Landis goes Postal
- Thread starter Cobblestones
- Start date
limerickman said:I remember watching the so-called "miracle stage" as Landis ****** away from the field and it was around the time we had the annual influx of American xenophobes.
That very day, I told the cretins that Flandis had doped and naturally our friends took umbrage because we're just "haters"
I must dig out that post.
... and here I was thinking that you had a new found respect (page 1 of this thread) for the perjurist, liar and a cheat.
I guess if you'd take oh, 2 minutes, to actually recall what happened on that stage you'd know that Floyd lost time to the group containing the other favorites on 3 of the 5 climbs. Most of the time taken was on the first col (col des saises) as everyone had pretty much written him off. No surprise there. There aint too many guys that can stick with Floyd on the descents however, which is where he recovered all of the time lost on subsequent climbs.
Inhuman riding from Floyd or bad tactics from the rest of the field? I'd say the latter.
None of the data available shows an average power for any of the climbs at over 395watts, even for the first climb of the day - which puts him at ~ 5.8w/kg - good for a Domestic Pro but hardly earth shattering for an Internationally recognised pro like Landis. This compares with what Vaughters said about Van der Velde during his breakthrough Tour - ie he never went over a sustained 6w/kg during any road stage in the mountains.
Compare that to Armstrongs' 495 watts at the end of the final Dauphine mountain stage in 2003 - not the best numbers he's recorded, apparently. Now, those are some numbers which 'may' suggest something untoward going on beyond a steroid patch or a shot of whiskey.
Contador's ride on Verbier is said, by people not looking for journalistic merit, to be ~450watts.
swampy1970 said:... and here I was thinking that you had a new found respect (page 1 of this thread) for the perjurist, liar and a cheat.
I guess if you'd take oh, 2 minutes, to actually recall what happened on that stage you'd know that Floyd lost time to the group containing the other favorites on 3 of the 5 climbs. Most of the time taken was on the first col (col des saises) as everyone had pretty much written him off. No surprise there. There aint too many guys that can stick with Floyd on the descents however, which is where he recovered all of the time lost on subsequent climbs.
Inhuman riding from Floyd or bad tactics from the rest of the field? I'd say the latter.
None of the data available shows an average power for any of the climbs at over 395watts, even for the first climb of the day - which puts him at ~ 5.8w/kg - good for a Domestic Pro but hardly earth shattering for an Internationally recognised pro like Landis. This compares with what Vaughters said about Van der Velde during his breakthrough Tour - ie he never went over a sustained 6w/kg during any road stage in the mountains.
Compare that to Armstrongs' 495 watts at the end of the final Dauphine mountain stage in 2003 - not the best numbers he's recorded, apparently. Now, those are some numbers which 'may' suggest something untoward going on beyond a steroid patch or a shot of whiskey.
You left out the bit where the previous, landis was sweating like a turkey approaching X-Mas day and lost a huge amount of time.
Point is, his performance was called that day as a doping performance that would resonate for years to come.
nns1400 said:It was great to watch, but yeah, how many times did they (during coverage) say "unbelievable!!" That's become our buzzword at home watching "incredible" and "miraculous" racing performances...yeah...UNbelievable.
After that stage, I too raised an eyebrow and thought, well I hope he didn't "do" something. It was disappointing but not surprising when he got busted. Blaming it on a shot of whiskey...also unbelievable.
Guess I'm a hater too, Lim.
But it was still a great stage and watching him divebomb those hills was pretty exciting at the time.
We're all haters
Can someone refresh my memory? Was it the day before that he suffered in the mountains then suddenly the next day he gained 30 minutes.limerickman said:
coneofsilence said:
Landis lost 8mins on stage 16 2006 TDF Bourg d'Oisans - La Toussuire stage.
It was a mountainous stage and it was extremely warm - and Landis was clearly having a bad day.
He crossed the finishing line with sweat literally rolling off him.
The commentators stated that Landis who had been in 4th place on GC before the start of stage 16, had dropped to 11th place on GC.
The following day, St.-Jean-de-Maurienne - Morzine stage 17, Landis went on a solo 120km break and moved back up to 3rd place
only a minute or so off the 1st place.
landis was tested after the stage and was found to have a testosterone level 400% higher than his usual reading (T/E should be 3;1, landis reading was 12/1, from memory).
This is what a Lemond had to say about Landis:
"I believe most of Floyd Landis’s statements regarding the systemic corruption in professional cycling. I imagine from my own experiences that today he is paying a heavy price for his honesty and I support Floyd in his attempt to free himself from his past. I hope that others- fans, riders and sponsor’s embrace this as an opportunity to bring about positive change in the sport."
Considering how Landis treated Lemond a couple of years ago (the sexual abuse thing, etc), this statement from Lemond shows that he is a real gentleman who has no hate.
Read more here:
Floyd Landis Admits Doping and Alleges Use by Others Greg Lemond
"I believe most of Floyd Landis’s statements regarding the systemic corruption in professional cycling. I imagine from my own experiences that today he is paying a heavy price for his honesty and I support Floyd in his attempt to free himself from his past. I hope that others- fans, riders and sponsor’s embrace this as an opportunity to bring about positive change in the sport."
Considering how Landis treated Lemond a couple of years ago (the sexual abuse thing, etc), this statement from Lemond shows that he is a real gentleman who has no hate.
Read more here:
Floyd Landis Admits Doping and Alleges Use by Others Greg Lemond
nns1400 said:
That is true to an extent, because Landis was dead and buried judging previous stage.
The peloton let him get away, probably thinking that he would come back eventually.
Problem was, he didn't!
I wouldn't say peloton let him get away.limerickman said:
Phonak prepared launching pad for him in typical fashion. Others couldn't respond to that and needed some time to recuperate. Several riders (not enough for the whole day adventure) followed him for a very short time and decided to wait for help. Caisse led the chase mostly (that's the part of the reason why those several riders were pulled back- they were from Caisse), with Pereiro in the yellow jersey. Pereiro wasn't in great form and generally isn't as good climber as Landis was, so the pace was by Pereiro's measure - slower than Landis'. Landis gained time on the first climb and descents. He payed for his early attack by suffering alone on rest of the climbs failing to gain more time, although he looked in control.
Edit:
That stage was so entertaining that even a man, who's hard core fan of everything where Serbia is involved and hard core hater of everything where isn't, was thrilled.
A truly memorable ride, even if it was tainted. One of the best rides I've ever seen, and I've been watching cycling since the 80s.limerickman said:
Also, I don't think the field could have done anything about it. Noone who could have hung with him on the first climb could have hung with him the rest of the way. So maybe he didn't set any speed records on the later climbs. It was the ride as a whole that was so special.
Too bad about how it all turned out.
I have to notice how activity on the forum has increased since this thread started. Doping and scandal will bring more audience than races. I think that know organizers of big races too.
Regarding stage 17 in the 2006 Tour, Landis was charged and was charged to make up lost time. But he provided to us great entertainment. Riders today are also charged, but none of them dares to do something similar. It would be great if Vinokourov would lose time on Sunday and had to try something similar on, let's say, stage 19 to Aprica over Mortirolo. I've intentionally picked Vino and Mortirolo, symbolics would be complete.
Stage 20 would be great too. With all climbs over 2000 meters high and very long, with Cima Coppi (charge included in epics) and anniversary, but it's too much to expect before time trial.
Regarding stage 17 in the 2006 Tour, Landis was charged and was charged to make up lost time. But he provided to us great entertainment. Riders today are also charged, but none of them dares to do something similar. It would be great if Vinokourov would lose time on Sunday and had to try something similar on, let's say, stage 19 to Aprica over Mortirolo. I've intentionally picked Vino and Mortirolo, symbolics would be complete.
Stage 20 would be great too. With all climbs over 2000 meters high and very long, with Cima Coppi (charge included in epics) and anniversary, but it's too much to expect before time trial.
