Lance Armstrong Won't Fight Usada Charges

[oldbobcat]

Originally Posted by CAMPYBOB .


[SIZE= 14px]Damn! That Deming cat must be one o' them thar filibusterers![/SIZE]

[SIZE= 14px]Y'all hate away. Ima just going to keep laughing at the whole spectacle.[/SIZE]

[SIZE= 14px]Yay sport![/SIZE]

Must be nice living in a black and white world.

Yeah, Lance will never lose his fanboys. But long ago he lost the respect of those who admired his athletic performances and strove to withhold judgement until the evidence was in. I guess it takes a real man to remain an unconditional admirer and fan of a cheat, liar, hypocrite, and bully. I admire your steadfastness and loyalty.

 

[CAMPYBOB]

Must be nice living in a black and white world.

It is.

Yeah, Lance will never lose his fanboys. But long ago he lost the respect of those who admired his athletic performances and strove to withhold judgement until the evidence was in. I guess it takes a real man to remain an unconditional admirer and fan of a cheat, liar, hypocrite, and bully. I admire your steadfastness and loyalty.

Thanks!

Like Deming said...not enough evidence to write a parking ticket. The ex-fed prosecutor must be a steadfastly loyal fanboy. Certainly not a real man.

 

[CAMPYBOB]

Pat is very angry by all accounts. Or so he says.

He did not sound angry to me in reading the transcript of the video interview. At least he got a ride in and it's good to hear Mr. **** Pound is also working hard to keep cycling pure.

It's everyman for himself now, Bob.

Agreed. The cream will rise to the top.

 

[CAMPYBOB]

[COLOR= rgb(24, 24, 24)]is that bruce deming, former federal prosecutor and currently an ambulance chaser? [/COLOR]

A great man and noted author too! Interested in helping minority/immigrant cyclists against the eeevils brought about by the dastardly SUV! Whaddaguy!

http://www.brucedeming.com/blog/northern-virginia-cyclist-struck-and-killed-by-suv.cfm

Damned dollar-mongering attorneys! Helping motorcyclists and bicyclists get justice!

And...he goes after those eeevil oil companies! Bonus!

[FONT= 'Trebuchet MS']His service as a former federal prosecutor litigating billion dollar cases by the U.S. Government against major oil companies and his extensive experience in both state and federal appellate courts is brought to bear in every case.[/FONT]

Yeah, I'll take his opinion over yours every time. C'mon, lay some Latin on us. That will impress.

Fabiani might need a guy on staff with some inside time in the DOJ! I'm smelling civil suit! Livestrong could end up with millions of research dollars! Deming knows they couldn't make a yellow curb violation stick against Cancer Jesus.

But, let's not get side tracked here like socialist Bidenboy did last night. Back to our soap opera, "Haterz gonna hate".

 

[limerickman]

Originally Posted by CAMPYBOB .

Pat is very angry by all accounts. Or so he says.

He did not sound angry to me in reading the transcript of the video interview. At least he got a ride in and it's good to hear Mr. **** Pound is also working hard to keep cycling pure.

He didn't sound angry to you /img/vbsmilies/smilies/biggrin.gif

You didn't read the deposition transcript. Or if you did you're ignoring the facts (but given your track record, ignoring the facts is par for the course with ye).

And I am -- I get angry, and I'm very angry. And I told my federations this morning that I am angry because of this whole -- this whole thing.
Not talking about the merits of the case, or anything like that, but the mere fact that if these allegations, and we're talking, still, and everybody needs to understand, we're still
talking about allegations which haven't been, you know, haven't been shown or haven't even been reviewed by any independent tribunal. USADA are the only people that have -- that have handled this so far. No independent tribunal has even reviewed these allegations. So we're talking about allegations. But if everything is true, or a large part of it is true, what are in those allegations and what are in, you know, in the statements and the books and so forth have so far been coming out, then I have to be very, very angry that at the time when we were post-Festina and all that happened with the Festina affair, that guys were still going out and trying to beat the system.

 

[limerickman]

Originally Posted by CAMPYBOB .

[COLOR= rgb(24, 24, 24)]is that bruce deming, former federal prosecutor and currently an ambulance chaser? [/COLOR]

A great man and noted author too! Interested in helping minority/immigrant cyclists against the eeevils brought about by the dastardly SUV! Whaddaguy!

http://www.brucedeming.com/blog/northern-virginia-cyclist-struck-and-killed-by-suv.cfm

Damned dollar-mongering attorneys! Helping motorcyclists and bicyclists get justice!

And...he goes after those eeevil oil companies! Bonus!

[FONT= 'Trebuchet MS']His service as a former federal prosecutor litigating billion dollar cases by the U.S. Government against major oil companies and his extensive experience in both state and federal appellate courts is brought to bear in every case.[/FONT]

Yeah, I'll take his opinion over yours every time. C'mon, lay some Latin on us. That will impress.

Fabiani might need a guy on staff with some inside time in the DOJ! I'm smelling civil suit! Livestrong could end up with millions of research dollars! Deming knows they couldn't make a yellow curb violation stick against Cancer Jesus.

But, let's not get side tracked here like socialist Bidenboy did last night. Back to our soap opera, "Haterz gonna hate".

Seeing as you're resorted to trying to redeem your hero's reputation with the views and opinions of non-entities (see above).

I see Sean Yates is running away as fast as he can from this mess.

[COLOR= rgb(40, 40, 40)]“It’s all pretty damning for Lance and the whole history of his seven Tour wins and beyond,” Yates admitted. “My opinion is one of disappointment and slightly upset, really. I’m shocked at the depth of the whole system, as it’s been called. I worked with Lance but never had any inclination this type of practice was going on.[/COLOR]
“I was with Lance in 2005, for his last Tour win. Before that I was working with another team. I’d turn up, I’d drive the car in the Tour de France, and I never ever saw an indication of anything dodgy going on. I used to jump out in the morning, go out on my bike, go back, drive the car, and call the tactics now and then, but I never saw anything that was untoward.
“I knew him from when he was young and he became world champion. I just believed he was a physically superior being, and therefore that’s why he was winning. He was also very, very determined and this damning report bears that out in varying degrees. My job was to make sure that the guys performed on the road, and did the right thing on the road. It was not to do with their training or anything else.”

 

[ambal]

Like Bob, i'm still a believer. I'm expecting some real proof to make it's way into the public arena. I seriously doubt that anyone who has suffered from cancer would risk their life by taking performance enhancing drugs.

 

[CAMPYBOB]

[COLOR= rgb(24, 24, 24)]Like Bob, i'm still a believer.[/COLOR]

[COLOR= rgb(24, 24, 24)]I believe I'll have a beer![/COLOR]




I worked with Lance but never had any inclination this type of practice was going on.

I was with Lance in 2005, for his last Tour win. Before that I was working with another team. I’d turn up, I’d drive the car in the Tour de France, and I never ever saw an indication of anything dodgy going on.
I used to jump out in the morning, go out on my bike, go back, drive the car, and call the tactics now and then, but I never saw anything that was untoward.

Weird. I thought he was going to provide some actual evidence of Lancer's doping.
I hope Travis T. Tygart gets this all down in the interrogation room.

[COLOR= rgb(24, 24, 24)]Seeing as you're resorted to trying to redeem your hero's reputation with the views and opinions of non-entities (see above).[/COLOR]
[COLOR= rgb(24, 24, 24)]Lance is a hero to millions of people. I admire what he has accomplished. His reputation is what it is and that can vary widely from one person to another. There is nothing I could do, even if I wanted to...which I do not...to either redeem or defame Lancer's reputation. I simply report the facts. A job similar to that performed by Travis T. Tygart. Except I stick to the facts.[/COLOR]

 

[CAMPYBOB]

He didn't sound angry to you

No. He 'said' he was angry, but he did not read like he was angry.

You didn't read the deposition transcript.

Yes sir, I did.

Or if you did you're ignoring the facts (but given your track record, ignoring the facts is par for the course with ye).

Travis T. Tygart must be rubbing off on me. I need a shower.

I'll be back in 20 minutes.

 

[limerickman]

Originally Posted by CAMPYBOB .



I worked with Lance but never had any inclination this type of practice was going on.

I was with Lance in 2005, for his last Tour win. Before that I was working with another team. I’d turn up, I’d drive the car in the Tour de France, and I never ever saw an indication of anything dodgy going on.
I used to jump out in the morning, go out on my bike, go back, drive the car, and call the tactics now and then, but I never saw anything that was untoward.

Weird. I thought he was going to provide some actual evidence of Lancer's doping.
I hope Travis T. Tygart gets this all down in the interrogation room.

Yates doesn't know what he saw or didn't see at this point. Have you seen the state of Yates these days? /img/vbsmilies/smilies/biggrin.gif

He can barely utter a coherent sentence. If you lived on this side of the world you'd have seen a series about the SKY cycling team called "Road to Glory".
Yates looks like a physical wreak. And the eyes in his head /img/vbsmilies/smilies/biggrin.gif

 

[limerickman]

Originally Posted by CAMPYBOB .

No. He 'said' he was angry, but he did not read like he was angry.

So Pat lied in that deposition?
Pat's either angry (as he said) or he's not angry (as you claim). You have evidence other than the deposition showing that Pat isn't angry?

 

[jpwkeeper]

Originally Posted by alienator .


I can't see that happening and I don't think it would be a good idea. It's certainly not in the spirit of cycling. The racing should be about winning based on your effort and your exertion and not about what chemical you used to raise your hematocrit, to speed your recovery, or any such thing. The calculator is not a good analogy IMHO, because many problems can't be done in the time a test takes without using a calculator. You don't use calculators on a test to find a solution for a technique you learned by employing that same technique on a calculator. Moreover, cycling shouldn't be about who has the funds to buy the best doping. Regarding people with naturally low hematocrit or similar issues, I think that governing bodies should have a list of approved doctors from which to choose that a rider can see to be examined in order to get a TUE for medication. At the same time, there are some illnesses/diseases for which riding within the rules might not be possible. FWIW, I'd be surprised if there were many pro cyclists with low hematocrit. That would tend to be a barrier to achieving success in cycling.

I understand where you're coming from with the spirit of cycling, and I agree with you in principal, but the line is, unfortunately, fuzzy.

My wife was surprised that riders can practically mainline Caffine during rides when she saw a rider drinking a Coke. I'm sure a lot of riders use high-end supplements as well.

Cost still comes into play without doping. Riders who can afford top medical trainers who can constantly monitor their bodies and tune their training to a fine edge I think have a bigger advantage over average riders who dope.

I do agree it shouldn't be about who has the funds to buy the best doping, but you could also argue that doping is so expensive because it's illegal. Doctors don't get trained on it, so there are very few who do it, and those who do it are always taking legal risks.

So I'm not saying legalize it, but maybe if the fuzzy line were moved a bit, so doping didn't provide a 1% advantage, but a .1% advantage, guys would be much less likely to do it and would be unable to rely on it so much to win.

 

[steve]

Originally Posted by limerickman .

I see Sean Yates is running away as fast as he can from this mess.

I would also put my running shoes on and run as far away as I can. The problem I have with Yates is he rode in the 90's....like most from that generation, they should just STFU.

Would anyone seriously believe;

Quote: Yates “It’s all pretty damning for Lance and the whole history of his seven Tour wins and beyond,” Yates admitted. “My opinion is one of disappointment and slightly upset, really. I’m shocked at the depth of the whole system, as it’s been called. I worked with Lance but never had any inclination this type of practice was going on. “I was with Lance in 2005, for his last Tour win. Before that I was working with another team. I’d turn up, I’d drive the car in the Tour de France, and I never ever saw an indication of anything dodgy going on. I used to jump out in the morning, go out on my bike, go back, drive the car, and call the tactics now and then, but I never saw anything that was untoward. “I knew him from when he was young and he became world champion. I just believed he was a physically superior being, and therefore that’s why he was winning. He was also very, very determined and this damning report bears that out in varying degrees. My job was to make sure that the guys performed on the road, and did the right thing on the road. It was not to do with their training or anything else.”


He thinks people are idiots, I guess he's lucky he isn't an american rider.

 

[CAMPYBOB]

Quote: [COLOR= rgb(24, 24, 24)]Pat's either angry (as he said) or he's not angry (as you claim).[/COLOR]



[COLOR= rgb(24, 24, 24)]He did not read like he was angry. Maybe the video would show his anger. If we could see the spittle hitting the the camera lens we would have some evidence of anger.[/COLOR]

[COLOR= rgb(24, 24, 24)]Right now, I'm leaning towards a preventative measure anger management course and a back-dated suspension from giving depositions. And a newer, better test for detecting anger.[/COLOR]

 

[limerickman]

Originally Posted by steve .
I would also put my running shoes on and run as far away as I can. The problem I have with Yates is he rode in the 90's....like most from that generation, they should just STFU.

Yates rode for Motorola 1992-1996 with Armstrong and was managed by Jim O.

/img/vbsmilies/smilies/biggrin.gif

 

[CAMPYBOB]

Quote: "Finally, the last thing I’ll say to the people who don’t believe in cycling, the cynics and the sceptics: I'm sorry for you. I’m sorry that you can’t dream big. I'm sorry you don't believe in miracles." "And there are no secrets — this is a hard sporting event and hard work wins it. "


Lance E. Gunderson

Miracles. Believe in them.

And don't be keeping no secrets from da Easter Bunny.

 

[slovakguy]

Originally Posted by CAMPYBOB .

[COLOR= rgb(24, 24, 24)]is that bruce deming, former federal prosecutor and currently an ambulance chaser? [/COLOR]

A great man and noted author too!

[FONT= 'Trebuchet MS']His service as a former federal prosecutor litigating billion dollar cases by the U.S. Government against major oil companies and his extensive experience in both state and federal appellate courts is brought to bear in every case.[/FONT]

Yeah, I'll take his opinion over yours every time. C'mon, lay some Latin on us. That will impress.

wow, bobbo! here you are being so broad-minded! you heart a government lawyer. not just any government lawyer, but one who prosecuted big oil! and not just any big oil, but prosecuted...prosecuted some firm or other...for, um, like, um, a BILLION! dollars! What details! no, wait, more like, what details? i did a search for his government career on the web and could only find one mention of him in a government case--against certainteed for an oil subsidy for the astonishing amount of eight hundred thousand dollars u s! oh the shock! a lawyer embellishing his c v to impress potential clients! you can really pick 'em, bobbo.

tu est magnus fossor ani!

 

[alienator]

On a slightly different note......what will befall Livestrong, and is there/will there be justification for the government to investigate the nature Armstrong's dealings with Livestrong, financial and otherwise? Livestrong has reported an increase in donations over the course of this USADA/Armstrong saga. The increase is curious and at the same time, not so surprising. After all, there's no shortage of Americans similar to those still supporting Armstrong, i.e. Americans that lack critical thinking skills, Americans that hate Europeans, Americans who think the French have a national agenda to take down Armstrong, NASCAR fans, ....

 

[lance_armstrong]

This whole affair reminds me of the time, twenty years ago, when my wife and I found our six year old daughter standing in our smoke-filled dining room, holding a box of matches in her hand. On the wall next to her were several strike marks from the matches, and some smoldering wall paper. I didn't need a forensic expert to tell me what happened. Nonetheless, the first words out of her mouth were "A bat did it. A bat flew in through the window and started lighting matches." It was such an outrageous lie, that I was speechless for a few seconds. Did she actually expect her parents to accept such a preposterous explanation for what happened? What was more amazing to me was that she held on to that lie, even under the threat of greater punishment. She really believed that if she stuck to her guns, and cried a river of tears, we would eventually come to accept her story, no matter how crazy it all sounded. It took my wife and I several hours to break her resolve, but she finally admitted what she did. All of this from a six year old child.

Over a dozen years ago, with Festina still ripe in our memories, Lance Armstrong began what I believe to be the biggest lie in sports history. Like my six year old daughter, he fabricated a tale of deceit, and stuck to his guns until the bitter end. Even worse, he enlisted an army of conspirators (by coercion, bribery, bullying, etc.) to protect the unbelievable lie, inevitably dragging everyone down with him. I'm worried now that the UCI will concoct an unbelievable lie of it's own to protect it's sorry backside. They have 21 days to respond to the USADA's report. After listening to Pat McQuaid, I got the sense that maybe they feel like all is not lost, and that maybe there's still some wiggle room to get out of this thing. I haven't seen enough of him to get a good read of what makes him tick, so I'm really hoping that he's not entertaining some get out of jail free scenario for the UCI. That's what really scares me - one more big lie. Cycling can't afford it anymore.

 

[CAMPYBOB]

This could be bigger than Y2K!!!


Quote: wow, bobbo! here you are being so broad-minded!


[COLOR= rgb(24, 24, 24)]Always. Thank you![/COLOR]

[COLOR= rgb(24, 24, 24)]Funny how Rudy P. is now claiming he's a small fish and Jan was innocent (er...the product of the East German Doping...er...Sports System?)...and the fight on the various forums over Jan's purported innocence is even funnier than the wailing buckets proclaiming Lancer's guilt.[/COLOR]

[COLOR= rgb(24, 24, 24)]Laughs galore![/COLOR]