In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong?



On Wed, 30 Mar 2005 22:05:33 GMT, "S o r n i"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>bbaka wrote:
>> S o r n i wrote:
>>> bbaka wrote:
>>>
>>>> Sorni,
>>>> I expected better from you. Have you 'ever' done your history
>>>> homework? The early 1950's were known as the McCarthy era for his
>>>> communist witch hunts and it is very well documented fact. What
>>>> makes you think that Bush and his inner circle could never be as
>>>> bad? My 'moronic ****' as you say is extrapolated from past history
>>>> and the 1950's were not all that far back. People weren't executed
>>>> but their lives were ruined, just the same.
>>>
>>>
>>> Even more reason you wouldn't openly say the stuff (read UTTER
>>> RIDICULOUS ****) you do.
>>>
>>> Is...is that a white van parked in front of your house?!?
>>>
>>> Bwwahahahahahahahahahaha.
>>>
>>>

>> Sorni,
>> You just blew my opinion of what I was willing to credit as your
>> intellect. I don't post UTTER RIDICULOUS
>> > ****, you just can't comprehend the meaning of some of my posts

>> when I am not openly trolling, like the tricycle bit. My car rolled
>> to 24-25 on that hill so I can only say that my speed was, in fact,
>> less than 25, exactly how much I don't know. Being picked up by the
>> police was a fact whether it is in the books or not.
>> Go back to your secure padded coward/blowhard room now, please.
>> Bill Baka

>
>I literally have tears on my cheeks. THANK YOU, BILL -- YOU NEVER
>DISAPPOINT!


I have this image of the stands empty, the umpire and both teams gone and mighty
Bill still at the plate swinging furiously at the pitch he missed 9 innings and
four hours ago.

Ron
 
On Wed, 30 Mar 2005 22:05:33 GMT, "S o r n i"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>bbaka wrote:
>> S o r n i wrote:
>>> bbaka wrote:
>>>
>>>> Sorni,
>>>> I expected better from you. Have you 'ever' done your history
>>>> homework? The early 1950's were known as the McCarthy era for his
>>>> communist witch hunts and it is very well documented fact. What
>>>> makes you think that Bush and his inner circle could never be as
>>>> bad? My 'moronic ****' as you say is extrapolated from past history
>>>> and the 1950's were not all that far back. People weren't executed
>>>> but their lives were ruined, just the same.
>>>
>>>
>>> Even more reason you wouldn't openly say the stuff (read UTTER
>>> RIDICULOUS ****) you do.
>>>
>>> Is...is that a white van parked in front of your house?!?
>>>
>>> Bwwahahahahahahahahahaha.
>>>
>>>

>> Sorni,
>> You just blew my opinion of what I was willing to credit as your
>> intellect. I don't post UTTER RIDICULOUS
>> > ****, you just can't comprehend the meaning of some of my posts

>> when I am not openly trolling, like the tricycle bit. My car rolled
>> to 24-25 on that hill so I can only say that my speed was, in fact,
>> less than 25, exactly how much I don't know. Being picked up by the
>> police was a fact whether it is in the books or not.
>> Go back to your secure padded coward/blowhard room now, please.
>> Bill Baka

>
>I literally have tears on my cheeks. THANK YOU, BILL -- YOU NEVER
>DISAPPOINT!


I have this image of the stands empty, the umpire and both teams gone and mighty
Bill still at the plate swinging furiously at the pitch he missed 9 innings and
four hours ago.

Ron
 
B i l l S o r n s o n wrote:

> bbaka wrote:
>
>>Tom Sherman wrote:
>>
>>>It appears that Mr. "Sonic" has swallowed the myth that "Americans"
>>>are inherently morally better than "other people" are. There are
>>>plenty of examples of religious repression, both historical and
>>>current. To believe that "Americans" are somehow different, so
>>>extreme religious persecution could never happen in the US is
>>>ridiculous.
>>>
>>>The same type of people that conducted the Salem witch trials are
>>>present to this day in the US.
>>>

>>
>>Said Mr. Sonic appears to live a sheltered life under a rock. We may
>>not agree on all things but I do have to admit that the Salem witch
>>hunts do have surviving descendants today. Remember the more recent
>>McCarthy era when they were looking for a Communist behind every
>>corner? Some people were blacklisted because they just admitted to
>>having talked with a Communist somewhere back in the 1930's. Even
>>Oppenheimer, one of the co-inventors of the atomic bomb was banned
>>from any further government access or research due to McCarthy's
>>witch hunt. Sorry Sonic thinks it is all ******** just because he
>>hasn't been nailed yet. This is a religious witch hunt and Bush is
>>quite a bit like McCarthy in that respect. Iraq, for now, is his
>>crusade of choice, but if he turns his attention inward, we could all
>>be persecuted for not attending church, or the correct church.

>
>
> Bill, if you really believed even a fraction of the moronic **** you spew,
> you wouldn't /dare/ sign your name to it. After all, those crazed Patriot
> Act Jesus Freak Bushies know who you are and where you live!
>
> (All Saddam would have done is chop off your hands, IF he'd been feeling
> generous that day.)
>
> Get a freaking clue, why doncha...


Jose Padilla, a US citizen, is still sitting in a US military prison
with his constitutional right to habeas corpus denied [1]. Yassir Hamdi,
another US citizen was in the same situation, but accepted exile to
Saudi Arabia as an escape from US detention.

[1] Depending on how the government appeals are decided by the courts.

--
Tom Sherman - Earth (Downstate Illinois, North of Forgottonia)
 
B i l l S o r n s o n wrote:

> bbaka wrote:
>
>>Tom Sherman wrote:
>>
>>>It appears that Mr. "Sonic" has swallowed the myth that "Americans"
>>>are inherently morally better than "other people" are. There are
>>>plenty of examples of religious repression, both historical and
>>>current. To believe that "Americans" are somehow different, so
>>>extreme religious persecution could never happen in the US is
>>>ridiculous.
>>>
>>>The same type of people that conducted the Salem witch trials are
>>>present to this day in the US.
>>>

>>
>>Said Mr. Sonic appears to live a sheltered life under a rock. We may
>>not agree on all things but I do have to admit that the Salem witch
>>hunts do have surviving descendants today. Remember the more recent
>>McCarthy era when they were looking for a Communist behind every
>>corner? Some people were blacklisted because they just admitted to
>>having talked with a Communist somewhere back in the 1930's. Even
>>Oppenheimer, one of the co-inventors of the atomic bomb was banned
>>from any further government access or research due to McCarthy's
>>witch hunt. Sorry Sonic thinks it is all ******** just because he
>>hasn't been nailed yet. This is a religious witch hunt and Bush is
>>quite a bit like McCarthy in that respect. Iraq, for now, is his
>>crusade of choice, but if he turns his attention inward, we could all
>>be persecuted for not attending church, or the correct church.

>
>
> Bill, if you really believed even a fraction of the moronic **** you spew,
> you wouldn't /dare/ sign your name to it. After all, those crazed Patriot
> Act Jesus Freak Bushies know who you are and where you live!
>
> (All Saddam would have done is chop off your hands, IF he'd been feeling
> generous that day.)
>
> Get a freaking clue, why doncha...


Jose Padilla, a US citizen, is still sitting in a US military prison
with his constitutional right to habeas corpus denied [1]. Yassir Hamdi,
another US citizen was in the same situation, but accepted exile to
Saudi Arabia as an escape from US detention.

[1] Depending on how the government appeals are decided by the courts.

--
Tom Sherman - Earth (Downstate Illinois, North of Forgottonia)
 
Bill Baka wrote:

> S o r n i wrote:
>
>> Tom Sherman wrote:
>>
>>> Remember, these are people who think there were no irregularities in
>>> the 2000, 2002 and 2004 US elections, despite all the statistically
>>> improbable (some all but impossible) events, that even more improbably
>>> all favored Republicans. Of course, they dismiss anyone who points out
>>> inconvenient facts as "crackpot conspiracy theorists" - attack the
>>> messenger when you can not dispute the facts.

>>
>>
>>
>> Mr. Sherman, in a final act of desperation, aligns his delusional
>> arguments
>> with one B. Baka.
>>
>> A sad event, indeed.
>>
>> Bill "ankle bracelets...WITH CROSSES ON 'EM!!!" S.
>>
>>

> Sonic is too dumb to be delusional. You, however seem to think you are
> in la-la land and Bush is the messiah. Mr. Sherman shows some
> intelligence, which is more than I can say for 'any' Bush supporters. I
> sat through the 2000 election at a restaurant (with TV) with a good
> friend and we stayed until it was down to Floriduh. Reality TV at its
> worst and we got the worst. Gore was kind of bland, Kerry was not
> photogenic enough, a sad reality of this television generation, and Bush
> is still an idiot that was elected by a majority of same.
>
> Year = 2000.
> Man who won the popular vote = Gore.
> Reason GWB won = A few thousand hanging chads, and, oh, gee, Jeb BUSH is
> the governor of Floriduh.
> Grow some new brain cells.


You forgot to mention all the Florida minority voters wrongfully purged
before the 2000 election by Choice Point [1].

[1] Yes, the same company that provided credit dossiers to identity thieves.

--
Tom Sherman - Earth (Downstate Illinois, North of Forgottonia)
 
Bill Baka wrote:

> S o r n i wrote:
>
>> Tom Sherman wrote:
>>
>>> Remember, these are people who think there were no irregularities in
>>> the 2000, 2002 and 2004 US elections, despite all the statistically
>>> improbable (some all but impossible) events, that even more improbably
>>> all favored Republicans. Of course, they dismiss anyone who points out
>>> inconvenient facts as "crackpot conspiracy theorists" - attack the
>>> messenger when you can not dispute the facts.

>>
>>
>>
>> Mr. Sherman, in a final act of desperation, aligns his delusional
>> arguments
>> with one B. Baka.
>>
>> A sad event, indeed.
>>
>> Bill "ankle bracelets...WITH CROSSES ON 'EM!!!" S.
>>
>>

> Sonic is too dumb to be delusional. You, however seem to think you are
> in la-la land and Bush is the messiah. Mr. Sherman shows some
> intelligence, which is more than I can say for 'any' Bush supporters. I
> sat through the 2000 election at a restaurant (with TV) with a good
> friend and we stayed until it was down to Floriduh. Reality TV at its
> worst and we got the worst. Gore was kind of bland, Kerry was not
> photogenic enough, a sad reality of this television generation, and Bush
> is still an idiot that was elected by a majority of same.
>
> Year = 2000.
> Man who won the popular vote = Gore.
> Reason GWB won = A few thousand hanging chads, and, oh, gee, Jeb BUSH is
> the governor of Floriduh.
> Grow some new brain cells.


You forgot to mention all the Florida minority voters wrongfully purged
before the 2000 election by Choice Point [1].

[1] Yes, the same company that provided credit dossiers to identity thieves.

--
Tom Sherman - Earth (Downstate Illinois, North of Forgottonia)
 
On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 20:53:02 -0600, Tom Sherman <[email protected]> wrote:

>Bill Baka wrote:
>
>> RonSonic wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 14:59:01 -0800, bbaka <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> This **** is hilarious.

>>
>>
>> Jeb Bush in '08 is funny????
>>
>>>
>>> For years I thought the weirdo-American whacko fringe was off on the
>>> conspiracy
>>> fan - right the Birchers and such. But you guys are freeking beyond.
>>> "Forced to go to church and confess their 'sins' under duress of a lie
>>> detector." That'll be a real handy quote the next time you want to argue
>>> anything with me.
>>> Where ever do you people get this stuff.

>>
>>
>> Reality is where. The government is in possesion of lie detectors that
>> don't attach and you won't know they are watching you. It exists and is
>> not rocket science.
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> Picture Jeb Bush getting elected in 08 and extrapolate from there.
>>>>
>>>> Creepy thought for me, and if not for you, check to see if you have
>>>> any active brainwaves.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> The creepy thing is that you either believe this ****, or you are so
>>> whacked
>>> that you think it is effective rhetoric.
>>> Ron
>>>

>> No, the creepy thing is that there are people like you out there who
>> don't believe in what is obviously coming our way. When Clinton was
>> elected in 1992 I thought that we were over the Bush family, and look
>> what happened. The worst nightmares are possible but you don't want them
>> to be. If you don't think Jeb in '08 is scary perhaps you are one of
>> those who thinks Republicans are taking us Gods' way.

>
>Bill,
>
>Remember, these are people who think there were no irregularities in the
>2000, 2002 and 2004 US elections, despite all the statistically
>improbable (some all but impossible) events, that even more improbably
>all favored Republicans. Of course, they dismiss anyone who points out
>inconvenient facts as "crackpot conspiracy theorists" - attack the
>messenger when you can not dispute the facts.


When you find a political party slashing the opposition's tires and trading
CRACK for voter registrations you shouldn't consider it improbable that the
other side is winning.

The dems traded crack for voter forms, now how whacked is that. Of course
they're losing. That's the sort of stupid, desperate **** that losers do. Losers
lose. It is really that simple. Hell, even winners often get beat so start with
a sane and healthy outlook. The conspiracy theories are not a part of that
program.

Come back with an agenda that makes sense to the American public; present a
DD-214 before declaring your candidate a war hero; answer any aggressive act
against the USA with the presumption that it was unjustified; try not to
ridicule the heartfelt beliefs of the people want to vote for you, and y'all
just might have a chance.

Ron
 
On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 20:53:02 -0600, Tom Sherman <[email protected]> wrote:

>Bill Baka wrote:
>
>> RonSonic wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 14:59:01 -0800, bbaka <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> This **** is hilarious.

>>
>>
>> Jeb Bush in '08 is funny????
>>
>>>
>>> For years I thought the weirdo-American whacko fringe was off on the
>>> conspiracy
>>> fan - right the Birchers and such. But you guys are freeking beyond.
>>> "Forced to go to church and confess their 'sins' under duress of a lie
>>> detector." That'll be a real handy quote the next time you want to argue
>>> anything with me.
>>> Where ever do you people get this stuff.

>>
>>
>> Reality is where. The government is in possesion of lie detectors that
>> don't attach and you won't know they are watching you. It exists and is
>> not rocket science.
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> Picture Jeb Bush getting elected in 08 and extrapolate from there.
>>>>
>>>> Creepy thought for me, and if not for you, check to see if you have
>>>> any active brainwaves.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> The creepy thing is that you either believe this ****, or you are so
>>> whacked
>>> that you think it is effective rhetoric.
>>> Ron
>>>

>> No, the creepy thing is that there are people like you out there who
>> don't believe in what is obviously coming our way. When Clinton was
>> elected in 1992 I thought that we were over the Bush family, and look
>> what happened. The worst nightmares are possible but you don't want them
>> to be. If you don't think Jeb in '08 is scary perhaps you are one of
>> those who thinks Republicans are taking us Gods' way.

>
>Bill,
>
>Remember, these are people who think there were no irregularities in the
>2000, 2002 and 2004 US elections, despite all the statistically
>improbable (some all but impossible) events, that even more improbably
>all favored Republicans. Of course, they dismiss anyone who points out
>inconvenient facts as "crackpot conspiracy theorists" - attack the
>messenger when you can not dispute the facts.


When you find a political party slashing the opposition's tires and trading
CRACK for voter registrations you shouldn't consider it improbable that the
other side is winning.

The dems traded crack for voter forms, now how whacked is that. Of course
they're losing. That's the sort of stupid, desperate **** that losers do. Losers
lose. It is really that simple. Hell, even winners often get beat so start with
a sane and healthy outlook. The conspiracy theories are not a part of that
program.

Come back with an agenda that makes sense to the American public; present a
DD-214 before declaring your candidate a war hero; answer any aggressive act
against the USA with the presumption that it was unjustified; try not to
ridicule the heartfelt beliefs of the people want to vote for you, and y'all
just might have a chance.

Ron
 
On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 18:43:55 -0800, bbaka <[email protected]> wrote:

>RonSonic wrote:
>> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 14:59:01 -0800, bbaka <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>
>> This **** is hilarious.

>
>Jeb Bush in '08 is funny????
>>
>> For years I thought the weirdo-American whacko fringe was off on the conspiracy
>> fan - right the Birchers and such. But you guys are freeking beyond.
>>
>> "Forced to go to church and confess their 'sins' under duress of a lie
>> detector." That'll be a real handy quote the next time you want to argue
>> anything with me.
>>
>> Where ever do you people get this stuff.

>
>Reality is where. The government is in possesion of lie detectors that
>don't attach and you won't know they are watching you. It exists and is
>not rocket science.


Okay.... and the part about mandatory church attendance and confessions? You got
that from reality? There's like a bill in congress or maybe you're aware of some
prominent group that's advocating such?

>>
>>
>>>Picture Jeb Bush getting elected in 08 and extrapolate from there.
>>>
>>>Creepy thought for me, and if not for you, check to see if you have any
>>>active brainwaves.

>>
>>
>> The creepy thing is that you either believe this ****, or you are so whacked
>> that you think it is effective rhetoric.
>>
>> Ron
>>

>No, the creepy thing is that there are people like you out there who
>don't believe in what is obviously coming our way. When Clinton was
>elected in 1992 I thought that we were over the Bush family, and look
>what happened. The worst nightmares are possible but you don't want them
>to be. If you don't think Jeb in '08 is scary perhaps you are one of
>those who thinks Republicans are taking us Gods' way.


Jeb isn't running, he's Governor of Florida and doing a pretty damn good job of
it. We could do worse, but I doubt you'll see him nominated for President. Too
many other Bushes have been elected lately. He might run in '12 if a Dem wins in
'08.

>Someone googled some things a while back, like...
>Bush talks to God. Hundreds of hits.
>God talks to Bush. Dozens of hits.
>They forgot one.
>Bush thinks he is God.....


Probably because it clearly isn't the case outside of your bizarre imaginings.

>Now go back to your corner and have faith that papa Bush has your best
>interests in mind. Yeah, right.


My interests are my business. If you are expecting any President to be your
daddy then that starts to explain your problems.

Ron
 
On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 18:43:55 -0800, bbaka <[email protected]> wrote:

>RonSonic wrote:
>> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 14:59:01 -0800, bbaka <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>
>> This **** is hilarious.

>
>Jeb Bush in '08 is funny????
>>
>> For years I thought the weirdo-American whacko fringe was off on the conspiracy
>> fan - right the Birchers and such. But you guys are freeking beyond.
>>
>> "Forced to go to church and confess their 'sins' under duress of a lie
>> detector." That'll be a real handy quote the next time you want to argue
>> anything with me.
>>
>> Where ever do you people get this stuff.

>
>Reality is where. The government is in possesion of lie detectors that
>don't attach and you won't know they are watching you. It exists and is
>not rocket science.


Okay.... and the part about mandatory church attendance and confessions? You got
that from reality? There's like a bill in congress or maybe you're aware of some
prominent group that's advocating such?

>>
>>
>>>Picture Jeb Bush getting elected in 08 and extrapolate from there.
>>>
>>>Creepy thought for me, and if not for you, check to see if you have any
>>>active brainwaves.

>>
>>
>> The creepy thing is that you either believe this ****, or you are so whacked
>> that you think it is effective rhetoric.
>>
>> Ron
>>

>No, the creepy thing is that there are people like you out there who
>don't believe in what is obviously coming our way. When Clinton was
>elected in 1992 I thought that we were over the Bush family, and look
>what happened. The worst nightmares are possible but you don't want them
>to be. If you don't think Jeb in '08 is scary perhaps you are one of
>those who thinks Republicans are taking us Gods' way.


Jeb isn't running, he's Governor of Florida and doing a pretty damn good job of
it. We could do worse, but I doubt you'll see him nominated for President. Too
many other Bushes have been elected lately. He might run in '12 if a Dem wins in
'08.

>Someone googled some things a while back, like...
>Bush talks to God. Hundreds of hits.
>God talks to Bush. Dozens of hits.
>They forgot one.
>Bush thinks he is God.....


Probably because it clearly isn't the case outside of your bizarre imaginings.

>Now go back to your corner and have faith that papa Bush has your best
>interests in mind. Yeah, right.


My interests are my business. If you are expecting any President to be your
daddy then that starts to explain your problems.

Ron
 
RonSonic ? wrote:

> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 20:53:02 -0600, Tom Sherman <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>Bill Baka wrote:
>>
>>
>>>RonSonic wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 14:59:01 -0800, bbaka <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>This **** is hilarious.
>>>
>>>
>>>Jeb Bush in '08 is funny????
>>>
>>>
>>>>For years I thought the weirdo-American whacko fringe was off on the
>>>>conspiracy
>>>>fan - right the Birchers and such. But you guys are freeking beyond.
>>>>"Forced to go to church and confess their 'sins' under duress of a lie
>>>>detector." That'll be a real handy quote the next time you want to argue
>>>>anything with me.
>>>>Where ever do you people get this stuff.
>>>
>>>
>>>Reality is where. The government is in possesion of lie detectors that
>>>don't attach and you won't know they are watching you. It exists and is
>>>not rocket science.
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Picture Jeb Bush getting elected in 08 and extrapolate from there.
>>>>>
>>>>>Creepy thought for me, and if not for you, check to see if you have
>>>>>any active brainwaves.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>The creepy thing is that you either believe this ****, or you are so
>>>>whacked
>>>>that you think it is effective rhetoric.
>>>>Ron
>>>>
>>>
>>>No, the creepy thing is that there are people like you out there who
>>>don't believe in what is obviously coming our way. When Clinton was
>>>elected in 1992 I thought that we were over the Bush family, and look
>>>what happened. The worst nightmares are possible but you don't want them
>>>to be. If you don't think Jeb in '08 is scary perhaps you are one of
>>>those who thinks Republicans are taking us Gods' way.

>>
>>Bill,
>>
>>Remember, these are people who think there were no irregularities in the
>>2000, 2002 and 2004 US elections, despite all the statistically
>>improbable (some all but impossible) events, that even more improbably
>>all favored Republicans. Of course, they dismiss anyone who points out
>>inconvenient facts as "crackpot conspiracy theorists" - attack the
>>messenger when you can not dispute the facts.

>
>
> When you find a political party slashing the opposition's tires and trading
> CRACK for voter registrations you shouldn't consider it improbable that the
> other side is winning.
>
> The dems traded crack for voter forms, now how whacked is that. Of course
> they're losing. That's the sort of stupid, desperate **** that losers do. Losers
> lose. It is really that simple. Hell, even winners often get beat so start with
> a sane and healthy outlook. The conspiracy theories are not a part of that
> program.
>
> Come back with an agenda that makes sense to the American public; present a
> DD-214 before declaring your candidate a war hero; answer any aggressive act
> against the USA with the presumption that it was unjustified; try not to
> ridicule the heartfelt beliefs of the people want to vote for you, and y'all
> just might have a chance.


Or just lie to the public and have the corporate owned media cover for
you. It seems to work pretty well, e.g. Mr. Ron "Sonic". Enough said.

--
Tom Sherman - Earth (Downstate Illinois, North of Forgottonia)
 
RonSonic ? wrote:

> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 20:53:02 -0600, Tom Sherman <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>Bill Baka wrote:
>>
>>
>>>RonSonic wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 14:59:01 -0800, bbaka <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>This **** is hilarious.
>>>
>>>
>>>Jeb Bush in '08 is funny????
>>>
>>>
>>>>For years I thought the weirdo-American whacko fringe was off on the
>>>>conspiracy
>>>>fan - right the Birchers and such. But you guys are freeking beyond.
>>>>"Forced to go to church and confess their 'sins' under duress of a lie
>>>>detector." That'll be a real handy quote the next time you want to argue
>>>>anything with me.
>>>>Where ever do you people get this stuff.
>>>
>>>
>>>Reality is where. The government is in possesion of lie detectors that
>>>don't attach and you won't know they are watching you. It exists and is
>>>not rocket science.
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Picture Jeb Bush getting elected in 08 and extrapolate from there.
>>>>>
>>>>>Creepy thought for me, and if not for you, check to see if you have
>>>>>any active brainwaves.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>The creepy thing is that you either believe this ****, or you are so
>>>>whacked
>>>>that you think it is effective rhetoric.
>>>>Ron
>>>>
>>>
>>>No, the creepy thing is that there are people like you out there who
>>>don't believe in what is obviously coming our way. When Clinton was
>>>elected in 1992 I thought that we were over the Bush family, and look
>>>what happened. The worst nightmares are possible but you don't want them
>>>to be. If you don't think Jeb in '08 is scary perhaps you are one of
>>>those who thinks Republicans are taking us Gods' way.

>>
>>Bill,
>>
>>Remember, these are people who think there were no irregularities in the
>>2000, 2002 and 2004 US elections, despite all the statistically
>>improbable (some all but impossible) events, that even more improbably
>>all favored Republicans. Of course, they dismiss anyone who points out
>>inconvenient facts as "crackpot conspiracy theorists" - attack the
>>messenger when you can not dispute the facts.

>
>
> When you find a political party slashing the opposition's tires and trading
> CRACK for voter registrations you shouldn't consider it improbable that the
> other side is winning.
>
> The dems traded crack for voter forms, now how whacked is that. Of course
> they're losing. That's the sort of stupid, desperate **** that losers do. Losers
> lose. It is really that simple. Hell, even winners often get beat so start with
> a sane and healthy outlook. The conspiracy theories are not a part of that
> program.
>
> Come back with an agenda that makes sense to the American public; present a
> DD-214 before declaring your candidate a war hero; answer any aggressive act
> against the USA with the presumption that it was unjustified; try not to
> ridicule the heartfelt beliefs of the people want to vote for you, and y'all
> just might have a chance.


Or just lie to the public and have the corporate owned media cover for
you. It seems to work pretty well, e.g. Mr. Ron "Sonic". Enough said.

--
Tom Sherman - Earth (Downstate Illinois, North of Forgottonia)
 
RonSonic ? wrote:
>
> Oh ********. Nobody (well, okay, nobody important) is trying to regulate
> everyone's sex lives. But don't we all think it well to encourage kids not to
> grow up to be characters in a Kevin Smith movie. Ten thousand years of history
> have taught that if you really work at it you can raise people to be judicious
> and prudent in their sexual decisions. And that if this isn't done hideous
> diseases are only the worst of a wide array of unpleasant consequences.
>
> If you can't liberate yourself from Ms Grundy's disapproving look you just ain't
> a grown-up yet. And that's really what all of this comes down to. Those people
> don't deserve more than a chuckle if you know you're right.


Article from the Seattle Times:
-------------------------------------------------------------------

Some Pharmacists Say No to Filling Birth-Control Prescriptions
by Rob Stein

An increasing number of pharmacists around the country are refusing to
fill prescriptions for birth-control and morning-after pills, saying
that dispensing the medications violates their personal moral or
religious beliefs.

The trend has opened a new front in the nation's battle over
reproductive rights, sparking an intense debate over a pharmacist's
right to refuse to participate in something he or she considers
repugnant, versus a woman's right to get medications her doctor has
prescribed.

It has triggered pitched political battles in state legislatures across
the nation as politicians seek to pass laws either to protect
pharmacists from being penalized or to force them to carry out their
professional duties.

"This is a very big issue that's just beginning to surface," said Steven
Aden of the Christian Legal Society's Center for Law and Religious
Freedom in Annandale, Va., which defends pharmacists.

"More and more pharmacists are becoming aware of their right to
conscientiously refuse to pass objectionable medications across the
counter. We are on the very front edge of a wave that's going to break
not too far down the line."

An increasing number of clashes are occurring. Pharmacists often risk
dismissal or other disciplinary action to stand up for their beliefs,
while shaken teenage girls and women desperately call their doctors,
frequently late at night, after being turned away by sometimes-lecturing
men and women in white coats.

"There are pharmacists who will only give birth-control pills to a woman
if she's married. There are pharmacists who mistakenly believe
contraception is a form of abortion and refuse to [dispense] it to
anyone," said Adam Sonfield of the Alan Guttmacher Institute in New
York, which tracks reproductive issues. "There are even cases of
pharmacists holding prescriptions hostage, where they won't even
transfer it to another pharmacy when time is of the essence."

That's what happened to Kathleen Pulz and her husband, who panicked when
the condom they were using broke. Their fear spiked when the Walgreens
pharmacy near their home in Milwaukee refused to fill an emergency
prescription for the morning-after pill.

"I couldn't believe it," said Pulz, 43, who with her husband had long
ago decided they could not afford a fifth child. "How can they make that
decision for us? I was outraged."

Supporters of pharmacists' rights see the trend as a welcome expression
of personal belief. Women's groups see it as a major threat to
reproductive rights and one of the latest manifestations of the
religious right's growing political reach.

"This is another indication of the current political atmosphere and
climate," said Rachel Laser of the National Women's Law Center in
Washington. "It's outrageous. It's sex discrimination. It prevents
access to a basic form of health care for women. We're going back in time."

The issue could intensify further if the Food and Drug Administration
approves the sale of the Plan B morning-after pill without a
prescription — a step that would likely make pharmacists the primary
gatekeepers.

The question of health-care workers refusing to provide certain services
first emerged over abortions. The trend began to spread to pharmacists
with the approval of the morning-after pill and physician-assisted
suicide in Oregon, with support from such organizations as the U.S.
Conference of Catholic Bishops and the Pharmacists for Life
International, which claims 1,600 members on six continents, primarily
the United States, Canada and Britain.

"Our group was founded with the idea of returning pharmacy to a
healing-only profession. What's been going on is the use of medication
to stop human life. That violates the ideal of the Hippocratic Oath that
medical practitioners should do no harm," said Karen Brauer, the
Pharmacists for Life president, who was fired from a Kmart pharmacy in
Delhi, Ohio, for refusing to fill birth-control prescriptions.

No one knows exactly how often that is happening, but cases have been
reported across the country, including in Washington, California,
Georgia, Illinois, Louisiana, Massachusetts, Texas, New Hampshire, Ohio
and North Carolina. Advocates on both sides say the refusals appear to
be spreading, often surfacing only in the rare instances when women file
complaints.

Pharmacists are regulated by state laws and can face disciplinary action
from licensing boards. But the only case that has gotten that far
involves Neil Noesen, who in 2002 refused to fill a University of
Wisconsin student's prescription for birth-control pills at a Kmart in
Menomonie, Wis., or transfer the prescription elsewhere.

An administrative judge last month recommended Noesen be required to
take ethics classes, alert future employers to his beliefs and pay what
could be as much as $20,000 to cover the costs of the legal proceedings.
The state pharmacy board will decide whether to impose that penalty next
month.

Wisconsin is one of at least 11 states considering "conscience-clause"
laws that would protect pharmacists like Noesen. Four states have laws
that specifically allow pharmacists to refuse to fill prescriptions that
violate their beliefs. At the same time, at least four states are
considering laws that would explicitly require pharmacists to fill all
prescriptions.

The American Pharmacists Association recently reaffirmed its policy that
pharmacists can refuse to fill prescriptions as long as they make sure
customers can get their medications some other way.

The alternative system can include making sure another pharmacist is on
duty who can take over or making sure another pharmacy nearby is willing
to fill the prescription, said Susan Winckler, the association's vice
president for policy and communications.

"The key is that it should be seamless and avoids a conflict between the
pharmacist's right to step away and the patient's right to obtain their
medication," she said.

Large pharmacy chains, including Walgreens, Wal-Mart and CVS, have
instituted similar policies that try to balance pharmacists' and
customers' rights.

Women's advocates say such policies are impractical, especially late at
night in emergency situations involving the morning-after pill, which
must be taken within 72 hours.

Even in nonurgent cases, poor women have a hard time getting enough time
off work to go from one pharmacy to another. Young women, who are often
already frightened and unsure of themselves, may simply give up when
confronted by a judgmental pharmacist.

"What is a women supposed to do in rural America, in places where there
may only be one pharmacy?" asked Nancy Keenan, president of NARAL
Pro-Choice America, which is launching a campaign today to counter the
trend. "It's a slap in the face to women."

But Brauer defends the right of pharmacists not only to decline to fill
prescriptions themselves but also to refuse to refer customers elsewhere
or transfer prescriptions.

"That's like saying, 'I don't kill people myself, but let me tell you
about the guy down the street who does.' "

Pulz, of Milwaukee, eventually obtained her prescription directly from
her doctor.

"I was lucky," Pulz said. "I can sympathize with someone who feels
strongly and doesn't want to be involved. But they should just step out
of the way and not interfere with someone else's decision."

Copyright © 2005 The Seattle Times Company
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nobody important trying to regulate the sex lives of others, Ron "Sonic"?

--
Tom Sherman - Earth (Downstate Illinois, North of Forgottonia)
 
RonSonic ? wrote:
>
> Oh ********. Nobody (well, okay, nobody important) is trying to regulate
> everyone's sex lives. But don't we all think it well to encourage kids not to
> grow up to be characters in a Kevin Smith movie. Ten thousand years of history
> have taught that if you really work at it you can raise people to be judicious
> and prudent in their sexual decisions. And that if this isn't done hideous
> diseases are only the worst of a wide array of unpleasant consequences.
>
> If you can't liberate yourself from Ms Grundy's disapproving look you just ain't
> a grown-up yet. And that's really what all of this comes down to. Those people
> don't deserve more than a chuckle if you know you're right.


Article from the Seattle Times:
-------------------------------------------------------------------

Some Pharmacists Say No to Filling Birth-Control Prescriptions
by Rob Stein

An increasing number of pharmacists around the country are refusing to
fill prescriptions for birth-control and morning-after pills, saying
that dispensing the medications violates their personal moral or
religious beliefs.

The trend has opened a new front in the nation's battle over
reproductive rights, sparking an intense debate over a pharmacist's
right to refuse to participate in something he or she considers
repugnant, versus a woman's right to get medications her doctor has
prescribed.

It has triggered pitched political battles in state legislatures across
the nation as politicians seek to pass laws either to protect
pharmacists from being penalized or to force them to carry out their
professional duties.

"This is a very big issue that's just beginning to surface," said Steven
Aden of the Christian Legal Society's Center for Law and Religious
Freedom in Annandale, Va., which defends pharmacists.

"More and more pharmacists are becoming aware of their right to
conscientiously refuse to pass objectionable medications across the
counter. We are on the very front edge of a wave that's going to break
not too far down the line."

An increasing number of clashes are occurring. Pharmacists often risk
dismissal or other disciplinary action to stand up for their beliefs,
while shaken teenage girls and women desperately call their doctors,
frequently late at night, after being turned away by sometimes-lecturing
men and women in white coats.

"There are pharmacists who will only give birth-control pills to a woman
if she's married. There are pharmacists who mistakenly believe
contraception is a form of abortion and refuse to [dispense] it to
anyone," said Adam Sonfield of the Alan Guttmacher Institute in New
York, which tracks reproductive issues. "There are even cases of
pharmacists holding prescriptions hostage, where they won't even
transfer it to another pharmacy when time is of the essence."

That's what happened to Kathleen Pulz and her husband, who panicked when
the condom they were using broke. Their fear spiked when the Walgreens
pharmacy near their home in Milwaukee refused to fill an emergency
prescription for the morning-after pill.

"I couldn't believe it," said Pulz, 43, who with her husband had long
ago decided they could not afford a fifth child. "How can they make that
decision for us? I was outraged."

Supporters of pharmacists' rights see the trend as a welcome expression
of personal belief. Women's groups see it as a major threat to
reproductive rights and one of the latest manifestations of the
religious right's growing political reach.

"This is another indication of the current political atmosphere and
climate," said Rachel Laser of the National Women's Law Center in
Washington. "It's outrageous. It's sex discrimination. It prevents
access to a basic form of health care for women. We're going back in time."

The issue could intensify further if the Food and Drug Administration
approves the sale of the Plan B morning-after pill without a
prescription — a step that would likely make pharmacists the primary
gatekeepers.

The question of health-care workers refusing to provide certain services
first emerged over abortions. The trend began to spread to pharmacists
with the approval of the morning-after pill and physician-assisted
suicide in Oregon, with support from such organizations as the U.S.
Conference of Catholic Bishops and the Pharmacists for Life
International, which claims 1,600 members on six continents, primarily
the United States, Canada and Britain.

"Our group was founded with the idea of returning pharmacy to a
healing-only profession. What's been going on is the use of medication
to stop human life. That violates the ideal of the Hippocratic Oath that
medical practitioners should do no harm," said Karen Brauer, the
Pharmacists for Life president, who was fired from a Kmart pharmacy in
Delhi, Ohio, for refusing to fill birth-control prescriptions.

No one knows exactly how often that is happening, but cases have been
reported across the country, including in Washington, California,
Georgia, Illinois, Louisiana, Massachusetts, Texas, New Hampshire, Ohio
and North Carolina. Advocates on both sides say the refusals appear to
be spreading, often surfacing only in the rare instances when women file
complaints.

Pharmacists are regulated by state laws and can face disciplinary action
from licensing boards. But the only case that has gotten that far
involves Neil Noesen, who in 2002 refused to fill a University of
Wisconsin student's prescription for birth-control pills at a Kmart in
Menomonie, Wis., or transfer the prescription elsewhere.

An administrative judge last month recommended Noesen be required to
take ethics classes, alert future employers to his beliefs and pay what
could be as much as $20,000 to cover the costs of the legal proceedings.
The state pharmacy board will decide whether to impose that penalty next
month.

Wisconsin is one of at least 11 states considering "conscience-clause"
laws that would protect pharmacists like Noesen. Four states have laws
that specifically allow pharmacists to refuse to fill prescriptions that
violate their beliefs. At the same time, at least four states are
considering laws that would explicitly require pharmacists to fill all
prescriptions.

The American Pharmacists Association recently reaffirmed its policy that
pharmacists can refuse to fill prescriptions as long as they make sure
customers can get their medications some other way.

The alternative system can include making sure another pharmacist is on
duty who can take over or making sure another pharmacy nearby is willing
to fill the prescription, said Susan Winckler, the association's vice
president for policy and communications.

"The key is that it should be seamless and avoids a conflict between the
pharmacist's right to step away and the patient's right to obtain their
medication," she said.

Large pharmacy chains, including Walgreens, Wal-Mart and CVS, have
instituted similar policies that try to balance pharmacists' and
customers' rights.

Women's advocates say such policies are impractical, especially late at
night in emergency situations involving the morning-after pill, which
must be taken within 72 hours.

Even in nonurgent cases, poor women have a hard time getting enough time
off work to go from one pharmacy to another. Young women, who are often
already frightened and unsure of themselves, may simply give up when
confronted by a judgmental pharmacist.

"What is a women supposed to do in rural America, in places where there
may only be one pharmacy?" asked Nancy Keenan, president of NARAL
Pro-Choice America, which is launching a campaign today to counter the
trend. "It's a slap in the face to women."

But Brauer defends the right of pharmacists not only to decline to fill
prescriptions themselves but also to refuse to refer customers elsewhere
or transfer prescriptions.

"That's like saying, 'I don't kill people myself, but let me tell you
about the guy down the street who does.' "

Pulz, of Milwaukee, eventually obtained her prescription directly from
her doctor.

"I was lucky," Pulz said. "I can sympathize with someone who feels
strongly and doesn't want to be involved. But they should just step out
of the way and not interfere with someone else's decision."

Copyright © 2005 The Seattle Times Company
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nobody important trying to regulate the sex lives of others, Ron "Sonic"?

--
Tom Sherman - Earth (Downstate Illinois, North of Forgottonia)
 
S o r n i wrote:
> bbaka wrote:
>
>>Maggie wrote:
>>
>>>S o r n i wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>Bwwahahahahahahahahahaha.
>>>
>>>
>>>I can hear that laugh in my mind. SCARY!!!!!!!
>>>Maggie...couching in fear.
>>>

>>
>>He is one of the few non-intellectuals (obviously) on here.
>>Bill Baka

>
>
> Yeah, MENSA wants me but I can't stand the puns.


Qualifying does not mean I am forced to join.
>
> Oh, and I was turned down by the military (about /35 years ago/!) for {begin
> euphemistic quotation mark} PERSONALITY PROBLEMS {end quotation mark}, and
> we all know how /those/ improve with age.


Acing the IQ test was not rocket science but the big assed sergeant
thought I was cheating. Who in the HELL cheats just to get drafted and
sent to Vietnam? ****, man, I'm not that crazy.
>
> So I ride my purple girls bike all around (about 10K+ miles/year), fixing
> things for neighborhood kids and gathering discarded items like
> transmissions and computers along my merry way.


Why not, there, oh sage dude? I am recycling. I also use those parts to
build computers for kids who have none due to parents on drugs.
>
> And then I promise to go away (which, once again, please don't), but then
> come back in spades commenting on almost every thread with no idea WTF I'm
> talking about. (Never stopped me before; why should it now?)


I usually have a pretty good clue what is going on but can't resist a
good troll sometimes, and I see you can be hooked every time I do.
>
> Gotta go tho'; I hear the black helicopters overhead, with what /might/ be a
> Dept. of Homeland Security parabolic listening cone aimed right at my
> chimney.


I don't have a chimney, it's California. The black helicopters are
usually chasing somebody running through our back streets, but only
about once a week.

(And I could swear that's Ashcroft riding shotgun, with a Donny &
> Marie Microphone singing patriotic songs!)


If Ashcroft was on board I might get out a gun and have some target
practice. Damn, I'm out of shells, maybe next time.
>
> K-mart jeans and t-shirt: $11.


If even that much. I paid $20 for the "Bike around the Buttes 2001"
shirt I am now wearing, since I do that charity event every year. April
21, 2001 was the vintage of this shirt. I am usually the lead rider
starting out at 6:55 AM to kick it off.
>
> Whole stable of junker bikes: $37.


I spent more than that on my Shimano/Sugino add ons. Oh and in 2000 I
rode an antique 3 speed Sturmey-Archer hub bike with wire baskets on the
charity ride. I almost got an award for the strangest looking bike on
the circuit and just missed the local newspaper photo shoot. It was a
rolling refreshment stand, and it was a good ride with many riders
pulling up to talk about the odd set of wheels.
>
> Telling tall tales on Usenet and almost believing a good portion:
> Priceless.


The tricycle was the only really obvious troll, and many of the rest are
true so it makes no difference whether anyone here believes or not. My
wife knows, and my friends know of many of my exploits, but I would
hardly ask them to post on here. I did 140 MPH on a Kawasaki 650 and my
wife went out that same day and got it to 142 MPH just to prove she
could go faster. I got my Mustang up to 162 on a stretch of road near
Sacramento and what does she do??? She drag raced a highway patrol and
beat him on the top end at ohhh, 155++. He was the one who asked her to
race and got beat, by a girl.
>
> Don't ever leave, Bill Baka; you ARE a riot!
>
> /bs (non-intellectual)
>
>
>

It is possible to live through many outrageous adventures and then smirk
at the non-believers who think that 30 MPH is fast. I tried the "Live
fast and die young" thing but lived through it, so I get the last laugh.
Bill Baka
 
S o r n i wrote:
> bbaka wrote:
>
>>Maggie wrote:
>>
>>>S o r n i wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>Bwwahahahahahahahahahaha.
>>>
>>>
>>>I can hear that laugh in my mind. SCARY!!!!!!!
>>>Maggie...couching in fear.
>>>

>>
>>He is one of the few non-intellectuals (obviously) on here.
>>Bill Baka

>
>
> Yeah, MENSA wants me but I can't stand the puns.


Qualifying does not mean I am forced to join.
>
> Oh, and I was turned down by the military (about /35 years ago/!) for {begin
> euphemistic quotation mark} PERSONALITY PROBLEMS {end quotation mark}, and
> we all know how /those/ improve with age.


Acing the IQ test was not rocket science but the big assed sergeant
thought I was cheating. Who in the HELL cheats just to get drafted and
sent to Vietnam? ****, man, I'm not that crazy.
>
> So I ride my purple girls bike all around (about 10K+ miles/year), fixing
> things for neighborhood kids and gathering discarded items like
> transmissions and computers along my merry way.


Why not, there, oh sage dude? I am recycling. I also use those parts to
build computers for kids who have none due to parents on drugs.
>
> And then I promise to go away (which, once again, please don't), but then
> come back in spades commenting on almost every thread with no idea WTF I'm
> talking about. (Never stopped me before; why should it now?)


I usually have a pretty good clue what is going on but can't resist a
good troll sometimes, and I see you can be hooked every time I do.
>
> Gotta go tho'; I hear the black helicopters overhead, with what /might/ be a
> Dept. of Homeland Security parabolic listening cone aimed right at my
> chimney.


I don't have a chimney, it's California. The black helicopters are
usually chasing somebody running through our back streets, but only
about once a week.

(And I could swear that's Ashcroft riding shotgun, with a Donny &
> Marie Microphone singing patriotic songs!)


If Ashcroft was on board I might get out a gun and have some target
practice. Damn, I'm out of shells, maybe next time.
>
> K-mart jeans and t-shirt: $11.


If even that much. I paid $20 for the "Bike around the Buttes 2001"
shirt I am now wearing, since I do that charity event every year. April
21, 2001 was the vintage of this shirt. I am usually the lead rider
starting out at 6:55 AM to kick it off.
>
> Whole stable of junker bikes: $37.


I spent more than that on my Shimano/Sugino add ons. Oh and in 2000 I
rode an antique 3 speed Sturmey-Archer hub bike with wire baskets on the
charity ride. I almost got an award for the strangest looking bike on
the circuit and just missed the local newspaper photo shoot. It was a
rolling refreshment stand, and it was a good ride with many riders
pulling up to talk about the odd set of wheels.
>
> Telling tall tales on Usenet and almost believing a good portion:
> Priceless.


The tricycle was the only really obvious troll, and many of the rest are
true so it makes no difference whether anyone here believes or not. My
wife knows, and my friends know of many of my exploits, but I would
hardly ask them to post on here. I did 140 MPH on a Kawasaki 650 and my
wife went out that same day and got it to 142 MPH just to prove she
could go faster. I got my Mustang up to 162 on a stretch of road near
Sacramento and what does she do??? She drag raced a highway patrol and
beat him on the top end at ohhh, 155++. He was the one who asked her to
race and got beat, by a girl.
>
> Don't ever leave, Bill Baka; you ARE a riot!
>
> /bs (non-intellectual)
>
>
>

It is possible to live through many outrageous adventures and then smirk
at the non-believers who think that 30 MPH is fast. I tried the "Live
fast and die young" thing but lived through it, so I get the last laugh.
Bill Baka
 
RonSonic wrote:
>
> I have this image of the stands empty, the umpire and both teams gone and mighty
> Bill still at the plate swinging furiously at the pitch he missed 9 innings and
> four hours ago.
>
> Ron
>

Batting practice!!!!
Bill Baka
 
RonSonic wrote:
>
> I have this image of the stands empty, the umpire and both teams gone and mighty
> Bill still at the plate swinging furiously at the pitch he missed 9 innings and
> four hours ago.
>
> Ron
>

Batting practice!!!!
Bill Baka
 
Tom Sherman wrote:
>> Year = 2000.
>> Man who won the popular vote = Gore.
>> Reason GWB won = A few thousand hanging chads, and, oh, gee, Jeb BUSH
>> is the governor of Floriduh.
>> Grow some new brain cells.

>
>
> You forgot to mention all the Florida minority voters wrongfully purged
> before the 2000 election by Choice Point [1].
>
> [1] Yes, the same company that provided credit dossiers to identity
> thieves.
>


I did't forget, but then this wasn't supposed to be a political group
anyway. The minority voters probably would have swung it away from the
great evil known as Bush, and his brother Jeb knew that. The doomsayers
used to say that the world would end in 2000. Maybe that meant Bush
getting elected and he would start the process of bringing about "The end.".
Bill Baka
 
Tom Sherman wrote:
>> Year = 2000.
>> Man who won the popular vote = Gore.
>> Reason GWB won = A few thousand hanging chads, and, oh, gee, Jeb BUSH
>> is the governor of Floriduh.
>> Grow some new brain cells.

>
>
> You forgot to mention all the Florida minority voters wrongfully purged
> before the 2000 election by Choice Point [1].
>
> [1] Yes, the same company that provided credit dossiers to identity
> thieves.
>


I did't forget, but then this wasn't supposed to be a political group
anyway. The minority voters probably would have swung it away from the
great evil known as Bush, and his brother Jeb knew that. The doomsayers
used to say that the world would end in 2000. Maybe that meant Bush
getting elected and he would start the process of bringing about "The end.".
Bill Baka