Incremental upgrade of Groupset/drivetrain

[radial]

Im after some advice on how i can incrementally upgrade my girlfriends groupset.

She has a Trek 1000 WSD that has Shimano Tiagra De's on it with a SRAM 850 Cassette and Bontrager Sport Chainwheel.

The chainwheel is a bit "naff" cos when the chain is on the 42T ring the chain rubs against the 52T ring when the chain is on the 15T ring cos the 42T is to close to the 52T, so it makes a heap of noise. Plus there is just no smoothness of changing the rear De. Its very clunky.

I suppose thats when happens when u buy a bike built for a price.

However I want to upgrade it to say Ultegra level or SRAM Rival level but from a financial perspective I need to upgrade it incrementally starting with the crankset/chainwheel as it is the most troublesome at the moment. My problem is that I dont know if its possible to upgrade without doing the whole Groupset all at once (cassette/hub/chain/rear d/bb.)

Any help on how I should proceed with a plan would be helpful.

Radial

 

[capwater]

Swapping a crank doesn't require anything else to go along with it, but you may not solve your problem. If the frame has a short wheelbase along with the triple setup. Your big cash on an upgrade would be the shifters assuming you are going to Ultegra 10 speed. Then you get into the new cassette and chain requirements. FD and RD should work OK.

Go back to square one and ask "Why the upgrade?" It's an entry level bike and all that cash spent isn't going to do much.

But, what I would suggest in addition to a new crank would ne nicer wheels. They do improve performance and are tranferrable to other bikes down the proverbial road.

 

[gclark8]

Sounds like the bike needs a service, both derailleurs adjusted.

Being a Womens design, the new short reach (10 speed) STI shifters will be the most expensive item, ST-R700 will test your level of comitment to her.

 

[radial]

Ok a couple of things.

This HAS TO BE an incremental upgrade.

1: Im getting married to her in October (my 2nd time around) and we are in SAVE SAVE SAVE mode, so substantial expenditure IS NOT AN OPTION, hence why it needs to be incremental. For those of you with "better halves" you will all understand that as guys, our passion and enthusiasm for cycling and buying bike stuff is ALWAYS SUPERCEEDED by the importance of us accompanying our betrothed to a bridal shop, as they are the CFO of the household and mapping out a financial budget for the biggest day in our/her lives is more important than our cycling priorities.... =)

Just kidding, but you get my drift.

2: Selling the bike and buying another is not an option as the turnaround price will be in the order of $500-$700. Will never get it past the CFO.

3: The current groupset is tuned as well as it can be and the 52/42T rings are just too close together when the chain is on the 42T and 12T with maximum deflection the chain rubs on the 52T. The chain DOES NOT rub on the derailleur, it rubs against the 52T. The issue is to do with a design flaw and is only correctable with changing the chainrings/crankset.

4: Rear Dee is bargain basement so it changes ok, but clunkily (budget)

So.... How to proceed?

Does anyone see any issues if I only change the Cranks/Chainwheel to Ultegra to start with to alleviate the noise, or will I have to do the chain, which then means i have to do the cassette, which then means i have to do the rear Dee.

Please let me know how to proceed. For the sake of marital harmony I cant go ahead on this only to find that i cant do it incrementally and have to spend $700 on her bike in one shot. That without question is paramount to suicide.

Any help you can give is appreciated.

 

[gclark8]

Your Front Chainring conflict will be solved with a longer bottom bracket, 3mm more may be enough. Have you tried using the trim feature of the front shifter?

 

[OldGoat]

3: The current groupset is tuned as well as it can be and the 52/42T rings are just too close together when the chain is on the 42T and 12T with maximum deflection the chain rubs on the 52T. The chain DOES NOT rub on the derailleur, it rubs against the 52T. The issue is to do with a design flaw and is only correctable with changing the chainrings/crankset.

Why insist on using 42-12 in lieu of more sensible 52-15 gearing, which is almost exactly equivalent? Cross-chaining (big front/big rear or small front/small rear) is in general not a good thing, and not just because of chain rub; look at the stress it puts on the chain.This is one reason for the move away from triples to compact doubles, since with triples the effects of cross-chaining are magnified due to the greater angles between any given rear cog and the small and large front rings.

If you are insistent on fixing what you suppose to be a problem, have you considered using (a set of 5) very thin, small, identical flat washers to add a wee bit more clearance? Might have to adjust front derailleur stop to compensate, but if it works, it'd be about as inexpensive a "fix" as you'll find.

Separate thought: are you sure you have the correct size (width) chain on the bike? Most likely you do, but in case you don't......

 

[creekbruin]

Hmm. This may be an off-the-wall suggestion, but it's cheap (assuming you do the work it would just be the cost of the spacers) so may be worth trying. What if you put spacers on one of the chainrings to move it away from the other chainring. You may have to change the inner or outer derailleur throw depending on which chainring you put the spacers on. Heck, maybe I am all wet but it may be worth taking this shot.

Ok a couple of things.

This HAS TO BE an incremental upgrade.

1: Im getting married to her in October (my 2nd time around) and we are in SAVE SAVE SAVE mode, so substantial expenditure IS NOT AN OPTION, hence why it needs to be incremental. For those of you with "better halves" you will all understand that as guys, our passion and enthusiasm for cycling and buying bike stuff is ALWAYS SUPERCEEDED by the importance of us accompanying our betrothed to a bridal shop, as they are the CFO of the household and mapping out a financial budget for the biggest day in our/her lives is more important than our cycling priorities.... =)

Just kidding, but you get my drift.

2: Selling the bike and buying another is not an option as the turnaround price will be in the order of $500-$700. Will never get it past the CFO.

3: The current groupset is tuned as well as it can be and the 52/42T rings are just too close together when the chain is on the 42T and 12T with maximum deflection the chain rubs on the 52T. The chain DOES NOT rub on the derailleur, it rubs against the 52T. The issue is to do with a design flaw and is only correctable with changing the chainrings/crankset.

4: Rear Dee is bargain basement so it changes ok, but clunkily (budget)

So.... How to proceed?

Does anyone see any issues if I only change the Cranks/Chainwheel to Ultegra to start with to alleviate the noise, or will I have to do the chain, which then means i have to do the cassette, which then means i have to do the rear Dee.

Please let me know how to proceed. For the sake of marital harmony I cant go ahead on this only to find that i cant do it incrementally and have to spend $700 on her bike in one shot. That without question is paramount to suicide.

Any help you can give is appreciated.

 

[Albert 50]

Why insist on using 42-12 in lieu of more sensible 52-15 gearing, which is almost exactly equivalent? Cross-chaining (big front/big rear or small front/small rear) is in general not a good thing, and not just because of chain rub; look at the stress it puts on the chain.

100% correct....go to the top of the class Goatie

This is one reason for the move away from triples to compact doubles, since with triples the effects of cross-chaining are magnified due to the greater angles between any given rear cog and the small and large front rings.

Now for my comments on part 2.......How did you conjure up such a suggestion???? I'd bet my left gonad that triples cross chaining has nothing what-so-ever to do with the creation or proliferation of compacts.
Proper gear selection when riding a triple will actually keep the chain generally straighter than a double 'anything' 8, 9, or 10 rear can achieve. eg....39/25 [D or T] = 30/19[T] which is virtually straight. Highest & lowest gears are also straighter than any double.
Btw my comments are not in any way a double verses triple conflict , but merely pointing out a fact.

 

[radial]

Guys,

Please dont get distracted on the 42/12 52/15 issue...... I understand it totally.... BUT TRY TO EXPLAIN IT TO MY BETROTHED TO BE.... (I know it sounds bad, but its just a fact of life.

The spacers idea is a good one, and i will give it a try, however, if i do change bit on it....

In what order do i change.

Chainrings/FD = No impact
Cassette = Must change chain
RD = Gear slelectors.

 

[ieandro]

Im after some advice on how i can incrementally upgrade my girlfriends groupset.

She has a Trek 1000 WSD that has Shimano Tiagra De's on it with a SRAM 850 Cassette and Bontrager Sport Chainwheel.

The chainwheel is a bit "naff" cos when the chain is on the 42T ring the chain rubs against the 52T ring when the chain is on the 15T ring cos the 42T is to close to the 52T, so it makes a heap of noise. Plus there is just no smoothness of changing the rear De. Its very clunky.

I suppose thats when happens when u buy a bike built for a price.

However I want to upgrade it to say Ultegra level or SRAM Rival level but from a financial perspective I need to upgrade it incrementally starting with the crankset/chainwheel as it is the most troublesome at the moment. My problem is that I dont know if its possible to upgrade without doing the whole Groupset all at once (cassette/hub/chain/rear d/bb.)

Any help on how I should proceed with a plan would be helpful.

Radial

I'm in the same boat as you my friend. I also have a TREK 1000 and was looking for drivetrain upgrades. The only thing is with me is that I have been essentially saving and building up a groupset piece by piece. I hope to have all the components ready to be installed by mid spring.

So far I have an FSA Gossamer Megaexo and both front and rear Ultegra 10spd. derailleurs I got used from eBay. The shifters are the most expensive out of the group. Costing upwards past $150. Anyone know of 10 speeds for under $150 ?

It looks like your fiance and I both have the same components, but I fail to see the rub issue. I occasionally get rub on the big - big combo, but only when I hammer it. The rear derailleur clicks fairly accurately although a bit sluggish. The components are exactly designed for what they are supposed to do - no more, no less.

Go back to square one and ask "Why the upgrade?" It's an entry level bike and all that cash spent isn't going to do much.Radial

Don't let that stop you from upgrading. It didn't for me. The only reason this is an entry level bike is because of the components Trek decided to put on. It uses some older technology on an otherwise very decent frame. It saved me money being a youngbuck and not earning too much money. I learned getting into the game that square taper BB's and cranks were old tech. Although still effective, its cheaper in price. Nothing compared to the new integrated types. Oh well. I'm not complaining. Some old tech is still proven. I can keep up with some of the more high end bikes on my grouprides. Not all, but I find it satisfying when I do.

 

[Scotty_Dog]

Guys,

Please dont get distracted on the 42/12 52/15 issue...... I understand it totally.... BUT TRY TO EXPLAIN IT TO MY BETROTHED TO BE

Since she isn't here, YOU NEED TO EXPLAIN IT TO HER. TELL HER TO SHIFT TO THE 52.

Something like this should really set the mood:
"Just because my car will go 30 MPH in first gear, it doesn't mean that I shouldn't shift to a higher gear."