Iraq
- Thread starter ewep
- Start date
You miss the point - Rumsfeld (on behalf of Reagan) met with SH.
The Reagan goverment support Hussein because Hussein opposed Iran.
The USA gave military and financial support to SH to fight Iran.
You made the point that SH was a cancer.
He was a cancer when he organised his Ba'athist coup in 1979.
He was a cancer when he was fighting Iran.
But because the prevailing opinion in Washington was "my enemies, enemy, is therefore my friend" it was expedient for the
USA to support SH.
You lecture us on how badly SH treated his people as part of the justification for your country's invasion of Iraq.
Your country knew that he was evil when Rumsfeld met him in 1983.
Perhaps Rumsfeld is going to use the the old excuse of "well I
only following orders when I met him" or "well we didn't have the intelligence that we now have ".
Expediency, more like.
'But since none of your planes were being shot at it doesn't matter does it?' Zapper
O.k, I'm getting so peed off with this. Anything Lim says you like to contradict. What is it about? You seem to do it all the time no matter what. He can't seem to type one word without you jumping onto his back contradictory to quite a few other's posts that are seriously un true.
Please tell me what you know about war; which regiments served, why, and what happened to them?
I was at boarding school as my dad was in the Army hence us having to move a lot. Most of my fellow school mates had Fathers who were in the R.A.F. 2 of those got shot down and were held hostage as sadly when they had to eject they got captured. Please don't go with the 'our planes got shot down but yours didn't' etc... Rubbish. American rethoric is what you are stating and it is bull. I saw and heard those daughters crying their eyes out for months until 1 Dad came back. The other never did
Actually though it does make my brain clink.....I pressume you are American? What a suprise. If anything is being achieved on this site is that you guys (on the whole) need to wake up to the fact that we are so ****** off at your 'Foreign Policy' and attitude.
Go and read Michael Moore (yeah, he won the Palm D'Or btw for his new film and contradictions about the U.S Gov) and please for goodness sake WAKE UP. Stop being blindfolded by the rubbish you are fed on CNN etc..... Read some broadsheets, watch other news channels and get an opinion for yourself instead of spitting fire at limerickman and what you are fed through the media all the time.
Open your eyes and stop getting swallowed up in what the U.S Gov feed you instead of trying to form your own opinion with some real and serious facts.
Alice
O.k, I'm getting so peed off with this. Anything Lim says you like to contradict. What is it about? You seem to do it all the time no matter what. He can't seem to type one word without you jumping onto his back contradictory to quite a few other's posts that are seriously un true.
Please tell me what you know about war; which regiments served, why, and what happened to them?
I was at boarding school as my dad was in the Army hence us having to move a lot. Most of my fellow school mates had Fathers who were in the R.A.F. 2 of those got shot down and were held hostage as sadly when they had to eject they got captured. Please don't go with the 'our planes got shot down but yours didn't' etc... Rubbish. American rethoric is what you are stating and it is bull. I saw and heard those daughters crying their eyes out for months until 1 Dad came back. The other never did
Actually though it does make my brain clink.....I pressume you are American? What a suprise. If anything is being achieved on this site is that you guys (on the whole) need to wake up to the fact that we are so ****** off at your 'Foreign Policy' and attitude.
Go and read Michael Moore (yeah, he won the Palm D'Or btw for his new film and contradictions about the U.S Gov) and please for goodness sake WAKE UP. Stop being blindfolded by the rubbish you are fed on CNN etc..... Read some broadsheets, watch other news channels and get an opinion for yourself instead of spitting fire at limerickman and what you are fed through the media all the time.
Open your eyes and stop getting swallowed up in what the U.S Gov feed you instead of trying to form your own opinion with some real and serious facts.
Alice
EXCUSE ME? We have all read and seen the news and know about Rumsfeld. Are you trying to deny that union? Or rather, should I say....let's forget the Geneva Convention and what the U.S soldiers did and have a party/rock concert?!!!
Brainwashing appears to prevail!
Alice
Alice, I'm happy to see that you have no opinion...But seriously, I'll answer your questions and set you straight on a few things..
1. I have actually agreed with Lim on at least two occasions.. Surprisingly enough, I'm not going to let him or YOU continue to bash my president and Commander-in-Chief without expressing MY point of view. I do believe I have a right to MY opinion and it doesn't have to always align with LM's or yours.
2. War huh...I've been involved in two. Both in the middle east. I've see my daughter's eyes fill with tears as I was shipping off for yet another 6-9 months as I've made a few. Without giving you an exact description of who I am since I no nothing of you the following are the units I've been assigned to. USS JOHN KING (DESTROYER), USS TICONDEROGA CRUISER USS HARRY S TRUMAN...AIRCRAFT CARRIER. My Military I.D. card state Geneva convention catagory II..You seem to know so much you should be able to figure out my approximate rank by what category I'm in. might I continue...Carrier Group TWO, Comnavsurflant NSA Bahrain. I've seen shipmates die via accident, marines I've partied with, laughed with and ate with die in combat and there are many good friends of mine who will never return...either from the bombing of the USS Cole or the attack on the Pentagon. I am not brain washed. I didn't join the military for the money nor the education although I have earned by bs degree while on active duty. My wife makes more than I do and she doesn't risk her life every day. But I don't care because I believe I am doing my part to make this world better for her and for my children. I truly believe that, you can mock my beliefs and convictions, I frankly don't care....
If you don't suscribe to that opinion, I don't care. I can't make you agree with me, and you certainly have the right to your opinon. However, when one comes on here and assimilates a few facts from here and there and then states he/she knows beyond a shadow of a doubt...that's where I draw the line! We get ****** off as you call it at those who just know one line...no wmd's bush lied eieiei O. We get ****** off at people who whine when we try to express our point of view...we should be quiet for we are wrong??? The Americans never get the whole story...yadda ydda yadda Who is playing Judge here?Because I disagree with him I'm spitting fire??Ha ha very funny. You are trying to silence "my opinion" on a public forum...priceless... I could see your point if I was speaking in political terms in another area besides "bloody soapbox" Or if I was calling him names for goodness sake... Alice, you really should have taken a deep breath and counted to 10 before you made your comments...
So don't lecture me on WAR or my 17 years of Military service nor generalize my behavior with those security forces who "tortured" those poor law abiding iraqi citizens... You weren't there and neither was I so we all get the same info...BTW I don't watch CNN!!!Never will!
LM can take up for himself...He is "informed" "educated" but I just don't happen to agree with him all the time. Make that most of the time and its always the same issue!!! BTW pretty hypocritical statement about jumping on someone, why don't you just take a look at how many times he has jumped posters on here with his anti-bush rhetoric.
By the way, Michael Moore is an IDIOT! He doesn't impress me, he doesn't represent me and since a bunch of Johnny Depp butt kissing Liberals voted for his POLITICAL POC movie his bogus award doesn't impress me at all either. The best place to be in Cannes is on the beach with a chest full of beer!
Well, sorry ole AliceM, I thought we saw eye-to-eye when we were trying to get some racist dude to shut up...but now that I have disagreed with "the limerickman" I'm an evil American fanatic...once again Priceless...Wow, the Limerickman really does have a following. I'm impressed. Dude, you need to get a website!
BTW the only thing we are learning here is just how close minded you guys really are..."I assume you are an American..what a surprise" ugh..... If I had made a statement like that, I would be how you say it...Spitting Fire???
Zapper
I don't need to watch Lim's back. He is more than capable of doing that for himself. Contrary to what you seem to believe we don't always agree at all. It was a general observation that I was making.
I have plenty of opinions thank you but choose not to express most of them. Oh,and, yes, I did more than count to 10 before posting. Cheers for your concern!
You are correct that everyone should have their own opinions so I do apologise if offended you, but my opinion is to say that 'Europeans' are getting royally fed up with American Foreign Policy. That is the bottom line. Nothing said about your President etc.....FOREIGN POLICY and an incorrect statment re our planes etc from the first war.
Impressive tour list, and yes, can guess your rank. It is a seriously admirable job you are doing for your country, but it still doesn't change my mind that this last war should have ever occured.
Alice
I don't need to watch Lim's back. He is more than capable of doing that for himself. Contrary to what you seem to believe we don't always agree at all. It was a general observation that I was making.
I have plenty of opinions thank you but choose not to express most of them. Oh,and, yes, I did more than count to 10 before posting. Cheers for your concern!
You are correct that everyone should have their own opinions so I do apologise if offended you, but my opinion is to say that 'Europeans' are getting royally fed up with American Foreign Policy. That is the bottom line. Nothing said about your President etc.....FOREIGN POLICY and an incorrect statment re our planes etc from the first war.
Impressive tour list, and yes, can guess your rank. It is a seriously admirable job you are doing for your country, but it still doesn't change my mind that this last war should have ever occured.
Alice
Alice, at least we agree that although opinions may differ, we call have them and fortunately have the means to express them.
I can say, that I can't exactly agree with all of our decisions concerning policy foreign or otherwise but I truly feel that although difficult, this war was right..We should have done it during the first war but we didn't....
I'm sorry but in my attempt to bring some levity to this exchange, I might have generalized about your admiration of the "L" man...
I do remember that on every tour in that region, I had friends who came back to the carrier from patrolling the "no fly zone" and had been shot at...I saw lots of footage that showed the ground fire as well. I'm just a little frustrated that "some" either brush that little tidbit aside or ignore it all together and think that is was perfectly alright for S.H. to do that even though it was in direct violation of U.N. Resolutions. I know that it may not "change minds" but I believe along with the WMD argument that this is another factor.
Funny, how the media will only "harp" on the bad stuff or they latch onto any shred that puts the Pres in a "bad light", in my "opinion" that is "tunnel vision" and Liberal media at work. Contrary to what you or others may think, I do listen and read when I have the opportunity. What I have a problem with is to find the "good news" I have to plow through the "doom and gloom" and find the good stuff buried on the last page.
Equal coverage is all I want. We may disagree and that’s ok...as long as the whole story is out there and in my opinion it is not readily available to the GP.
The atrocities against detainees are being investigated, people are/will be prosecuted and I agree some of the activities depicted make my stomach turn. BUT, there are more than 100,000 soldiers doing great work and once again, it would be refreshing to see pictures of that plastered on the nightly news instead of having to go searching for it.
Alice, I respect your opinion and it doesn't bother me so much for one to have a problem with policy...I'm just not a big fan of those who personally attack my President. He is a human being after all and far from perfect but I happen to like him and will support him to the end!
Well, perhaps I should have taken some of my own advice as I was up late last night and shoud not have responded to your post until this morning... I think I was ok until the "Michael Moore" comment...Z.
Originally posted by alicem
'But since none of your planes were being shot at it doesn't matter does it?' Zapper
O.k, I'm getting so peed off with this. Anything Lim says you like to contradict. What is it about? You seem to do it all the time no matter what. He can't seem to type one word without you jumping onto his back contradictory to quite a few other's posts that are seriously un true.
Please tell me what you know about war; which regiments served, why, and what happened to them?
I was at boarding school as my dad was in the Army hence us having to move a lot. Most of my fellow school mates had Fathers who were in the R.A.F. 2 of those got shot down and were held hostage as sadly when they had to eject they got captured. Please don't go with the 'our planes got shot down but yours didn't' etc... Rubbish. American rethoric is what you are stating and it is bull. I saw and heard those daughters crying their eyes out for months until 1 Dad came back. The other never did
Actually though it does make my brain clink.....I pressume you are American? What a suprise. If anything is being achieved on this site is that you guys (on the whole) need to wake up to the fact that we are so ****** off at your 'Foreign Policy' and attitude.
Go and read Michael Moore (yeah, he won the Palm D'Or btw for his new film and contradictions about the U.S Gov) and please for goodness sake WAKE UP. Stop being blindfolded by the rubbish you are fed on CNN etc..... Read some broadsheets, watch other news channels and get an opinion for yourself instead of spitting fire at limerickman and what you are fed through the media all the time.
Open your eyes and stop getting swallowed up in what the U.S Gov feed you instead of trying to form your own opinion with some real and serious facts.
Alice
Iraq :
Thanks Alice for the support.
I am very heartened to hear from someone who has had direct experience of the reality of war and the effect on families.
What you have said here is absolutely correct.
That is why I posted earlier – that if those leaders (all leaders and not just Bush) had actually seen what war can do to people as regards injuries and death – they would not
be so quick to declare war.
As you point out, your family have direct experience of actual military involvement and are part of a professionally trained and widely respected army.
The British army’s training is the best in the world.
The standards they employ are respected worldwide – their officers are first class.
None of the unprofessional incidents attributed to the US army – have befallen the British Army.
Coincidence ?
No.
The British Army do a good job.
One cannot say the same for the US army.
Consistently, they have been shown to be unprofessional.
The abuses at Abu Ghuraib, the instances of death by friendly fire, their instances of killing innocent civilians, the inability to of their people to disseminate, verify and record
accurate intelligence : is astounding.
The US army recruit people who would not be employed otherwise.
(Look at Lynndie England and Graner : would you even interview these people for a job ?).
Their generals have said that the US military campaign in Iraq has been a disaster.
Generals Hoare and Zinni have both come out strongly against this war.
Of course, the US population was completed duped by the lies told by their politicians.
The politicians created the conspiracy of war.
Brave reporting by CBS, Washington Post, the New Yorker and the likes of Seymour Hersh is to be commended.
Others like the people on this site refuse to listen and to consider the overwhelming evidence.
They don’t represent anything that I would consider to be American – they are frauds.
Pavlovian frauds at that.
The Queens Lancashire Regiment were falsely accussed of prisoner abuse in Iraq.
Photos were shown of prisoners being abuses by QLR.
These were false allegations – everyone knew this.
When England and Graner and the Bush government were found out – it was evident that there was no such falsity.
Lim, you dissapoint me...I thought that you would at least give credit where it is due... You should be ashamed of your statements above.. I will give you that the British Army is well respected and they do a fine job. But once again...your statements concerning OUR military are YOUR OPPINION! You base your OPINION on the acts of a few. You just made yourself look like a complete fool...Congratulations!
You owe 10's of thousands good military personnel and their families an appology for your ugly statements above... You sir, have stooped to new lows...Obviously you must be bored and are attempting to incite or maybe its' sweeps weeks for the Limerickmans show...either way, you should be ashamed!
I based my opinion on the acts of a few ?
The number of instances of friendly fire casualties is highest amongst the US army.
The number of instances of civilian deaths caused during the Afghan and Iraq wars are due to the US army.
The only instances of prisoner abuses identified thus far have been where suspects have been humiliated, tortured and killed
while in US personnel custody.
The British army have successfully managed to interact with the people of southern Iraq around Basra.
The British army work with the local people of Basra and the surrounding areas.
One woman stated on TV "the British army engineers sunk wells for us to feed our animals - this saves us having to travel miles in order to feed our flock"
Another local says "on her day off, Private Smith comes to our school to help the teacher give our pupils english lessons".
Building goodwill is an essential ingredient for any military force.
The americans - well they can't interact with any iraqi's because most of them are holed up within the green zone in Baghdad.
Channel 4 ran a very good piece about the US army and it's recruits.
It was absolutlely frightening the level of ignornace of your recruits in Iraq.
They had no concept of Iraq - it's people - or it's culture.
One soldier says (thick southern accent) "well I just didn't know what to expect here in Iraq (he pronounces it as 'eyerack') - I mean they have got roads here and running water" as if this
was some revelation.
They have no interaction with ordinary Iraqi people on a day to day basis.
Within the Green Zone - they have their own McDonalds and their
own radio station blaring out musak.
They do not move or socialise outside of this area.
I loved this comment from a dj within the green zone
"I just wish all those bad people would go away - because I really miss my family" -
Indeed.
Professionalism - they wouldn't have any concept of that either.
LM - You are so predictable. You are obviously trying to make me mad by spewing your **** about how stupid our armed forces are. I am not angry, I just pity you. I feel sorry for you and your pitiful existence...You apparently are very unstable.. One minute you make perfect sense and speak like an intelligent human being, the next you make these insane malicious statements.
I refuse to deal with your outright ignorance concerning OUR brave men and women in uniform. I certainly don't appreciate your analogy, nor do any of the parents children and spouses of those you have just insulted.
Once again I must prove that although you are not always entirely wrong, you just tend to distort and antagonize.
Although the British took on a very important role and are a brilliant and effiecient fighting force indeed.. The limited number of troops involved (about 10%) of what we have prevented them from partaking in as many sorties/missions.. Do the math, figure the percentages, I'm not going to do the work of you!
Secondly, your accusations of our troops being holed up are untrue.. attached in both printed form and photographic evidence to the contrary...OUR WE CLEAR? You are a Liar! Are we clear?
Further discussion with you is useless for 75% of what comes out of your piehole is a lie or a distortion of the truth. It isn't worth gleaning through your post looking for the other 25%. So if I were you (which I'm glad I'm not) I would just go back to your little cubicle and crunch your little numbers and pretend you have a clue about what you are talking about!
Z
By Spc. Kimberly Snow
FORWARD OPERATING BASE BRASSFIELD MORA, SAMARRA, Iraq (April 2004) -- Since landing here in mid-February, Army Reserve Soldiers from the Kalamazoo, Mich.-based 415th Civil Affairs Battalion have diligently worked on projects aimed at improving living conditions for locals and gaining residents’ trust.
Among the projects are the reconstruction of 43 primary and secondary schools in and around Samarra. Public Works Team Chief Maj. John P. Lawlor met recently with Samarra chief of council and director of education, Shaikh Adnan Thabet Maher, at this forward operating base to discuss the status of the projects and the proposed reconstruction of 11 mosques.
You raise a good point Lim. I spent 7 years in the military and my experiance would back up what you say. The British Army is VERY well respected while the US army is not highly thought of at all. I have had little actual experiance with the US army, just one excersise and I was not at all impressed with there profesionalism. The only thing that does impress me about the US military is there toys, got love them gadgets, but gadgets can not buy them respect.
I am so sad anyway about this last war etc..... Also, I hate arguments!!!!
Oh, it really is a hard thing to even express but hope you will 'get it' My Dad was Army, Mum working for the Foreign in Moscow for one posting amonst others until she had to come back home to marry Dad (Oficers wives were not allowed to work back then.) She was the C/O's wife and had to look after all the women when thier hubands went on any tour
I have 4 others who are my Godparents. Even by brother's Godmother was in a very high up postion but I can't actually say what they all did etc.....I hope that makes sense? I can't reply properly on this topic but please don't think I am just 'making it up' or something as cannot say what they did job wise as it would be so compromising and againt them all having to have signed the Official Secrets Act. ALL served in one way or the other.
The second is this thread is very valuable, which is why I sometimes get so het up due to the fact that J. is Kurdish and me wanting to protect him in a way. No, it doesn't make me a fount of information at all but he has talked about being at home with his Mum and family. His father got the full works from his bullets from SH's guys) and he was just sitting out on the veranda having a cup of tea! In a way I can get more solid responses from my b/f compared to our media. He tells it how it is/was.
So, it almost like a doubled aged sword. I'm an Army Brat so would agree to most decisions war wise; doesn't mean I aproove of war but we did have to get S/H but I can't support this last war at all despite them getting him, let alone seeing the reaction on my b'f's face or of his friends when watching the news for example. They are all totally shoked and scared but actually repeatedly say that they are happy yours and our own troops were trying to help! There you go! Contracting myself?~just passing on his reaction and statements!
Get this for example; If my Mum or Dad found out I was going out with a Muslim, let alone a Kurd they go ballistic!!! That's an Army/Foreign Office background for you¬ It is still imprinted in their heads that anyone who is from Iraq is pulic enemy number 1 ! But I see it differently after listening to someone from Kurdistan themselves.
Then word got around re mass graves. They literally chuked the ypund men ithem in and were buried alive. He was told to get out now and fast by his Mum which he did thank goodness.
For once I can try and agree/find a way around the 'discussion' with both sides of this debate. All opinions are valid. No, I woun't agree to the last war, yet did the first war but perhaps we should aim to diagree or something on that topic?
Take care
Alice
Oh, it really is a hard thing to even express but hope you will 'get it' My Dad was Army, Mum working for the Foreign in Moscow for one posting amonst others until she had to come back home to marry Dad (Oficers wives were not allowed to work back then.) She was the C/O's wife and had to look after all the women when thier hubands went on any tour
I have 4 others who are my Godparents. Even by brother's Godmother was in a very high up postion but I can't actually say what they all did etc.....I hope that makes sense? I can't reply properly on this topic but please don't think I am just 'making it up' or something as cannot say what they did job wise as it would be so compromising and againt them all having to have signed the Official Secrets Act. ALL served in one way or the other.
The second is this thread is very valuable, which is why I sometimes get so het up due to the fact that J. is Kurdish and me wanting to protect him in a way. No, it doesn't make me a fount of information at all but he has talked about being at home with his Mum and family. His father got the full works from his bullets
from SH's guys) and he was just sitting out on the veranda having a cup of tea! In a way I can get more solid responses from my b/f compared to our media. He tells it how it is/was.So, it almost like a doubled aged sword. I'm an Army Brat so would agree to most decisions war wise; doesn't mean I aproove of war but we did have to get S/H but I can't support this last war at all despite them getting him, let alone seeing the reaction on my b'f's face or of his friends when watching the news for example. They are all totally shoked and scared but actually repeatedly say that they are happy yours and our own troops were trying to help! There you go! Contracting myself?~just passing on his reaction and statements!
Get this for example; If my Mum or Dad found out I was going out with a Muslim, let alone a Kurd they go ballistic!!! That's an Army/Foreign Office background for you¬ It is still imprinted in their heads that anyone who is from Iraq is pulic enemy number 1 ! But I see it differently after listening to someone from Kurdistan themselves.
Then word got around re mass graves. They literally chuked the ypund men ithem in and were buried alive. He was told to get out now and fast by his Mum which he did thank goodness.
For once I can try and agree/find a way around the 'discussion' with both sides of this debate. All opinions are valid. No, I woun't agree to the last war, yet did the first war but perhaps we should aim to diagree or something on that topic?
Take care
Alice
Thanks Fixey.
Yes, the unprofessionalism of the US army with their collateral damage (reality : killing civilians), casualties under friendly fire
(inability to distinguish their own soldiers before firing upon them) and their decision to barracade themselves away from the ordinary Iraqi citizen is a monumental blow.
How else would an ordinary citizen perceive an army that deliberately refuses to engage with them ?
Of course, it creates the perception of conquerers rather than liberators.
The British army has engaged with the local people.
The British are living openly in Iraq and they're not being picked off like our transatlantic friends - despiet their so-called green zone.
The professionalism of the British is helping to create a real sense
of liberation.
On the other hand our US friends - well they're too busy torturing
the people they came to liberate.
Thanks, my friend.
Indeed you are correct.
He/she cannot discuss a point without getting emotive.
We are dealing here with someone who is clearly in denial.
I was always taught to attack the persons argument and not the
person.
Seems that standards of behaviour and discourse have fallen too
with our transatlantic friends.
Originally posted by alicem
I am so sad anyway about this last war etc..... Also, I hate arguments!!!!
Oh, it really is a hard thing to even express but hope you will 'get it' My Dad was Army, Mum working for the Foreign in Moscow for one posting amonst others until she had to come back home to marry Dad (Oficers wives were not allowed to work back then.) She was the C/O's wife and had to look after all the women when thier hubands went on any tour
I have 4 others who are my Godparents. Even by brother's Godmother was in a very high up postion but I can't actually say what they all did etc.....I hope that makes sense? I can't reply properly on this topic but please don't think I am just 'making it up' or something as cannot say what they did job wise as it would be so compromising and againt them all having to have signed the Official Secrets Act. ALL served in one way or the other.
The second is this thread is very valuable, which is why I sometimes get so het up due to the fact that J. is Kurdish and me wanting to protect him in a way. No, it doesn't make me a fount of information at all but he has talked about being at home with his Mum and family. His father got the full works from his bullets
So, it almost like a doubled aged sword. I'm an Army Brat so would agree to most decisions war wise; doesn't mean I aproove of war but we did have to get S/H but I can't support this last war at all despite them getting him, let alone seeing the reaction on my b'f's face or of his friends when watching the news for example. They are all totally shoked and scared but actually repeatedly say that they are happy yours and our own troops were trying to help! There you go! Contracting myself?~just passing on his reaction and statements!
Get this for example; If my Mum or Dad found out I was going out with a Muslim, let alone a Kurd they go ballistic!!! That's an Army/Foreign Office background for you¬ It is still imprinted in their heads that anyone who is from Iraq is pulic enemy number 1 ! But I see it differently after listening to someone from Kurdistan themselves.
Then word got around re mass graves. They literally chuked the ypund men ithem in and were buried alive. He was told to get out now and fast by his Mum which he did thank goodness.
For once I can try and agree/find a way around the 'discussion' with both sides of this debate. All opinions are valid. No, I woun't agree to the last war, yet did the first war but perhaps we should aim to diagree or something on that topic?
Take care
Alice
AliceM : it's refreshing to read what you have said here because
it brings home how evil Hussein and his regime is.
I too work with two Iraqi's : one Sunni, one Shia.
Both of these people suffered under the Hussein regime - family
members were disappeared during the 1980's - no trace of them ever found.
Of course, issues like Halabja in Kurdistan shows just how far
Hussein would go to kill people.
Life meant nothing to him.
Of course the SH should have been toppled by Bush in 1991
but no, it was expedient to leave him in power - even after he
invaded another country.
Expediency.
Expedient to support him during the 1980's too.
If the USA was really interested in human rights and eliminating terror, as they claimed before invading Iraq in 2003, they would have eliminated SH in the 1980's.
The USA are not interested in human rights - sorry, they are interested in human rights only when it suits them.
It suited them to become interested in human rights in March 2003.
Listed below are FACTS that some will try to hide. Some will lie about a doomed U.S. Economy some will Lie and state the U.S. unemployment rate is over 6% when it is not! Some will lie and say that U.S. troops are doing nothing more than hiding in the “green zone” not venturing out to help local citizens when they in fact are! Some will twist the truth and compare U.S. Reservists with British regular troops…Sad…very sad…..
Britain's reputation is heavily besmirched by reports from Amnesty International that UK troops have killed innocent Iraqis who presented no apparent threat. Civilians are always going to be the innocent victims of war, but there is evidence that at least 12 and as many as 37 Iraqi civilians have been unlawfully killed by British troops.
National Association for Business Economics sees 4.7% growth in '04, also lifts inflation forecast.
May 24, 2004: 7:29 AM EDT
The economists raised their outlook for this year's growth to 4.7 percent from 4.6 percent in their February survey, the fourth time the 2004 outlook has been upgraded. The forecast for 2005 was unchanged at a more moderate 3.8 percent rise.
Signs of a strong pickup in employment in recent months have cemented market expectations for the Fed to begin raising short-term interest rates, possibly as early as June. Interest rates were dropped to a 1958 low of 1 percent last year in a bid to strengthen the slow recovery from the 2001 recession.
The NABE panel also upgraded their forecasts for employment growth in six of the next seven quarters and predicted the unemployment rate would drop to an annual average of 5.5 percent this year and an even better 5.3 percent in 2005.
Thursday, May 27, 2004
WASHINGTON — The economy (search) grew at a 4.4 percent annual rate in the first quarter of this year, slightly faster than previously thought and fresh evidence that the recovery possessed good momentum as it headed into the current quarter.
The increase in gross domestic product from January through March reported by the Commerce Department (search) on Thursday marked an improvement from both the 4.2 percent pace first estimated for the quarter
School Attendance is up 80%-Truth!
Again, according to an April, 2004 report from UNICEF, school attendance in Iraq increased by 60 percent shortly after the war to more than 95 percent during the recent national exam week
More than 1,500 schools renovated-Truth!
UNICEF says that as of April, 2004, more than 2,500 schools have been renovated with the goal of 4,000 being completed by the end of the year, but 10,000 more need repair.
The Port of Uhm Qasar [sic] renovated so grain can be offloaded faster-Truth!
In a November, 2003 interview on National Public Radio, Andrew Natsios of the U.S. Agency for International Development said that the port at Umm Qasar, Iraq's largest, is modern and functioning for the first time in 20 years.
All of the hospitals operating-Truth!
Because of disrepair and looting, it took a lot of work to get hospitals back up to speed but according to James Haverman, the Coalition Provisional Authority Senior Advisor to the Iraqi Ministry of Health, all 240 hospitals in Iraq as well as 2400 primary health care clinics were operating as of December, 2003
Students are taught field sanitation and hand washing techniques to prevent the spread of germs-Truth!
Not only are U.S. soldiers demonstrating field sanitation and hand washing, but UNICEF is conducting an active health education program to improve personal hygiene and promote more hand washing.
Textbooks that don't mention Saddam are in the schools for the first time in 30 years-Truth!
According to published reports, a team of U.S. appointed Iraqi educators combed through more than 500 Iraqi textbooks and removed every mention of Saddam Hussein and the Baath
party including pictures.
The texts will probably be revised by the Iraqis at some point in the future, but the pre-war texts were dominated with Saddam Hussein
“U.S. troops hand out nap sacks full of school supplies in Samarra. This just days after those four American contractors were killed and their bodies mutilated in Fallujah. “
Major progress has also been made in health care. Under Saddam, the Ministry of Health spent $16 million a year. The current budget is almost $1 billion. The health care system is now open to all Iraqis, with 30 percent more people now using the facilities. Doctors, who used to get $20 a month, now earn up to $180. Modern medication such as cancer drugs are now available, something unheard of during the Saddam years.
Last Sunday, these five Navy Seabees were killed in the Sunni triangle while on assignment rebuilding schools and medical facilities for the Iraqis.
Before the war, few areas had proper sewage facilities. One example of what soldiers are doing on the ground is in Mosul, where a neighborhood was swamped with raw sewage for 17 years. The U.S. Army spent $40,000 to hire local workers, and the problem is fixed.
Improvements in the infrastructure are widespread. Here are some key examples. Baghdad airport now has 43 passenger flights a day, including regular commercial service to Jordan.
And look at something as simple as phone service. Under Saddam, cell phones were a luxury, reserved only for top party and government officials. Now, more than 340,000 Iraqis have cell phones, and business is booming.
Britain's reputation is heavily besmirched by reports from Amnesty International that UK troops have killed innocent Iraqis who presented no apparent threat. Civilians are always going to be the innocent victims of war, but there is evidence that at least 12 and as many as 37 Iraqi civilians have been unlawfully killed by British troops.
National Association for Business Economics sees 4.7% growth in '04, also lifts inflation forecast.
May 24, 2004: 7:29 AM EDT
The economists raised their outlook for this year's growth to 4.7 percent from 4.6 percent in their February survey, the fourth time the 2004 outlook has been upgraded. The forecast for 2005 was unchanged at a more moderate 3.8 percent rise.
Signs of a strong pickup in employment in recent months have cemented market expectations for the Fed to begin raising short-term interest rates, possibly as early as June. Interest rates were dropped to a 1958 low of 1 percent last year in a bid to strengthen the slow recovery from the 2001 recession.
The NABE panel also upgraded their forecasts for employment growth in six of the next seven quarters and predicted the unemployment rate would drop to an annual average of 5.5 percent this year and an even better 5.3 percent in 2005.
Thursday, May 27, 2004
WASHINGTON — The economy (search) grew at a 4.4 percent annual rate in the first quarter of this year, slightly faster than previously thought and fresh evidence that the recovery possessed good momentum as it headed into the current quarter.
The increase in gross domestic product from January through March reported by the Commerce Department (search) on Thursday marked an improvement from both the 4.2 percent pace first estimated for the quarter
School Attendance is up 80%-Truth!
Again, according to an April, 2004 report from UNICEF, school attendance in Iraq increased by 60 percent shortly after the war to more than 95 percent during the recent national exam week
More than 1,500 schools renovated-Truth!
UNICEF says that as of April, 2004, more than 2,500 schools have been renovated with the goal of 4,000 being completed by the end of the year, but 10,000 more need repair.
The Port of Uhm Qasar [sic] renovated so grain can be offloaded faster-Truth!
In a November, 2003 interview on National Public Radio, Andrew Natsios of the U.S. Agency for International Development said that the port at Umm Qasar, Iraq's largest, is modern and functioning for the first time in 20 years.
All of the hospitals operating-Truth!
Because of disrepair and looting, it took a lot of work to get hospitals back up to speed but according to James Haverman, the Coalition Provisional Authority Senior Advisor to the Iraqi Ministry of Health, all 240 hospitals in Iraq as well as 2400 primary health care clinics were operating as of December, 2003
Students are taught field sanitation and hand washing techniques to prevent the spread of germs-Truth!
Not only are U.S. soldiers demonstrating field sanitation and hand washing, but UNICEF is conducting an active health education program to improve personal hygiene and promote more hand washing.
Textbooks that don't mention Saddam are in the schools for the first time in 30 years-Truth!
According to published reports, a team of U.S. appointed Iraqi educators combed through more than 500 Iraqi textbooks and removed every mention of Saddam Hussein and the Baath
party including pictures.
The texts will probably be revised by the Iraqis at some point in the future, but the pre-war texts were dominated with Saddam Hussein
“U.S. troops hand out nap sacks full of school supplies in Samarra. This just days after those four American contractors were killed and their bodies mutilated in Fallujah. “
Major progress has also been made in health care. Under Saddam, the Ministry of Health spent $16 million a year. The current budget is almost $1 billion. The health care system is now open to all Iraqis, with 30 percent more people now using the facilities. Doctors, who used to get $20 a month, now earn up to $180. Modern medication such as cancer drugs are now available, something unheard of during the Saddam years.
Last Sunday, these five Navy Seabees were killed in the Sunni triangle while on assignment rebuilding schools and medical facilities for the Iraqis.
Before the war, few areas had proper sewage facilities. One example of what soldiers are doing on the ground is in Mosul, where a neighborhood was swamped with raw sewage for 17 years. The U.S. Army spent $40,000 to hire local workers, and the problem is fixed.
Improvements in the infrastructure are widespread. Here are some key examples. Baghdad airport now has 43 passenger flights a day, including regular commercial service to Jordan.
And look at something as simple as phone service. Under Saddam, cell phones were a luxury, reserved only for top party and government officials. Now, more than 340,000 Iraqis have cell phones, and business is booming.
