Is it the Bike or the Rider?

[Frigo's Luggage]

I'll second the motion for black as the new fast...

Black with silver and white lettering on the frame.

Hell. I have a black bike with silver and white lettering...yet I'm not that fast. I guess busting my ass on my trainer is meaningless. In the future, I will just focus my energy on my bike colors.

 

[thebeatcatcher]

It was a decent bike in its time, with a Shimano 600 group and relatively light weight for its time (24-25 lbs.).

I know it's old, but is a Shimano 600 group decent?

As for an on topic post, I'm at the stage where I need to work more on my engine as a rider before a nice bike is going to help me out.

 

[kdelong]

I know it's old, but is a Shimano 600 group decent?

As for an on topic post, I'm at the stage where I need to work more on my engine as a rider before a nice bike is going to help me out.

The later Shimano 600 group is excellent. Shimano 600 and 600EX were the precursers to Shimano Ultegra. Shimano used to use all numbers(with the exception of Dura Ace) but changed over to names in the 1980's and 90's, except for the 105 group. Anyway, the latest 600 components are fairly close to the modern Ultegra. FWIW, I personally thought that the craftsmanship and overall appearance of the 600 was better than the Ultegra. I still use quite a bit of the old Shimano 600 components on my vintage bikes.

 

[thebeatcatcher]

The later Shimano 600 group is excellent. Shimano 600 and 600EX were the precursers to Shimano Ultegra. Shimano used to use all numbers(with the exception of Dura Ace) but changed over to names in the 1980's and 90's, except for the 105 group. Anyway, the latest 600 components are fairly close to the modern Ultegra. FWIW, I personally thought that the craftsmanship and overall appearance of the 600 was better than the Ultegra. I still use quite a bit of the old Shimano 600 components on my vintage bikes.

How do I know if I have the good Shimano 600?

 

[eugkimj]

The later Shimano 600 group is excellent. Shimano 600 and 600EX were the precursers to Shimano Ultegra. Shimano used to use all numbers(with the exception of Dura Ace) but changed over to names in the 1980's and 90's, except for the 105 group. Anyway, the latest 600 components are fairly close to the modern Ultegra. FWIW, I personally thought that the craftsmanship and overall appearance of the 600 was better than the Ultegra. I still use quite a bit of the old Shimano 600 components on my vintage bikes.

You're right, kdelong. I actually have the 600 EX SIS. I think that Shimano changed it to Ultegra 600 initially, then dropped the 600. For me, still works pretty well. I also have the Biopace rings, which I've always gotten a kick out of. I don't know if they do any harm or good.

 

[willocrew]

Hell. I have a black bike with silver and white lettering...yet I'm not that fast. I guess busting my ass on my trainer is meaningless. In the future, I will just focus my energy on my bike colors.

Don't forget the custom disc rear wheel with playboy decals on it.

 

[kdelong]

You're right, kdelong. I actually have the 600 EX SIS. I think that Shimano changed it to Ultegra 600 initially, then dropped the 600. For me, still works pretty well. I also have the Biopace rings, which I've always gotten a kick out of. I don't know if they do any harm or good.

They did make it Ultegra Shimano for only a year or two during the transistion. I still love teh original though. Nearly every bike I own has Biopace chainrings on them, except for my MTB and the granny on one of the road bikes with a triple. I scour eBay weekly to find NOS Biopace rings. The reason that I use them is my left knee. It gets a little sore when I ride round rings but not with the Biopace . For some reason this doesn't happen on the MTB but with the trails that I ride, I'm off the pedals as much as on them.

 

[kdelong]

How do I know if I have the good Shimano 600?

There are a lot of different things to look for. The brakes should be dual pivot brakes. Look at Ultegra Derailers from a couple of years ago. The 600 Derailers should have the same basic shape. Sometimes the 600 components were anodized, usually a grayish-green color, but they were also often left with the natural aluminum finish. A lot of the older 600 components had a stylized arrow design on them. The newer ones don't have this design.

The down side to this is that the Shimano 600 Rear Derailers only have a capacity of up to 7 gears. I tried one with an 8 gear cassette and it would only work on seven of the cogs. No matter how I tried to adjust it, I couldn't get either the first cog or the last cog. This was with both the Hi and Lo screws backed completely out.

 

[Peter Verdesi]

The way I look at things or justify things is to say that if I was to race myself on a $5,000.00 bike or on a $1000.00 bike I would probably be faster on the more expensive bike with less weight and better components. I'm not a pro by any stretch of the imagination but I just got third in my age group at a local triathlon by three seconds. Cheaper bike and I'd be driving home without a medal. Just my two cents.

 

[CAMPYBOB]

$4000 extra for a $6 medal!

I'm in the 'happy medium' class and agree that generally the more expensive machine is a quicker one.

Now frames for racing road and crits with? I view them as expendables. After that very subjective and individual price/performance point...the cheaper the better.

 

[JTE83]

I'd say it's mostly the rider, as Treks have won the TDF many times vs a Cervelo which is a way better bike.

For me my best to worst bikes all gave a corresponding top speed sprint results in the flats with no wind --

2004 Cervelo Soloist Team Ksyrium SLs - 32.9 mph
2005 Kestrel Talon Campy Eurus - 31.5 mph
2002 Giant TCR Aero 2 - 30.5 mph
2004.5 Giant OCR 1 with 2 Jandd panniers (29 lbs) - 29.8 mph
Modified Pacific MTN bike with 2 Jandd panniers & Shimano XT - 27.8 mph

But of course - I was in different form during each top speed result.


2006 Cervelo CF Soloist Team Zipp 404s ergomo pro Zero Gravity Ti Selle Carbon - not tested yet!

 

[Peter Verdesi]

It was actually a $2.00 engraved pint glass.

$4000 extra for a $6 medal!

I'm in the 'happy medium' class and agree that generally the more expensive machine is a quicker one.

Now frames for racing road and crits with? I view them as expendables. After that very subjective and individual price/performance point...the cheaper the better.