- Thread starter millzebub
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Ok. So the weight is attached to the existing flywheel, huh? I had it wrong there duhhh...Well, none the less, that is good. No new calculations needed! Great!! Thanks!!frenchyge said:Adding weight to the existing flywheel should not change the resistance curve of the unit.

ok. After thinking on this, which may be the problem I am confused. If you add weight to the flywheel, you need more power to attain the same mph you would achieve without it, right? Shouldn't that change the mph readings and the power output that corresponds with it?millzebub said:Ok. So the weight is attached to the existing flywheel, huh? I had it wrong there duhhh...Well, none the less, that is good. No new calculations needed! Great!! Thanks!!

"The Pro Machine was designed specifically for use with the extra weight of the optional 12 lb. flywheel. Because of the extra weight, it requires a bigger 16mm shaft (versus the 12mm of the Road Machine) and also the Pro Machine’s 16 mm shaft is threaded to accept the attachment bolt to hold the 12 lb. flywheel in place."

"It’s the fluid chamber alone that provides the resistance and so the resistance does not change, even with the additional 12 lb. flywheel. The extra weight of the 12 lb. flywheel is only designed to make the ride even smoother and to replicate the outdoor road ride. Because the fluid chamber alone provides the resistance, there is no need to recalibrate the Kinetic PC when using either just the 6 lb. permanent flywheel or the additional 12 lb. flywheel."

Formula 5.244820x + .019168x^3

17mph=183.33w

17.1mph=185.53w

17.2mph=187.74w

17.3mph=189.98w

17.4mph=192.23w

17.5mph=194.51w

17.6mph=196.80w

17.7mph=199.12w

17.8mph=201.46w

17.9mph=203.81w

18mph=206.19w

18.1mph=208.59w

18.2mph=211.01w

18.3mph=213.45w

18.4mph=215.91w

18.5mph=218.39w

18.6mph=220.89w

18.7mph=223.42w

18.8mph=225.96w

18.9mph=228.53w

19mph=231.12w

19.1mph=233.73w

19.2mph=236.36w

19.3mph=239.02w

19.4mph=241.70w

19.5mph=244.40w

19.6mph=247.12w

19.7mph=249.86w

19.8mph=252.63w

19.9mph=255.42w

20mph=258.24w

20.1mph=261.07w

20.2mph=263.93w

20.3mph=266.81w

20.4mph=269.72w

20.5mph=272.65w

20.6mph=275.60w

20.7mph=278.58w

20.8mph=281.58w

20.9mph=284.60w

21mph=287.65w

21.1mph=290.72w

21.2mph=293.82w

21.3mph=296.94w

21.4mph=300.09w

21.5mph=303.26w

21.6mph=306.45w

21.7mph=309.67w

21.8mph=312.92w

21.9mph=316.19w

22mph=319.48w

22.1mph=322.80w

22.2mph=326.15w

22.3mph=329.52w

22.4mph=332.92w

22.5mph=336.34w

22.6mph=339.79w

22.7mph=343.26w

22.8mph=346.76w

22.9mph=350.29w

23mph=353.84w

23.1mph=357.42w

23.2mph=361.03w

23.3mph=364.66w

23.4mph=368.32w

23.5mph=372.01w

23.6mph=375.72w

23.7mph=379.46w

23.8mph=383.23w

23.9mph=387.03w

24mph=390.85w

24.1mph=394.70w

24.2mph=398.58w

24.3mph=402.48w

24.4mph=406.42w

24.5mph=410.38w

24.6mph=414.37w

24.7mph=418.39w

24.8mph=422.44w

24.9mph=426.51w

25mph=430.62w

25.1mph=434.75w......Lance Armstrong FTP maybe

25.2mph=438.91w

25.3mph=443.10w

25.4mph=447.32w

25.5mph=451.57w

25.6mph=455.85w

25.7mph=460.16w

25.8mph=464.49w

25.9mph=468.86w

26mph=473.26w

millzebub said:ok. After thinking on this, which may be the problem I am confused. If you add weight to the flywheel, you need more power to attain the same mph you would achieve without it, right? Shouldn't that change the mph readings and the power output that corresponds with it?

Do you have any numbers for the Clydesdale unit. I bought one, but can not even find it on the Kinetic Website. Google only find those for sale. No info.wiredued said:

Looks Identical to the standard. I assume the internals have been changed to simulate a heavier rider.

wiredued said:http://www.kurtkinetic.com/faq.php

"The Pro Machine was designed specifically for use with the extra weight of the optional 12 lb. flywheel. Because of the extra weight, it requires a bigger 16mm shaft (versus the 12mm of the Road Machine) and also the Pro Machine’s 16 mm shaft is threaded to accept the attachment bolt to hold the 12 lb. flywheel in place."

"It’s the fluid chamber alone that provides the resistance and so the resistance does not change, even with the additional 12 lb. flywheel. The extra weight of the 12 lb. flywheel is only designed to make the ride even smoother and to replicate the outdoor road ride. Because the fluid chamber alone provides the resistance, there is no need to recalibrate the Kinetic PC when using either just the 6 lb. permanent flywheel or the additional 12 lb. flywheel."

Formula 5.244820x + .019168x^3

17mph=183.33w

17.1mph=185.53w

17.2mph=187.74w

17.3mph=189.98w

17.4mph=192.23w

17.5mph=194.51w

17.6mph=196.80w

17.7mph=199.12w

17.8mph=201.46w

17.9mph=203.81w

18mph=206.19w

18.1mph=208.59w

18.2mph=211.01w

18.3mph=213.45w

18.4mph=215.91w

18.5mph=218.39w

18.6mph=220.89w

18.7mph=223.42w

18.8mph=225.96w

18.9mph=228.53w

19mph=231.12w

19.1mph=233.73w

19.2mph=236.36w

19.3mph=239.02w

19.4mph=241.70w

19.5mph=244.40w

19.6mph=247.12w

19.7mph=249.86w

19.8mph=252.63w

19.9mph=255.42w

20mph=258.24w

20.1mph=261.07w

20.2mph=263.93w

20.3mph=266.81w

20.4mph=269.72w

20.5mph=272.65w

20.6mph=275.60w

20.7mph=278.58w

20.8mph=281.58w

20.9mph=284.60w

21mph=287.65w

21.1mph=290.72w

21.2mph=293.82w

21.3mph=296.94w

21.4mph=300.09w

21.5mph=303.26w

21.6mph=306.45w

21.7mph=309.67w

21.8mph=312.92w

21.9mph=316.19w

22mph=319.48w

22.1mph=322.80w

22.2mph=326.15w

22.3mph=329.52w

22.4mph=332.92w

22.5mph=336.34w

22.6mph=339.79w

22.7mph=343.26w

22.8mph=346.76w

22.9mph=350.29w

23mph=353.84w

23.1mph=357.42w

23.2mph=361.03w

23.3mph=364.66w

23.4mph=368.32w

23.5mph=372.01w

23.6mph=375.72w

23.7mph=379.46w

23.8mph=383.23w

23.9mph=387.03w

24mph=390.85w

24.1mph=394.70w

24.2mph=398.58w

24.3mph=402.48w

24.4mph=406.42w

24.5mph=410.38w

24.6mph=414.37w

24.7mph=418.39w

24.8mph=422.44w

24.9mph=426.51w

25mph=430.62w

25.1mph=434.75w......Lance Armstrong FTP maybe

25.2mph=438.91w

25.3mph=443.10w

25.4mph=447.32w

25.5mph=451.57w

25.6mph=455.85w

25.7mph=460.16w

25.8mph=464.49w

25.9mph=468.86w

26mph=473.26w

Ergoman said:The numbers you list below match the table provided on the Kurt Kinetic website, but don't seem to match the formula. For example, I get 185.84 watts when I use the formula for 17 mph. Which do you suppose is correct?

jetnjeff said:Do you have any numbers for the Clydesdale unit. I bought one, but can not even find it on the Kinetic Website. Google only find those for sale. No info.

Looks Identical to the standard. I assume the internals have been changed to simulate a heavier rider.

I like the smaller flywheel cause I have to make my spin smooth. Not the flywheel. I would think the power curve during accelerations and decelerations would be different with different flywheel weights, but same at steady state.

So the heavier flywheel might fell more real during sprints and such for a big guy.

I am not so concerned about that though.

wiredued said:Sorry I don't know anything about that unit... BTW what is the flywheel weight on the Clydesdale?

Flywheels store energy, they don't increase frictional losses or other energy loss terms the way a fan (air resistance), fluid resistance unit(similar to air resistance but more so) or electrical resistance unit does. Yep, you have to put some energy into accelerating a flywheel but that energy is returned when you coast. At steady state the power required to turn the resistance unit / flywheel combo is the same but smoother than the same system with a smaller or lower mass (really lower moment of inertia) flywheel.millzebub said:...I am confused. If you add weight to the flywheel, you need more power to attain the same mph you would achieve without it, right? Shouldn't that change the mph readings and the power output that corresponds with it?

So to answer your questions, the watts vs mph readings from your KK or other trainer won't change with a larger flywheel in ways that you can measure. The larger flywheel will just smooth out the irregularites of your pedal stroke by coasting through the dead spots better. If you could make very fast micro power measurements you'd see it takes additional energy to initially accelerate the larger flywheel but you'd get that energy back by maintaining wheel speed when you coasted saving you the effort of accelerating the system again to make up for the lost speed. In general you won't see these differences during acceleration for reasonably sized flywheels because the moment of inertia is still relatively small and cyclometers and power meters only sample so often and usually average their displays a bit to reduce erratic readings. IOW the additonal moment of inertia is small enough that you still acellerate the trainer fairly fast and the averaging/sampling rate of the cycling computers make it hard to see the micro differences during that period of acceleration.

-Dave

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