Just something for many of you to think about.



C

Complex592

Guest
While I really don't know much about Dr. Andrew Chung but I do know that I
have followed his board postings intermittantly for some time. It seems to me
that the hostility I have seen lately has been totally out of proportion. How
many of you people with so much to say have gone through college, medicial
school, internship and fellowship? How many of you have passed the medical
boards and all the exams that are required to become a cardiolologist. Dr.
Andrew Chung may have chosen for himself a life style that you question..
Maybe it was chosen as a result of life circumstances maybe it was not. I tend
to believe it was a combination of things. Medicine today often is a political
thing. It is who you know, not always what you know and some people can deal
with that better than others. There are people in this world that were born to
smooze their way through anything and there are those that will not bow to if
there is little to bow to. How many of you have never had a postion in which
politics played a part on survival more than skill? How many out there have
never had a negative work experience whether your fault or not your fault?
You bashers out there, What is the saying "He who lives in a glass house should
never through stones." Each of us lives with our own little failures and short
comings.Each of us goes on in the way they can handle. I am not a doctor. I
have attempted to answer questions on arrhythmias and pacemakers. I do not for
one moment consider myself on the level of Dr. Chung. I am a technician with 26
years of experience in arrhythmia interpretation, pacemakers, stress tests,
holter monitors and event monitors. I have worked in the hospital setting. I
have worked in the lab setting. For 26 years I have specialized in just this
one area, the cardiac electrical system. I know from a technical standpoint
more than most. However, never ever do I believe I have the vast knowledge
that Dr. Chung has in relations to the patient and the sum of its parts. He
knows every aspect of the cardiovascular system. All the plumbing as well, Ha
HA. The reponse of that system to circumstances, internal, external, and
changes from other caused by other physiological abnormalites. He knows the
whole body and specializes in the heart and cardiovascular system. If he passed
the boards, schools and programs then he has earned his degree and initials
M.D. and you nasty bashers have no right or reason to belittle him. The fact
stands, he holds the honers and you need to either respect those honors or look
for a new board because there are a lot of sincere people out there that stop
coming to the board because of all that has been posted. Obviously a number of
them do not have a cardiologist that gives them the time that it takes to gain
a complete understanding of problems. Some of them abrupt, some of them above
it all, some of them not capable of explaining in laymans terms. Some just
moving to the next patient fast because of the reimbursment problems and HMO's.
No matter what the reason some of these people need a pat on the back and a
little explanation. I try to do this for my patients and on this board as
well. So does Dr. Chung. How many MDs are on this only cardiology user group
doing the same. None, either they are busy counting their money or out on the
golf course. The other option is that they are burnt out and have enough to
do 23 1/2 hours a day and dont want to spend the last half doing it. I
appreciate that too. That is why we have to make room for the Dr Chungs of the
world. Not attack him for his choices and his promotions. We need him too. We
are not all alike. We are not all cut from the same mold. We have to respect
others for their personal lifestyles without passing judgement.
I hope for those I have responded to this past few months that I have been
helpful in my explanations. I hope that I will have the chance to answer
still more questions in my field of expertise. Good night, friends, foes and
Dr. Chung.
 
[email protected] (Complex592) wrote:


snip

> How many MDs are on this only cardiology user group
>doing the same. None, either they are busy counting their money or out on the
>golf course. The other option is that they are burnt out and have enough to
>do 23 1/2 hours a day and dont want to spend the last half doing it. I
>appreciate that too. That is why we have to make room for the Dr Chungs of the
>world. Not attack him for his choices and his promotions. We need him too. We
>are not all alike. We are not all cut from the same mold. We have to respect
>others for their personal lifestyles without passing judgement.
>I hope for those I have responded to this past few months that I have been
>helpful in my explanations. I hope that I will have the chance to answer
>still more questions in my field of expertise. Good night, friends, foes and
>Dr. Chung.


It would appear to me that the critics that pop up from time to time
with different names and aliases, are probably very unsuccessful,
poorly educated people that resent the fact that Dr Chung is a
Doctor in one of the most demanding specialties in Medicine, something
they could never achieve in two lifetimes. Couple this with the fact
that Doctor Chung takes the time to try and help people that have
questions about their heart Condition, at no charge, this just puts
the "mean people" that visit this newsgroup over the edge.

I think the old Bumper sticker that says " MEAN PEOPLE SUCK" is
highly appropriate for some of the jerks that Troll this newsgroup and
have as their main goal to try and create as much hate and discontent
as possible. Kind of like Newsgroup Terrorists.

Bob
 
Bob Cardone <cardone1!@!mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> [email protected] (Complex592) wrote:
> I think the old Bumper sticker that says " MEAN PEOPLE SUCK" is
> highly appropriate for some of the jerks that Troll this newsgroup and
> have as their main goal to try and create as much hate and discontent
> as possible. Kind of like Newsgroup Terrorists.


Have you noticed that most of the trolling is crossposted to several groups?
The source of most of it is outside this group.

I haven't followed all of it - my killfile is reaching epic proportions! I
do read most of Dr Chung's replies though, so I've seen some of what
has been said. None of it has changed my opinion of Dr Chung in any way
and I would imagine that that is the case for most of the regular readers
of [and posters to] the cardiology group. Having been a victim of trolling
and internet stalking myself I found that the only real way to deal with it
was not to respond. [Take legal action and inform ISPs etc. by all means
but don't respond.] If the troll receives no response whatsoever, either
from the target or from other members of the group, s/he doesn't even know
whether his/her comments have been seen. And it saves an awful lot of
time and grief.

I think trolling on this group is irresponsible and dangerous. People
who may be in life-threatening situations write in with questions and may
not get a response because the group is full of "noise" or because the
person who knew the answer left because of the trolls.

I'd like to thank Dr Chung and the other knowledgeable people who
contribute to this group. I've learned a lot.

And I think I'll leave my sig off this one!!

Anna
 
"Bob Cardone" > wrote in message 4ax.com...
> I think the old Bumper sticker that says " MEAN PEOPLE SUCK" is
> highly appropriate for some of the jerks that Troll this newsgroup and
> have as their main goal to try and create as much hate and discontent
> as possible. Kind of like Newsgroup Terrorists.
>
> Bob


Bob...... i have to agree with you
and where the problem starts is when Chung decides to post his 2 lb diet
drivel on the diabetes newsgroups with his cohort Mu/Roose/Feedrus/whatever
today's name is

then you get this back and forth crossposting with many points of view.....
as soon as someone has a point of view that doesn't agree with "the only
way" of Dr Chung, the flinging starts

if Chung would stop cross posting, and if his cohort would stop the cross
posting, this annual flame fest would soon stop...... it's not beneficial to
EITHER ng
 
"Anna" <[email protected]> wrote:

>
>Bob Cardone <cardone1!@!mindspring.com> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> [email protected] (Complex592) wrote:
>> I think the old Bumper sticker that says " MEAN PEOPLE SUCK" is
>> highly appropriate for some of the jerks that Troll this newsgroup and
>> have as their main goal to try and create as much hate and discontent
>> as possible. Kind of like Newsgroup Terrorists.

>
>Have you noticed that most of the trolling is crossposted to several groups?
>The source of most of it is outside this group.
>
>I haven't followed all of it - my killfile is reaching epic proportions! I
>do read most of Dr Chung's replies though, so I've seen some of what
>has been said. None of it has changed my opinion of Dr Chung in any way
>and I would imagine that that is the case for most of the regular readers
>of [and posters to] the cardiology group. Having been a victim of trolling
>and internet stalking myself I found that the only real way to deal with it
>was not to respond. [Take legal action and inform ISPs etc. by all means
>but don't respond.] If the troll receives no response whatsoever, either
>from the target or from other members of the group, s/he doesn't even know
>whether his/her comments have been seen. And it saves an awful lot of
>time and grief.
>
>I think trolling on this group is irresponsible and dangerous. People
>who may be in life-threatening situations write in with questions and may
>not get a response because the group is full of "noise" or because the
>person who knew the answer left because of the trolls.
>
>I'd like to thank Dr Chung and the other knowledgeable people who
>contribute to this group. I've learned a lot.
>
>And I think I'll leave my sig off this one!!
>
>Anna
>
>



I agree with you, that it is mostly the people crossposting from
other groups. Crossposting is something that most ISPs do not like,
and that is why in the post header there is usually and email address
to report crossposting. All one has to do is copy the post including
all the headers, and paste it in an email and send it to the ISP. Two
or three of those usually results in the ISP canceling the account of
the offender.
>


When I see a person has no more to contribute on this newsgroup,
except negative garbage, I just killfile them . Sometimes the topic
gets so riddled with whining and false accusations that I just
killfile the topic.

You are correct, in not responding, and every once in awhile I fall
into the trap of calling their bluff when they post something that is
totally false. Better off ignoring it .

Bob
 
Very nicely said and exquisitely truthful.

On 01 Sep 2003 01:00:34 GMT, [email protected] (Complex592) wrote:

> While I really don't know much about Dr. Andrew Chung but I do know that I
>have followed his board postings intermittantly for some time. It seems to me
>that the hostility I have seen lately has been totally out of proportion. How
>many of you people with so much to say have gone through college, medicial
>school, internship and fellowship? How many of you have passed the medical
>boards and all the exams that are required to become a cardiolologist. Dr.
>Andrew Chung may have chosen for himself a life style that you question..
>Maybe it was chosen as a result of life circumstances maybe it was not. I tend
>to believe it was a combination of things. Medicine today often is a political
>thing. It is who you know, not always what you know and some people can deal
>with that better than others. There are people in this world that were born to
>smooze their way through anything and there are those that will not bow to if
>there is little to bow to. How many of you have never had a postion in which
>politics played a part on survival more than skill? How many out there have
>never had a negative work experience whether your fault or not your fault?
>You bashers out there, What is the saying "He who lives in a glass house should
>never through stones." Each of us lives with our own little failures and short
>comings.Each of us goes on in the way they can handle. I am not a doctor. I
>have attempted to answer questions on arrhythmias and pacemakers. I do not for
>one moment consider myself on the level of Dr. Chung. I am a technician with 26
>years of experience in arrhythmia interpretation, pacemakers, stress tests,
>holter monitors and event monitors. I have worked in the hospital setting. I
>have worked in the lab setting. For 26 years I have specialized in just this
>one area, the cardiac electrical system. I know from a technical standpoint
>more than most. However, never ever do I believe I have the vast knowledge
>that Dr. Chung has in relations to the patient and the sum of its parts. He
>knows every aspect of the cardiovascular system. All the plumbing as well, Ha
>HA. The reponse of that system to circumstances, internal, external, and
>changes from other caused by other physiological abnormalites. He knows the
>whole body and specializes in the heart and cardiovascular system. If he passed
>the boards, schools and programs then he has earned his degree and initials
>M.D. and you nasty bashers have no right or reason to belittle him. The fact
>stands, he holds the honers and you need to either respect those honors or look
>for a new board because there are a lot of sincere people out there that stop
>coming to the board because of all that has been posted. Obviously a number of
>them do not have a cardiologist that gives them the time that it takes to gain
>a complete understanding of problems. Some of them abrupt, some of them above
>it all, some of them not capable of explaining in laymans terms. Some just
>moving to the next patient fast because of the reimbursment problems and HMO's.
> No matter what the reason some of these people need a pat on the back and a
>little explanation. I try to do this for my patients and on this board as
>well. So does Dr. Chung. How many MDs are on this only cardiology user group
>doing the same. None, either they are busy counting their money or out on the
>golf course. The other option is that they are burnt out and have enough to
>do 23 1/2 hours a day and dont want to spend the last half doing it. I
>appreciate that too. That is why we have to make room for the Dr Chungs of the
>world. Not attack him for his choices and his promotions. We need him too. We
>are not all alike. We are not all cut from the same mold. We have to respect
>others for their personal lifestyles without passing judgement.
>I hope for those I have responded to this past few months that I have been
>helpful in my explanations. I hope that I will have the chance to answer
>still more questions in my field of expertise. Good night, friends, foes and
>Dr. Chung.
 
"Variations On Mu" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Very nicely said and exquisitely truthful.
>
> On 01 Sep 2003 01:00:34 GMT, [email protected] (Complex592) wrote:
>
> > While I really don't know much about Dr. Andrew Chung but I do know

that I
> >have followed his board postings intermittantly for some time. It seems

to me
> >that the hostility I have seen lately has been totally out of proportion.


Message to Chung:

You're an idiot and a quack. There's no way you should be giving any type of
medical advice. That's why you don't have access to a hospital, and why you
were fired in Florida. This is also why you troll usenet for unsuspecting
"patients". I've also heard that you bought your credentials on the
internet. Shame on you.

Very nicely said and exquisitely truthful.
 
The only problem I see is that Doctor Chung is a Cardiologist, Dr
Mirkin is not. When we are talking about problems with someone's
Cardio system, I would tend to believe Dr Chung much more than Dr
Mirkin. Everyone that reads this newsgroup is must be aware of having
a family doctor refer you to a Cardiologist when it is apparent that
you have some Cardio issue. Why would you trust what a Doctor in
another specialty would tell you regarding heart problems over a
Cardiologist. It's like asking a Urologist for information and
treatment of a possible Brain Tumor.

Bob




[email protected] (Brad Sheppard) wrote:

>I like Dr. Chung's advice on medical issues and think he is very
>knowledgable. When he touts to his 2 pound diet I find it annoying.
>I don't find Dr. Chung to be as cutting edge as Dr. Gabe Mirkin, who
>spends many hours a day scouring medical research journals. Dr. Chung
>didn't find anything wrong with my sister's high resting heart rate -
>yet research quoted by Dr. Mirkin showed a resting heart rate over 83
>triples your chances of CHD in the next five years.
>
>[email protected] (Complex592) wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
>> While I really don't know much about Dr. Andrew Chung but I do know that I
>> have followed his board postings intermittantly for some time. It seems to me

snip
 
In article <[email protected]>, Variations On
Mu <[email protected]> wrote:

> Very nicely said and exquisitely truthful.
>
> On 01 Sep 2003 01:00:34 GMT, [email protected] (Complex592) wrote:
>
> > While I really don't know much about Dr. Andrew Chung but I do know that I
> >have followed his board postings intermittantly for some time. It seems to
> >me
> >that the hostility I have seen lately has been totally out of proportion.


Dear "Vari"
Let's assume Andrew is as cute as his picture, surpasses Mensa
standards in intelligence, keeps patient's hearts from beating faster
etc. etc. and on to sainthood (God Bless)

His personal saga has no place on ASD.

His advice, suggestions, 2PD info are suitable topics but what is
beginning to seem like the longest running feud since the hatfields and
McCoys is getting old.

Please for the umpteenth time, keep it off this group.

--
Diva in Distress
******************
Looking for a Drop in the Bucket (size of my rear end)
 
Anyone wanting to speak with Chung can go to his web page and do so. It
is clear he continues to post out of spite, ego, and wanting to avoid
losing face. For the most part his behavior has put him outside of the
pale of anyone to consider for consultation. I shudder to think his
personal behavior is a measure of his professional judgement and practice.
He has failed in a shameful manner which disqualifies him for medical
anything. If there is any reason to judge someone a failure in these ways
it is our dear Chung who heads the pack. There have been too many false
personalities, sock puppets, spiteful tactics, and other such disgraceful
web behaviors. If he comes and ask in a sincere manner for us to overlook
his past behaviors, then perhaps we can give him a fresh start and clean
his name from the list of shame. That some others have acted poorly is no
reprieve for him and judging him is by his displayed behavior.
 
Carol Frilegh <[email protected]> wrote:

>In article <[email protected]>, Variations On
>Mu <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Very nicely said and exquisitely truthful.
>>
>> On 01 Sep 2003 01:00:34 GMT, [email protected] (Complex592) wrote:
>>
>> > While I really don't know much about Dr. Andrew Chung but I do know that I
>> >have followed his board postings intermittantly for some time. It seems to
>> >me
>> >that the hostility I have seen lately has been totally out of proportion.

>
>Dear "Vari"
>Let's assume Andrew is as cute as his picture, surpasses Mensa
>standards in intelligence, keeps patient's hearts from beating faster
>etc. etc. and on to sainthood (God Bless)
>
>His personal saga has no place on ASD.
>
>His advice, suggestions, 2PD info are suitable topics but what is
>beginning to seem like the longest running feud since the hatfields and
>McCoys is getting old.
>
>Please for the umpteenth time, keep it off this group.


Why do you keep crossposting to the Cardio group. pray tell? Put a lid
on the Crossposting Lady!!!!

Bob
 
Troll Alert ( sound of siren)

Arm Kill Filter

Activate

Ploink





[email protected] wrote:

>Anyone wanting to speak with Chung can go to his web page and do so. It
>


snip of trash
 
On Mon, 01 Sep 2003 20:45:50 -0400, Carol Frilegh <[email protected]>
wrote:

>Dear "Vari"
>Let's assume Andrew is as cute as his picture, surpasses Mensa
>standards in intelligence, keeps patient's hearts from beating faster
>etc. etc. and on to sainthood (God Bless)
>
>His personal saga has no place on ASD.


Neither does yours but you seem damn certain to post it.
 
Tiger Lily wrote:

> "Bob Cardone" > wrote in message 4ax.com...
> > I think the old Bumper sticker that says " MEAN PEOPLE SUCK" is
> > highly appropriate for some of the jerks that Troll this newsgroup and
> > have as their main goal to try and create as much hate and discontent
> > as possible. Kind of like Newsgroup Terrorists.
> >
> > Bob

>
> Bob...... i have to agree with you
> and where the problem starts is when Chung decides to post his 2 lb diet
> drivel on the diabetes newsgroups with his cohort Mu/Roose/Feedrus/whatever
> today's name is
>
> then you get this back and forth crossposting with many points of view.....
> as soon as someone has a point of view that doesn't agree with "the only
> way" of Dr Chung, the flinging starts
>
> if Chung would stop cross posting, and if his cohort would stop the cross
> posting, this annual flame fest would soon stop...... it's not beneficial to
> EITHER ng


Sorry, I don't initiate cross-posts, Ms. Tiger Lilly.

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/
 
X-No-Archive: yes

re-read...... Mu/Feedrus/Roose/name of the day initiates the
crossposting.... then you reply to ALL of the newsgroups.... next thing we
have our annual flame fest going

it's Sept..... does this mean Mu will quietly go away again like last year??


"Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <[email protected]> wrote in
message.com...

> Sorry, I don't initiate cross-posts, Ms. Tiger Lilly.
>
> --
> Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
> Board-Certified Cardiologist
> http://www.heartmdphd.com/
>
>
 
[email protected] (Complex592) wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> While I really don't know much about Dr. Andrew Chung but I do know that I
> have followed his board postings intermittantly for some time. It seems to me
> that the hostility I have seen lately has been totally out of proportion. How
> many of you people with so much to say have gone through college, medicial
> school, internship and fellowship? How many of you have passed the medical
> boards and all the exams that are required to become a cardiolologist. Dr.
> Andrew Chung may have chosen for himself a life style that you question..
> Maybe it was chosen as a result of life circumstances maybe it was not. I tend
> to believe it was a combination of things. Medicine today often is a political
> thing. It is who you know, not always what you know and some people can deal
> with that better than others. There are people in this world that were born to
> smooze their way through anything and there are those that will not bow to if
> there is little to bow to. How many of you have never had a postion in which
> politics played a part on survival more than skill? How many out there have
> never had a negative work experience whether your fault or not your fault?
> You bashers out there, What is the saying "He who lives in a glass house should
> never through stones." Each of us lives with our own little failures and short
> comings.Each of us goes on in the way they can handle. I am not a doctor. I
> have attempted to answer questions on arrhythmias and pacemakers. I do not for
> one moment consider myself on the level of Dr. Chung. I am a technician with 26
> years of experience in arrhythmia interpretation, pacemakers, stress tests,
> holter monitors and event monitors. I have worked in the hospital setting. I
> have worked in the lab setting. For 26 years I have specialized in just this
> one area, the cardiac electrical system. I know from a technical standpoint
> more than most. However, never ever do I believe I have the vast knowledge
> that Dr. Chung has in relations to the patient and the sum of its parts. He
> knows every aspect of the cardiovascular system. All the plumbing as well, Ha
> HA. The reponse of that system to circumstances, internal, external, and
> changes from other caused by other physiological abnormalites. He knows the
> whole body and specializes in the heart and cardiovascular system. If he passed
> the boards, schools and programs then he has earned his degree and initials
> M.D. and you nasty bashers have no right or reason to belittle him. The fact
> stands, he holds the honers and you need to either respect those honors or look
> for a new board because there are a lot of sincere people out there that stop
> coming to the board because of all that has been posted. Obviously a number of
> them do not have a cardiologist that gives them the time that it takes to gain
> a complete understanding of problems. Some of them abrupt, some of them above
> it all, some of them not capable of explaining in laymans terms. Some just
> moving to the next patient fast because of the reimbursment problems and HMO's.
> No matter what the reason some of these people need a pat on the back and a
> little explanation. I try to do this for my patients and on this board as
> well. So does Dr. Chung. How many MDs are on this only cardiology user group
> doing the same. None, either they are busy counting their money or out on the
> golf course. The other option is that they are burnt out and have enough to
> do 23 1/2 hours a day and dont want to spend the last half doing it. I
> appreciate that too. That is why we have to make room for the Dr Chungs of the
> world. Not attack him for his choices and his promotions. We need him too. We
> are not all alike. We are not all cut from the same mold. We have to respect
> others for their personal lifestyles without passing judgement.
> I hope for those I have responded to this past few months that I have been
> helpful in my explanations. I hope that I will have the chance to answer
> still more questions in my field of expertise. Good night, friends, foes and
> Dr. Chung.




Paragraphs are your friend =)
 
Carol Frilegh <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<020920031744500753%[email protected]>...

>
> The saga I refer to is the ongoing insults and counter insults not his
> medical advice.


I think we should all be on a 'diet' the way we feel to be. No insults,
no criticizing about what we feel is right for us or wrong for our neighbor.
I got carried away with someone a few weeks ago and ended up calling her
an unneccessary nasty name. Uh uh. It's not needed.
 
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Regards,

Jeff Owens
 
Tiger Lily wrote:

> X-No-Archive: yes
>
> re-read...... Mu/Feedrus/Roose/name of the day initiates the
> crossposting....


Lately it hasn't been Mu.

>


> then you reply to ALL of the newsgroups.... next thing we
> have our annual flame fest going


Not, all.

>
>
> it's Sept..... does this mean Mu will quietly go away again like last year??
>


Wouldn't know.


--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/
 
Carol Frilegh wrote:

> The saga I refer to is the ongoing insults and counter insults not his
> medical advice.
>


Who've I insulted?

>
> Progress, suggestions and support are welcome here for me personally
> and I am grateful for all the 2PD info, but the Pasotrio stuff, no
> thanks.


Ok, I have called Mr. Pastorio a "chef."

Is that what you mean by "insult?"

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/