumbents are as different as a mountain-trailer
    to a time-trailer, so you need to ride a few to find out what characteristics you are looking for.
    As in uprights speed tends to equal money!

    If you're near Cambridge you can try my Speed Ross (an overseat steering short wheelbase. Fast but
    not good in traffic.)

    Mike
     
  5. Just Zis Guy

    Just Zis Guy Guest

    On Sun, 1 Jun 2003 20:50:14 +0100, "Gadget" <[email protected]> wrote:

    >I would keep my upright for the trails and, if I do decide to get a bent, use it on the road. I'm
    >looking to spend no more than £400 and if possible even less.

    That rules out new 'bents.

    I'd probably go for an Optima Baron, an overdraft and a HUGE grin :)

    Guy
    ===
    ** WARNING ** This posting may contain traces of irony. http://www.chapmancentral.com (BT ADSL and
    dynamic DNS permitting)
    NOTE: BT Openworld have now blocked port 25 (without notice), so old mail addresses may no longer
    work. Apologies.
     
  6. Mike Causer

    Mike Causer Guest

    On Sun, 01 Jun 2003 21:47:47 +0100, Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:

    > I'd probably go for an Optima Baron, an overdraft and a HUGE grin :)

    I'd go for a hooooge overdraft and a Windcheetah.

    Mike
     
  7. Gadget

    Gadget Guest

    > I'd probably go for an Optima Baron, an overdraft and a HUGE grin :)

    I'm guessing the Optima Baron is a good 'bent. It's had two reveiws already. Unfortuanly my bank
    manager says that if I go any further deeper into my overdraft, I might as well buy the bank.

    Gadget
     
  8. Dave Kahn

    Dave Kahn Guest

    "Gadget" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...

    > Unfortuanly my bank manager says that if I go any further deeper into my overdraft, I might as
    > well buy the bank.

    Sell some gadgets.

    --
    Dave...
     
  9. Peter Clinch

    Peter Clinch Guest

    Gadget wrote:
    > I'm a lover of speed (not the drug) and after reading comments on here =
    I've
    > learned that 'bents seem to have more speed than an upright.=20

    Not necessarily... not all 'bents are designed for speed, and if you=20 turn up on a BikeE or the
    like you can expect to be left well behind=20 anything vaguely sporty.

    But 'bents built for speed have plenty (though again, you won't see them =

    in hill climbing competitions even if they were let in), especially into =

    the wind and/or downhill. And if they have a fairing they'll go even=20 faster.

    > I was wondering what would be the ideal 'bent for me. I would keep my upright for the t=
    rails
    > and, if I do decide to get a bent, use it on the road. I'm looking to s=
    pend
    > no more than =A3400 and if possible even less.

    Probably a second hand Orbit Crystal or Speed Ross. That was my first=20 'bent, and they're quite
    fast and sporty and would change hands for that =

    sort of money, or often less (mine was an ex demo at =A3250, though neede= d=20 a complete
    re-gearing). New 'bents start at ~=A3600 (the HPV Wavey is about that, and though not = a=20 slouch
    I don't think many people race them).

    Pete. --=20 Peter Clinch University of Dundee Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Medical Physics,
    Ninewells Hospital Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net [email protected]
    http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
     
  10. Gadget

    Gadget Guest

    I've come across a website of a guy who makes his own bikes, especially 'bents.

    http://www.atomiczombie.com/

    Is there any advantage to building your own 'bent? Is it difficult? Is it cheaper? Where do you
    get plans?

    Gadget
     
  11. andy_welch

    andy_welch New Member

    Joined:
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    Recumbents are great fun and much more comfortable than uprights. Whether or not they are faster depends on a lot of things, including terrain. I've ridden a StreetMachine and a Windcheetah neither of which were faster than my 28lb upright steel tourer over the hills of Aberdeenshire. On the other hand I've just put together an upright race bike [1] and am setting personal bests all over the place. For example, despite having a heavy cold for all of last week I managed 1:17 for a 23 mile ride home from work on Friday. Fastest time on a recumbent was 1:23 and that was with a force 6 tail wind.

    So by all means check out recumbents but don't assume that recumbent=faster.

    Cheers,

    Andy

    [1] A Principia RS6 with full Record triple group. Pictures at http://principia.fotopic.net/
     
  12. Mike Causer wrote:

    > Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:
    >
    >> I'd probably go for an Optima Baron, an overdraft and a HUGE grin :)
    >
    > I'd go for a hooooge overdraft and a Windcheetah.

    I'd go for an even hooooooger overdraft and a Trice Micro or XXL, but then I've previously owned an
    ancient Windcheetah and I've got a Baron already...

    Dave Larrington - http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/
    ===========================================================
    Editor - British Human Power Club Newsletter
    http://www.bhpc.org.uk/
    ===========================================================
     
  13. Peter Clinch

    Peter Clinch Guest

    Gadget wrote:

    > Is there any advantage to building your own 'bent? Is it difficult? Is it cheaper? Where do you
    > get plans?

    Pretty much the same set of answers as you'd get for building any other sort of cycle.

    Stuff like wheels, transmission and brakes will simply be a case of buying whatever you want off the
    component shelves, the frame will probably require a welding kit and the knowledge to use it (or a
    friend with same) plus an appropriate stock of tubing.

    The principal advantage is you can have it exactly how you want it[1].

    Unlike upright diamond frames, a homebuilt 'bent has rather more in the way of unknowns about how it
    will perform (there's a far bigger stock of possible designs) so there's a bit more risk attached in
    that you might come up with something totally unrideable. (I think I saw "Legs" Larrington allude to
    a trike that Mike Burrows had got spectacularly wrong in a post in the last week or two, and if he
    can cock it up, so can anyone else!)

    I'd think the British Human Power Club is probably the best place to look if you want to home build
    a speed machine, as that's exactly what quite a few of the members seem to do.
    http://www.bhpc.org.uk/ is the place to start, and it looks like they'll have a new edition of "So
    you want to build an HPV" out in the near future...

    Pete.

    [1] given caveats like what you want is actually *possible*, of course...
    --
    Peter Clinch University of Dundee Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Medical Physics, Ninewells Hospital
    Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net [email protected]
    http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
     
  14. Gadget wrote:

    > Is there any advantage to building your own 'bent?

    Well, you do get exactly what you want. Usually. A bit.

    > Is it difficult?

    If one is handy with tools, notably those for sticking bits of metal together, then no more so than
    plumbing, but speaking as one with the coordination of a thousand camels, I have naught but Respect
    for those who
    do. You could try a composite frame instead, which may be easier.

    > Is it cheaper?

    Almost certainly, especially if recycling bits of other bikes for parts.

    > Where do you get plans?

    America, mostly. The only plans I know of currently available in Europe are those for the Zephyr low
    racer - http://www.zephyr.nl/home.php?pagina=bouwbeschrijving&links=lageracerlinks Note that the
    page is all in Dutch, though. I'm sure Danny used to have an English version, but I can't find one.

    Greenspeed in Oz do trike plans - http://www.greenspeed.com.au/plans.htm - but trikes require a host
    of Special Bits, notably around the front wheels, which tend to make them more expensive.

    HTH

    Dave Larrington - http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/
    ===========================================================
    Editor - British Human Power Club Newsletter
    http://www.bhpc.org.uk/
    ===========================================================
     
  15. Graeme Dods

    Graeme Dods Guest

    "Gadget" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...

    > Unfortuanly my bank manager says that if I go any further deeper into my overdraft, I might as
    > well buy the bank.

    Take him up on his offer - buy the bank, sack the sarcy git then buy a whole fleet of bents from the
    big bonus you give yourself for having reduced expenditure to the tune of one manager's wages.
    Simple really*

    Have fun!

    Graeme

    * - the value of this advice may go down as well as up, but most likely down.
     
  16. Mads Hilberg

    Mads Hilberg Guest

    > I'm a lover of speed (not the drug) and after reading comments on here
    I've
    > learned that 'bents seem to have more speed than an upright. I was
    wondering
    > what would be the ideal 'bent for me. I would keep my upright for the
    trails
    > and, if I do decide to get a bent, use it on the road. I'm looking to
    spend
    > no more than £400 and if possible even less. I hear there is a shop with
    its
    > own test track in London. Is this true? So any ideas from you Dark Siders out there.

    With such a limited budget, perhaps an Azub would be a good buy. Personally I'd go for the below
    seat steering - it takes a little longer to get used to, but it's more comfortable in the long run.
    http://www.azub.cz/old/english/products.html

    I can't think of (m)any other new recumbents that would fit your budget.

    Otherwise it's time to search for second hand deals.

    Whatever you do, make sure you try out a wide range of recumbent styles before making a decision.

    Mads
     
  17. Jim Price

    Jim Price Guest

    Gadget wrote:
    > I've come across a website of a guy who makes his own bikes, especially 'bents.
    >
    > http://www.atomiczombie.com/

    I found that the other day too - great bikes! Oh, when I found it, there were lots more pics and
    stuff about mad electronic devices too. That doesn't seem to be there now.

    > Is there any advantage to building your own 'bent?

    For me, personal satisfaction, and potentially saving a lot of dosh. I wanted to try the whole thing
    out without spending a shedload on something which depreciates faster than a C5.

    > Is it difficult?

    Not if you are happy doing all your own maintenance and have appropriate tools. I chose to get a
    friend of a friend to do the welding for me, but the rest was just tinkering. I could have avoided
    the welding, but I'm a fairly heavy powerful type person, and I wasn't convinced by the strength of
    any of the no-welds designs I'd seen or heard about. Since then, I've been lent a welder, too.

    > Is it cheaper?

    I reckon my homebuilt cost me about £89, using roadkill components. Cheaper than anything I have
    seen other than the one someone gave away on this newsgroup a while ago. I reckon a really
    professional job with all brand new bits etc. might be doable for £700.

    > Where do you get plans?
    Um, I didn't really work from plans, but I did get a lot of ideas from the large picture on this
    guys site:

    http://www.wideopenwest.com/~lipetz/Bicycles/bicycles.htm

    <get carried away with description mode>

    I ended up using a regular 15" mountain bike frame, rather than a girls bike frame. This did end up
    a bit taller than some other designs, but I can still get my feet on the floor while sitting on it,
    so its fine.

    My major contribution to improved ease of building was the front brake design. Mr. Lipetz fabricated
    a new bridge on his forks, but I cheated and used U brakes on the regular canti mounts which fit
    perfectly for a 20" wheel in a 26" fork.

    My main problem was with the seat. I ended up just throwing one together made out of an old
    skateboard, a camping mat and bits of hardware from Homebase. The idea was to mock up something
    which would allow me to decide where the ideal seat postion was, because the distance to the pedals
    was not adjustable (without a welder etc.). It worked well enough that I have not got around to
    replacing it yet. It has one feature I haven't seen on anyone elses recumbent - the forward part of
    the seat is hinged to allow me to get on easier. I would have upgraded this to a fibreglass one the
    other day, but for the normally well regarded Bikefix failing to stand by the price of the recumbent
    seat as advertised on their web site.

    The other bit which takes a little time is getting the chain routing sorted out. I used the two
    chains approach like Mr. Lipetz, to avoid routing problems. I aimed for a straight line from the top
    of the front cog to the top of the 'middle' cog (at the normal bicycle frame's bottom bracket) so I
    didn't have to go around a guide pulley on the drive side of the chain. I used an old rear deraileur
    bolted to an old front derailleur for the chain tensioner, and a bit of round electrical conduit for
    a chain guide.

    I went for over seat steering, which was eased by finding Halfords getting rid of multiple stem
    raisers for £2 each, and a set of BMX handlebars whcich were lying around.

    I didn't go with suspension, just two inch slick tyres.

    One other thing I would probably do if I wanted it to look posh would be to get a better paint job
    done on it - its current "anti-theft-hammerite" job is a bit flaky.

    I realise that you gave me a bike a few months ago, and if you do decide to embark on the homebuilt
    project, I can let you have some useful bits in return. Contact me directly if you're interested.

    Now, if I could borrow a digital camera, I could put up some pictures on the web site...

    Jim Price
     
  18. Peter Clinch

    Peter Clinch Guest

    andy_welch wrote:

    > So by all means check out recumbents but don't assume that recumbent=faster.

    One thing 'bents tend to do rather better than uprights is accept aerodynamic fairings. With these
    in place you really can go faster (but again, if you're winching up a big hill in grannies they're
    just added weight). Having pointed that out, I'll now point out that practically all of the road
    going ones I've seen in the flesh haven't had fairings... If it wasn't so hilly round here I'd quite
    like HPVel's Streamer for my Streetmachine, though to keep the rain off more than to go faster.

    Pete.
    --
    Peter Clinch University of Dundee Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Medical Physics, Ninewells Hospital
    Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net [email protected]
    http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
     
  19. Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:
    >On Sun, 1 Jun 2003 20:50:14 +0100, "Gadget" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >>I would keep my upright for the trails and, if I do decide to get a bent, use it on the road. I'm
    >>looking to spend no more than £400 and if possible even less.
    >
    >That rules out new 'bents.

    http://www.dutchbikes.nl/uk.htm is only 433 Euro. But it's a kit, and needs a donor upright to
    provide parts (including the rear triangle).

    If you're happy with that approach, see also http://www.iesales.com/ http://www.bentechbikes.com/
    http://www.ihpva.org/Builders/DBEconBent/ http://www.wisil.recumbents.com/wisil/plans/plans1.htm
    http://rqriley.com/bike.html or, taking things to extremes (forks held together with hose clips?!),
    http://www.halcyon.com/peterson/wb.html
     
  20. Alan Braggins wrote:
    > Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:
    >
    >>On Sun, 1 Jun 2003 20:50:14 +0100, "Gadget" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>>I would keep my upright for the trails and, if I do decide to get a bent, use it on the road. I'm
    >>>looking to spend no more than £400 and if possible even less.
    >>
    >>That rules out new 'bents.
    >
    >
    > http://www.dutchbikes.nl/uk.htm is only 433 Euro. But it's a kit, and needs a donor upright to
    > provide parts (including the rear triangle).

    Oooh. I'm seriously tempted now I have a nice big workshop to lose all the bits in. Anyone here
    given it a go?

    Colin
     
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