knee pain

Discussion in 'General Fitness' started by hintofsmile, Dec 30, 2005.

  1. spodosaurus

    spodosaurus Guest

    hintofsmile wrote:
    > spodosaurus wrote:
    >
    >>See a rheumatologist. A chiropractor could do a lot more harm than just
    >>lightening your wallet.

    >
    >
    > Thanks. I'll look into that. I actually did see my general physician
    > at first. He was the one who sent me to the orthopedist, who,
    > dumbstruck by my symptoms, refered me to a physical therapist.


    GPs generally aren't very good with strange chronic joint/back problems.
    Orthopods are great for surgical fixes and such, but also not very good
    if the problem doesn't show up on films. I find that rheumatologists,
    especially those with a sports medicine background, can handle these
    sorts of things pretty well, referring you to an orthopaedic surgeon
    when/if there's a possible surgical solution to the issue. That said,
    I've heard about a 70:30 ratio of good to bad stories with
    rheumatlogists, so you may have to shop around. The first one I saw was
    great, and also a sports medicine specialist working with Australia's
    professional athletes and olympians (which is probably why I have to pay
    a significant out of pocket gap every time I see him).

    cheers,

    Ari



    --
    spammage trappage: remove the underscores to reply

    I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
    neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
    hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
    marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
    transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
    http://www.abmdr.org.au/
    http://www.marrow.org/
     


  2. JMW

    JMW Guest

    "David" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >So I take this kind of warning seriously i.e. he did say "one
    >should become familiar with Ohio criminal statutes on Telecommunications
    >Harassment and Coercion" Sounds like serious stuff, criminal and all


    As a public service to those who wish to conform their conduct to the
    law:

    http://tinyurl.com/dxp4p
    http://tinyurl.com/8ed6q
     
  3. spodosaurus

    spodosaurus Guest

    [email protected] wrote:
    > Where did all this negative crap come from? Every profession has its
    > jerks and losers, but dont put all of us in here!


    I didn't, but your profession needs to seriously tighten up its
    accreditation. The reputation as snake oil salesmen that you have has
    been EARNED. As I said, I found one good one out of my experiences and
    all the combined experiences of family and friends.

    > You wouldnt dare tell this BS to the lady with the aortic aneurism,


    So you got lucky (as did the lady...more or less) and saw an abdominal
    aortic aneurism. That isn't rocket science.

    > and
    > the lady with the Cardiac Condition (SubclavianSteal) I diagnosed in my
    > office on Tuesday. Thats just 2 patients one day.
    >
    > And Spodosaurus, did you know that Essentials Of Skeletal Radiology
    > was written by a DC, and is used in most Med Schools and Teaching
    > Hospitals?
    >


    So you're claiming to be a radiologist or at the very least claiming
    that all chiropractors have the same qualifications to read x-rays as
    real medical doctors?

    > Did you also know that we REGULARLY receive direct referrals from
    > PCPs, Neurolgists and Neurosurgeons, serve on the staff of many
    > hospitals,


    And there are homeopaths and other charlatans that get money from people
    for medical woes because snake oil can still be peddled to people who
    are scared and in pain.

    > write texts, do research.


    Have you heard the expression "don't believe everything you read"? There
    are "texts" and "research" out there to back up the claims of every type
    of snake oil salesman. Would you like to try and get us all in on an MLM
    scheme to sell tahitian noni juice while you're here?


    >
    > Oh, BTW, the feds are now studying (with grant$) the remarkable
    > results with some learning disabled and ADHD children.


    So you're claiming to adjust the fused skull bones of children, like the
    cult quack who I mentioned earlier?

    > Should I go on?
    > The bottom line is a bad doc is a bad doc, no matter what their degree.


    You are NOT an MD, and you do not have the training of an MD. That's
    just a fact, and the rigour under which they trained and you trained are
    very different. Like I said at the beginning, your profession needs to
    tighten up who it lets loose on the public.

    Cheers,

    Ari



    --
    spammage trappage: remove the underscores to reply

    I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
    neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
    hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
    marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
    transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
    http://www.abmdr.org.au/
    http://www.marrow.org/
     
  4. Curt James

    Curt James Guest

  5. Curt James

    Curt James Guest

    David <[email protected]> wrote:

    >"Curt James" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >> David <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>
    >>>I phoned the court house in Wooser and tried to
    >>>talk to a guy called Martin Frantz to get some more
    >>>info. He had already gone home but they said I
    >>>could try again on Tuesday. Just trying to get
    >>>clarification as apparently this is Ohio law we are
    >>>talking about. So will check this thing out as I am
    >>>a little concerned

    >>
    >> Me too. Ask Franz about my membership kit. I mean, I'm a
    >> T-t-t-t-t-t-t-t-rrrrrock'nRRRRROOOOOLLLLLL!!!!!!! I deserve over-nite
    >> delivery, right? I wonder what Ohio law says about that.
    >>
    >> Could you ping me with Marty's phone number?

    >
    >
    >330-2623030 Martin Frantz is the chief prosecutor - fax is - Fax
    >330-2875412
    >
    >The receptionist over there is pretty cool - we had a little chat - she gave
    >me a bit of an insight. Interesting.
    >
    >[......]
    >> Good luck on your trip, David!

    >
    >Thanks!


    Cool. Still, I'm giving the membership kit a few days to reach me
    before making the call. I mean, I ~*KNOW*~ he has my address. <snerk>

    --
     
  6. Curt James

    Curt James Guest

    spodosaurus <[email protected]_yahoo_.com> wrote:
    <snip>
    >You are NOT an MD, and you do not have the
    >training of an MD. That's just a fact, and the rigour
    >under which they trained and you trained are very
    >different.

    <snip>

    Looks like Hanson is not the only overwrought person in MFW.

    >Cheers,


    Right. Chew him a new one and then offer your fake *Cheers*.

    >Ari
    >

    <snip>
    ><snip>Complications in hospital


    But it wasn't a chiropractor, though, was it?

    --
     
  7. spodosaurus

    spodosaurus Guest

    Curt James wrote:
    > spodosaurus <[email protected]_yahoo_.com> wrote:
    > <snip>
    >
    >>You are NOT an MD, and you do not have the
    >>training of an MD. That's just a fact, and the rigour
    >>under which they trained and you trained are very
    >>different.

    >
    > <snip>
    >
    > Looks like Hanson is not the only overwrought person in MFW.
    >


    Convenient how you snipped the bit where he refers to himself as a
    'doc', when the connotations associated with that term do not apply.
    That's a troll tactic, curt, but I guess you couldn't mask your true
    colours for very long.

    >
    >>Cheers,

    >
    >
    > Right. Chew him a new one and then offer your fake *Cheers*.
    >


    Again, you've deliberately excluded the entirety of the post, but we all
    know you'd much rather have this be acrimonious than civil. John
    Williams and I don't agree on a great many things, but you've proven his
    point for him: you're a troll.

    >
    >>Ari
    >>

    >
    > <snip>
    >
    >><snip>Complications in hospital

    >
    >
    > But it wasn't a chiropractor, though, was it?


    No, I would never trust a chiropractor to perform surgery on anyone,
    especially not me! And the situation was caused by politicians and
    bureaurats, not doctors, but for a troll such facts shouldn't get in the
    way, right curt?

    Cheers,

    Ari


    --
    spammage trappage: remove the underscores to reply

    I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
    neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
    hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
    marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
    transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
    http://www.abmdr.org.au/
    http://www.marrow.org/
     
  8. hintofsmile

    hintofsmile Guest

    Curt James wrote:
    > I'm same height and weight. Are you all legs or, like me, all torso? I
    > imagine that having really long legs would make deadlifting a pain in
    > the neck (or shins moreso).


    I'm more legs than torso. Yes, deadlifting is very difficult for me.
    I often did the sumo deadlift instead, which put less pressure on my
    lower back, but more on my knees.

    > Well, how severe is this pain? If you've stopped lifting completely,
    > is it due to holiday laziness, a too busy schedule or because the pain
    > has been that severe? If it's due to the pain level then certainly
    > check out a regular family doctor type and see what recommendation
    > they would have.


    The pain isn't severe, but making the trip to the gym would definitely
    aggravate it. It's not so much the pain that keeps me from exercising
    as much as it's the weakness in my legs and their unsteadiness.

    I haven't mentioned this, but *all* of my limbs now quiver and spasm
    when I use them. For example, my hand tends to jerk randomly whenever
    I write, making my recent handwriting quite messy. I just became aware
    that this may be related to my spine.

    > Franco Columbu (ol' Ah-nuld's training buddy from back in the day and
    > a doctor of chiropractic, by the way) stated in one of his books that
    > most can tell the difference between /general muscle soreness/ pain
    > and /damn-what-did-I-destroy-now?/ pain. If you're suffering from
    > general pain then suck it up as soon as possible and get back in the
    > gym - yes, working around the painful parts, but continuing to work
    > out. Seriously, best of luck with your training! And please report
    > back regarding your progress.


    Thanks; will do.
     
  9. hintofsmile

    hintofsmile Guest

    spodosaurus wrote:
    > X-rays belong to the patient. If the chiro is holding them, and his
    > 'report', he's trying to hide that he is completely unqualified to order
    > and review x-rays.


    The x-rays was shot in his office, so he could say that they belong to
    him. I'll try asking him again.


    > > Here's a bit from
    > > http://www.ncsu.edu/policies/student_services/student_health/REG11.45.6.php
    > >
    > > "Written authorization for release of information, including releasing
    > > diagnostic tests to outside ordering physicians must be requested from
    > > the patient. Possible uses of the information should be explained to
    > > the patient. It should be explained to the patient that granting
    > > consent is strictly on a voluntary basis."
    > >
    > > /ncsu.edu
    > >

    >
    > These are for medical notes and such, x-rays are patient property and
    > the patient's responsibility. Also, a chiro is NOT a physician!


    Thanks, Ari. That info will help a lot when I ask him again for my
    films.
     
  10. spodosaurus

    spodosaurus Guest

    hintofsmile wrote:
    > spodosaurus wrote:
    >
    >>X-rays belong to the patient. If the chiro is holding them, and his
    >>'report', he's trying to hide that he is completely unqualified to order
    >>and review x-rays.

    >
    >
    > The x-rays was shot in his office, so he could say that they belong to
    > him. I'll try asking him again.


    I wonder if this is standard practice for chiropractors? A real doctor,
    such as a radiologist, gives you the films and the report. They don't
    hide their work from other health professionals.

    >
    >>>Here's a bit from
    >>>http://www.ncsu.edu/policies/student_services/student_health/REG11.45.6.php
    >>>
    >>>"Written authorization for release of information, including releasing
    >>>diagnostic tests to outside ordering physicians must be requested from
    >>>the patient. Possible uses of the information should be explained to
    >>>the patient. It should be explained to the patient that granting
    >>>consent is strictly on a voluntary basis."
    >>>
    >>>/ncsu.edu
    >>>

    >>
    >>These are for medical notes and such, x-rays are patient property and
    >>the patient's responsibility. Also, a chiro is NOT a physician!

    >
    >
    > Thanks, Ari. That info will help a lot when I ask him again for my
    > films.
    >


    You may also wish to make a complaint to your relvant local business
    authority. I doubt complaining to any chiropractic professional
    association would do much good, sadly. It would be extraordinarilly
    irresponsible for him to cause you to have to have further radiation
    exposure due to his failure to give you the product (x-ray films) that
    you paid him for.

    Ari

    --
    spammage trappage: remove the underscores to reply

    I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
    neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
    hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
    marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
    transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
    http://www.abmdr.org.au/
    http://www.marrow.org/
     
  11. spodosaurus

    spodosaurus Guest

    hintofsmile wrote:

    > The pain isn't severe, but making the trip to the gym would definitely
    > aggravate it. It's not so much the pain that keeps me from exercising
    > as much as it's the weakness in my legs and their unsteadiness.
    >
    > I haven't mentioned this, but *all* of my limbs now quiver and spasm
    > when I use them. For example, my hand tends to jerk randomly whenever
    > I write, making my recent handwriting quite messy. I just became aware
    > that this may be related to my spine.
    >


    I'm not going to say what this sounds like, assuming this is a chronic
    problem that isn't just the result of some short term fatigue or stress.
    See a doctor please. The knee pain may be unrelated to the shakiness
    you're experiencing.

    Ari

    --
    spammage trappage: remove the underscores to reply

    I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
    neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
    hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
    marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
    transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
    http://www.abmdr.org.au/
    http://www.marrow.org/
     
  12. "hintofsmile" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    >
    >> If you'll forgive a simple but hopefully very effective suggestion, try
    >> putting your knee through a full range of motion for reps every day, even
    >> more than once a day. Something like bodyweight squats, either
    >> flat-footed
    >> or up on your toes at the bottom, but full range - thighs resting on
    >> calves.
    >> Be sure your knees and feet track in the same direction, and see if a few
    >> days of this - build up gradually, of course - doesn't make you feel
    >> better.
    >> One of the biggest reasons for joint problems is lack of use, such as you
    >> describe following injury.
    >>
    >> -S-
    >> http://www.kbnj.com

    >
    > Thanks for the suggestion. It *did* occur to me that the weakness in
    > my legs is from lack of use. But going full range (thighs on calves),
    > in my current condition will definitely be painful on the knees. I've
    > tried. Still, I'll try building gradually.


    In addition to Curt's and Seth's good suggestions, you might also consider
    one of my favorites - lay on your back and do pretend bicycling motions.
    Put the knee through the full range of motion - push down leading with your
    heel to fully straighten, and come up to your chest only as high as is
    comfortable - that end of the ROM will increase with more regular use.

    A great book on this subject is Pavel's "Super Joints" - see
    http://www.kbnj.com/sj.htm for more.

    -S-
    http://www.kbnj.com
     
  13. Curt James

    Curt James Guest

    Ari <[email protected]_yahoo_.com> wrote:

    >Convenient how you snipped the bit where he refers to himself as a
    >'doc', when the connotations associated with that term do not apply.


    Doctor of chiropractic
    <http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rls=GGLG,GGLG:2005-29,GGLG:en&q=doctor+of+chiropractic>
    is a term I've read and heard more than once, Ari. And snipping all
    but the relevant bits IS both convenient and a Usenet norm.

    >That's a troll tactic, curt,


    No. It's a Usenet /tactic/ or accepted convention, ari.

    http://www.netmeister.org/news/learn2quote2.html#ss2.1

    >you'd much rather have this be acrimonious than civil.


    As I believe I've stated elsewhere in this ng, it does take two to
    argue. What would you rather have this be, Ari?

    "Cheer!"

    --
    Curt
    http://curtjames.com/
     
  14. spodosaurus

    spodosaurus Guest

    The Queen of Cans and Jars wrote:

    > (My problem wasn't so much my neck as the fact that my skull had shifted
    > off the atlas


    Seeing as you're not dead, I'd very much like to see those x-ray films.
    That's a higher up injury that Christopher Reeves had, and yet you're
    not on a ventillator!




    --
    spammage trappage: remove the underscores to reply

    I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
    neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
    hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
    marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
    transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
    http://www.abmdr.org.au/
    http://www.marrow.org/
     
  15. spodosaurus <[email protected]_yahoo_.com> wrote:

    > The Queen of Cans and Jars wrote:
    >
    > > (My problem wasn't so much my neck as the fact that my skull had shifted
    > > off the atlas

    >
    > Seeing as you're not dead, I'd very much like to see those x-ray films.
    > That's a higher up injury that Christopher Reeves had, and yet you're
    > not on a ventillator!


    Come on over and take a look at them. But if you're going to insist on
    being such a know-it-all asshole about it, don't expect me to give you a
    cup of coffee or anything.
     
  16. spodosaurus

    spodosaurus Guest

    Curt James wrote:
    > Ari <[email protected]_yahoo_.com> wrote:
    >
    >
    >>Convenient how you snipped the bit where he refers to himself as a
    >>'doc', when the connotations associated with that term do not apply.

    >
    >
    > Doctor of chiropractic
    > <http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rls=GGLG,GGLG:2005-29,GGLG:en&q=doctor+of+chiropractic>
    > is a term I've read and heard more than once,


    I've heard lots of people who are not medical doctors or academics call
    themselves doctors, capitalising on the connotations that go along with
    that term. Mouth breathers might fall for it, but not the rest of us.

    Ari


    --
    spammage trappage: remove the underscores to reply

    I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
    neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
    hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
    marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
    transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
    http://www.abmdr.org.au/
    http://www.marrow.org/
     
  17. spodosaurus

    spodosaurus Guest

    The Queen of Cans and Jars wrote:
    > spodosaurus <[email protected]_yahoo_.com> wrote:
    >
    >
    >>The Queen of Cans and Jars wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>>(My problem wasn't so much my neck as the fact that my skull had shifted
    >>>off the atlas

    >>
    >>Seeing as you're not dead, I'd very much like to see those x-ray films.
    >>That's a higher up injury that Christopher Reeves had, and yet you're
    >>not on a ventillator!

    >
    >
    > Come on over and take a look at them. But if you're going to insist on
    > being such a know-it-all asshole about it, don't expect me to give you a
    > cup of coffee or anything.
    >


    Knowing about injuries involving the atlas or axis certainly does not
    qualify anyone to be labelled a "know-it-all". Can you scan these images
    and post them on a website? I don't drink coffee anyway :p~~~ :)

    --
    spammage trappage: remove the underscores to reply

    I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
    neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
    hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
    marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
    transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
    http://www.abmdr.org.au/
    http://www.marrow.org/
     
  18. spodosaurus <[email protected]_yahoo_.com> wrote:

    > The Queen of Cans and Jars wrote:
    > > spodosaurus <[email protected]_yahoo_.com> wrote:
    > >
    > >
    > >>The Queen of Cans and Jars wrote:
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>>My problem wasn't so much my neck as the fact that my skull had shifted
    > >>>off the atlas
    > >>
    > >>Seeing as you're not dead, I'd very much like to see those x-ray films.
    > >>That's a higher up injury that Christopher Reeves had, and yet you're
    > >>not on a ventillator!

    > >
    > >
    > > Come on over and take a look at them. But if you're going to insist on
    > > being such a know-it-all asshole about it, don't expect me to give you a
    > > cup of coffee or anything.
    > >

    >
    > Knowing about injuries involving the atlas or axis certainly does not
    > qualify anyone to be labelled a "know-it-all". Can you scan these images
    > and post them on a website?


    Nope.

    Why did you not bother to respond to my point that my "real" doctors
    never showed me my x-rays (let alone gave them to me) whereas the
    chiropractor did? I know you have a raging hard-on for the world of
    chiropractic, but are you really so stupid that you can't admit there
    might be a chiropractor out there who's not scamming his patients?
     
  19. Curt James

    Curt James Guest

    Ari <[email protected]_yahoo_.com> wrote:

    >Knowing about injuries involving the atlas or axis
    >certainly does not qualify anyone to be labelled a
    >"know-it-all".


    Does not qualify anyone to be labeled an asshole either.

    And yet you are.

    Hnh.

    --
    Curt
    http://curtjames.com/
     
  20. Curt James

    Curt James Guest

    Ari <[email protected]_yahoo_.com> wrote: (snipped here and there)

    re the fact that there are /good/ chiropractors

    >Funny how people keep missing the fact that
    >I've acknowledged that point REPEATEDLY.


    People keep missing that, eh?

    Is that ALL people or just some?

    >Either there's a pocket of people with reading
    >disabilities on MFW, or


    Or...

    http://groups.google.com/group/misc.fitness.weights/msg/d0a6eed0941556f3

    Specifically: "Although Ari and - was it ATP*? - offered a caveat,
    something like, /not all chiropractors are bad/ it was rather weak.
    I'd say not at all balanced (or even nuanced!), imo."

    So, Ari, do you count yourself among that potential pocket of people
    with reading disabilities on MFW? I'll give you an out: Perhaps you
    skipped that post.

    *Cheers!*

    --
    Curt
    http://curtjames.com/
     
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