S

#### Sleepyman

##### Guest

know if it is a semi-constant level, that can be brought down slowly, or is it more similar to Bg

levels, in that it can change rapidly?

Sleepy

-----------------

Eskimo/Inuit up!

-----------------

T2- 3/14/01

You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.

You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.

You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.

S

know if it is a semi-constant level, that can be brought down slowly, or is it more similar to Bg

levels, in that it can change rapidly?

Sleepy

-----------------

Eskimo/Inuit up!

-----------------

T2- 3/14/01

O

news:[email protected]...

> Wondering about Insulin Resistance. As I know there

is no specific insulin

> resistance test, do we know if it is a semi-constant

level, that can be

> brought down slowly, or is it more similar to Bg

levels, in that it can

> change rapidly?

Insulin resistance is tied in with fat. The more fat tissue you have the more likely you are to have

insulin resistance. It wouldn't change rapidly, even with dieting, as it takes a while for someone

to go from obesity to normal weight levels (or making more muscle and reducing the fat tissue).

Reducing insulin resistance can happen with diet alone but most doctors prefer to give an insulin

resistance drug to type 2's like Metformin as well as advise weight loss. Building muscle mass is a

big help also.

Insulin resistance does not mean a type 2 can't control their diabetes. Many obese type 2's control

with very low carb. But losing the fat tissue and gaining muscle would help enormously, allow a bit

more leeway re the amount of carbs a type 2 could eat every meal. Not all overweight, underexercised

people progress to diabetes, there is still a genetic pre disposition (unless there has been a

breakthrough I haven't heard about).

So in a nutshell, keep weight close to normal and keep active (building muscle helps) and you may

never get insulin resistance or if you have it already you can control the type 2 much easier.

C

news:[email protected]:

> Wondering about Insulin Resistance. As I know there is no specific insulin resistance test, do we

> know if it is a semi-constant level, that can be brought down slowly, or is it more similar to Bg

> levels, in that it can change rapidly?

There are actually a couple of methods for measuring insulin resistance, but they are usually

reserved for research settings.

As there are a number of mechanisms that cause insulin resistance, some understood fairly well

and some not at all well, and there are a number of time scales involved. Some are reversible

and some not.

Three of the most common mechanisms for increasing insulin resistance are aging, weight gain, and

sedentary life style. While these aspects are clearly related, it appears that they function to some

degree independently.

It is, of course, fairly difficult to do much about aging. Removing excess weight, or more properly

body fat ratio, seems to have a range of difficulty in the population. None-the-less it is clear

that reducing excess weight will reduce insulin resistance. Sometimes a relatively small weight loss

will produce noticeable results. The time scale is, naturally, the time scale of the weight loss.

Exercise effects insulin resistance on several time scales. There is an immediate effect during

exercise as insulin independent glucose disposal pathways are opened up. As exercise becomes

regular, other insulin resistance reductions appear and persist for various periods from a few days

to a few weeks. It may take a few days to a few weeks to begin to see these results.

O

>Wondering about Insulin Resistance. As I know there is no specific insulin resistance test, do we

>know if it is a semi-constant level, that can be brought down slowly, or is it more similar to Bg

>levels, in that it can change rapidly?

>

>Sleepy

>

There are a variety of Insulin Resistance Tests. Some are reserved for the Research Docs only

(e.g. Euglycemic Insulin Clamp or Frequently Sampled Intravenous Glucose Tolerance Test (FSIVGTT)

One test which your doc can run is the HOMA-R test. One measures fasting blood sugar and fasting

insulin level simultaneously.

The product of the the values is a measure of Insulin Resistance.

Much, much, more than a normal person would want to know about HOMA can be found at:

http://www.medforum.nl/idm/vascular_dysfunction_precedes____.htm

http://care.diabetesjournals.org/cgi/reprint/23/4/449.pdf

The QUICKI test is mathematically equivalent to the HOMA test

Of course, that measures your Insulin Resistance "that morning"

I find that heavy exercise can affect my insulin injection requirements for 24 hours. Since I am

chubby ( let us avoid the "O" word) I presume that I am tracking effects on exercise on Insulin

Resistance.

High blood sugars can (will??) produce temporary Insulin Resistance.

Regards

Old Al

M

value of < 3 is taken as a good measure of resistence.

>Wondering about Insulin Resistance. As I know there is no specific insulin resistance test, do we

>know if it is a semi-constant level, that can be brought down slowly, or is it more similar to Bg

>levels, in that it can change rapidly?

>

>Sleepy

>

>-----------------

>Eskimo/Inuit up!

>-----------------

>T2- 3/14/01

P

[email protected] wrote:

> One rule of thumb is the ratio of lipid blood values. In particular the ratio of trig / hdl, where

> a value of < 3 is taken as a good measure of resistence.

You sure that's not greater than 3 rather than less than 3? A tri/HDL ratio of less than or equal to

2.0 is ideal.

Priscilla

H

<[email protected]> wrote:

>One rule of thumb is the ratio of lipid blood values. In particular the ratio of trig / hdl, where

>a value of < 3 is taken as a good measure of resistence.

This seems strange, as high triglycerides are considered bad and high HDL is considered good.

--

This address is for information only. I do not claim that these views are those of the Statistics

Department or of Purdue University. Herman Rubin, Department of Statistics, Purdue University

[email protected] Phone: (765)494-6054 FAX: (765)494-0558

O

>In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] wrote:

>

>> One rule of thumb is the ratio of lipid blood values. In particular the ratio of trig / hdl,

>> where a value of < 3 is taken as a good measure of resistence.

>

>You sure that's not greater than 3 rather than less than 3? A tri/HDL ratio of less than or equal

>to 2.0 is ideal.

>

>Priscilla

That one came up a while back. The 3.0 is a conservative estimate of "too high"; it identifies

the abnormal conditions brought about by elevated Insulin Resistance.

When you think about it, a conservative estimate of abnormal really shouldn't be that close to

"ideal" lest you end up with a slew of false negatives.

Regards

Old Al

K

> In article <[email protected]>, <[email protected]> wrote:

>

>

>>One rule of thumb is the ratio of lipid blood values. In particular the ratio of trig / hdl, where

>>a value of < 3 is taken as a good measure of resistence.

>

>

> This seems strange, as high triglycerides are considered bad and high HDL is considered good.

The lower the ratio the better;

TG 200/ HDL 35 ration is 6; these are common diabetic values.

TC 100/ HDL 50 ration is 2; these are cited as target values

--

K'neH'a'Iw

Uncloaking, Shields up.

M

encompass. That number is using the US unit of measure, the number outside of the US is indeed a

lower number for that measureing scale.

> One rule of thumb is the ratio of lipid blood values. In particular the ratio of trig / hdl, where

> a value of < 3 is taken as a good measure of resistence.

You sure that's not greater than 3 rather than less than 3? A tri/HDL ratio of less than or equal to

2.0 is ideal.

M

directly related. A trig of 300 and hdl of 50 has a ratio of 6. The numbers above are not unusual in

a diabetic where trigs often sore even with a good hdl; such as the 50 in the example. High

resistence leads to high trigs, which can in time lead to poor hdl numbers also, the trigs don't

directly create the hdl level.

>One rule of thumb is the ratio of lipid blood values. In particular the ratio of trig / hdl, where

>a value of < 3 is taken as a good measure of resistence.

This seems strange, as high triglycerides are considered bad and high HDL is considered good.

P

>I don't follow your question. The info I have seen is < 3, which is also what = to or < 2 would

>encompass.

No, =< 2 would be included in <3. It wouldn't encompass it. (The smaller cannot encompass

the larger.)

> That number is using the US unit of measure, the number outside of the US is indeed a lower number

> for that measureing scale.

I think the confusion is in the way you worded it.

You said that less than 3 was "a good measure of resistence." Do you mean that it's a good value in

terms of resistence, or it's an effective measure of resistence? I read it as the latter, which

seems backwards to me. A higher value would indicate greater resistence. 3 is a lower value and

would not be so clearly indicating resistence.

>> One rule of thumb is the ratio of lipid blood values. In particular the ratio of trig / hdl,

>> where a value of < 3 is taken as a good measure of resistence.

>You sure that's not greater than 3 rather than less than 3? A tri/HDL ratio of less than or equal

>to 2.0 is ideal.

Priscilla

H

K'neH'a'Iw <K'neH'a'[email protected]> wrote:

>Herman Rubin wrote:

>> In article <[email protected]>, <[email protected]> wrote:

>>>One rule of thumb is the ratio of lipid blood values. In particular the ratio of trig / hdl,

>>>where a value of < 3 is taken as a good measure of resistence.

>> This seems strange, as high triglycerides are considered bad and high HDL is considered good.

>The lower the ratio the better;

>TG 200/ HDL 35 ration is 6; these are common diabetic values.

>TC 100/ HDL 50 ration is 2; these are cited as target values

I definitely have insulin resistance. However, my last ratio was TG 80 / HDL 85. My previous ones

were not that good, but were still less than 2.

--

This address is for information only. I do not claim that these views are those of the Statistics

Department or of Purdue University. Herman Rubin, Department of Statistics, Purdue University

[email protected] Phone: (765)494-6054 FAX: (765)494-0558

K

>>The lower the ratio the better;

>

>

>>TG 200/ HDL 35 ration is 6; these are common diabetic values.

>

>

>>TC 100/ HDL 50 ration is 2; these are cited as target values

>

>

> I definitely have insulin resistance. However, my last ratio was TG 80 / HDL 85. My previous ones

> were not that good, but were still less than 2.

Mine are in that same range, but I don't know if I am insulin resistant or not. I assume I am

because I am T2.

--

K'neH'a'Iw

Uncloaking, Shields up.