Lane seeding

Discussion in 'General Fitness' started by Micheal Artinda, Feb 21, 2004.

  1. I know lane 4 is suposeded to be fore the fastest swimmer. what is the order from lane 4 to 8 that
    should be used for fastest to slowest?

    Does it realy matter what lane you are in?
     
    Tags:


  2. M. W. Smith

    M. W. Smith Guest

    On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 00:19:02 -0500, Micheal Artindale
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    > I know lane 4 is suposeded to be fore the fastest swimmer. what is the order from lane 4 to 8 that
    > should be used for fastest to slowest?
    >
    > Does it realy matter what lane you are in?

    Nowadays, I think it makes no difference in terms of turbulence, given the improvements in laneline
    and gutter technology. The outer lanes should have lanelines on both sides. What is important is to
    be able to see the other swimmers, so being in the middle is better from that point of view.

    martin

    --
    If you are a US citizen, please use your constitutional right to vote, because we badly need a new
    president.
     
  3. Diablo

    Diablo Guest

    are you asking the lane assignments according to seed for top 8? if so, 1-8th is lnes
    4,5,3,6,2,7,1,8 respectively in an 8 lane pool.

    as for does it make a difference, yes, it makes a huge difference. while some technology these days
    combats it, there is still an appreciable effect.

    case in point, had a meet at UIC in Chicago last weekend, (which is the venue for the Speedo
    Sectional - Central meet)...all of my swimmers picked up time in lane 8 and 1 (especially 8 with
    that damn stupid bulkhead), while they held their times in other lanes. only newer pools are really
    equipped to handle wash, and even they don't do a perfect job. if you'sa in an outside, lane, you'sa
    might have some trouble.

    Steve

    "Micheal Artindale" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > I know lane 4 is suposeded to be fore the fastest swimmer. what is the order from lane 4 to 8 that
    > should be used for fastest to slowest?
    >
    > Does it realy matter what lane you are in?
     
  4. de Valois

    de Valois Guest

    diablo left this mess on Sun, 22 Feb 2004 09:08:26 -0600 for The Way to clean
    up:
    >
    >
    >are you asking the lane assignments according to seed for top 8? if so, 1-8th is lnes
    >4,5,3,6,2,7,1,8 respectively in an 8 lane pool.
    >
    >as for does it make a difference, yes, it makes a huge difference. while some technology these days
    >combats it, there is still an appreciable effect.
    >
    >case in point, had a meet at UIC in Chicago last weekend, (which is the venue for the Speedo
    >Sectional - Central meet)...all of my swimmers picked up time in lane 8 and 1 (especially 8 with
    >that damn stupid bulkhead), while they held their times in other lanes. only newer pools are really
    >equipped to handle wash, and even they don't do a perfect job. if you'sa in an outside, lane,
    >you'sa might have some trouble.
    >

    Personally, I've always questioned this development in pool technology. What's the incentive in
    swimming faster qualifying times if there's no real physical advantage in lanes 3,4, & 5 (other than
    sighting other swimmers)? You *ought* to pay a price to be stuck in 1&8.

    Tao te Carl "It takes a village to have an idiot." - Carl (c) 2003

    (Kudos to Cap'n Jim Wyatt for this link) BEFORE you ask a dumb-ass question
    here...http://www.speakeasy.org/~neilco/bart.gif
     
  5. M. W. Smith

    M. W. Smith Guest

    On 22 Feb 2004 15:00:32 -0800, de Valois <[email protected]>
    wrote:

    > diablo left this mess on Sun, 22 Feb 2004 09:08:26 -0600 for The Way to clean up:
    >>
    >>
    >> are you asking the lane assignments according to seed for top 8? if so, 1-8th is lnes
    >> 4,5,3,6,2,7,1,8 respectively in an 8 lane pool.
    >>
    >> as for does it make a difference, yes, it makes a huge difference. while some technology these
    >> days combats it, there is still an appreciable effect.
    >>
    >> case in point, had a meet at UIC in Chicago last weekend, (which is the venue for the Speedo
    >> Sectional - Central meet)...all of my swimmers picked up time in lane 8 and 1 (especially 8 with
    >> that damn stupid bulkhead), while they held their times in other lanes. only newer pools are
    >> really equipped to handle wash, and even they don't do a perfect job. if you'sa in an outside,
    >> lane, you'sa might have some trouble.
    >>
    >
    > Personally, I've always questioned this development in pool technology. What's the incentive in
    > swimming faster qualifying times if there's no real physical advantage in lanes 3,4, & 5 (other
    > than sighting other swimmers)? You *ought* to pay a price to be stuck in 1&8.

    The incentive is to get into the finals.

    martin

    --
    If you are a US citizen, please use your constitutional right to vote, because we badly need a new
    president.
     
  6. Al

    Al Guest

    In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says... [...]
    > Personally, I've always questioned this development in pool technology. What's the incentive in
    > swimming faster qualifying times if there's no real physical advantage in lanes 3,4, & 5 (other
    > than sighting other swimmers)? You *ought* to pay a price to be stuck in 1&8.

    I think that would amount to penalizing someone for what is a more intelligent strategy - i.e., do
    only as much as it takes to get into finals so you've got more left for a maximum effort. Their
    penalty will be not making finals if they try to shave that margin too close.

    From a spectator point of view, I've always loved those races where the person in lane 1 or 8 swims
    away with the race.

    - Al
     
  7. Diablo

    Diablo Guest

    I think there are very few swimmers who can afford the luxury of swimming just enough to get back at
    night - and those that do that are probably fast enough to guarantee their spot in the middle 4
    lanes anyway.

    like anything its a gamble however.

    "Al" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says... [...]
    > > Personally, I've always questioned this development in pool technology.
    What's
    > > the incentive in swimming faster qualifying times if there's no real
    physical
    > > advantage in lanes 3,4, & 5 (other than sighting other swimmers)? You
    *ought* to
    > > pay a price to be stuck in 1&8.
    >
    > I think that would amount to penalizing someone for what is a more intelligent strategy - i.e., do
    > only as much as it takes to get into finals so you've got more left for a maximum effort. Their
    > penalty will be not making finals if they try to shave that margin too close.
    >
    > From a spectator point of view, I've always loved those races where the person in lane 1 or 8
    > swims away with the race.
    >
    > - Al
     
  8. Al

    Al Guest

    In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    > I think there are very few swimmers who can afford the luxury of swimming just enough to get back
    > at night - and those that do that are probably fast enough to guarantee their spot in the middle 4
    > lanes anyway.
    >
    > like anything its a gamble however.

    For major meets that's true, but on occasion it can be a doable (although not necessarily
    recommended) thing - admittedly less so these days with the time disparity between the top finishers
    getting smaller and smaller. But way back when it was fun to try to "game" the system - particularly
    at poorly organized meets with minimal recovery time between prelims and finals. Certainly not a
    strategy for the feint of heart, though :)

    - Al
     
  9. Diablo

    Diablo Guest

    sucks to be seeded first in the psyche sheet, then swim yourself into the consolation
    final...seen it happen once or twice. saw a guy seeded first in the 100 by over a second end up
    in the banana heat...

    "Al" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    > > I think there are very few swimmers who can afford the luxury of
    swimming
    > > just enough to get back at night - and those that do that are probably
    fast
    > > enough to guarantee their spot in the middle 4 lanes anyway.
    > >
    > > like anything its a gamble however.
    >
    > For major meets that's true, but on occasion it can be a doable (although not necessarily
    > recommended) thing - admittedly less so these days with the time disparity between the top
    > finishers getting smaller and smaller. But way back when it was fun to try to "game" the system -
    > particularly at poorly organized meets with minimal recovery time between prelims and finals.
    > Certainly not a strategy for the feint of heart, though :)
    >
    > - Al
     
  10. DaKitty

    DaKitty Guest

    "Al" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    > > I think there are very few swimmers who can afford the luxury of
    swimming
    > > just enough to get back at night - and those that do that are probably
    fast
    > > enough to guarantee their spot in the middle 4 lanes anyway.
    > >
    > > like anything its a gamble however.
    >
    > For major meets that's true, but on occasion it can be a doable (although not necessarily
    > recommended) thing - admittedly less so these days with the time disparity between the top
    > finishers getting smaller and smaller. But way back when it was fun to try to "game" the system -
    > particularly at poorly organized meets with minimal recovery time between prelims and finals.
    > Certainly not a strategy for the feint of heart, though :)
    >
    > - Al

    Then there are multiple heats, so many people really get to swim in lanes 3 and 4. Just very few get
    to swim in the lane 4 in a final heat of the event.
     
  11. Al

    Al Guest

    In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    > sucks to be seeded first in the psyche sheet, then swim yourself into the consolation
    > final...seen it happen once or twice. saw a guy seeded first in the 100 by over a second end up
    > in the banana heat...

    Yeah, that's a pretty gnarly outcome. What also sucks is to be one of those early heat, lane 8 guys
    that breaks the world record in prelims at olympic trials, then doesn't make the team in finals
    (although the world record remains intact.) (Kurt Krumpholtz, 1972 - I flew back on the same plane
    as him to Santa Clara following the trials in Chicago... a flight full of bay area swimmers that
    didn't make the team... man, that was quiet!)

    - Al
     
  12. Tbone

    Tbone Guest

    depends if the heat is "circle seeded" or not

    "Micheal Artindale" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > I know lane 4 is suposeded to be fore the fastest swimmer. what is the order from lane 4 to 8 that
    > should be used for fastest to slowest?
    >
    > Does it realy matter what lane you are in?
     
  13. M. W. Smith

    M. W. Smith Guest

    On Tue, 24 Feb 2004 03:53:16 GMT, Mike Edey <[email protected]> wrote:

    > Nope - the lane order still holds, it's just that everybody from one heat won't nec be seeded
    > faster then everybody from another. Whithin each heat the lane order is unchanged.

    Masters meets in Adelaide just order all the entires by entry time, slowest to fastest, and then
    deal them out eight at a time, slowest to fastest, men and women in the same event. I like that way
    because then you usually get to race against people who are about your speed but a little faster.
    But that's masters.

    martin

    > --Mike
    >
    > On Mon, 23 Feb 2004 20:56:44 -0500, tbone wrote:
    >
    >> depends if the heat is "circle seeded" or not
    >>
    >>
    >> "Micheal Artindale" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >> news:[email protected]...
    >>> I know lane 4 is suposeded to be fore the fastest swimmer. what is the order from lane 4 to 8
    >>> that should be used for fastest to slowest?
    >>>
    >>> Does it realy matter what lane you are in?
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>

    --
    If you are a US citizen, please use your constitutional right to vote, because we badly need a new
    president.
     
  14. de Valois

    de Valois Guest

    In the highest levels of competition, this is true, but for the vast majority of races, I think
    there's quite a bit of "room for error", especially if you're in heat 8 of an 8-heat qualifier and
    you already know whose on the bubble.

    Again, a narrow case, but any advantage like that can be huge.

    diablo left this mess on Mon, 23 Feb 2004 12:39:41 -0600 for The Way to clean up:
    >
    >I think there are very few swimmers who can afford the luxury of swimming just enough to get back
    >at night - and those that do that are probably fast enough to guarantee their spot in the middle 4
    >lanes anyway.
    >
    >like anything its a gamble however.
    >
    >"Al" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    >> In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says... [...]
    >> > Personally, I've always questioned this development in pool technology.
    >What's
    >> > the incentive in swimming faster qualifying times if there's no real
    >physical
    >> > advantage in lanes 3,4, & 5 (other than sighting other swimmers)? You
    >*ought* to
    >> > pay a price to be stuck in 1&8.
    >>
    >> I think that would amount to penalizing someone for what is a more intelligent strategy - i.e.,
    >> do only as much as it takes to get into finals so you've got more left for a maximum effort.
    >> Their penalty will be not making finals if they try to shave that margin too close.
    >>
    >> From a spectator point of view, I've always loved those races where the person in lane 1 or 8
    >> swims away with the race.
    >>
    >> - Al
    >
    >

    Tao te Carl "It takes a village to have an idiot." - Carl (c) 2003

    (Kudos to Cap'n Jim Wyatt for this link) BEFORE you ask a dumb-ass question
    here...http://www.speakeasy.org/~neilco/bart.gif
     
  15. Al

    Al Guest

    In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    > In the highest levels of competition, this is true, but for the vast majority of races, I think
    > there's quite a bit of "room for error", especially if you're in heat 8 of an 8-heat qualifier and
    > you already know whose on the bubble.
    >
    > Again, a narrow case, but any advantage like that can be huge.

    I tended to find myself, for whatever reason, in the final heat lots of times towards the middle
    (although almost never in the middle at a big meet :)... so in terms of seeding I wasn't usually so
    far out of the money that I couldn't take advantage of mistakes/bad swims on the part of higher
    seeded people in earlier heats. And if I happened to have a handle on how fast the guy in lane 4 was
    likely to swim, I could sometimes get away with gambling on a 80 - 90% effort to have a little
    something left over for finals - particularly if I was in a position to drag off of lane 4.

    This was usually 200 fly for me - but the 100 was too much of a thrash for me to take chances
    like that.

    - Al
     
  16. de Valois

    de Valois Guest

    Al left this mess on Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:20:13 -0600 for The Way to clean up:
    >
    >In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    >>In the highest levels of competition, this is true, but for the vast majority of races, I think
    >>there's quite a bit of "room for error", especially if you're in heat 8 of an 8-heat qualifier and
    >>you already know whose on the bubble.
    >>
    >> Again, a narrow case, but any advantage like that can be huge.
    >
    >I tended to find myself, for whatever reason, in the final heat lots of times towards the middle
    >(although almost never in the middle at a big meet :)... so in terms of seeding I wasn't usually
    >so far out of the money that I couldn't take advantage of mistakes/bad swims on the part of higher
    >seeded people in earlier heats. And if I happened to have a handle on how fast the guy in lane 4
    >was likely to swim, I could sometimes get away with gambling on a 80 - 90% effort to have a little
    >something left over for finals - particularly if I was in a position to drag off of lane 4.
    >
    >This was usually 200 fly for me - but the 100 was too much of a thrash for me to take chances
    >like that.
    >

    I suspect this strategy works better (and might even be more effective) for longer races, true.

    Tao te Carl "It takes a village to have an idiot." - Carl (c) 2003

    (Kudos to Cap'n Jim Wyatt for this link) BEFORE you ask a dumb-ass question
    here...http://www.speakeasy.org/~neilco/bart.gif
     
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