Iraq

[zapper]

Originally posted by limerickman

This accusation is outrageous.
I want you to withdraw the accusation that I am a liar.

Ok, after much deliberation and due consideration during which your previous posts were reviewed, I have come to the conclusion that you are indeed owed an apology.

You are owed an apology by the academic institution that awarded you a degree of some sort yet failed to explain the difference between a “continent” and a “country”

You are owed an apology from whatever treatment facility that allowed you to leave prior to completing your program for you are not of sound mind.

You are owed an apology from UPS, FEDEX or what ever carrier failed to deliver you a copy of “hooked on phonics” for you seem to have a problem reading my posts..

Finally, you are owed an apology from your IP which for what ever reason only allows you to look up anti-Bush, Anti -U.S. economy and Anti-U.S. Army propaganda and prevents you from being able to find anything else..

You can’t determine fact from fiction. You state our troops are inferior. You state our troops are dumb and Fixey loves our toys..Well, who do you think operates and repairs “our toys”? Do you know how to forward bias an NPN transistor? Do you know what voltage should be at the base, emitter or collector? How about diodes…Do you even know what I’m talking about…didn’t think so.

Do you even know the requirements for entry into the military? There are different levels based on your scores one is assigned a specialty…Obviously humans have different abilities not everyone is a good public speaker.

You mock ones accent, based upon that you feel the young soldier is stupid do you…Not only are you a liar but you are a hypocrite.

You wonder why Americans become arrogant and rude at times…Little wonder when you make stereotypical asinine comments like that…

We Americans are peaceful and loving and only get ****** off once someone else lays down the gauntlet. So grow up, learn how to read and take your Zoloft… Its obvious your prescription has lapsed…

By the way, I care not of your response…I’m done with you…You are nothing more than a waste of protoplasm…..

TA TA

Z

 

[limerickman]

Originally posted by zapper
Ok, after much deliberation and due consideration during which your previous posts were reviewed, I have come to the conclusion that you are indeed owed an apology.

You are owed an apology by the academic institution that awarded you a degree of some sort yet failed to explain the difference between a “continent” and a “country”

You are owed an apology from whatever treatment facility that allowed you to leave prior to completing your program for you are not of sound mind.

You are owed an apology from UPS, FEDEX or what ever carrier failed to deliver you a copy of “hooked on phonics” for you seem to have a problem reading my posts..

Finally, you are owed an apology from your IP which for what ever reason only allows you to look up anti-Bush, Anti -U.S. economy and Anti-U.S. Army propaganda and prevents you from being able to find anything else..

You can’t determine fact from fiction. You state our troops are inferior. You state our troops are dumb and Fixey loves our toys..Well, who do you think operates and repairs “our toys”? Do you know how to forward bias an NPN transistor? Do you know what voltage should be at the base, emitter or collector? How about diodes…Do you even know what I’m talking about…didn’t think so.

Do you even know the requirements for entry into the military? There are different levels based on your scores one is assigned a specialty…Obviously humans have different abilities not everyone is a good public speaker.

You mock ones accent, based upon that you feel the young soldier is stupid do you…Not only are you a liar but you are a hypocrite.

You wonder why Americans become arrogant and rude at times…Little wonder when you make stereotypical asinine comments like that…

We Americans are peaceful and loving and only get ****** off once someone else lays down the gauntlet. So grow up, learn how to read and take your Zoloft… Its obvious your prescription has lapsed…

By the way, I care not of your response…I’m done with you…You are nothing more than a waste of protoplasm…..

TA TA

Z

Eh indeed !

 

[limerickman]

Originally posted by zapper
Listed below are FACTS that some will try to hide. Some will lie about a doomed U.S. Economy some will Lie and state the U.S. unemployment rate is over 6% when it is not! Some will lie and say that U.S. troops are doing nothing more than hiding in the “green zone” not venturing out to help local citizens when they in fact are! Some will twist the truth and compare U.S. Reservists with British regular troops…Sad…very sad…..

Britain's reputation is heavily besmirched by reports from Amnesty International that UK troops have killed innocent Iraqis who presented no apparent threat. Civilians are always going to be the innocent victims of war, but there is evidence that at least 12 and as many as 37 Iraqi civilians have been unlawfully killed by British troops.

National Association for Business Economics sees 4.7% growth in '04, also lifts inflation forecast.
May 24, 2004: 7:29 AM EDT
The economists raised their outlook for this year's growth to 4.7 percent from 4.6 percent in their February survey, the fourth time the 2004 outlook has been upgraded. The forecast for 2005 was unchanged at a more moderate 3.8 percent rise.
Signs of a strong pickup in employment in recent months have cemented market expectations for the Fed to begin raising short-term interest rates, possibly as early as June. Interest rates were dropped to a 1958 low of 1 percent last year in a bid to strengthen the slow recovery from the 2001 recession.
The NABE panel also upgraded their forecasts for employment growth in six of the next seven quarters and predicted the unemployment rate would drop to an annual average of 5.5 percent this year and an even better 5.3 percent in 2005.

Thursday, May 27, 2004

WASHINGTON — The economy (search) grew at a 4.4 percent annual rate in the first quarter of this year, slightly faster than previously thought and fresh evidence that the recovery possessed good momentum as it headed into the current quarter.
The increase in gross domestic product from January through March reported by the Commerce Department (search) on Thursday marked an improvement from both the 4.2 percent pace first estimated for the quarter

School Attendance is up 80%-Truth!
Again, according to an April, 2004 report from UNICEF, school attendance in Iraq increased by 60 percent shortly after the war to more than 95 percent during the recent national exam week

More than 1,500 schools renovated-Truth!
UNICEF says that as of April, 2004, more than 2,500 schools have been renovated with the goal of 4,000 being completed by the end of the year, but 10,000 more need repair.

The Port of Uhm Qasar [sic] renovated so grain can be offloaded faster-Truth!
In a November, 2003 interview on National Public Radio, Andrew Natsios of the U.S. Agency for International Development said that the port at Umm Qasar, Iraq's largest, is modern and functioning for the first time in 20 years.

All of the hospitals operating-Truth!
Because of disrepair and looting, it took a lot of work to get hospitals back up to speed but according to James Haverman, the Coalition Provisional Authority Senior Advisor to the Iraqi Ministry of Health, all 240 hospitals in Iraq as well as 2400 primary health care clinics were operating as of December, 2003

Students are taught field sanitation and hand washing techniques to prevent the spread of germs-Truth!
Not only are U.S. soldiers demonstrating field sanitation and hand washing, but UNICEF is conducting an active health education program to improve personal hygiene and promote more hand washing.

Textbooks that don't mention Saddam are in the schools for the first time in 30 years-Truth!
According to published reports, a team of U.S. appointed Iraqi educators combed through more than 500 Iraqi textbooks and removed every mention of Saddam Hussein and the Baath
party including pictures.
The texts will probably be revised by the Iraqis at some point in the future, but the pre-war texts were dominated with Saddam Hussein

“U.S. troops hand out nap sacks full of school supplies in Samarra. This just days after those four American contractors were killed and their bodies mutilated in Fallujah. “
Major progress has also been made in health care. Under Saddam, the Ministry of Health spent $16 million a year. The current budget is almost $1 billion. The health care system is now open to all Iraqis, with 30 percent more people now using the facilities. Doctors, who used to get $20 a month, now earn up to $180. Modern medication such as cancer drugs are now available, something unheard of during the Saddam years.
Last Sunday, these five Navy Seabees were killed in the Sunni triangle while on assignment rebuilding schools and medical facilities for the Iraqis.
Before the war, few areas had proper sewage facilities. One example of what soldiers are doing on the ground is in Mosul, where a neighborhood was swamped with raw sewage for 17 years. The U.S. Army spent $40,000 to hire local workers, and the problem is fixed.
Improvements in the infrastructure are widespread. Here are some key examples. Baghdad airport now has 43 passenger flights a day, including regular commercial service to Jordan.
And look at something as simple as phone service. Under Saddam, cell phones were a luxury, reserved only for top party and government officials. Now, more than 340,000 Iraqis have cell phones, and business is booming.

Look folks - it took him 24 hours to make this stuff up !!

 

[limerickman]

Originally posted by zapper
Listed below are FACTS that some will try to hide. Some will lie about a doomed U.S. Economy some will Lie and state the U.S. unemployment rate is over 6% when it is not! Some will lie and say that U.S. troops are doing nothing more than hiding in the “green zone” not venturing out to help local citizens when they in fact are! Some will twist the truth and compare U.S. Reservists with British regular troops…Sad…very sad…..

National Association for Business Economics sees 4.7% growth in '04, also lifts inflation forecast.
May 24, 2004: 7:29 AM EDT
The economists raised their outlook for this year's growth to 4.7 percent from 4.6 percent in their February survey, the fourth time the 2004 outlook has been upgraded. The forecast for 2005 was unchanged at a more moderate 3.8 percent rise.
Signs of a strong pickup in employment in recent months have cemented market expectations for the Fed to begin raising short-term interest rates, possibly as early as June. Interest rates were dropped to a 1958 low of 1 percent last year in a bid to strengthen the slow recovery from the 2001 recession.
The NABE panel also upgraded their forecasts for employment growth in six of the next seven quarters and predicted the unemployment rate would drop to an annual average of 5.5 percent this year and an even better 5.3 percent in 2005.

Thursday, May 27, 2004

WASHINGTON — The economy (search) grew at a 4.4 percent annual rate in the first quarter of this year, slightly faster than previously thought and fresh evidence that the recovery possessed good momentum as it headed into the current quarter.
The increase in gross domestic product from January through March reported by the Commerce Department (search) on Thursday marked an improvement from both the 4.2 percent pace first estimated for the quarter

Waffle : Waffle : Lies and More lies from our transatlantic friend living in post code denial - eating his $120 meals.

Dollar hits 8-week low versus euro on weak US data
By Steve Johnson in London
Published: May 27 2004 11:31 | Last Updated: May 27 2004 17:28

The dollar's recent slide accelerated on Thursday as soft US economic data intensified fears that the market had factored in US interest rates rising too far and too fast.

The greenback also crashed through a number of technical levels, triggering a barrage of stop-loss orders and sending the dollar spinning lower still."The dollar is looking very ropey," said David Bloom, currency analyst at HSBC. "The trend of strengthening that the market was extrapolating, of 5 per cent growth ad infinitum, is maybe just too powerful."The dollar's rally since February was predicated on rampant economic growth leading to rapid monetary tightening, leading speculators to liquidate dollar-funded carry trades.Concerns that high oil prices could sabotage this rosy picture have weighed of late. On Thursday this fear was compounding by soft economic data, with fourth quarter US GDP revised upwards less than expected, to 4.4 per cent, while weekly jobless claims came in at a disappointing 344,000.

After weak durable goods and homes sales numbers on Wednesday, the market rowed back from an assumption that US rates will reach 2 per cent by the year-end."The dollar continues to be undermined by uncertainties over the extent of monetary tightening that will be needed in the second half of the year to slow economic activity in the US," said Derek Halpenny, currency economist at Bank of Tokyo-Mitsubishi.

Consequently the dollar slumped 1.4 per cent against the euro to an eight-week low of $1.2266 as a support level of $1.2180 was comprehensively breached, 2.2 per cent against the Swiss franc to a three-month low of SFr1.2460 and 1.1 per cent versus the yen to a two-week low of Y110.80.The greenback also lost 1.5 per cent against sterling to chalk up a fresh six-week low of $1.8372, with three-week lows against the dollars of both New Zealand, where the likelihood of a further rate rise to 5.75 per cent next month remains strong, and Australia, to $0.6351 and $0.7177 respectively.The Swiss franc was a key beneficiary, rising 0.8 per cent against the euro to an 11-month high of SFr1.5270 and 1.2 per cent versus the yen to Y88.99, as its safe haven status proved popular.

Sterling was aided by the CBI monthly trends survey showing manufacturing orders at their highest level since February 1998 and exports at their best for eight years. With the Nationwide survey indicating that house price inflation may be accelerating, Robert Sinche, head of currency strategy at Citigroup, said the chances of a June interest rate hike had "increased significantly".

 

[limerickman]

Originally posted by zapper
Listed below are FACTS that some will try to hide. Some will lie

National Association for Business Economics sees 4.7% growth in '04, also lifts inflation forecast.
May 24, 2004: 7:29 AM EDT
The economists raised their outlook for this year's growth to 4.7 percent from 4.6 percent in their February survey, the fourth time the 2004 outlook has been upgraded. The forecast for 2005 was unchanged at a more moderate 3.8 percent rise.
Signs of a strong pickup in employment in recent months have cemented market expectations for the Fed to begin raising short-term interest rates, possibly as early as June. Interest rates were dropped to a 1958 low of 1 percent last year in a bid to strengthen the slow recovery from the 2001 recession.
The NABE panel also upgraded their forecasts for employment growth in six of the next seven quarters and predicted the unemployment rate would drop to an annual average of 5.5 percent this year and an even better 5.3 percent in 2005.
endquote



This is like hitting a punchy boxer : once again the FACTS quoted above are more.......I don't have to say it, folks, just read below :

The US will be in the red by almost half a trillion dollars - but will the growing budget deficit harm the economy?

The non-partisan Congressional Budget Office says the US government will run up a budget deficit of nearly $500bn in 2004 - a figure likely to be confirmed by the Bush administration when it reveals its budget forecast on Monday.
It is the largest in US history in absolute terms, and, at 5% of GDP, the largest since 1993 as a percentage of the economy.
(ouuccccccch !! : real sign of a great economy !!)

And within the space of a few years, a projected surplus over ten years of $5.6 trillion has turned into a deficit for the same period of $1.4 trillion.
(you've just got to ask how they manage to screwup so often !)
These are telephone directory numbers, almost hard to imagine
The budget deficit is now one quarter of total Federal spending, and 80% of the total receipts from Federal income taxes.
It is equal to $1,600 per US citizen this year, and the accumulated deficit over ten years would be nearly $20,000 per person.
(great - pass on that debt to your grandkids !)

Controversial figures.

The huge swing in the budget deficit have led some to argue that it is impossible to forecast.
The ups and downs of the economy, the need for more defence spending on the war on terror, and the generous tax cuts for the wealthy, have all changed the budget arithmetic.
The Bush administration believes that is impossible to forecast more than five years in advance, and no longer provides the long-term forecasts that are done by the non-partisan Congressional Budget Office.
And the economic rebound, which has seen economic growth rates of over 8% in the most recent quarter, have led Mr Bush to suggest that the budget deficit will be brought under control as the economy expands.
But many economists argue that this is wishful thinking.
Robert Rubin, Treasury Secretary under Bill Clinton, says that the uncertainty of the future is no reason not to be prudent today.
He argues that by running huge budget deficits, the government is limiting its flexibility to respond to future crises.

Run on the dollar

Mr Rubin, who is now chairman of Citigroup, argues that the adverse consequences of running large budget deficits may "be far larger and occur more suddenly than traditional analysis suggests".
In a paper for the Brookings Institution, he argues that "substantial deficits projected far into the future can cause a fundamental shift in market expectations and a related loss of confidence both at home and abroad".
This could lead to a run on the dollar (which is already suffering serious weakness), and a sharp rise in the interest rates demanded on Federal debt, which in turn could hurt the stock market, weaken banks and reduce private sector spending.
The Bush administration is doing its best to ward off such an eventuality by constantly telling the financial markets that it is committed to reducing the deficit, and arguing that it is "manageable" as a proportion of the economy.
And Treasury Secretary John Snow also argues that deficit spending is boosting the US growth rate, which will benefit the world economy.

Long-term investment

But other economists argue that large budget deficits undermine the economy by squeezing out private investment.
Benjamin Friedman, professor of economics at Harvard University, says that "what is at stake in all this is America's economic growth".
He argues that large budget deficits take a substantial proportion of America's savings, preventing it being put to more productive use in the private sector who should be buying new equipment, developing new technologies, and retraining the workforce.
And he points to the Reagan years of high budget deficits, when net investment fell to historic lows and the standard of living and real wages of the typical American family stagnated.
Professor Friedman says that a combination of spending restraint and tax increases - such as those introduced in the l990s - will be needed to close the budget gap.
But he sees little evidence that the Bush administration is committed to either.

Cutting taxes - and spending

Indeed, after a series of big tax cuts, government receipts have now fallen to their lowest post-war level, and payroll taxes that are earmarked to pay for social security and Medicare, the programmes for elderly Americans, now yield more than Federal income taxes.
And the government is using the temporary surpluses in the social security trust funds to reduce the size of the deficit - a risky approach when the baby boomers begin to retire after 2012. Without these surpluses, the budget deficit will average nearly $500bn per year for the whole of the decade, assuming the tax cuts are made permanent (as Mr Bush would like).

Rumble on the right

But meanwhile, rising government spending is beginning to worry some fiscal conservatives on the Republican right.
John Berthoud, president of the National Taxpayers Union, says the government's record on spending was "abysmal."
At a recent Conservative Political Action conference, delegates - including some Congressmen - questioned whether the Bush administration was conservative enough.
"There are troubling signs that the ship of conservative governance is off-course," said Indiana Congressman Mike Pence. And Congressman Tom Feeney accused the administration of "baby-sitting the nanny state."
In fact, total defence spending is now higher than all the rest of discretionary Federal spending put together - but pork-barrel politics means that special projects earmarked for the districts of individual Congressmen have risen from $44bn to $70bn, according to the CBO.
Political issue Cutting the budget deficit will not be easy, as the experience of the 1990s showed. The Bush administration has made it clear that it has other, higher priorities, including fighting the war and terrorism and cutting taxes.
And it will not be popular for Democrats running for election to call for both the limits on domestic spending and the tax rises that tackling the budget deficit will require. So postponing addressing the problem - at least until the after the presidential election in November - seems the most likely outcome.

 

[limerickman]

Originally posted by zapper


School Attendance is up 80%-Truth!
Again, according to an April, 2004 report from UNICEF, school attendance in Iraq increased by 60 percent shortly after the war to more than 95 percent during the recent national exam week

More than 1,500 schools renovated-Truth!
UNICEF says that as of April, 2004, more than 2,500 schools have been renovated with the goal of 4,000 being completed by the end of the year, but 10,000 more need repair.

The Port of Uhm Qasar [sic] renovated so grain can be offloaded faster-Truth!
In a November, 2003 interview on National Public Radio, Andrew Natsios of the U.S. Agency for International Development said that the port at Umm Qasar, Iraq's largest, is modern and functioning for the first time in 20 years.

All of the hospitals operating-Truth!
Because of disrepair and looting, it took a lot of work to get hospitals back up to speed but according to James Haverman, the Coalition Provisional Authority Senior Advisor to the Iraqi Ministry of Health, all 240 hospitals in Iraq as well as 2400 primary health care clinics were operating as of December, 2003

Students are taught field sanitation and hand washing techniques to prevent the spread of germs-Truth!
Not only are U.S. soldiers demonstrating field sanitation and hand washing, but UNICEF is conducting an active health education program to improve personal hygiene and promote more hand washing.

“U.S. troops hand out nap sacks full of school supplies in Samarra. This just days after those four American contractors were killed and their bodies mutilated in Fallujah. “
Major progress has also been made in health care. Under Saddam, the Ministry of Health spent $16 million a year. The current budget is almost $1 billion. The health care system is now open to all Iraqis, with 30 percent more people now using the facilities. Doctors, who used to get $20 a month, now earn up to $180. Modern medication such as cancer drugs are now available, something unheard of during the Saddam years.
Last Sunday, these five Navy Seabees were killed in the Sunni triangle while on assignment rebuilding schools and medical facilities for the Iraqis.
Before the war, few areas had proper sewage facilities. One example of what soldiers are doing on the ground is in Mosul, where a neighborhood was swamped with raw sewage for 17 years. The U.S. Army spent $40,000 to hire local workers, and the problem is fixed.
Improvements in the infrastructure are widespread. Here are some key examples. Baghdad airport now has 43 passenger flights a day, including regular commercial service to Jordan.
And look at something as simple as phone service. Under Saddam, cell phones were a luxury, reserved only for top party and government officials. Now, more than 340,000 Iraqis have cell phones, and business is booming. [/B]

endquote :

Limerickman :

The contradicts just keep on coming.

Tonight Channel 4 news ran a piece that shows just what the US
army is up to in Iraq.
I would ask posters to read the garbage posted by Zapper above
and then contrast his "stories" with what is posted below.
It will show just how far in denial our transatlantic friend really is.

"Independent filmaker - Clara Sutton (an american) - has made a documentary called Falujah.
This documentary deals with the capture and decapitation of four US citizens in the town of Falujah and the US army response to these murders.

On the 31st March 2004, 4 US citizens were attacked in their motor vehicle by rpg's as they travelled through Falujah.
The four men were seriously injured - however, these men were
dragged from their vehicle and lynched.
The bodies were burnt and their remains were strung up on a bridge over looking the Euphrates river.
These men were singled out by militants after stories of torture and murder had begun to eminate from the local prison :
ABU GHURAIB : where systematic torture of Iraqi's was atking place.
Further 17 innocent Iraq's civilians were murdered by US troops in
Falujah in April 2003.
Resentment of all things american had been formenting for months.

The reaction to the murder of US citizens was widespread throughout the USA.
On the 5th April Brig.Gen Mark Kimmet said " we will avenge these killings, we will pacify Falujah and we will get thse murderers dead or alive.
WE WILL MAKE EVERY EFFORT TO AVOID CIVILIAN CASUALTIES
AND WE WILL MAKE EVERY EFFORT TO CONDUCT THIS OPERATION
SPEEDILY".
So began a 26 day battle for the control of Falujah.

1300 US Marines surrounded the city of Falujah - population
300,000.
The
The Marines with support from the US army, blockaded all entry and exits from the city in an operation called "Operation Vigilant
Resolve".
The city hospital was cut off from the civilian population because
the US army targetted a district called Jolan.
The Marines called in are support (F16 and F18) and began bombing the district of Jolan in the northwest region of Falujah.
The US began indiscriminate bombing of Jolan :

Motaqa and Ali Abbas "the americans started to bomb the houses
around us. No warning had been given. Our family had to hid - we
did not know who or what the americans were targetting"

Majid Hamid's home was completely destroyed "they bombed our house - my wife and child were killed - look at my wounds" (Majid
takes off his shirt to show extensive burns on his torso)

Twenty six members of the Al-Kamez family were killed when one bomb destroyed their entire home.
Al Jazeera filmed the bodies being placed in to coffins.

4 Hospital theatres - in the hospital on the opposite side of the closed bridges, lay empty while the US bombed Jolan.
The US army refused to allow medical help to enter/leave
Jolan.
Dr.Kamal Al Anni Chief Surgeon Falujah Hospital
"we could not get to the hospital to operate on the wounded or dying. I had to operate on people in their homes - without
anaesthetic. We had many injured people. I contacted the adminstrator at the hospital and asked him to call Mr.Bremer to allow the sick and injured free passage over the bridge to Falujah
hospital. But we did not get permission to evacuate the injured".

Al Jazeera's coverage of the 26 dead members of the Al Kamez
family infuriated Gen Kimmet
When asked about this at their daily press conference on the day after the attack
Kimmet "change the channel. Change the channel : Al Jazeera
is not telling the truth" (Limerickman : sounds just like Zapper,
eh, folks ?).

Al Jazeeras film provoked a response : thousand of people across
Iraq began to donate blood.
In Mosques across Iraq, both Sunni and Shia openly prayed for
a victory.
Sunni and Shia militants joined forces in Falujah to fight back against the US army.
Slowly, the Iraqi militants began to force the USarmy back.
Patrick Graham, a journalist with The Observer came across a group of marines as they retreated.
He says "these marines were petrified" they were saying "we don't know where the fire is coming from".

On April 9th : Kimmet declared that a ceasefire had been agreed.
He was informed by Washington that a ceasefire was to be enforced on the condition that the Al Jazeera reporter who reported the death of the the 26 family members also vacate
Falujah.
Ahmed Massur the reporter concerned did not leave Falujah.
The US agreed to allow civilians to leave Falujah - but as they were doing so, innocent Iraqi's were being fired upon by US snipers.
Dr.Salem Al Aoudi said "as people were leaving Falujah, they were being fired upon by snipers from the US side.
I treated to casualties - one was a 75 year old man - what threat
was he to the US army ?"

On April 26th, the real ceasefore was agreed after US forces failed
to take over Falujah.
The football stadium in Falujah contains some of the dead during the 26 day battle - Clara Sutton counted 248 graves.
36 US marines died during the 26 day battle.
Scores of Iraqi's were injured.

The US forces still haven't found who murdered the four contractors.

Case closed.

 

[Fixey]

Originally posted by zapper

You can’t determine fact from fiction. You state our troops are inferior. You state our troops are dumb and Fixey loves our toys..Well, who do you think operates and repairs “our toys”? Do you know how to forward bias an NPN transistor?

Z

LMAO, you claim to be in the military yet you dont see the differance between a good soldier and a good techie? My god man! I have observed US soldiers on patrol in bush, riffles slung, chatting and chewing gum. If I did any of those 3 I would have had the bosses boot up my butt so fast.......Just bad field craft. Now before you jump on your "Generalisation" bandwagon, US troops are known for there poor discipline and craft at a basic level by most military people I have spoken too, and I have spoken to many of differing ranks and nationality. Alot of ex-service men I have spoken to who served in Vietnam say they where as likely to be killed by Americans as the VC

 

[Fixey]

Zapper kind of proved my point with that last post Lim, couldnt argue fact so he dribbled a bit and attacked you personally.

 

[limerickman]

Originally posted by Fixey
Zapper kind of proved my point with that last post Lim, couldnt argue fact so he dribbled a bit and attacked you personally.

Yes, when the discussion turns to factual data our transatlantic friend adopts the Pavlovian Dog mode and starts barking and foaming and insulting people.

Pavlovian dog's can't help themselves - everytime that bell chimes, they just have to react.
I suspected that this was our friends behaviour earlier, but I gave the Pavlovian dog the benefit of the doubt.
I was wrong.

Pavlov's dog will always, always prove you right, Fixey.

It comes out immediately after someone posts a contradictory view.
It hasn't got the ability to de-program it's natural reaction.
It simply cannot sit and think about what is being said to it.

Just look back st some of the posts :
"An Idiot - Michael Moore" or "I can't be bothered replying to you...." but as ever the Pavlovs dog comes running down the
garden path barking and yelping and snarling to each and every post that takes issue with it's view.

Or how about the classic "ARE WE CLEAR !" AND "YOU ARE A LIAR"
(these classic posts remind me of the scene with Tom Cruise and
Jack Nicholson in the film "A Few Good Men", when Nicholson starts foaming at the mouth in the witness box).

To be perfectly honest with you, I don't post information to these threads to get a reaction from Pavlov's dog.
I know that Pavlov's dog doesn't read and think about what is being said.

I post so that perhaps other american citizens might read the information here and just might say to themselves "perhaps there
is another view concerning Iraq. Maybe, just maybe, Pavlov's dog and his goverment are wrong"
If I can get someone to at least consider another view - I am happy.

In the meantime - Pavlov is watching these threads waiting for another chance to bark, foam and snarl.
Pavlov's dog, just can't help it.

As ever we await the next Pavlovian lecture.

 

[alicem]

Thank you both Fix and Lim

The point I keep stating re M.Moore is that we all need to 'look outside the box' (re and pro)

(WOAH,..’Pav’ woke up due to an American film title and phrases!?!)

I'll give you/him this; he states it as he sees it and that is a valid point. All points are valid, so, shall we go and read them on the yellow brick road?

(~sorry ‘Pav’... slip of the sarcastic k/board.tongue.)

I would be more than happy to really understand where you are coming from. Not the Navy, but YOU. What do YOU think?

Yes, you serve and I admire that (as have said b4) but don't serve without having a mind of your own to question....oops, I just broke it...no one, not you or my Father/Mother/Godparents for e.g can serve without question. If you could you wouldn't be able to! You couldn’t and neither could my family.

Example; have my Mum in Moscow at 21 yrs of age; scared out of her brains; her maid apparently cleaning her teeth with bleach due to poverty whilst she (Mum) was out drinking/partying the best Champers and eating Caviar like it wasn't going to exist tomorrow but then having her flat bugged! ~Heck, if that was me I would be hitting the Vodka!~

How scared was she? A damn sight more scared than she would be if on a ship with you and your colleagues and a ton of missiles. She was in the FIELD, as many of my Godparents and my father were. Bugged, spiked drinks, a maid who for the life of us cannot understand how some one so ‘low down in the USSR train’ could speak fluent English for starters.

Protection, however, from a major ship in the ‘60’s? per chance?. B%llocks. I wish she had that from any troops, even yours, so she didn’t have nightmares to this day at 60 ½.!

So, please don’t give me your ‘Our American Army did this, that and the other; we rule….’. I won’t even start at what we all think of your troops, their conduct, and I hate to say it….but proven behaviour as well. It doesn’t wash, make sense or even convince an Army Brat to go to war; support it, let alone ‘think’ have back up when they don’t from American half assed liars.

Nothing has changed and we are now in another century!!!!!!!!!

Let’s not let sleeping dogs ‘lie’, for a change. Those in the S.I.B (or whatever your term is for the Royal Military Police, Special Investigations Branch in America) would me more than interested to continue viewing your breaches of security. What were those ships again btw?.... OOOOh, yes, I don’t need to ask; you posted them BLANTLY in b/w !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Goodness, you can’t even reply to that or your ‘position’ would be compromised AGAIN wouldn’t it?

I hope for your sake you are lying!


Alice