INCREDIBLE WATTAGE!- Stage 2- WINNING POWER FILE- Greg Henderson.



Hunter w/kg

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Jul 4, 2003
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UNREAL. Seriously. Look at the last 27 seconds of the race when he gapped the field and made it to the line.
Talk about fatigue resistance! Probably best I have seen for Neuromuscular power.

http://home.trainingpeaks.com/races/team-sky-races/2011-amgen-tour-of-california/stage-3-auburn---modesto---1962km.aspx


Hunter Allen

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That's really impressive. I'm most impressed with the fact that this figure came after 5hrs of racing and having burnt almost 4600kj!
I've done 889w for 30secs, but that was at the end of a 30min crit - which in NO WAY compares to having been on the road for 5hrs!
Pros are pros for a good reason...
 
It's pretty impressive, given it was at the end of 5hrs of racing and the final 30 minutes were obviously pretty intense. Is what makes it more impressive is that it was on flat roads (high speed). It's fairly more difficult to keep the wattage up at high speed, compared to on a hill.

If you really want to find big wattage for <30 second efforts, there are MUCH higher numbers out there. World class kilo rider's like Tournant put up 1000w average for a MINUTE. That's insane. Humans are not suppose to be able to do that.

Wattage can always be maxed out higher in non-race situations where you are fresh and aiming for big numbers, not the win. I'm a pretty typical average amatuer (non-racer nowadays), and remember seeing 1500w average for a 25 second hill sprint. At 80kgs. It doesn't mean I win races though, it's just a number. If we arrived at the last 150 meters heading into a hill while still aerobic, then I'm in contention.
 
Originally Posted by velomanct .


Wattage can always be maxed out higher in non-race situations where you are fresh and aiming for big numbers, not the win. I'm a pretty typical average amatuer (non-racer nowadays), and remember seeing 1500w average for a 25 second hill sprint. At 80kgs. It doesn't mean I win races though, it's just a number. If we arrived at the last 150 meters heading into a hill while still aerobic, then I'm in contention.
I don't know you from Adam, but I have to admit that I find this assertion extremely hard to believe. Averaging 1500w for 25secs? Sounds pretty immortal to me. Unless you're world class in the kilo or sprint, I dunno about that...but hey, it sounds good on the internet where pretty much every assertion is true and believable...
 
Originally Posted by tonyzackery .




I don't know you from Adam, but I have to admit that I find this assertion extremely hard to believe. Averaging 1500w for 25secs? Sounds pretty immortal to me. Unless you're world class in the kilo or sprint, I dunno about that...but hey, it sounds good on the internet where pretty much every assertion is true and believable...
It really doesn't matter, there are very few races that give first place to the highest wattage. I have nothing to gain by lying. It's an ability I was specifically training, as I was focusing on the Major Taylor Hillclimb which is a 23 second hill sprint.

My point is that you aren't going to find big wattage in the final 500 meters of a pro road race, especially if it's flat. Local amatuer strong guys can in fact be more powerful in such short durations. Road racing isn't about big wattage alone.

Even the big track sprinters won't see their highest wattage in a 200 meter sprint. It is just not efficient to hit such absolute peak wattages. You apply your energy in the smartest way possible. And IMO, high cadences reduce wattage quite a bit. That's another reason I think you'd see ridiculous wattage from track sprinters if they were go apesheet on a short steep hill in the proper gear. That's how I got my highest numbers. In a race, I'm lucky to average 1000watts in a 15 second sprint, because I'm blown when it starts.
 
Hunter,

You are a coach, am I right? Neuromuscular power is not the prominent ability during the final 27 seconds of a road race, especially when you consider how hard the rider was likely going before this effort started. IMO, neuromuscular power is displayed accurately only when the athlete is fresh, completely warmed up, and of duration from 1 second - 5 seconds. POSSIBLY 8 seconds. Anything past 8 seconds and the ATP stores are pretty much shot and the athlete has then turned to the alactate energy system I believe. Attentive riders know can feel that after about 7 or 8 seconds of PURE EXPLOSIVE effort, there is a pretty sharp decline in power. This would likely vary according to the rider's conditioning though.

If you aren't experiencing that drop off after 8 seconds then I can assure you that you were not doing a true sprint to begin with.

Sorry to pick your words apart, but this topic is of great of interest to me. :D I love using my neuromuscular power when appropiate. It "saves" my other energy systems by using up the ATP stores which don't "hurt". Comes in handy if there is a gap that needs closing, a steep very short rise or such.

Rich
Originally Posted by Hunter w/kg .

UNREAL. Seriously. Look at the last 27 seconds of the race when he gapped the field and made it to the line.
Talk about fatigue resistance! Probably best I have seen for Neuromuscular power.
 
Originally Posted by velomanct .

It really doesn't matter, there are very few races that give first place to the highest wattage.

You're absolutely right - it doesn't matter what you claim is your best wattage for 25secs. Why you chose to state it in the context of this thread is why I made the statement I did. Claims are challenged frequently on net - don't take it personally.

Lastly, I'd also go so far as to say that even Tournant, during his WR kilo, didn't average 1500w for 25secs of his 58sec effort. I don't know for a fact, but I'd be suprised if he did...
 
Originally Posted by tonyzackery .





You're absolutely right - it doesn't matter what you claim is your best wattage for 25secs. Why you chose to state it in the context of this thread is why I made the statement I did. Claims are challenged frequently on net - don't take it personally.

Lastly, I'd also go so far as to say that even Tournant, during his WR kilo, didn't average 1500w for 25secs of his 58sec effort. I don't know for a fact, but I'd be suprised if he did...
Well his WR kilo was at 11,000 feet, so I'm sure his power was less than it was at normal elevations. I've read that such kilo riders do average around 1000w for that minute. Riding a kilo is a lot different than sprinting a hill too. I'd estimate that if I were to do a kilo, I'd average maybe 900ish for the first 25s. I'm prob a 1:10 - 1:12 rider though.
 
A 1:10 - 1:12 kilo, and you say you've seen a 1500w average for 25secs? I suggest you not take your claim over to the FixedGearFever.com forum - someone over there would lay into you pretty good...I'm done though.

Henderson was(is) a damn strong track rider and probably got close (within several seconds) to the one minute mark in the kilo back in his track days, so his long sprint prowess doesn't surprise me all that much. Regardless, the numbers are eye-popping...
 
Originally Posted by velomanct .


Hunter,

You are a coach, am I right? Neuromuscular power is not the prominent ability during the final 27 seconds of a road race, especially when you consider how hard the rider was likely going before this effort started. IMO, neuromuscular power is displayed accurately only when the athlete is fresh, completely warmed up, and of duration from 1 second - 5 seconds. POSSIBLY 8 seconds. Anything past 8 seconds and the ATP stores are pretty much shot and the athlete has then turned to the alactate energy system I believe. Attentive riders know can feel that after about 7 or 8 seconds of PURE EXPLOSIVE effort, there is a pretty sharp decline in power. This would likely vary according to the rider's conditioning though.

If you aren't experiencing that drop off after 8 seconds then I can assure you that you were not doing a true sprint to begin with.

Sorry to pick your words apart, but this topic is of great of interest to me. :D I love using my neuromuscular power when appropiate. It "saves" my other energy systems by using up the ATP stores which don't "hurt". Comes in handy if there is a gap that needs closing, a steep very short rise or such.

Rich
Hunter's "best I have seen" for neuromuscular power was in reference to his (quite useful, IMO) idea of "fatigue profiling". You can read more about it in the 2nd edition of our book.
 
Originally Posted by tonyzackery .

A 1:10 - 1:12 kilo, and you say you've seen a 1500w average for 25secs? I suggest you not take your claim over to the FixedGearFever.com forum - someone over there would lay into you pretty good...I'm done though.
Been there, done that.

I'm surprised that you think 1500w up an 18% grade is comparable to 1500w on a flat road. They aren't the same. I'm currently looking at a print out I did of a power profile from an event a few years ago. 1436w average for the duration of the event, which they recorded as ~23 seconds. It's not a kilo or any track event. When I got to the top of the hill I wasn't happy as I was still coherant and not as trashed as I should of been.


Again, my point: you want to see big watts? Take it to a steep hill. And don't do at the end of a road race when you're anaerobic. I wish a few track sprinters in New England would take it to Worcester in a few weeks.
 

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